I told you guys that Michelin and Bridgestone is a win-win situation
08-29-2001, 06:15 PM
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I told you guys that Michelin and Bridgestone is a win-win situation
Eric, no bashing here but I told you I disagreed with the brand of tires you chose. I know the following does not mean much and you might be happy with your tires but it is significant when it happens 4 years in a row:
Dunlop and Michelin tire brands rated highest in customer satisfaction in J.D. Power and Associates' annual tire survey.
Dunlop rated first among tire brands used on light trucks, which includes vans, pickups and sport utility vehicles. Michelin ranked highest in passenger vehicle tires for the fourth consecutive year.
The study is based on the experience and opinions of more than 39,000 consumers who have owned the tires that came with their vehicles for three years or less.
Firestone light truck tires dropped below average.
BFGoodrich, Michelin, Uniroyal, Goodyear, Bridgestone and Continental, respectively, follow Dunlop in the light-truck segment. Yokohama and General also finished at or below industry average in this segment.
Pirelli, BFGoodrich, Continental and Dunlop, respectively, follow Michelin in the passenger car segment. In addition to Firestone, brands performing at or below average are Bridgestone, General, Goodyear, Hankook, Kumho, Toyo, Uniroyal and Yokohama, the survey said.null
Dunlop and Michelin tire brands rated highest in customer satisfaction in J.D. Power and Associates' annual tire survey.
Dunlop rated first among tire brands used on light trucks, which includes vans, pickups and sport utility vehicles. Michelin ranked highest in passenger vehicle tires for the fourth consecutive year.
The study is based on the experience and opinions of more than 39,000 consumers who have owned the tires that came with their vehicles for three years or less.
Firestone light truck tires dropped below average.
BFGoodrich, Michelin, Uniroyal, Goodyear, Bridgestone and Continental, respectively, follow Dunlop in the light-truck segment. Yokohama and General also finished at or below industry average in this segment.
Pirelli, BFGoodrich, Continental and Dunlop, respectively, follow Michelin in the passenger car segment. In addition to Firestone, brands performing at or below average are Bridgestone, General, Goodyear, Hankook, Kumho, Toyo, Uniroyal and Yokohama, the survey said.null
08-29-2001, 06:54 PM
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I think that if you drill down more into that report, you will find that the market segment earmarked for their study was probably the all-season-tire buying public.
On this board, however, most of us are looking at performance tires.
I SERIOUSLY doubt that the Michelin Pilot sport is $100 better - PER TIRE - than the Toyo Proxes T1-S and $160 better - PER TIRE - than the Kumho Ecsta Supra 712.
You put a regular Accord or Taurus driver (not the performance kind) in our car with Kumhos and they will HATE the ride.
Tirerack's comments are more in-line with what could be used to gauge performance tire buyer's opinions, but even their responses are skewed towards people with unlimited (read: BMW) budgets.
On this board, however, most of us are looking at performance tires.
I SERIOUSLY doubt that the Michelin Pilot sport is $100 better - PER TIRE - than the Toyo Proxes T1-S and $160 better - PER TIRE - than the Kumho Ecsta Supra 712.
You put a regular Accord or Taurus driver (not the performance kind) in our car with Kumhos and they will HATE the ride.
Tirerack's comments are more in-line with what could be used to gauge performance tire buyer's opinions, but even their responses are skewed towards people with unlimited (read: BMW) budgets.
08-29-2001, 06:55 PM
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Quesion here is what are 'people' looking for in a tire. 'We' are looking for performance (willing to give up wear) while the 'average person' wants a tire that will last and ride well in the rain.
'We' want to be able to hit corners at 50mph while 'others' want to save money by not having to buy tires every year.
'We' want to be able to hit corners at 50mph while 'others' want to save money by not having to buy tires every year.
08-29-2001, 07:07 PM
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JD Power & Associates = "Rent a Review"
If you ask "10,000 average americans" what their favorite tire is you might discover:
1. What tire the respondent actually has on his car, if he knows.
2. What tire has the most effective advertising.
If you combine all the results you might be able to determine who sold the most tires and who has the best advertising.
Will you know anything about the relative quality of tires?
No.
If you ask "10,000 average americans" what their favorite tire is you might discover:
1. What tire the respondent actually has on his car, if he knows.
2. What tire has the most effective advertising.
If you combine all the results you might be able to determine who sold the most tires and who has the best advertising.
Will you know anything about the relative quality of tires?
No.
08-29-2001, 07:36 PM
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What are you guys talking about? You are telling me that all these top brands in the report are good for popular tires like all season tires but when it comes hard core performance tires, Kuhmo and Yokohama are better?
Is that why BMW choses to use the Pilot Sport for their M3 cars for several years now, and is that why the S2000 comes with S02s and the 911s come with P Zeros? Cos they are not good and done perform as well?
