Another one bites the dust....CL-S kill....
#1
Another one bites the dust....CL-S kill....
So I was crusing around in the Maxima (NOS bottle was empty ) tonight with my buddy who has a supercharged Max and this black CL-S starts tailing me when I'm lining up next to some passat 1.8T....
I have to say...the CL-S HIDs are PHAT.....
anyway...he follows me for a bit...and finally we get a run from a light.....I pull out on him in first about a car and a half....and put another car on in second...by the top of third he's about 2.5-3 cars back, and I shut it down. He rolls up next to me and ask to run from a roll at 20....so we do....and the same thing happens. I then pull next to him at a LONG light and we had a nice conversation, he complimented me on my car and I did the same to him...
BLACK CLs are NICE looking...
he also mentioned that he was stock "for now", and gate shifting at 7100 RPMs.....
I'm glad some people can have a civil race and not get all pissed off and start a road rage in the end like most of the teenage 5.0 drivers I run into.
Props to CL guys!
I have to say...the CL-S HIDs are PHAT.....
anyway...he follows me for a bit...and finally we get a run from a light.....I pull out on him in first about a car and a half....and put another car on in second...by the top of third he's about 2.5-3 cars back, and I shut it down. He rolls up next to me and ask to run from a roll at 20....so we do....and the same thing happens. I then pull next to him at a LONG light and we had a nice conversation, he complimented me on my car and I did the same to him...
BLACK CLs are NICE looking...
he also mentioned that he was stock "for now", and gate shifting at 7100 RPMs.....
I'm glad some people can have a civil race and not get all pissed off and start a road rage in the end like most of the teenage 5.0 drivers I run into.
Props to CL guys!
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#11
Re: Another one bites the dust....CL-S kill....
Originally posted by TypeSKiller
So I was crusing around in the Maxima (NOS bottle was empty ) tonight with my buddy who has a supercharged Max and this black CL-S starts tailing me when I'm lining up next to some passat 1.8T....
I have to say...the CL-S HIDs are PHAT.....
anyway...he follows me for a bit...and finally we get a run from a light.....I pull out on him in first about a car and a half....and put another car on in second...by the top of third he's about 2.5-3 cars back, and I shut it down. He rolls up next to me and ask to run from a roll at 20....so we do....and the same thing happens. I then pull next to him at a LONG light and we had a nice conversation, he complimented me on my car and I did the same to him...
BLACK CLs are NICE looking...
he also mentioned that he was stock "for now", and gate shifting at 7100 RPMs.....
I'm glad some people can have a civil race and not get all pissed off and start a road rage in the end like most of the teenage 5.0 drivers I run into.
Props to CL guys!
So I was crusing around in the Maxima (NOS bottle was empty ) tonight with my buddy who has a supercharged Max and this black CL-S starts tailing me when I'm lining up next to some passat 1.8T....
I have to say...the CL-S HIDs are PHAT.....
anyway...he follows me for a bit...and finally we get a run from a light.....I pull out on him in first about a car and a half....and put another car on in second...by the top of third he's about 2.5-3 cars back, and I shut it down. He rolls up next to me and ask to run from a roll at 20....so we do....and the same thing happens. I then pull next to him at a LONG light and we had a nice conversation, he complimented me on my car and I did the same to him...
BLACK CLs are NICE looking...
he also mentioned that he was stock "for now", and gate shifting at 7100 RPMs.....
I'm glad some people can have a civil race and not get all pissed off and start a road rage in the end like most of the teenage 5.0 drivers I run into.
Props to CL guys!
Anyway good kill man!
#15
Re: Re: Another one bites the dust....CL-S kill....
Originally posted by Gabo3k
You wording was a bit confusing. Did you say the Max you guys ran in was supercharged? If so, well that victory should have been almost garanteed, right?
Anyway good kill man!
You wording was a bit confusing. Did you say the Max you guys ran in was supercharged? If so, well that victory should have been almost garanteed, right?
Anyway good kill man!
I was the one who raced the CL-S....
BTW....for Russ's sake....my maxima ran 14.7 N/A last year with just an intake and y-pipe in HORRIBILY humid, hot weather...and I have since added some more goodies....so it SHOULD be around 14.3-14.4 N/A with a good launch...running a STOCK CL-S....3 carlenghs to 90 is about right since a stock CL-S at best runs about a 14.7....
