I have a 2000 Honda Odyssey with Navi as well as my TSX, so here's my view on long term use:

* I wouldn't buy another car without Navi -- I like it that much. (And I did not consider the TSX without it.)

* I use it every day, although perhaps not every trip, in either car. I like knowing where I am as well as where I'm going.

* Navigator calling out turns is helpful when I'm thinking about other things.

* Even when I'm not using it to go to a location, I like knowing the names of upcoming cross streets, etc. Seeing the neighborhood has resulted in my finding short cuts, etc.

* The 2000 Honda Navigation System is not showing signs of age. Sure, it doesn't take voice commands, but it Navigates well (I bought an update disk, but it wasn't absolutely necessary). The hardware won't be obsolete. It will continue to do what it was designed to do, no matter how fast new systems are.

* The components seem unlikely to fail, and are covered by my Hondacare for 7 years. It's mostly electronic, with few mechanical parts and I've had no problem with it. I have Hondacare (more for the power doors and iffy transmission on the 2000 Odyssey) and it covers the Navigation system as well.

Of course, your opinions may vary. My wife (much to her surprise as well as mine) likes the Navigation systems and uses them when she goes someplace new. (She does not use them daily.)

 

Real men don't even ask directions, much less spend $2k for an electric map.

 

Real men don't get lost with the Navi.

 

What you are doing here is comparing a device with an extremely limited set of functions to a much more full-featured, and useful iteration of the same kind of device. The type of handheld you can get for $150 can be extremely accurate. Because, accuracy is just dependent on the ability to read the GPS signals. But, the amount of information it can covey is limited. It doesn't plot directions on the fly, give you larger high quality maps on the screen, or any of the other useful information that you get with the Nav system in the Honda/Acura products. Also, you are dependent on another computer (laptop or desktop).

Its more than apples and oranges here. It is comparing a device that has limited use for the typical driver, to the most effective route navigational aid that is available in any car. I've used just about every GPS out there and nothing comes close to the Alpine/Honda unit.

 

Real men know a Nav system is a lot more than just an "electric map."

 

All in all, I'd have to say this is a fair comparison.

 

On the other hand, lets also keep in mind another point: If you buy the sort of device RB1 is talking about here, you can take it with you on a buisness trip, or when you are driving in another car.

 

I don't have Nav (not available in Canada), but I'm not so sure I'd buy it if it were. I guess I'd really have to try one to know for sure. However, I do have a Garmin eTrex Legend GPS that I've used for travelling and it is kind of handy. I do like being able to create routes and waypoints on my computer ahead of time and just dump them to the GPS. The Legend has mapping and upcoming turn indicators and so on. In some cases it has more data than my paper maps. I don't think it does restaurant lookups without some addon software.

Honestly, I can't think of anything the handheld doesn't do that I would actually want. Not to say that the Nav wouldn't be a cool toy, I'm just not sure that I could justify spending $2K for it.

 

 

I respect your opinion about this. But, I suspect you would feel differently if you had spent a week in a car with Nav.

Here is just an example of what Nav could do that you Garman can't: A few weeks ago, I found myself in Pasadena (an area a bit north of Los Angeles) unexpectantly. I was with a friend, and we remembered that there was good Thai place in that neck of the woods. I could not, however, remember exactly where. So, I typed the name of the place into the NAV, and the NAV quickly gave me voice directions right to the door.

Or, when I first bought the car, I was on the road to Yosemite when I had car trouble (that is a loooong story in itself). So, I just gave NAV the verbal command "Find nearest Acura dealer" and it took me right to the door.

Or, yesterday, I was at a party, and a few of my friends asked me to meet then at a local department store afterwards. Once again, I had no idea where it was, but Nav got me there.

I've said it before, but I'll echo it one more time. Once you drive a car with NAV, you'll never want to go back.

 

Pad Thai
Colorado Blvd.
2 Blocks West of Rosemead Blvd.

I've got a Navi in my head!

 

Darth,

You do know that a pda based system could do the same? (sans the voice control). Given, it's not as elegant as a built in unit but it is a hell of alot cheaper, and it's portable.

A friend of mine showed me his PPC based system using Bluetooth (Pharos GPS). Real nice. Turn by turn directions, site locations, places of interest, route re-calculation, etc.

Needless to say, I'll be getting rid of my Ipaq 1910 and getting an Ipaq 4100 with BT and WiFi and the Pharos GPS. Cost = < $600. Not too shabby.

 

Actually, I was thinking of Saladag on Fair Oak. That said, you do have a good point. If you live in an area where you know the streets, shopes, and places to eat very well, and you really travel to places where you don't know the streets, Nav might not be that useful.

I wonder how many outside of LA realize what a Thomas Guide is?

 

I have five PDAs (Two Pocket PCs, two palm pilots, and one "other"). It's a hobby of mine. So, I've looked at most of the GPS solutions out there.

The best GPS's for the Pocket PC still do not have nearly the capabilities of the Alpine Nav system.

