Well, it's essentially done. The tuner's wife had a baby a week before I was supposed to get my car tuned, so I had to wait 5 agonizing weeks. It went on the dyno on Saturday and is running strong, but not entirely done (more on that later...)

New mods in Phase 5:
- K-Pro
- 3.0" pulley
- Bosch 725cc injectors
- machined VTC pulley to 45 degrees
- 375mL/min water/methanol nozzle
- Hytech header
- Hytech cat
- modified B-pipe on Comptech exhaust

I made 304whp/225wtq on a Dyno Dynamics dyno. I will upload the scanned plot later. Many people consider these the "heartbreaker" dynos, but I'm happy with the results. For the sake of consistency, I will also be making a few more pulls on the Dynojet I had run before. The consensus seems to be that on average, Dyno Dynamics read 10-15% lower than Dynojets so I'm hoping to see around 338whp/250wtq which would be a HUGE improvement over the previous setup (3.2" pulley untuned, 276whp/211wtq).

Initial impressions are . The car just pulls absurdly hard. Thanks to a good partial throttle tune, it's also as smooth as it was stock at any load. In order to prevent valve float, we kept the redline to 7600. Running a properly tuned setup with properly large injectors makes the engine feel so much more solid than before, and with the water/meth there is less chance of detonation issues at higher boost levels. Speaking with the tuner, he told me he kept it a conservative tune (timing limited to 21 degrees) rather than advancing ignition and cutting fuel to offset the water/meth. In fact, he actually tuned it the car to run without water/meth at all. By doing this, I can still run the car if there is an issue with the injection process (pump failure, nozzle clog, etc), yet I can also gain the cooling and octane boost advantages of the water/meth as the Stage 2 kit can inject progressively with boost levels. I won't be getting as large of a gain as I would have with a more aggressive tune (he thinks 15-20whp @ 26-27 degrees), but as this is my DD I need it to be reliable.

The Hytech header + cat just sings. I've mentioned it before, but I really disliked the raspy sound my car made with my CT header + RT cat. However, with the Hytech setup the raspiness is now completely gone, replaced by an insanely aggressive tone that is truly addicting. There were some minor fitment issues (initial bend on the primaries wasn't angled enough, needed to be heated and rebent), but it worked out fine in the end. I kept my Comptech catback as I believe it provides sufficient flow (2.5" B-pipe inlet to 2.25" Y-pipe to the mufflers). The B-pipe was shortened by about 1 foot, so this catback has to stay with the header+cat as one system.

Now for the vids:

Dyno pull (front)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LL5tOlIkwoI

Dyno pull (rear)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kCg6kZVeodM

Acceleration run (25-70MPH, 2nd-3rd gear)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_vDlT6seZiE

Acceleration run (40-115MPH, 3rd-4th gear) *Disclaimer* I don't normally speed this fast...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L_rxtHbYOQg

Issues
1) There is a bad buzzing sound that is coming through the speakers. It sounds to me like a ground loop issue, but I can't figure it out. The shop guys and I tried grounding the new ECU and the fuel rail, but nothing has worked so far.
2) Intermittently, I hit lean cut mode @ 3500 RPM (K-Pro senses high A/F ratio above acceptable limit and cuts fuel immediately, feels like car autobrakes HARD). It only activates at EXACTLY 3500 RPM and I'm not sure why.
3) Idle is a bit off. Even when the car is warmed up, it fluctuates between 700-850 RPMs. It hasn't stalled, but it's not smooth either.

Overall, barring the corrections of the issues above, I am more than satisfied with where the performance of my car is now. The way I see it, any more power than what I'm making would most likely require upgraded internals which I don't really want to think about (for now ). I feel like I'm at the limits of what's capable on a stock K24. I will post the Dynojet results once I get them this Wednesday .

 

beast! Doesn't seem like the needle flies up fast enough for a 300hp car, though... :/

If you do plan on doing internals, are you talking cylinder reinforcements? or maybe stage 2/3 cams?? hehe

 

HOLY S**T the MPH needle flies faster than your RPM needle. Looks and sounds crazy

 

Congrats on the new mods! Love the sound of the SC.

 

awesome!. you're my new role model

 

Congrats! Sounds like a beast!

Few questions: Is the fuel system stock other than the injectors? and were the injectors direct swaps or did they need some modification? Finally, have you noticed a significant decrease in mileage, when[if] not pushed too hard?

