I'm looking on temple of vtec website and according to them the CL might be redesigned in '03 with a front mounted engine with rear-wheel drive???? I know it's speculation but TOV is usually pretty good with advanced information no?

http://www.vtec.net/news/modelmatrix.html


If you look at the matrix, it seems that Acura is interested in head to head competition with the BMW market, front mounted engines and rear-wheel drive. New NSX may also go with the FR combo as well?

All i can say is wow. Looks like acura is gearing up for battle with the big boys, i.e., infinity, lexus, bmw etc.,


The matrix hasn't been updated since Oct'01 so who knows.

 

Honestly I personally think it would be a mistake for the NSX to go to a FR configuration. The MR (or pretty close) is what the NSX currently is, and the balance is so much better.

Generally the NSX's can take a turn later than FR configured cars due to the weight shift that most (if not all) FR cars experience.

-Johnny

Just my .02$

 

I agree with you totally. Especially with a new ivtec-v8 with all that torque. Leaving MR would finally all the NSX to compeat with the italian supercars.

 

Unfortunately this is going to be my last Acura. My next car or should I say truck is going to be an SUV.. I'm looking at the BMW X5, the new Infiniti FX45 and new Qx4, and Lexus GX 470. I've been pretty loyal to Acura and the CL brand because I've owned a 1997 CL 3.0 and currently the CL Type S. I personally think Acura needs to do more research on the current U.S. marketplace. I have never understood why Acura decided to use FWD on the CL or the Integra. If you look at MB, Lexus, now Infiniti, BMW, and other luxury brand car companies they all have RWD vehicles.

This might sound like it's being petty but how come the CL does not have a body spoiler kit but the TL and RSX does????? I feel that the CL is sort of the 3rd child because it seems like all the "goodies" are given to the TL and RSX.. Oh well, like I said before this will be my last Acura brand car and I wouldn't hold my breath for a RWD CL or TL.. I don't think Honda has any current plans to do this..

 

I feel thankful to Honda for keeping the FWD. I you want RWD, get the 325 or 330i, but I need FWD for snow. If they did not offer FWD, I would not have been able to get a Luxury/sports car.

 

I feel thankful to Honda for keeping the FWD. I you want RWD, get the 325 or 330i, but I need FWD for snow. If they did not offer FWD, I would not have been able to get a Luxury/sports car.

I had a 328ci and traded it in for the 01 CL Type S. I live in Illinois and the winters here can be pretty brutal. I haven't felt that much of a difference in winter driving between the RWD 328ci and my FWD CLS. Maybe it's because I had snow tires on the 328 but I never felt unsafe driving it in the winter. The reason I traded the Bimmer in for the CLS is because of the horrendous problems I was having with it! I was constantly taking it in for one reason or another and I remembered how well my 97 CL 3.0 treated me.. 4 major accidents and it kept on running.. Oh well, like I said my next ride will definitely be an SUV.. That way, I don't ever have to worry about traction problems in the winter..

 

There's no such thing as a FWD sports car. I think it's a good move. I hate the fact my CLS is FWD. Granted its the best FWD i've driven. It's still not sporty.

If you need to be in the snow why would you buy a sporty car?

duh...


Now if they would just change over to an INLINE 6 CYL!

:-P V6 crap...

 

Siggy,
Why shouldn't I buy a sporty car if I want one, all of you that complain should go for a 325i or CLK320. C'mon Shawn, back me up on this one.

 

That’s funny….I just checked out in my garage and there’s one parked out there right now.

How the hell can you say the CL-S is NOT a sports car?

If Acura goes RWD, my 03 6-Speed will be my LAST.
Acura will lose 40-50 percent of their Northern State customers and most of Canada.

Shawn S

Show me a RWD Coupe that can get me home through THIS:

 

Forget FWD, forget RWD. My next car is going to be a AWD (S4 or 330xi).

I'd love it to be an Acura, but it seems Acura is a little lsow on the uptake with this kind of thing. Isn't the Accord getting AWD sometime soon?

 

actually shawn, you should see some of the crap my dad gets through up here in his 740iL

 

Its not! its a ***SPORTY*** TOURING COUPE!

:-P


.


RWD is night and day different in a true sports car. I agree with your snow problems. But a RWD car just outperforms a FWD. sorry. There is no such thing as a FWD sports car man. Deal with it. Hmm.... FWD bmw... Hmmm FWD ferarri!! LMAO!! ya Lamborghini, Corvette, Supra, RX-7, Mustang, Camaro, Trans-AM, Porsche, MG... I could keep going, but I think you get the point...

Our cars plow around corners... And if you give it enough gas in the corner ohh sliding away you go... No power sliding with acceleration like you can do with RWD. And no torque steer...

hence... Sports Car

If a CLS is a sports car to you, you should go drive some other cars. Corvette, Camaro, Trans am, BMW, Porsche. Our car was designed to mainly tour... Although it has some *sportyness* to it. The 330I (and 3 series) is a better car, but its *NOT* in the same class as ours.