 

Care to elaborate a bit on the differences? I'd be interested to hear. Have you used the Pharos products?

 

One major difference is that you have much more data with you on your DVD disk than you can fit on a CF or SD card. So, you get more detailed information and more accurate maps. And, of course, you go from the 3.5" screen to the much larger screen in the NAV unit. The NAV unit in the Hondas is also much, much faster.

Yes, I've seen the Pharos. It is pretty nice for a PDA-based solution. But, as you've observed, it is not as elegant as the Alpine systems and does not have voice control. It also has fewer features, overall.

BTW, Consumer Reports did a rundown on the GPS soultions in a recent issue. I think their conclusions are consistent with my own.

 

I opted not to buy a NAV-equipped TSX. I weighed the advantages/disadvantages of it carefully and decided that it was not worth it for me.

I rarely drive the TSX in unfamiliar surroundings, and I already own an auto-routing handheld GPS (Garmin GPS V).

My $400 GPS V can be used in any of my vehicles. It's used most frequently in my SUV, which is the vehicle that sees unfamiliar territory most often.

I'm already familiar with the operation of my GPS V, and I didn't want to learn a whole new GPS system.

I didn't like the fact that the radio and climate controls force you to use the LCD screen. If the LCD/touchscreen interface ever malfunctions, you not only lose NAV, but you have reduced functionality of your radio and AC.

As confirmed by several Acura salespeople I spoke with, pre-owned NAV-equipped Acura vehicles often sell for nearly the same price as non-NAV vehicles. In other words, a NAV-equipped car will experience more depreciation than a non-NAV car.

NAV software is still somewhat immature. New features such as topographic 3D map views will be available in future NAV systems, making current offerings seem as modern as Windows95. For example, take a look at this.

With that being said, if you've never owned any kind of GPS navigation system and you have a penchant for getting lost in your own neighborhood, it's probably a good tool.

 

I'm not here to bash handheld GPS's, only to ask some information because I've never tried one. But what other features does it have besides strictly nav based features. The built in has calendar, pretty advanced little calculater, calculates fuel economy, average speed, can auto dimm at night, remembers addresses for multiple people (2) with password protection, remembers previous destination, controls my radio and ac, etc. All this and it takes up no more room in the car than if I didn't have the navigation. I guess without using one I see the handhelds as a cheaper, albeit less elegant, less integrated, and less full featured alternative. I don't know if portability is necessarily good, because knowing myself, the first time I forget my pda is the time I'll need it. When it's built in, you can't forget it.

 

If you use a GPS system with a Pocket PC, the options are pretty much unlimited. It can not only do all that PIM stuff (calendar, calculator, etc) but can also check your e-mail and surf the net!

 

I get it. I'll admit the handhelds do sound pretty nice. Any trouble with the smaller screens, or is it something you get used to? Acura needs to build in satelite internet connections and then the built in navigtation would be really impressive. Would probably mean a monthly charge which would suck though.

 

Don't get me wrong. I'm not advocating for the Pocket PC approach. The screen is small (3.5 inches, or 3.8 depending on the model) and they're much slower than the NAV unit in the TSX. However, you can take a Pocket PC with you and it is a powerful device for other purposes.

 

I don't deny that might be the case. I like gadgets too, it wouldn't take much convincing.

However, the reality is that for me, if I'm in a city I don't know well, chances are > 95% that I flew there and I'm driving a rental. So what I'd do is, before I leave home, load up the handheld with a few waypoints and maybe a route from the airport to my hotel and so on. I'd also typically load up some other travel info or mapquest maps on my Palm which I'd have anyway. For me, long trips with the car just aren't likely.
Actually, except for the voice directions, the eTrex Legend could do that, with this software. I'm not sure if it could "find nearest Acura dealer" or not, but with 5 million businesses in the db, I'm thinking the chances are pretty good. I'm not really arguing that a handheld is the only way to go. It's just one way, and seems adequate for me. The main things it doesn't do that I do think would be handy (but probably not worth $2K) are the fuel calculations and other trip computer functions. The handheld is pretty good wrt current speed, avg speed, ETA, etc, provided it has accurate route data (waypoints) for the trip.
That's kind of what I'm half-afraid of.

 

Wow, i get back from work to see 40 more posts on this,what did i start?
xplorx4, you have made some valid points about more than just the nav being inoperable (radio/AC) if the Nav unit breaks.

Do other acura and honda Nav units also control the radio and AC?
I know it is a big (IF) the nav breaks, but if it did, i would be suffering big time in south texas with NO A/C!! If this happened after warranty (which it probably would-murphy's law) then we would be talking big $$$ for the fix. I'm an ex- honda technician and realize no wrench turning in the world will help me out with electronics!
Shit, i'm undecided again!!...LOL

 

Well i guess i should give my opinion as well. I too have the navi -- its my first car with navi -- and it has proved to be invaluable to me time and time again. Many have said that there are multiple possiblities with the navi that you cannot forsee until you actually own a car with such a system. This is too true.

