acuracxs

Who here thinks swiveling is stupid ? I think it is, because I do not see any benefits other wow it is cool.


Lets say you drive straight and the light shines in front of you which is fine because that is where you want to see anyway.



The cars with swiveling headlights, the lights actually turn left if you are going left and right if you are going right. In theory I think that would be beneficial. But in reality it would not benefit a driver at all. If you are making a turn the headlight is fixed to the car so where ever the car points to the headlights points in the the direction you are going already. But if you have those swiveling headlights lets say you turn right the lights also turn right then it would be shining too much to the right.

accsuperstar

the lights dont seem to turn that much. you can go to www.bmwusa.com. they have a little flash model of what it looks like. of course i havent seen it in person so i cant really judge it. btw new 3 series led tailights are HOT

TSXautoXer

I think it's a great design. Your theory is true only when the car rotates and point to the direction you're going towards during a turn. That means, you'll have to kick the tail out, and drift through the corners in order for the fixed light to shine at the right direction all the time. That's pretty difficult to achieve...

I autocross at evening/night time, and most of us turn OFF our headlight and just depends on the venue's illumination. One of the reason being it's not shining at the direction we want to go towards. Instead it's towards the outside corner cones.

James

i think it should work well... it only turns 15º or so in a lexus rx330 which shouldnt impact the general coverage area you want to be visible to you. i think it's a neat idea.

dabuda

yeah, i dont think those swivel lights turn that agressively. for example if you're making a 90º (right turn) the lights won't swivel 90º. it's a slight swivel like james pointed out so you should still be able to see in front of you.

moda_way

The major component you're missing from your hypothesis is speed. The adaptive systems know that if you are turning at a corner light that they will not be aiming the light into the corner. Now if you are at speed, then the lights (follow me here) adapt to the turn angle, rate of speed, angle of incline/decline, and put the lights where your eyes would naturally be.

I think adaptive systems are great and it was the only option I didn't get that I wanted when I went and decided on the TSX.

acuracxs

I still think it is useless, because the lights already shine where you are going anyway, regardless of how many degrees the lights swivel.

acuracxs

From what you saying is that on a conventional system the light does not follow where your going ? That is not so.

acuracxs

Okay so lets say you make a 90 degree turn, the conventional lights follow wherever the car is turning in this it is 90 degrees.


So why even bother with the swiveling lights if it only swivels a small degree.



Remember conventional headlights already cover what is in front of you and also about 15 degrees to each of the side.

magic_man

When turning, your car is NOT pointing in the direction it is going. If it were, your tires would be pointed straight. Since they're not, you car is constantly behind the curve. The headlights, if fixed in a straight alignment, will always trail the optimal lighting angle of the turn by a direct proportion to the angle of your tires. In other words, if your tires are at a 45 degree angle to the right when you are driving, then your actual path of travel is roughly 45 degrees to the right of the center of your light pattern. This isn't an exact science because of the possibility of tire slip, wheel alignment, etc. However, adaptive lighting systems attempt to compensate for your radial path by aiming the headlights into your turn so that you have a better chance of seeing what is approaching on a curve. Even if they only turn 15 degrees into a 45 degree turn, it's better than 0 degrees into the turn. The point of adaptive headlights is to help see what's ahead of you. In a turn, what's ahead of you is either to the right or the left of straight ahead.

MrChad

I think the TSX should have 3 headlights!!

the one extra [in the middle] should turn and leave the 2 outside stationary. This would be great except................


.............Tucker already did that in 1948.

AdamC

There's no doubt adaptive headlights system is beneficial.
I have sat in a bimmer with this option to let you know that it's well calibrated to give the driver the best visibility under almost any steering/speed inputs.

moda_way

Thank you for being the 2nd person to refer to them as adaptive; me being the first.

I completely agree with you. I originally was going after a BMW 330Ci, but didn't like BMW's nickel and diming me to death.

acuracxs

When turning, your car is IS pointing in the direction it is going, its just the wheels are turning at a greater degree. That is why I agree with on this statement : Since they're not, you car is constantly behind the curve. But remember your headlights has the light pattern spread to somethin like 160 degrees which is more then enough light the road even in a turn.

How many of you make a turn to an on ramp and NOT focus your attention in front of you ?

moda_way

Honestly, if you haven't driven a car with adaptive headlights, YOU WON'T UNDERSTAND.