 

totally Altough Audi makes an excellent car I don't like the styling much.

 

totally,

It depends on the driver and the vehicle. I'd much rather swing the rear end around (RWD) then slide the front end accross the street (FWD)in the snow. Mercedes also has an excellent traction control system. As do many other car manufacturers. I think people are still thinking RWD cars are just like they used to be in the 80's ....

 

You make some valid points but I still think that the CL can safely be called a “Sports Car”.
And I think the 6-Speed will add some positive backing to my argument.

Comparing Ferrari, Lamborghini and the Chevy Camaro in the same sentence……NO.

Shawn S

 

I wasn't comparing...

Just listing some sports cars... showing they are all RWD

I'm waiting for someone to list some FWD ones...

 

Here’s one for YA……


Shawn S

 

Celica GTS
RSXS
Integra type R
Mitsubishi Eclipse
Honda Prelude


For starters.

 

You should get the MDX, it's better than all of those SUV's listed
above, and has won more awards. Better value for money
too.

 

LMAO

how did I know that was comming....


I still don't like those wheels, the more and more I see them. Glad I have the older ones. They look odd in person, I think I need to see a different color other than blue. Because thats the same car they had at the Chicago show. I think it's still nice, but looks a lot more like a touring car now with those wheels.

 

We definetly have different views of what a sports car is...

Granted some of those do handle well. They are all turds in the sport performance area. Accept the RSX-S and the type-r for straight line acceleration. But they still dont handle and drive the same.

All Japanese cars... FWD is a cheap way to give performance.

Although I have to agree those are considered sports cars... Just not what I would consider to be sporty. Guess I have to realize there is a few different "Sports" classes...

:-)

 

HEY !!!
We finally agree on something, I don’t like them either.
That’s why they have been SOLD and I’m shopping for new 18” wheels and tires as we speak.

What do you think….Will they make my car more “SPORTY” ???

Shawn S

 

LOL

yeah, Honda sporty! All show NO go! heheh

j/k

But a true statement with just about all civics (minus a few)

Take a pic when you get your new wheels, I'd like to see 'em

 

Just would like to get my imput on this, since im also geting a 6-speed CL-S....First of all, sporty is different to many people....its all a matter of how you look at it. One person may think there 89 Chevy Caprice is sporty, cause thats what they could afford or all they had. Sporty is realy a matter of your own opinion, just like some people like the new wheels, some dont...its your opinion. I meen obviously a lambo or porshce or something like that is, but if me or shawn s want to think a 6 speed is a sports car and you dont, then whatever, its realy not a big deal....Dont know if anyone is realy understanding what im typing, but i just felt the need to type this.

And Shawn, how much did you sell your wheels/tires for, and how much is the shiping/ where u shiping it to...how did u find the person....was it the guy at the post office you were telling us about? Just curious cause i think im going to do the same thing, but i think im gonna get the 01-02 wheels. Thanks.

 

Collective27,

I sent you a PM.

Shawn S

 

Ya I agree... But it's not just my opinion. Its an enthusiasts opinion. Anyone who has driven RWD sports car will agree. (a new comparible one, not a 1980 berlinetta camaro).

But you'll notice even the CD review calls it a touring car... And so do the rest of them...

http://www.caranddriver.com/xp/Caran..._acura32cl.xml

technically you can't compare a RWD and a FWD they are 2 different class of vehicles... Why I get upset then people compare the 3 series to the CLS. Granted they both have 4 wheels and some pedals. Buts that about all thats the same.

http://www.angelfire.com/biz/snwvlly/fwd.html

 

Look, I am fairly new to this forum so jumping in to the ring isnt fairly bright but if yall are "true enthusiasts", (which I believe everyone on here is) why is this discussion taking place? OK, the CLS, even though I love it to death and cant wait another second to get my 6sp, IS NOT A SPORTS CAR. Plain and simple. A BMW 330i IS NOT A SPORTS CAR. These cars are classified as sports sedans and sport coupes which are basically under the touring category. Guys, as much as we all love the CL, a 6sec (IF WE'RE LUCKY) 0-60 car is nowhere near a sports car. Come on, is that a joke or something?? I agree that comparing the CL to a 911, Corvette, Camaro, Ferrari, etc. is ridiculous cause of one reason: ITS $30 grand, 15 more you get a sports car in the Vette. Leave it as the CL is a great car that has awesome acceleration, wonderful ammenities, and great luxury or 30 grand. But come on, go drive a Vette and still tell me the CL is a sports car. My opinion if you want a sports car that bad, the Vette is the best you can get for under 45, unless you find a hell of a deal on a new M3.