I recently moved to NJ and am not familiar with the area. The roads and towns are VERY hard to navigate through, IMO, if you are not famiar with the area. So needless to say i use it all the time.

But even in PA where i am from, i use it. i type in my destination just to have a real time estimate of miles-to-destination and time-remaining. Someone calls my cell -- where are you? -- i tell them i am 13 miles from their house going south on Rt 1. It has already payed for itself for me, because i do a lot of driving.

And yes its true -- once you go navi, you wont be able to get a car without it. In my situation that is 100% true.

 

Actually I always thought that Saladang kinda sucked... Pad Thai is the best (and cheapest) thai food in that area... where I don't live. All you need is a Zagat and a Thomas Guide and you're set!

 

Don't be a dork.

 

A question for all of you touting PDA-based or handheld nav systems, or saying you don't think it's worth it: have you ever owned a built-in nav system?

 

Well, here's my take. Consider that for the same price I could buy:

3 complete home computers

A home computer, two 31" T.V's and a stereo system

Or, you could completely furnish a room in your house.

Or buy a washer/dryer, stove, refrigerator, and dishwasher.

Or you can have a little 8" screen in your car that gives directions and calls restaurants.

For folks with "money to burn", I'd say sure, go for it. They won't miss the $2000.

EDIT: Oh, and for those of you in your earlier 20's, that same $2000 invested now compounds to about $45,000 by the time you retire (at an 8% annual return)

 

i rarely use mine... but when i do it pays for itself.

the navi has saved me HOURS out of many a trip. the `detour` function saves lives. heh

 

Let's just be happy that we have the option of Navi for our cars. I for one have it and love it. If it were not an option people would be complaining about it for not having the option.

I see the portable navi as a handy alternative. Much like a portable cd player with that little tape thingy that you put in the cassette desk. Useful, until you hit a bump and the darn thing slides under your seat.

Also, the navi for me is all about the custom look and additional functions not included in the handheld. The portable unit is neat, but I would hate to have to take it down after every trip I make.

This car only costs $28,000 with Navi!! Let's stop being so cheap!!

 

My question is where are you pulling a consistent 8% return.

gsi00154 is my brother and he invited me over to check you guys out I'm visiting from clubcelica.com and rx8fourms.com. I'm a pro-navi person myself. I'm in the market for an RX-8 and my brothers Navi put me over the top for the that decision in my car.

For those of us that are homeonwers the point about buying accessorys is pretty much moot. Sure enough you could save 15k if you decided to go with a Kia over the TSX. But, I would suspect that the average TSX owner is not trying to squeeze into the car. IMO the 2K point is kinda moot on a 26K+ car. I mean if that is the case then you should be out homeshopping and not car shopping. Buy a car over 25K when you are in an apartment is kinda dodgy anyways. But, that's just me.

I can respect the opinion of those who are just flat out against it. To each his own. I also readily submit that if you live in a small city or town and you don't travel much then the navi would be a waste outside of the wow factor which I agree isn't worth 2K or .5k for that matter. I would note the inherent dangers of reading a map while driving as well as reading a map at night. Most people don't get lost in the daytime.

My brother touched the point on a portatble that I would make.

To me I look at it like this. How much is my time worth? Of course the navi will have a novelity factor for places that you already know how to get to but, that one time you don't know you will be counting your lucky stars. To me if you can afford it and you like it there shouldn't be a reason not to get it.

 

The bottom line for me: I am willing to bet that all of those who think the Navi is not worthwhile have never owned a car (or driven one for a more then a test drive) that had a high caliber navi system. Once you have it, you'll never want to be without it.

Again, however, I have to acknowledge that I live in a sprawling complex urban environment. If you are going to need NAVI anywhere, it is here.

 

I say again: have you ever owned a built-in nav system?

 

I have driven several cars that have them. Not exactly "owned", but close enough IMHO.

 

i love all these people sayign navi money could be used for investment.

lol

navi is no more of a luxury then power/heated seats, or auto climate control, 17in wheels, powerful stereo, dimming mirrors, or any other amentities the TSX might have.

so if your so concerned about money why didnt you just buy a Civic? you dont NEED anything the TSX has. you certainly DONT NEED the premium you pay for the Acura nameplate... which is certainly in excess of $2000.

 

Actually, I did buy a car that costs about $10,000 less than a TSX w/NAVI. And it has most (but of course not all) the goodies, too.

 

I assume soop was being a little rhetorical here.

I don't think the TSX costs 2K more than a "comparable" Accord --
not that there really is a comparable Accord, but we'll give it the benefit of the doubt....

 

uummmm. i do believe an accord v6 w navi is like 25k.

 

It's not close enough. You need to spend two weeks with one and you'll never go back. Or don't if you're looking for that $45K in retirement.

 

It's a little more than that but the point is made, although it's not nearly as cut and dry as that. Off topic though for this thread.