Sidenote- My 14.0 was done with intake, y-pipe, cat-back and a 50-shot....with LOTS of wheel spin....with that 99mph trap speed I could hit 13.8 with a 2.1 60ft.....but I only had a chance to do three runs due to LOTS of people at the track that day.
#17
hmm i wonder whos black CLS you raced... i cant think of anyone on the board thats stock that has a black on here in chicago. But i do know a guy who would love to race ya... WHERES SPIROH?
#18
Originally posted by Crazy AcurA
hmm i wonder whos black CLS you raced... i cant think of anyone on the board thats stock that has a black on here in chicago. But i do know a guy who would love to race ya... WHERES SPIROH?
hmm i wonder whos black CLS you raced... i cant think of anyone on the board thats stock that has a black on here in chicago. But i do know a guy who would love to race ya... WHERES SPIROH?
#19
Originally posted by TypeSKiller
I know Spiroh.....met him at the last meet we had with you guys. If you see him, tell him I'd like to run him....but I may have my bottle filled by then
I know Spiroh.....met him at the last meet we had with you guys. If you see him, tell him I'd like to run him....but I may have my bottle filled by then
me 2
#21
Re: Re: Re: Another one bites the dust....CL-S kill....
Originally posted by TypeSKiller
Sorry about the wording....MY Maxima has bolt-on N/A mods and my buddy has a supercharger, but he was just following....he saves his gas for F-bodies and stangs
I was the one who raced the CL-S....
BTW....for Russ's sake....my maxima ran 14.7 N/A last year with just an intake and y-pipe in HORRIBILY humid, hot weather...and I have since added some more goodies....so it SHOULD be around 14.3-14.4 N/A with a good launch...running a STOCK CL-S....3 carlenghs to 90 is about right since a stock CL-S at best runs about a 14.7....
Sidenote- My 14.0 was done with intake, y-pipe, cat-back and a 50-shot....with LOTS of wheel spin....with that 99mph trap speed I could hit 13.8 with a 2.1 60ft.....but I only had a chance to do three runs due to LOTS of people at the track that day.
Sorry about the wording....MY Maxima has bolt-on N/A mods and my buddy has a supercharger, but he was just following....he saves his gas for F-bodies and stangs
I was the one who raced the CL-S....
BTW....for Russ's sake....my maxima ran 14.7 N/A last year with just an intake and y-pipe in HORRIBILY humid, hot weather...and I have since added some more goodies....so it SHOULD be around 14.3-14.4 N/A with a good launch...running a STOCK CL-S....3 carlenghs to 90 is about right since a stock CL-S at best runs about a 14.7....
Sidenote- My 14.0 was done with intake, y-pipe, cat-back and a 50-shot....with LOTS of wheel spin....with that 99mph trap speed I could hit 13.8 with a 2.1 60ft.....but I only had a chance to do three runs due to LOTS of people at the track that day.
I know of someone with a heavily modded 300ZX, he races almost anyone. Wanna race him?
Your point is, you have no point... No matter what you drive there will always be someone faster than you.
Good kill though!
#22
Re: Re: Re: Re: Another one bites the dust....CL-S kill....
Originally posted by Gabo3k
Yeah all cool stuff, you beat a stock CL-S with a modded Maximan, and your point is?
I know of someone with a heavily modded 300ZX, he races almost anyone. Wanna race him?
Your point is, you have no point... No matter what you drive there will always be someone faster than you.
Good kill though!
Yeah all cool stuff, you beat a stock CL-S with a modded Maximan, and your point is?
I know of someone with a heavily modded 300ZX, he races almost anyone. Wanna race him?
Your point is, you have no point... No matter what you drive there will always be someone faster than you.
Good kill though!
http://www.maxima.org/forums/showthr...hreadid=109226
Thanks for the props though...MOST of you CL guys are pretty cool....and your cars are very nice.
#23
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Another one bites the dust....CL-S kill....