Folks, Michelin and Bridgstone right now have the best know how when it comes down to tires in general. Performance or not. It is not coincidental that they are the two providers of F1 tires.
Is that why BMW choses to use the Pilot Sport for their M3 cars for several years now, and is that why the S2000 comes with S02s and the 911s come with P Zeros? Cos they are not good and done perform as well?
Folks, Michelin and Bridgstone right now have the best know how when it comes down to tires in general. Performance or not. It is not coincidental that they are the two providers of F1 tires.
08-29-2001, 07:44 PM
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I'm not sure which tires would be best because it all depends on personal preference. However, I agree with Wild Weasel on his assesment of J.D. Power. We've argued for years their results on rating customer satisfaction of new cars. Why would their results for tires be any better. A better place to find customer feedback would be places like Tire Rack.
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08-29-2001, 07:48 PM
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FYI, Bridgestone and Michelins are at least a decade ahead in terms of tire technology. Most companies have been sliding by on "old" technology...only recently has Goodyear started to pour some money into R&D. Kumho are decent for the price, but if you had the money...and were willing to spend it on some good tires...what would you buy??? S-03s or Kumhos??
08-29-2001, 07:52 PM
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Originally posted by e1828:
<STRONG>S-03s!!!!.. hey Dustin.. what price for some S-03s from ur friend's place?</STRONG>
<STRONG>S-03s!!!!.. hey Dustin.. what price for some S-03s from ur friend's place?</STRONG>
hehehe...s-03s and re730s...235/40/17s??? right!?!
08-29-2001, 07:54 PM
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Originally posted by moomaster_99:
<STRONG>
A lot...
hehehe...s-03s and re730s...235/40/17s??? right!?!</STRONG>
<STRONG>
A lot...
hehehe...s-03s and re730s...235/40/17s??? right!?!</STRONG>
08-29-2001, 07:58 PM
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Originally posted by e1828:
<STRONG>
Actually I am looking into the 18s.. don't wanna lower my car.. so I may want the 225/45/18s instead..</STRONG>
<STRONG>
Actually I am looking into the 18s.. don't wanna lower my car.. so I may want the 225/45/18s instead..</STRONG>
08-29-2001, 08:00 PM
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Originally posted by moomaster_99:
<STRONG>FYI, Bridgestone and Michelins are at least a decade ahead in terms of tire technology. Most companies have been sliding by on "old" technology...only recently has Goodyear started to pour some money into R&D. Kumho are decent for the price, but if you had the money...and were willing to spend it on some good tires...what would you buy??? S-03s or Kumhos??</STRONG>
<STRONG>FYI, Bridgestone and Michelins are at least a decade ahead in terms of tire technology. Most companies have been sliding by on "old" technology...only recently has Goodyear started to pour some money into R&D. Kumho are decent for the price, but if you had the money...and were willing to spend it on some good tires...what would you buy??? S-03s or Kumhos??</STRONG>
Exactly my point. The TireRack has tested the S03 as best overall performance tire currently. And they have a special right now for 215X55X17 for $175 each. Not that expensive dont you think?
08-29-2001, 08:01 PM
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Originally posted by gavriil:
<STRONG>
Exactly my point. The TireRack has tested the S03 as best overall performance tire currently. And they have a special right now for 215X55X17 for $175 each. Not that expensive dont you think?</STRONG>
<STRONG>
Exactly my point. The TireRack has tested the S03 as best overall performance tire currently. And they have a special right now for 215X55X17 for $175 each. Not that expensive dont you think?</STRONG>
08-29-2001, 08:08 PM
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Originally posted by moomaster_99:
<STRONG>Hey those aren't bad....</STRONG>
<STRONG>Hey those aren't bad....</STRONG>
08-29-2001, 08:44 PM
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Why does (did) Ford buy Firestones?
Why does BMW buy Michelins?
Why does Toyota buy Bridgestone?
Do you think it is because the individual tires are somehow determined to be the best for their individual models?
No.
These companies buy tires in the hundreds of thousands. They negotiate deals to purchase them for a fraction of their retail cost, from manufacturers who can guaranty delivery for years in advance. The advertising done by the tire manufacturer and its name recognition is a consideration as well.
Now that Ford finds it convenient to blame their Explorer troubles on Firestone, they are scrambling to find sources to make up the slack. It is not easy. Many of the substituted tires will be inferior to the Firestones being replaced because MONEY and NOT QUALITY determine what tires end up on new cars.
I guess if you feel better riding on Michelins because BMW or Acura uses them as original equipment, there's nothing wrong with that. It's just got nothing to do with the best performance tires.
Why does BMW buy Michelins?
Why does Toyota buy Bridgestone?