 

Congrats again Jason. The car sounded good when you brought it by on Saturday. Wednesday should be a great day, if all goes to plan...

 

So how much modding is needed to your exhaust to use the hytech header. I want to use it but don't want to mod my j's racing exhaust.

 

Very nice! I was just reading that N/A cams are good for supercharger and turbo setups.. I read it from Evans tunings page. It was a 60hp increase when they did the swap from CTR cams to Skunk2 Pro1 cams.. just a thought. And i also have the idle issue.. it does it for awhile and then it stops. My car still pulls like no other but your supercharger must be nuts!

 

epic. wicked. BRAVO

 

congrats on the setup! that is one. mean. tsx.

 

If you want to use the Hytech header you are not going to have a choice -- you'll have to modify the J's exhaust.

 

 

can I get pics from anyone on how much I will need to get it changed. Also does anyone know where I can just custom titanium exhaust parts made cause I want to get a custom b-pipe made for my J's exhaust anyways that doesnt have a resonator in it.

 

Thanks for the comments, guys. I really need the issues resolved to be truly satisfied (the lean cut issue is really pissing me off), but I can't deny the performance gains feel great.

I'm basically running the M62 at it's limit, so I'm not sure what more I can really gain from internal work. I've read that the stock rods are the weakest link in the K24 block, but I don't think I'm pushing enough power for an upgrade to be absolutely essential (unlike it will be for turbo guys). I would consider doing some headwork (springs, retainers, cams) to increase my redline and gain some power, but besides the fact that K24 piston speeds are already extremely fast at 7600RPMs, any additional revving would overdrive the blower past its efficiency point. If I do add cams, I know which ones I'd go with, but that won't be for some time. For now I'm pretty comfortable with where the car is right now.

The fuel system is more or less the returnless stock setup. The only adjustment besides the larger injectors is that the FPR was crushed slightly to increase fuel flow, but that was already done when the S/C was initially installed (Comptech includes a crusher tool with the kit). The shop recommended I go with the Bosch injectors because they apparently atomize fuel better than any other injectors out there, meaning they can yield an even fuel delivery without needing to boost pump pressure.

As for mileage, I'm still on my first tank of gas (almost done) so I can't really say how MPG is affected. I can let you know in a day or so.

You have the idle issue too? Did your tuner mention what it could be attributed to, and do you plan to have your cal adjusted?

I have one pic (below). With just the header attached, there was about a 6 inch gap between the header outlet and B-pipe inlet. Adding the cat in the mix required the B-pipe to be shortened by about a foot or so. We just reused the flange that came with the catback.

 

Looks awesome Dayta! It must be a lot of fun to drive. That thing is a beast! Thanks for the videos too. Do you get any traction in 1st gear? You should post a video of first gear. I bet you rev through first like it's nothing.

I just got my K-Pro in on Saturday. Still tuning everything. I have the idle issue too. I've asked Hondata about this and he says that it takes 3 full driving cycles for the ECU to relearn the idle. So hopefully this problem improves for us. My idles seems to fluctuate from 500-650 RPMs. It doesn't die, but it's not smooth like you mentioned.

I've hit lean cut too. I've been talking to an RSX K-Pro expert and he says "conservative lean protection can be a real drag as it tends to cut in on you when it shouldn't. If you're confident in your tune, you could try turning it off. I've hit it too already, and I'm trying to figure out why it's coming. Do you have both lean protection 1 and 2 turned on in your K-Pro calibration?

 

You can also try to see via a Datalog why you're hitting any lean conditions. Datalog the lean cut and look at everything leading up to it to see why it is coming.

 

I thought we fixed it but it actually just started..

 

Even with the LSD and warm tires, traction in 1st gear is hard to achieve. Alot of throttle modulation is required, but it's doable if I focus.

So are you tuning the car yourself? If so, props . Interesting info about the ECU relearning the idle point. Not exactly sure what you mean by driving cycles, but I've run my car a number of times since Saturday and the rough idle is still there.

AFAIK, both lean protection windows are turned off. That is why I'm even more baffled at why I'm having a lean cut issue. I just read this off the Hondata website which might help shed some light on our problem:

As for datalogging, I'm a Mac user so I need to first find either a PC or a Windows XP disc so I can upload Kmanager.

