freeone

Going to purchase a car by Monday morning. Choices are between the two.
1. 2006 TSX, 6 speed, navigation with 20k miles. Asking $23,987. Will not budge on selling for less than $23,700.

2. 2004 TL, 6 speed, navigation with 54k miles. Asking $22,244. Will sell to me for $20,000! It's "Certified pre-owned," so it'll come with a 12 month bumper-to-bumper warranty, and a 7 yr power train warranty, 100k mile from original purchase date. Which gives me about 3 years power train warranty.

I am pissed off that they wouldn't budge on the price. Their reason is that it is priced to sell (yeah right ) and that they already reduced it $2,000 from last month. Well, to me, you overpriced it by $2,000 last month. Not my fault that you didn't price it accordingly. What matters is the market value for it and what someone is willing to pay for it.

Obviously, the market told you that you mispriced it.

Which one should I choose? Yes, I've test driven both and both very nice!

club_euro2

I would go with the tsx. I would shop around though. 23k is kind of high.
08 tsx auto/non navi

Jim Holloman

Both seem to be reasonable deals, so it ought to come down to which type of car do you prefer; a small, taut, sporty, car with excellent handling or a car that is larger, heavier, and with a softer ride and handling that is not as quick and agile as the TSX. The TSX will give you a little better mileage.

In regard to the TSX, my observations generally show a depreciation allowance of 0.25 to 0.28 per mile.

A new, 2008, non-nav, is $28,900, so I presume a new, 2008, with nav would be $30,900 or at least $29,900 with a discount.

So, 30,900 - 23,700 = $7,200 / 20,000 = 0.36 per mile depreciation.

At 29,900 - 23,700 = $6,200 / 20,000 = 0.31 per mile depreciation.

Let's say we consider a car fully depreciated at 120,000 miles; ignoring a salvage value of perhaps $100.00. Then, a new car at $28,900 would incur a depreciation rate of 28,900 / 120,000 = 0.24 per mile; ignoring any maintenance cost.

If the 2006 TSX has an interior, and exterior, that are in near mint condition, then the 2006 is close to being a 2008. The dealer is allowing about 0.30 per mile for depreciation. So, in my opinion, not a bad deal. If the original warranty transfers, then you still have about 2 years and 30,000 miles under warranty. You might even get a better warranty.

I don't think I could make these calculations with a BMW, or MB, or Audi because the maintenance costs becomes a wild card. I do recall an unusually high incidence of transmission failures in the TL's at around 120,000-150,000 miles. No such record yet for the TSX's.

ak3883

Insurance might be higher for a TL, but a slightly older TL and slightly newer TSX might work out about even. If you can, find out. For my insurance company(USAA)I can get quotes right on their website, for any vehicle. Pretty neat.

Also, 04 TL was the first year of the 3rd gen TL, be a bit cautious there. Might be worth taking a look at the TL TSBs for the most common issues(if they are linked in the respective TL forum like we have for the TSXs). I'm sure you have read about all the issues with the 1st year TSXs. Many feel 06 was the sweet spot for TSXs, that's the year it got the refresh and more features, little better engine, etc.

davidspalding

Get a used car price report from Consumer Reports on that TSX, that'll tell you with some certainty if that price is high or fair for 6MT with Navi (which I understand is hard to find, so in demand). I have a 2006 5AT and love it. 2007 only added TPMS, big whoppy. You might also check if they have updated the DVD for the Navi system (2007 disc?).

BTW, that's pretty low mileage, depending on when the 2006 TSX went into service. Is it NOT CPO? Wonder why.... Anyway, it has at least 30,000 miles on the factory warranty. I presume this dealer is offering a full Carfax report for each; the report will tell you how many owners, when it entered service, yada yada yada.

LuvMyTSX

The TL is already 4 years old, whereas the TSX is a bit newer. Try looking for a cheaper TSX or a newer TL and see how you fare.

Simba91102

Ya I agree; almost a no brainer. The 06 TSX is a newer, well sorted out car. The 04 TLs had first year issues just like the TSX; I wouldn't touch one (and this one has more miles too). That's way too much money for an 06 TSX though. Don't forget that for all intents and purposes, it's a 3 year old car (now that the new ones are out).

Mokos23

bottom line, more power, get TL, if you want a less common car, better gas mileage, and better resale when you sell the car again, get the TSX.

freeone

Ok, guys.... the verdict is a 05 TL, 6speed, w/navigation. The dealership that had TSX called me and said that was the final price, so I said "screw it."