Do you think it is because the individual tires are somehow determined to be the best for their individual models?
No.
These companies buy tires in the hundreds of thousands. They negotiate deals to purchase them for a fraction of their retail cost, from manufacturers who can guaranty delivery for years in advance. The advertising done by the tire manufacturer and its name recognition is a consideration as well.
Now that Ford finds it convenient to blame their Explorer troubles on Firestone, they are scrambling to find sources to make up the slack. It is not easy. Many of the substituted tires will be inferior to the Firestones being replaced because MONEY and NOT QUALITY determine what tires end up on new cars.
I guess if you feel better riding on Michelins because BMW or Acura uses them as original equipment, there's nothing wrong with that. It's just got nothing to do with the best performance tires.
08-29-2001, 09:42 PM
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Considering I have another 20,000 and change miles left on my stock tures I think I'm going to stick with all season tires. I don't really feel like changing to snow tires... Thats why I chose a car with FWD, the all season'ness.' I think I just made up a word...
Now if I had a RWD BMW 330, or Mercedes C... then I'd reconsider.
But chances are I'll stick with Michelin or go with Goodyear.
Now if I had a RWD BMW 330, or Mercedes C... then I'd reconsider.
But chances are I'll stick with Michelin or go with Goodyear.
08-29-2001, 10:05 PM
#18
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Originally posted by gavriil:
<STRONG>Eric, no bashing here but I told you I disagreed with the brand of tires you chose. I know the following does not mean much and you might be happy with your tires but it is significant when it happens 4 years in a row:
Dunlop and Michelin tire brands rated highest in customer satisfaction in J.D. Power and Associates' annual tire survey.
Dunlop rated first among tire brands used on light trucks, which includes vans, pickups and sport utility vehicles. Michelin ranked highest in passenger vehicle tires for the fourth consecutive year.
The study is based on the experience and opinions of more than 39,000 consumers who have owned the tires that came with their vehicles for three years or less.
Firestone light truck tires dropped below average.
BFGoodrich, Michelin, Uniroyal, Goodyear, Bridgestone and Continental, respectively, follow Dunlop in the light-truck segment. Yokohama and General also finished at or below industry average in this segment.
Pirelli, BFGoodrich, Continental and Dunlop, respectively, follow Michelin in the passenger car segment. In addition to Firestone, brands performing at or below average are Bridgestone, General, Goodyear, Hankook, Kumho, Toyo, Uniroyal and Yokohama, the survey said.null</STRONG>
<STRONG>Eric, no bashing here but I told you I disagreed with the brand of tires you chose. I know the following does not mean much and you might be happy with your tires but it is significant when it happens 4 years in a row:
Dunlop and Michelin tire brands rated highest in customer satisfaction in J.D. Power and Associates' annual tire survey.
Dunlop rated first among tire brands used on light trucks, which includes vans, pickups and sport utility vehicles. Michelin ranked highest in passenger vehicle tires for the fourth consecutive year.
The study is based on the experience and opinions of more than 39,000 consumers who have owned the tires that came with their vehicles for three years or less.
Firestone light truck tires dropped below average.
BFGoodrich, Michelin, Uniroyal, Goodyear, Bridgestone and Continental, respectively, follow Dunlop in the light-truck segment. Yokohama and General also finished at or below industry average in this segment.
Pirelli, BFGoodrich, Continental and Dunlop, respectively, follow Michelin in the passenger car segment. In addition to Firestone, brands performing at or below average are Bridgestone, General, Goodyear, Hankook, Kumho, Toyo, Uniroyal and Yokohama, the survey said.null</STRONG>
Let the buyer pick what they want, I have no problems with that. Never did.
I wanted 235/45-17 and I wanted the XL and 97 rating (better than 93 would be more accurate). I wanted a tire that had a good reputation for wet/dry stick.
So, I am totally open to having someone, someday take an Acura CL Type-S and take the brands used here like: Toyo T1S Proxy, S-03, S-02, SP-9000s, Michelin Pilots, Pirelli Rossos (and others), Nitto 555s, Yoko (various), and have a tire shoot out.
One of the problems with "all of this" is the following:
Each maker makes so many "different" tires and each type of tire responds in a different fashion depending of the car, user, conditions, and other factors.
Now factor in the various dealers that sell people tires that ARE NOT CORRECT for their situation. Example, there is a poor soul over on one of the Toyo rating boards that said he expects his Toyo T1S to be great in the winter compared to his old all-season tires. So, how do you think this guy will rate the tires when he slides off a snowy mountain in the winter???
So, what does all of this really mean... Until, Toyo supplies me with free tires, I have not $$$ gain in telling people what I like... And if everyone is happy with their choice in tire, that’s great. Finally, I don’t pick the “brand” I pick the tire (with a few minor exceptions)…
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