Originally posted by TypeSKiller
I was just laying it all out becuase Speedy3.2CL-S (Russ) is under the impression that no modded maxima could EVER beat a CL-S if the CL-S is driven "right".....that's the only reason I defended my claim....I know that there are plenty of faster cars out there...that wasn't my point. If you are confused then check out this thread on the maxima forums that Russ posted in...his name over there is RussMaxManiac.
http://www.maxima.org/forums/showthr...hreadid=109226
Thanks for the props though...MOST of you CL guys are pretty cool....and your cars are very nice.
I was just laying it all out becuase Speedy3.2CL-S (Russ) is under the impression that no modded maxima could EVER beat a CL-S if the CL-S is driven "right".....that's the only reason I defended my claim....I know that there are plenty of faster cars out there...that wasn't my point. If you are confused then check out this thread on the maxima forums that Russ posted in...his name over there is RussMaxManiac.
http://www.maxima.org/forums/showthr...hreadid=109226
Thanks for the props though...MOST of you CL guys are pretty cool....and your cars are very nice.
And a 255hp auto 2k2 that runs 14.4-14.6 ran a CL-S and won by a fender in a race with a TL-S. Posted on maxima.org. So you are saying your faster than a 255hp Maxima now? Okay, I will go in my corner. Let others decide.
#24
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Another one bites the dust....CL-S kill....
Originally posted by Speedy3.2CL-S
Not really. You guys keep thinking that your maxima is faster than a type-s when it isn't. I have raced modded maximas, and they go 2 cars behind before I shift out of 3rd. I just don't see that happening.
And a 255hp auto 2k2 that runs 14.4-14.6 ran a CL-S and won by a fender in a race with a TL-S. Posted on maxima.org. So you are saying your faster than a 255hp Maxima now? Okay, I will go in my corner. Let others decide.
Not really. You guys keep thinking that your maxima is faster than a type-s when it isn't. I have raced modded maximas, and they go 2 cars behind before I shift out of 3rd. I just don't see that happening.
And a 255hp auto 2k2 that runs 14.4-14.6 ran a CL-S and won by a fender in a race with a TL-S. Posted on maxima.org. So you are saying your faster than a 255hp Maxima now? Okay, I will go in my corner. Let others decide.
"This car is faster than that car....so are you saying that you could beat this car??" DUDE, DROP IT....GET A LIFE, and GET A WOMAN....maybe a hobby besides cars too.
BTW-Theres a reason that pretty much every thread you flame in over at the .org gets deleted.....think about it.
#26
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Another one bites the dust....CL-S kill....
Originally posted by Speedy3.2CL-S
Not really. You guys keep thinking that your maxima is faster than a type-s when it isn't. I have raced modded maximas, and they go 2 cars behind before I shift out of 3rd. I just don't see that happening.
And a 255hp auto 2k2 that runs 14.4-14.6 ran a CL-S and won by a fender in a race with a TL-S. Posted on maxima.org. So you are saying your faster than a 255hp Maxima now? Okay, I will go in my corner. Let others decide.
Not really. You guys keep thinking that your maxima is faster than a type-s when it isn't. I have raced modded maximas, and they go 2 cars behind before I shift out of 3rd. I just don't see that happening.
And a 255hp auto 2k2 that runs 14.4-14.6 ran a CL-S and won by a fender in a race with a TL-S. Posted on maxima.org. So you are saying your faster than a 255hp Maxima now? Okay, I will go in my corner. Let others decide.
I have been checking times here of the CL-S and the average is roughly 15.1, with the exception of high 14's. Brian ran a 14.7 N/A at the track. There was a Cl-S there that ran low 15s with Comptech Headers and Intake on the same conditions.
What is so hard to believe. Do the math! I dont see anyone discrediting it besides you on here .
Hell i bet my 2k 5speed with 20 less hp than stock due to a malfunctioning VIAS will be neck and neck with a CL-S. I ran a 15.3 with this problem on a hot/humid day.
#27
Re: Re: Re: Another one bites the dust....CL-S kill....
Originally posted by TypeSKiller
so it SHOULD be around 14.3-14.4 N/A with a good launch
so it SHOULD be around 14.3-14.4 N/A with a good launch
And who is Spiroh and what's he running? A modded Type-S? I'm up for a run against that!
Later,
#28
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Another one bites the dust....CL-S kill....
Cut the BS? I do not see me doing any BS here except for you trying to start crap on a forum you do not belong. Users here can go look at your post over there saying that oh yeah, type-s is slow, etc etc....They get the idea.