I went and test drove the 04 TL again, and this time, I felt the car pulling to the left. Maybe it needed and alignment?

So, I test drove a 05 TL and that one drove just fine. It has 42k miles on it and was listed for just under $25k. It wasn't not "Certified pre-owned" however. We went inside to talk numbers and he came back to me at $22,900 and they would certify it, so that's an extra 12 mo/12k mile bumper to bumper warranty when the original warranty ends and gives me the 7 yr/100k mile power train warranty.

I love the car!!! Oh, yeah.... the salesman selling the TSX had the nerve to call me late in the afternoon to see if I bought the TL. Sure did, sucka! You gambled and lost. I'm sure that TSX is going to be sitting for a while before it's sold.

LuvMyTSX

Congrats.

Mokos23

was this all at the same dealership?

club_euro2

Congrats.

freeone

The TSX was at a Honda dealership and the two TL's were both at the one Acura dealership.

mltk53

06 tsx ftw. 04 tl ftt

davidspalding

It's early in the month. Car sellers and third parties strongly recommend doing the deal at the end of the month.

The Honda salesman thought you had him in a corner. No idea why, if he KNEW you were driving cars at an Acura dealership. Or ... maybe they know some lost lamb will see the TSX at the Honda dealership, and make an assumption about its value without doing a car price report. "Wow, honey, they've got a TSX here. That's the nicest thing on the lot, we oughta try for that."

I'm skeptical that a pre-owned TL that wasn't CPO just suddenly becomes CPO at the closing. Ask them what they've done to the car, and to show you the CPO checklist. Might encourage them to look it over REAL GOOD and stuff before you drive it off. Fer instance, there were 2-3 things wrong with my car, and 2 of them they fixed right away, which came out of their pocket, and 1 they asked me to do under warranty a month later. If you find 5-6 things (hopefully no more), they might balk if they simply labeled it CPO but didn' t do the checklist. I could be wrong, i'm presuming a lot.

I'd also check the navi DVD ... is it the current update, or the factory original one. They sell for > $100, if you have to update it yourself, your "sweet deal" is a wee bit less sweet. Just my .

Jim Holloman

Nope, you are the sucka because:

1) You put too much emphasis on price.
2) You believe that buying a car is some kind of game -- perhaps like gambling.
3) And yep, you took a bigger gamble with the TL. It might end up in the shop more than you expect.
4) You passed on a car that has a great maintenance record for a car that has had some maintenance issues; most commonly transmissions. Rattles, I understand, are also common in the TL line.
5) You treat car salesmen with contempt.
6) My English dictionary does not define "sucka". Is that an English word?

With that said, I would use extra caution buying an Acura from an Honda dealer. Why would someone want to trade an Acura, with only 20,000 miles, for a Honda? Curious minds would like to know.

Why not call the Honda salesman back in a month and see if the TSX is still available. You might be surprised. There is strong demand for smaller, fuel efficient, cars; especially for those that are in good condition, with low mileage, and do not carry a "new car" price. The added luxury of an Acura is a bonus. There are many reports of people looking for a used TSX and can not find any; particularly on the West coast. And, when then do find one, the price is so close to the "new car" price that they often just go ahead and buy a new one. It is my opinion that the revised '09 model will likely increase the demand for good, used, 1st gen TSX's. They don't make anymore -- and they (Acura) currently does not make anything that is even close. The first gen TSX ought to hold is value very well. Can't say the same for a 2005 TL.

davidspalding

Fixed. (Typing before having coffee, that's my excuse.)

davidspalding

Fixed. (Typing before having coffee, that's my excuse.)

Addendum:

I'm just picturing that a TSX with HandsFreeLink, touchscreen Navigation, 6MT, AUX input, blah blah blah .. they must be thinking that car trumps any pre-owned Accord LX on the lot, so buyers will see past the inflated price and say "oooh, toys ... gimme." Might happen. "There's a sucker born every minute." (Who said that? P.T. Barnum?)

davidspalding

I wonder ... if the seller tried to sell/trade it in at Acura, and they declined? Wonder why ... major accident preventing CPO certification? ... Bought an Accord and didn't want to private sale the TSX? Some kind of recurring issue?

Fixed. AND I would call a different salesperson. That guy who was so inflexible, I'd blow him off. Ignore him politely if he approaches you.

CiViCKiDD

I got my 08 TSX non-navi for around $26.5+ttl...