Trust me.. it makes a difference. The beam of light on standard headlights are concentrated very far forward and at the center. Now, imagine that exact view but in the turn of a corner at speed.

Trust me... take the time some late afternoon and test drive a car with adaptive systems. Try the RX 330 or any BMW with this option. You may just understand what AdamC, MrChad and I are talking about.

phile

Because that's all it takes. Like you said, we look forward even if we make a turn. Swiveling the lights a small degree to the left or right is enough for your eyes to see. We have bifocal vision, our primary field of view is ahead of us, and we can only see a few degrees to either our left or right without turning our heads, thus the headlights don't need to turn so aggressively to help.

MrChad

Adaptive headlights are owed:



It made sense then (1948) it makes sense now.
If you drive with any degree of forethought you should always look past the turn. These help!

magic_man

I stand corrected. At any particular instant in time of the curve, yes, your car is pointing in the direction it is traveling. However, when you are driving, you aren't interested in your instantaneous position/direction, you're concerned with your forecasted position/direction. In a curve, at any point in time after the immediate, your direction is different than it previously was. Think of reading a compass. In a turn, the compass is continuously moving to indicate your current heading. The headlights are compensating accordingly for your continuously changing direction. So, like somebody here just said, you shouldn't be looking straight ahead in a turn, you should be looking into the turn. I don't think that anybody is debating whether or not you get any light into the turn with standard headlamps. Adaptive headlights just aid you by providing MORE light in the direction of your intended course. It never hurts to have more useable light in your field of view.

You can count me as one who doesn't focus directly in front of me when turning into a ramp.

acuracxs

[QUOTE]Originally posted by moda_way
[B]Honestly, if you haven't driven a car with adaptive headlights, YOU WON'T UNDERSTAND.

Trust me.. it makes a difference. The beam of light on standard headlights are concentrated very far forward and at the center. Now, imagine that exact view but in the turn of a corner at speed.

Trust me... take the time some late afternoon and test drive a car with adaptive systems. Try the RX 330 or any BMW with this option. You may just understand what AdamC, MrChad and I are talking about. [/


Yes I have driven the RX 330 with adaptive headlights and still think the technology is more of a gadget then anything else.

Nachoman

Think of it this way, when you are walking around the halls at work and get to a corner, do you: a) charge around the corner with your head pointed straight ahead like you have a neck brace on, or b) turn your head as you round the corner to see down the next hallway. I hope its b) cuz otherwise i wouldn't want to work in the same building as you. in b), your head looks ahead of you body, forcasting the space ahead. now imagine it is pitch black and you have one flashlight but your arms fell off. do you a) mount it on your shoulder or b) mount it on your head? obviously if you mount it on your head you will see what is ahead of you better since your head looks in front of your direction of travel. same with adaptive lights, they don't merely point straight in front of you, they point ahead of your direction of travel.

acuracxs

With your example above it is not same for a car, because the car has two lights and the spread of the light is much more then the example above.

acuracxs

[QUOTE]Originally posted by acuracxs
[B]Yes I trust you and I know that it makes a difference. My point is that the difference is neglible so useless in my book.

acuracxs

[QUOTE]Originally posted by acuracxs
[B]

Also if I we're to put $500 into adaptive headlights (which only turns 5 degree). I rather put that money in HID fogs/driving in the bumper so that it can be more than 5 degrees and you get better visibility then adaptive lights ever will.

acuracxs

With your example a) charge around the corner with your head pointed straight ahead like you have a neck brace on,.

How is this possible in a car ? The car would have to pointed straight and wheels turned 90 degrees and be moving like a sidewinder. The car would more realistically represent you example in b)

TSXautoXer

acuracxs, I was thinking, maybe you haven't had the habit of 'looking ahead' while driving. This concept may be a little hard to grasp, but I'll try my best to explain.

For example, when you're approaching a 90 degrees right turn, first you will brake, downshift, and begin turning your steering. At this point, the car is just starting to turn, but not yet rotated to the "90 degrees" direction. However, at this point, you should already be looking at the "90 degrees" direction, but alas, the conventional lighting will not lit up that part because the beam pattern didn't have that much of a spread. With adaptive lighting, the headlight will turn towards that "90 degrees" direction. Not by much, but certainly wil light up the area much sooner than a conventional headlight. Sometimes during driving, it's neccesary to look out of other openings than just the windshield. In the example I've given, the driver should look at his 2 to 3 o'clock direction, which is between the extreme right side of the windshield and passenger side window. (A pillar will block part of the view though.)

