Blkout19

My buddy has a 6 speed always beats me by 3 or 4 car lengths ?
Same car same horsepower , I understand it's manual .
But he beats me in rolls too , 2nd gear , 3rd gear etc ,
Why is the 6 speed faster ?

fuzzy02CLS

iTrader: (2)

Less drivetrain loss. Different gearing. But 3 or 4 car lengths? That's a but much if it's stock to stock. You sure your car is working right? If your IMRC is not working your car will be pretty slow. Search on that.

justnspace

iTrader: (1)

also, lighter.

harvthesecond

Didn't the 6spd get an extra 20 or 40hp over the auto cars? Also the 6spd cars have limited slip front dif which will help on the launch.

civicdrivr

iTrader: (9)

Same engine, same power at the crank. But on a dyno, the difference between the two is about 20whp.

The automatic is about 70lbs heavier. Even though the automatic has a shorter final drive, the rest of the gearing is much taller then the 6MT.

Also, as harv mentioned, the 6MT has an LSD. The autos have an open diff. If you are racing from a dig, you also have VSA that will kill the power if it senses wheel slip.

fuzzy02CLS

iTrader: (2)

The auto I had was 205hp, 195t-198ish/tq, The 6MT was 215hp 205tq stock for stock, SAE corrected. And it did feel a little faster at higher rpms, but it wasn't a night & day difference. It was far easier to launch the auto then the 6mt.

If you do the math, the 6mt has about a 18% drivetrain loss & the auto has about a 21% loss.

civicdrivr

iTrader: (9)

^ Oddly enough, most of the stock 6MT dynos Ive seen were around 220whp, while the autos were in the 195-200whp range.

clpassenubye

iTrader: (20)

like civic said 3 to 4 car lengths is a bit much there has to be other reasons.

civicdrivr

iTrader: (9)

Blkout19

From a dig with vsa disabled he'll get me with about 3-4 car lengths , from a roll in second I'd say about 2 .
The auto is still pretty quick , it's only peak gears are 2nd & 3rd though.. & he does have 100,000 less miles then me lol so I'm sure that can come into play somewhere.
I'm over the auto , I wanna get a 6 m/t
on the 3rd tranny -_____-

Blkout19

Regardless his Cl is faster , I'll show you 2 races of both of us racing my buddy's maxima

Blkout19

My Cl vs the maxima

Blkout19

buddies Cl6

Blkout19

03CLSMT

your IMRC is probably stuck closed...order a new one but in the meantime you can open them up by clamping or zip tying the butterfly lever on the passenger side of the IM...it makes a huge difference, it happened to my car and my dads too. Also, what kind of maxima is that? what do they normally run in the 1/4?

Karanx7

iTrader: (2)

Maybe try closing your window?

Blkout19

Yeah ima have to look into that
& it's a 3.5 v6 , 5 more hp then the cl

clpassenubye

iTrader: (20)

Yes this happens to a lot of CL's its happened to me also and it definitely slows you down when it malfunctions its like driving a different car.

fsttyms1

My auto on the scale was about 200lbs heavier than the manual trans.

Blkout19

Is it something that needs to be taken to a shop ? Or a part to be replaced?

richardparker

iTrader: (7)

Try tying it open on a run.
When the last time the oil was changed ?
oil beyond it's time will make your car slower.
Did both of you only have one person in the car ?

Start sheding weight off the car and your ass then you can keep up

Blkout19

Oil was changed about 1000k ago , & I do have a 60 pound system in the truck.. But would that really make a difference?

CL-S progression 01

iTrader: (2)

i dunno what mods you have OP but I'd get a pair of headers for ur car and then ud be giving him a run for his money.

i raced a cl6 on the highway from 50mph or so to 120. and then a few other random rips (since we were headed in the same direction). but it wasn't that much faster surprisingly. like he only gained 2 car lengths

so we slow down roll windows down and he he asks me what i did to my car.. lol and i ask him if he was modded and he said headers and intake and i was surprised to hear that. I wanna race a stock cl-6 i think it' be a nailbiter

Blkout19

Well maybe my cars just coming to an end lol

civicdrivr

iTrader: (9)

Interesting, I went by the published numbers from Honda.

Blkout19

It's okay to drive it with it constantly open ?

CL-S progression 01

iTrader: (2)

blkout19 what mods do u have?

cause i had all my mods on my car to do that.

intake, headers, ud pulley, tb spacer, thermal gaskets, p/s pulley (not like that does anything tho), plenums.

they are fast.. i never really mind getting beat by a 6spd... lol

rp_guy

you might lose some torque on the low end but your top end will gain more

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Variabl...ntake_manifold

Blkout19

We're both bone stock

Blkout19

From driving with it zip tied open? I'm confused lol

gnuts

iTrader: (1)

The IMRC controls the opening and closing of the valve in the intake manifold. It stays shut at lower RPM for more torque and opens at higher RPM for more power. If yours is stuck closed (IMRC not functioning) then you're losing out on power up top. Just make sure it's working.

Not sure if this is true or not, but can you have someone rev the engine up to ?RPM and listen for the changeover, or put your hand on the manifold to feel it open?

civicdrivr

iTrader: (9)

If you take the plastic cover off the intake manifold, rev the car up to ~4k rpm, you should see the IMRC open on the left side of the manifold. You should also be able to hear it "click" as it opens and closes.

clpassenubye

iTrader: (20)

If you stand over your engine and have someone e rev the car over 4500 rpm's you should be able to hear it click open if its working I know I can hear mine click but you have to know what your looking and listening for.

If you do a search there was a post with a video showing how the IMRC works look for that so you know what your looking for.

03CLSMT

yeah take the plastic crap off the engine so u can see the IMRC move and you will see on the passenger side of the Intake Manifold the "lever" you can zip tie down to make it run open all the time. It makes a huge difference if yours isnt opening.

Some people on the boards actually take the IM off and dremel the butterflys completely out and port/polish it

Blkout19

Well thanks guys , I'm going to check it tomorrow to see if it's working .