 

Yeah the only issue is finding someone that can weld titanium. That is a shame the header is so long then though. Maybe I will just get it and have a 6 inch custom test pipe made.

 

That sounds like your best bet by far. But that would screw up your old stance of not wanting to have to swap parts for emissions -- not only would you have to swap on the test pipe, you'd have to swap out the Hytech to be able to run your OEM cat... (DO IT)

 

kmanager should run fine with VMware fusion

 

Dayta, you should turn on the on-board datalogging. I'm thinking about adding a switch so that I can turn it on whenever I want. You can also turn it on based on certain parameters too, such as TPS Position and RPMs. Then just use a friends laptop to grab the datalogs when you need them.

 

Thanks for the heads up .

Yeah, I was reading up on the on-board datalogging option as well. My only concern is it's limited ability to pick up error codes (only 60%).

I think adding a switch would be the best choice as it sounds like setting up auto-activate parameters would tie up internal memory with unwanted datalogs that could only be deleted manually with a laptop. In other words, K-Pro would not be able to record your most recent datalog if all the internal memory had already been used up to save previous runs.


These lean cut issues are happening more frequently. I'm noticing now that they're happening at partial throttle when the car isn't fully warmed up, making me think it's a open vs closed loop issue. However, I'm also monitoring my A/F ratio point at 3500 RPMs and I do notice a lean spike up to the high 15:1s (only in vacuum, not boost).

 

Under the parameters->Protection. What is the value for the cold boost cut? I've noticed that my engine wants to cut when it's cold too. It doesn't like me going to boost when it's not fully warmed up. Still trying to figure this out. I've learned to just stay off of boost until the engine has warmed up.

It's normal to see the AF ratio spike up if you're off the throttle. It will running especially lean, when decelerating and you are off the throttle. If the engine is under load and it goes lean, that's when you should be concerned. My guess is that the low speed (non-vtec) fuel table needs to be tuned. When the engine is cold, then it will not go into the high speed (vtec). The tuner probably spent a lot of time tuning the high speed vtec table, but may just have to tweak the non-vtec low speed table.

My idle also seems to be getting better. I made a change, but I want to confirm it's definitely better before I tell you guys what I did.

 

I won't know exactly what the calibration settings are until I get my hands on a laptop. However, my issue happens at partial throttle when I'm still in vacuum, so I don't think it has to do with the boost cut parameter.

I'm aware of the A/F spike when off-throttle, but the lean cut happens during acceleration. Like you said, my guess is that the low cam mappings need adjusting. Specifically, I think more fuel needs to be added pre- and post- VTEC engagement in order to prevent lean cut from hitting. Also, I need to check the parameters to make sure VTEC engagement is a window and not a specific RPM/kPa.

Funny that you mentioned the idle issue again because mine seems to be getting better (though still not completely smooth).

 

I was out tuning earlier and I think I was able to fix my lean cut issue. I had to add some fuel on the low cam table, 2500-3000 RPMs, in the area right before boost kicks in (-10 vacuum to 0.5 psi boost range). Basically, the area we were talking about.

Still tuning out some of the knock, but everything is going well. I have the AF ratios close to 12.0 under boost! You gotta get a laptop so you can datalog man! It's a lot of fun and then we'll also be able to trade datalogs

 

Eaton's got a much better blower out now... time to upgrade???

 

hmmm i cant wait til i get an sc... i think an eeepc would be perrrrrfect for tuning =)

 

you don't need anything nearly that powerful!

 

I like 11.8 better

 

I'm loving boost. Got my car back from Josh today... that whine's addicting. DAYTA and I are heading to the dyno at 8 tonight, so look for more posts later/tomorrow...

ps Kenny, do you still have the autotensioner you bought? For some bizzare reason, I got a manual tensioner. I had assumed the autotensioner was included with all kits nowadays. So now, my ETD has no chance in hell of fitting, but it fits DAYTA's car fine with his autotensioner. I may want to take yours off your hands if you don't plan to install it... shoot me a PM.

 

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Is it a dramatic change to the way the car drives or just more low to mid range torque? I am getting my kit put in while I am in Greece and I am really wondering what to expect. I don't know if I am expecting the car to be a rocket (please everyone, take the word "rocket" lightly here) or just more responsive in the low/mid range of the RPMs.