TSXautoXer

A lot of drivers don't have the habit anyways. It's something that needs training. And actually, I will pay $500 for that system. It's just safer.

Nachoman

My point is that your head will be looking ahead of where your car is pointed. if your head lights could follow your head as it looks ahead, then it is of greater benefit than if they did not move at all. Nobody is debating the fact that you can see just fine with nonadaptive headlights, the spread of the light will certainly cover enough area for you to see. The point is that with nonadaptive headlights, the majority of the light will not be pointing where your is pointing in a turn.

nguyendminh

The concept of looking a ahead is not hard for me. I do drive a motorcycle. Now you do me a favor and drive behind a car hat has HID headlights without adaptive lights such asl the G35 or a BMW. as you can see the spread of the light is almost 180 degrees, I am guessing about 170 degrees, which is more enough spread without the aid of adaptive lights, that is why I think it is useless technology. Maybe if you use adaptive lights on halogen lamps then I would see it as beneficial.

TSXautoXer

Oh, almost all of my friend's car has HIDs and non of them is adaptive, and well, 170 degrees? Yeah, right.

Scientifically impossible.

acuracxs

I didn't say all cars i specifically said the G35 and the BMW.

MrChad

I can't see why everyong is arguing against adaptive headlights?

No headlight is anywhere neat the quality of daylight. Infact, even HID's are a pretty pathetic light source as they can still be out driven.

So I can't see why every little bit of help wouldn't be wanted. I wouldn't mind adaptive headlights if the option package I chose on a car came with them.

Until I get night vision super powers for my first genie wish I'm going to be happy with all the light output/placement technology I could get from a set of headlights.

I feel this thread has turned into the My TSX is not available with this option, therefore its not a useful option.

I personnally can't wait until Honda mergers Asimo gained technology with the TSX-Accord. Then when I talk into my Honda watch my car will pick me up at the front door in the rain. But, I guess if somebody else uses this technology first it will be unneccesary.

phile

Everyone? It's only acuracsx and his other screen name that's arguing against it.

MrChad

Oh! my bad.

TSXautoXer

We had 3 BMWs in our group. A 528i, 325i, and an M3. I understand what you're arguing about, but no automotive headlights have a 170 degrees EVEN spread. The brightest part of the beam pattern is always in front of the car, not the side of the car. Also, the beam pattern is not a even at the edge too.

I was just wondering, have you been to BMW's website to learn more about the technology? If you have already done so, and yet still think it's more of a gadget, and unneccesary, then that'll remain your point of view. But for sure, an adaptive headlight has more advantage over a conventional light. Since any additional light coverage on the road can only lead to goodness.

MrChad

This is the thread that doesn't end.

Yes it goes on and on my friend.

Some people started typing it not knowing what it was.

And they'll just keep on typing it forever just because.

This the thread that doesn't end........

acuracxs

Yes I have seen the animation on the adaptive lights on the BMW site. Everybody has their views and conceptions. So I will my stand my ground and so will most you, which is okay. This what a forum is about. I did not start this thread without doing any research, I did drive the RX 330 with adaptive headlights and think that it is a gimmick. I also saw the flash animation and it looked useful, but it is not real life. I also drove behind and also inside a friends BMW and G35 (both HID) and noticed the spread is sufficient, it maybe not be 170 degrees, but sufficient. I picked 170 degrees as a best estimate without any scientific measurement.

1SICKLEX

This sounds like people that did not have HIDs when they first came out and people thought they were a gimmick. Now once you have HIDs you can't go back.

Same with headlights that aim in the direction you turn in.

phile

Not really, the majority here feel that they are beneficial and not just a gimmick. I was just thinking about this exact thread last night as I drove through pouring rain...hurricane Isabel is making her way to Jersey. I could barely see through the rain ahead of me, when it was time to make a turn, my eyes were always a few milliseconds ahead of the path of my headlights. I was pretty much look through the dark and waiting for the light to illuminate the road with every turn I made. I says to myself: "Self, it would be nice if you had them swiveling headlights."