Also one other thing....since you mentioned most in the 15.1s, well, I see more 5spd running stock 15.4-15.8 and autos 15.8-16.2. 4th gens. 5th gens 15.2-15.4 5spd and autos 15.8-16.2 as well. So as rare as it is for 4th and 5th gens hitting high 14s, and that is like 15 at the most for both gens, we have more CL-Ss and TL-Ss hitting 14s than you guys and they are autos! Why not you compare manual vs manual?
http://www.acura-tl.com/forum/showth...threadid=37542
New TL-S which is heavier and slower hit 14.7 stock. hmmm
Also one other thing....since you mentioned most in the 15.1s, well, I see more 5spd running stock 15.4-15.8 and autos 15.8-16.2. 4th gens. 5th gens 15.2-15.4 5spd and autos 15.8-16.2 as well. So as rare as it is for 4th and 5th gens hitting high 14s, and that is like 15 at the most for both gens, we have more CL-Ss and TL-Ss hitting 14s than you guys and they are autos! Why not you compare manual vs manual?
http://www.acura-tl.com/forum/showth...threadid=37542
New TL-S which is heavier and slower hit 14.7 stock. hmmm
Originally posted by TypeSKiller
Cut the BS Russ....
"This car is faster than that car....so are you saying that you could beat this car??" DUDE, DROP IT....GET A LIFE, and GET A WOMAN....maybe a hobby besides cars too.
BTW-Theres a reason that pretty much every thread you flame in over at the .org gets deleted.....think about it.
Cut the BS Russ....
"This car is faster than that car....so are you saying that you could beat this car??" DUDE, DROP IT....GET A LIFE, and GET A WOMAN....maybe a hobby besides cars too.
BTW-Theres a reason that pretty much every thread you flame in over at the .org gets deleted.....think about it.
#29
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Another one bites the dust....CL-S kill....
P.S., none of my flame wars have gotten deleted unless I delete them or request them deleted. Because idiots like you are biased.
Originally posted by TypeSKiller
Cut the BS Russ....
"This car is faster than that car....so are you saying that you could beat this car??" DUDE, DROP IT....GET A LIFE, and GET A WOMAN....maybe a hobby besides cars too.
BTW-Theres a reason that pretty much every thread you flame in over at the .org gets deleted.....think about it.
Cut the BS Russ....
"This car is faster than that car....so are you saying that you could beat this car??" DUDE, DROP IT....GET A LIFE, and GET A WOMAN....maybe a hobby besides cars too.
BTW-Theres a reason that pretty much every thread you flame in over at the .org gets deleted.....think about it.
#30
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Another one bites the dust....CL-S kill....
Originally posted by Speedy3.2CL-S
Cut the BS? I do not see me doing any BS here except for you trying to start crap on a forum you do not belong. Users here can go look at your post over there saying that oh yeah, type-s is slow, etc etc....They get the idea.
Also one other thing....since you mentioned most in the 15.1s, well, I see more 5spd running stock 15.4-15.8 and autos 15.8-16.2. 4th gens. 5th gens 15.2-15.4 5spd and autos 15.8-16.2 as well. So as rare as it is for 4th and 5th gens hitting high 14s, and that is like 15 at the most for both gens, we have more CL-Ss and TL-Ss hitting 14s than you guys and they are autos! Why not you compare manual vs manual?
http://www.acura-tl.com/forum/showth...threadid=37542
New TL-S which is heavier and slower hit 14.7 stock. hmmm
Cut the BS? I do not see me doing any BS here except for you trying to start crap on a forum you do not belong. Users here can go look at your post over there saying that oh yeah, type-s is slow, etc etc....They get the idea.
Also one other thing....since you mentioned most in the 15.1s, well, I see more 5spd running stock 15.4-15.8 and autos 15.8-16.2. 4th gens. 5th gens 15.2-15.4 5spd and autos 15.8-16.2 as well. So as rare as it is for 4th and 5th gens hitting high 14s, and that is like 15 at the most for both gens, we have more CL-Ss and TL-Ss hitting 14s than you guys and they are autos! Why not you compare manual vs manual?
http://www.acura-tl.com/forum/showth...threadid=37542
New TL-S which is heavier and slower hit 14.7 stock. hmmm
#31
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Another one bites the dust....CL-S kill....