Seems like an ok deal, but the difference between your deal and a new 08 navi is like $5k, I wouldn't go used in this case.

larryziegler

You can speculate all you want on why he traded it in.....it could have been a 24-30 mo lease......he may have needed to downsize into a Civic for financial reasons.....he may have needed to upgrade into a truck/SUV, such as a Pilot or Ridgeline.....nobody really knows, except him.

And as far as the salesman goes, he wants to sell a car and earn his commission, not blow away a sale. The salesman has no control over the negotiated price....or the ability to arbitrarily decline a sale, unless he already knows that a sales price floor has been set and can't negotiate any further from that. I'd make an assumption with the increased price and lowered pricing flexibility on the 09 TSX, this dealership feels it can sell this car to a more unknowledgeable client at the price they want. Used car sales departments frequently sell cars at prices not far off from the cost of a new car. Below is data from edmunds.com substantiating the high resale value of these cars.....

2006 Acura TSX 4dr Sedan w/Navigation System (2.4L 4cyl 6M)
Trade-In Private Party Dealer Retail
National Base Price $21,171 $22,717 $23,884
Optional Equipment $0 $0 $0
Color Adjustment
White $-7 $-7 $-8
Regional Adjustment
for Zip Code 93720 $-20 $-21 $-22
Mileage Adjustment
20,000 miles $402 $402 $402
Condition Adjustment
Outstanding $914 $932 $1,004
Total $22,460 $24,023 $25,260

808havok_tsx

say... you aren't in hawaii are you? that's the EXACT same line that was used on me. and when i tried to deduct 500 bucks, they absolutely refused. why? i later found out as i was signing the papers that they had acura's theft insurance on the car THAT I DID NOT ASK FOR. that cost 500 bucks. i have full insurance coverage on my car via my insurance company - why would i want to buy acura's theft coverage??? anyway, make sure there are no "hidden" costs or other "costs" that the salesman did not tell you about. in 5 years time when its time for me to buy another car, i doubt i'll buy from the ONE dealership in hawaii due to their shady deception. i'm going with lexus.

DJ2000

I just went through all this stuff when I was looking for a tsx. I was looking for a use one w. navi for around that price. But I thought to myself for a while and said screw it. Why get someone elses old car?! SO I went and bought a new 2008. They have much better financing on new cars and right now you can get the 2008s at invoice.

Im very happy with my purchase. And im very glad that I didn't get a used one. Hell for the prices and financing you cant beat it.

Good luck

-Brandon

freeone

1. Geez... looks like I struck someone's nerve. Why wouldn't I put an emphasis on the price? Maybe you like to throw away money and pay full asking price. Why not pay them more than they are asking while you are at it? Stealerships makes a couple thousand of used cars, there's NO WAY I'm ever going to paying asking price for any vehicle.

2. Buying a car may be or may not be a game. Just how you look at it. I could care less.

3. Everything in life is a risk, son.

4. Knew that about the transmission. That's why you have a warranty. The rattling doesn't bother me as much.

5. Salesmen are not your friend, in case you thought they were. I don't want to play the back and forth game with them. In my opinion, they are the biggest liers next to loan officers. I just want to get down and work some numbers to see if we can come to a mutual agreement. If not, then we don't.

6. That's right. You are correct.

To 808havock: No, I'm in MN

TL929

he ended up getting an 05.

3G TL FTW!

You know all you TSX owners really want a TL

ThirdLane

Not really Why would be want a fancy US Accord when we could have a fancy JDM/EDM Accord

SatinSilverAV6

iTrader: (2)

Nice choice picking the TL. I much prefer it to the TSX. Too bad that acura didn't offer the J30A4 in the TSX.

7Davie7

dude - you made the right choice...who cares what a couple of TSX obsessed people say. Though u also posted this in a TSX forum so expect the replies to be slightly bias, just as they would be if it had been posted in the TL forum.
Oh and we all drive fancy over pried honda's anyway you look at so who cares that the TL is built on the Accord Chasis, google Honda Accord on a European website, you'll find an Acura TSX that they call...oddly enough The Honda Accord. Next time your out of the US, in the Carribean, or Europe and you think u see a TSX, look closely, The TSX is the Honda accord all over the rest of world!

MMsTSX

^

Mokos23

I don't think the JDM/EDM Accord is available in Asia, aside from Japan of course.

TL929

If you want a V6 with the better looking interior & exterior, you'll take the fancy US Accord

davidspalding

Yes. We know this. I learned this the first day I logged in here. Moving onward....

dom

Since when do 3G TL's have transmission problems. Thats news to me.

Anyway congrats on the purchase. Closing this since it has no where to go but down.