 

You say anyone who has driven RWD sports car will agree with you...Have to say I don't agree and I've driven a 1999 vette, 1997 M3 coupe,and 1995 Nissan Z. (Yes, I know they M3 and the vette would kill the CL in most comparisons) The fact however that the 225 hp Z I drove didn't have a turbo, and felt like a big overweight slug didn't stop all the major car magazines from calling it a sports car...My cl could eat that car for breakfast, even in the twisties. That car didn't have a turbo, and the CL doesnt have FWD...anyway my point is that in both cases, a design characteristic(s) exists that may detract from performance of each car under certain conditions. Neither disqualifies each car from sports car status IMO. I also don't think that just because a newer, better, faster car comes out that suddenly my 1989 porsche 911 is no longer a sports car anymore.

 

Totally agree w/u. However, dealers are charging as much as $1500 over MSRP plus they have a 4 moth wait now. But, autoweek tested an MDX and made it go 0-60 in 7.8 sec, not bad at all.

FWD can't corner & handle as well as RWD mostly b/c FWD's are generally heaveier than their RWD counterparts. The extra unsprung weight hurts the FWD car terribly, although aftermarket suspension def. improves cornering & handling esp. CLP/S.


P>S>/sidenote Does ne 1 know the weight of the Acural RL & MDX. I'm just curious b/c I think the RL is lighter than the MDX but is it by alot? I'm asking b/c I think putting in the MDX motor in the RL would help th RL out alot...but why doesn't acura do it, it would save them money since the present RL engine is of a diff block and isn't used ne where else by honda.

 

I'm not sure I understand this thread.

FWD cars are better in the winter conditions due to the weight of the engine providing greater traction for the front wheels. At least that's the assumption.

But what if the car has a weight distribution of 50/50? Does it really matter if it is FWD/RWD? If Acura makes a perfectly balanced vehicle, why wouldn't you want to eliminate torque steer?

Granted, I only have to drive in ice about once every 2 years, but I have never had problems in ice with any my RWD cars...just tossed a couple of hundred pounds in weight in the back.

 

Does anyone get the feeling that Honda could build a FWD car that behaves *exactly* like a RWD car and some people would still say, "But its FWD so it sucks."?

 

No, not exactly. It's just not possible to apply the power/physics to the front wheels, and have it perform like a RWD. No-one said FWD sucks, we just stated it's (CLS) not a sports car. And thats a major reason for it. Why I said anyone who has driven a RWD (new) sports car will agree. Accept someone was confused and said something about their Porsche not being a sport car anymore because it was slow by todays standards. I can't think of when we compared HP output in this thread. But the simple pure passion of driving a RWD car. It's just a night and day difference...

I think people should read the whole thread before posting on a tid-bit of one post. (not this thread, but others)

 

High power FWD sucks period.
The AT's are a little easier to handle but the manuals just suck.
So do RWD's :-)
I drive a 300+ HP FWD Volvo manual and it sucks, at lower speed that is.
3, 4 and 5 are super!! :-)
But if it catches you by surprise I would rather drive a FWD than a RWD.
I used to drive a beamer and crashed it going 90 mph when aquaplanning hit me.
One tenth of a second and I lost the car and no room for correction.
This wouldn't have happened if I drove a FWD.
One thing that I like about RWD are the powerslides.

 

Bro almost the same thing happened to my friend. He had a 3series his car was tapped in the rear end by some dude, however, he lost control and just swereved out till he hit a mailbox (he was only doing 30mph) . His car got totaled and the guy who tapped him left the scene


Bro, what volvo is it? Is it the c70, if so how long have u had it and how reliable has it been? Its a sweet looking car and my cousin is looking at getting one. Also how are aftermarket support on the volvos? Thanks man.

 

Volvo S60T5 manual.

 

dude...300+ hp? must have been a *seriously* modded s60 cus the s60 T5 only puts out 247 horses..and that's with the stock high pressure turbo?

 

Air intake, chipped and 3" stainless steel downpipe with race cat and 3" exhaust with free flow mufflers.
Standard turbo running 1.4 bar at peak with 1.15 bar average.
Dyno'd up to 180 kw at the wheels after which it went out the rollers.
Chip was dyno'd at 200 kw in another car with same spec.
Calculated torque around 465nm at 4000 rpm.
Just moderate mods :-)

 

benz dumped the inline 6, there v engines are much better and still provide good hp and torque

 

It was my post that referred to the porsche and you missed my point completely (and yes I read this thread in its entirety, thanks). I was simply saying that subjective things are being used to qualify what is and isn't a sports car. There is no universally accepted consensus as to what constitutes a 'sports' car. Enzo Ferrari once said "the only true amercian sports car is a jeep"...I think alot of people would take issue with that statement, but it was only one guy's opinion. My point is this, and I don't think I can be any more crystal clear; just because you're selling me this 'FWD cars are not sports cars' doesn't mean I have to buy it. I think that's fair.

 

nice. I love the s60...I didn't realize you could tap that much performance out of it with just a few mods. So how much did that stuff run ya? Got any pics of your ride? I'm seriously considering the s60 t5 as my next car.