Originally posted by Maximized
Russ may i ask what ur Maxima ran??? 14.8, correct??? That is better than the majority of TL/CL owners. Russ can you please do a search on the .org from a year ago. Maybe you will see why a lot of people give you shit.
Russ may i ask what ur Maxima ran??? 14.8, correct??? That is better than the majority of TL/CL owners. Russ can you please do a search on the .org from a year ago. Maybe you will see why a lot of people give you shit.
Yea I ran 14.8, with 1/4 tank of gas, no spare, no jack, and beating the shit out of the car. Clutch finanlly went. It went 14.8 at 94.6 mph stock. RARE occasions maximas hit 14s. Type-S hit them alot more often. The Maxima 5spd is a good 1/4 car, but on a roll or highway the type-s will for sure take one. I ran the guy I use to run in my Maxima all the time, Ants97se, we were basically even when we ran, sometimes he pulled, sometimes I pulled on him. But when we ran with the new car and another modded maxima, both 5spds, I went from 50mph to 110 and put over 2 car lengths on them, twice.
#32
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Another one bites the dust....CL-S kill....
Originally posted by Speedy3.2CL-S
Alot of people on that forum give others shit because they are all idiots and don't have proof. I have proof and usually back up everything with it. But still kids on that forum want to argue.
Yea I ran 14.8, with 1/4 tank of gas, no spare, no jack, and beating the shit out of the car. Clutch finanlly went. It went 14.8 at 94.6 mph stock. RARE occasions maximas hit 14s. Type-S hit them alot more often. The Maxima 5spd is a good 1/4 car, but on a roll or highway the type-s will for sure take one. I ran the guy I use to run in my Maxima all the time, Ants97se, we were basically even when we ran, sometimes he pulled, sometimes I pulled on him. But when we ran with the new car and another modded maxima, both 5spds, I went from 50mph to 110 and put over 2 car lengths on them, twice.
Alot of people on that forum give others shit because they are all idiots and don't have proof. I have proof and usually back up everything with it. But still kids on that forum want to argue.
Yea I ran 14.8, with 1/4 tank of gas, no spare, no jack, and beating the shit out of the car. Clutch finanlly went. It went 14.8 at 94.6 mph stock. RARE occasions maximas hit 14s. Type-S hit them alot more often. The Maxima 5spd is a good 1/4 car, but on a roll or highway the type-s will for sure take one. I ran the guy I use to run in my Maxima all the time, Ants97se, we were basically even when we ran, sometimes he pulled, sometimes I pulled on him. But when we ran with the new car and another modded maxima, both 5spds, I went from 50mph to 110 and put over 2 car lengths on them, twice.
#33
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Another one bites the dust....CL-S kill....
Originally posted by Speedy3.2CL-S
http://www.acura-tl.com/forum/showth...threadid=37542
New TL-S which is heavier and slower hit 14.7 stock. hmmm
http://www.acura-tl.com/forum/showth...threadid=37542
New TL-S which is heavier and slower hit 14.7 stock. hmmm
#34
Re: Re: Re: Re: Another one bites the dust....CL-S kill....
Originally posted by GTPguy97
Hey TSK, are you going to bring your Maxima up to Union Grove on the 10th? I would really like to see a fast Maxima with my own 2 eyes because to tell you the truth, from what I have seen from them on the streets....I'm not impressed at all. I guess I just run up against mainly automatics or poorly driven 5-speeds, all non-modded also I'm sure. Anyway, a low-14 out of an NA Max would be mighty impressive and I'd like to see you try and do it. Hell, I'd like to have my car in the opposite lane while you try to do it.
And who is Spiroh and what's he running? A modded Type-S? I'm up for a run against that!
Later,
Hey TSK, are you going to bring your Maxima up to Union Grove on the 10th? I would really like to see a fast Maxima with my own 2 eyes because to tell you the truth, from what I have seen from them on the streets....I'm not impressed at all. I guess I just run up against mainly automatics or poorly driven 5-speeds, all non-modded also I'm sure. Anyway, a low-14 out of an NA Max would be mighty impressive and I'd like to see you try and do it. Hell, I'd like to have my car in the opposite lane while you try to do it.
And who is Spiroh and what's he running? A modded Type-S? I'm up for a run against that!
Later,
Well the 10th is a Wednesday....and I don't think the track is open....do you mean saturday the 13th???? I'll be there saturday with a bunch of maximas....2 auto maxs that should be in the 12s with boost. You've probably run into all automatic stock maximas....they typically run high 15s....so they aren't very impressive...especially for a intake and pully GTP.....I've already run 14.0....I'm going with more HP than when I ran the 14.0....so I SHOULD be well into the 13s...I'll bring my video camera on the 13th...I have my 14.0 run on video....so you can check it out.
#35
Originally posted by Gabo3k
Stock for stock CL-S whips the Maxima, END OF STORY!
Stock for stock CL-S whips the Maxima, END OF STORY!
#36
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Another one bites the dust....CL-S kill....
Originally posted by TypeSKiller
Well the 10th is a Wednesday....and I don't think the track is open.
Well the 10th is a Wednesday....and I don't think the track is open.
#37
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Another one bites the dust....CL-S kill....
Originally posted by Crazy AcurA
Looks like it is open during the week... couldnt we get more runs in if we go during the week? http://www.greatlakesdragaway.com/2002schedule.htm
Looks like it is open during the week... couldnt we get more runs in if we go during the week? http://www.greatlakesdragaway.com/2002schedule.htm
#38
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Another one bites the dust....CL-S kill....
Originally posted by Speedy3.2CL-S
Alot of people on that forum give others shit because they are all idiots and don't have proof. I have proof and usually back up everything with it. But still kids on that forum want to argue.
Yea I ran 14.8, with 1/4 tank of gas, no spare, no jack, and beating the shit out of the car. Clutch finanlly went. It went 14.8 at 94.6 mph stock. RARE occasions maximas hit 14s. Type-S hit them alot more often. The Maxima 5spd is a good 1/4 car, but on a roll or highway the type-s will for sure take one. I ran the guy I use to run in my Maxima all the time, Ants97se, we were basically even when we ran, sometimes he pulled, sometimes I pulled on him. But when we ran with the new car and another modded maxima, both 5spds, I went from 50mph to 110 and put over 2 car lengths on them, twice.
Alot of people on that forum give others shit because they are all idiots and don't have proof. I have proof and usually back up everything with it. But still kids on that forum want to argue.
Yea I ran 14.8, with 1/4 tank of gas, no spare, no jack, and beating the shit out of the car. Clutch finanlly went. It went 14.8 at 94.6 mph stock. RARE occasions maximas hit 14s. Type-S hit them alot more often. The Maxima 5spd is a good 1/4 car, but on a roll or highway the type-s will for sure take one. I ran the guy I use to run in my Maxima all the time, Ants97se, we were basically even when we ran, sometimes he pulled, sometimes I pulled on him. But when we ran with the new car and another modded maxima, both 5spds, I went from 50mph to 110 and put over 2 car lengths on them, twice.
blah blah blah blah....
#39
Originally posted by TypeSKiller
I wouldn't say that....5-speed 95-99 maximas have run 14.7-14.8 BONE STOCK...The fastest time...and I've only seen it ONCE for a stock CL-S on this board is 14.7....I wouldn't exactly call that whopping....seems to me the race would go to the better driver.
I wouldn't say that....5-speed 95-99 maximas have run 14.7-14.8 BONE STOCK...The fastest time...and I've only seen it ONCE for a stock CL-S on this board is 14.7....I wouldn't exactly call that whopping....seems to me the race would go to the better driver.
#40
Originally posted by Speedy3.2CL-S
There are only 1-3 maximas that have run 14.7-14.9 bone stock in 4th gen form. All the rest were 15s. He seems to hav forgotten to mention that. They HAVE run, yes, but very few. Many type-s cars have hit high 14s, you just do a search and you will see.
There are only 1-3 maximas that have run 14.7-14.9 bone stock in 4th gen form. All the rest were 15s. He seems to hav forgotten to mention that. They HAVE run, yes, but very few. Many type-s cars have hit high 14s, you just do a search and you will see.
BLAH BLAH BLAH BLAH..... Russ is