........what are some of the difficulties you may have encountered being a first timer?
The point of this thread is to bring about some discussion, on the pros and cons, or mysteries which come about when using a PC. I get quite a few emails, phone calls or PM's every week asking about what products to purchase for a consumers particular needs. My first question is always, "by hand or PC?"
"Whats a PC?" is sometimes returned via email or PM.
So, for those of you who have just started out using a PC, what are some issues which arose, which you may not have had anticipated? i.e. polish breakdown, amount of products, speeds used, pads selection, product removal etc......

 

My first time using the PC was using too much product. It toook me forever to clean my pads. Second mistake was not bumping the PC to speed 5-6 and adding a bit of pressure, which didn't help break down the polish. My advice if it's your first time using the PC, dont try to do the whole car at once. I would practice on a certain area until you get the desired results.

Once you get comfortable handling the PC with speeds of 5-6 it will make the task of polishing alot more fun.

 

Thanks to this board, using the PC my first time about 6 months ago was relatively easy. However, the two most difficult issues I faced was how much pressure to apply to the machine (I know now its almost to the point of bogging it down, in most cases) and which product to use relative to the amount of correction I needed. For example, I started using optimum polish w/orange pad when I should have been using OC and the orange pad.

What also surprised me was how much time it takes to do the job right and how back breaking it can be. Hard to see how people make a living doing this @$200-300/car. After a week, I'd need a long vacatiion!

 

Point blank - IT DOESN'T WORK.



All I have are spider webs everywhere, and I'm out all the money I spent on the buffer and supplies.

I absolutely HATE my paint job now, and new Acura TSX has become a big headache, instead of something I enjoy. (it actually makes me regret trading in my old car......... in the future, I don't think I'll even invest money on a nice LOOKING car at all, and just save the money and skip all the work and hassle it takes trying to make a car look nice on the outside)

I'd advise any newbie to turn around, run don't walk, and do NOT do this yourself, unless you are REALLY interested in becoming a detailing enthusiast, and taking this up as a major investment of your time and life.

 

TSXSBC, nothing could be further from the truth. You aren't doing something right. I never used a PC before and always just washed and waxed by hand. Once I started using the PC, a new world opened up, it's like night and day. Not sure what you are doing, but clearly you aren't doing something right if you still have spider webs.

My process is as follows:

1. Wash with Meguairs Gold
2. Clay with Meguiars
3. PC w/Optimum compound and orange pad
4. PC w/Optimum polish and white pad
5. wipe with 50/50 IPA
6. Apply meguiars synthetic sealand 2.0.

Its all probably in your technique. use a quarter size amount of product for steps 3 and 4. Start the pc on 3/4 them move up to 5/6 when its spread around. You should be working an area or roughly 16" x 16" and you should probabloy work the area for a good minute or two, until you notice the product is breaking down. Pretty simple, though it does take a fair amount of practice to get really good. I'm not quite there yet, but what I've just described should get you good results.

 

fixed.

 

Well I am not here to argue.

All I can do is share MY experience.


Anyone asking ME, I'd tell not to spend money on a buffer, and try to take up doing this stuff yourself, unless you want to invest a TON of time, and make this into a hobby.

I think the majority of people on this forum, enjoy this as their hobby, and that's why they are so in favor of it.


That's just like if fixing computers was MY hobby, and I'm trying to encourage others to fix computers too. Yes to the person who enjoys doing it, nothing could be greater. To the average Joe though? You let somebody who is into that do it, and move on to what YOU are into.


Personally speaking, I am into dance and music. Outside of work, those are my two hobbies.

I wish I could get back to them, but at this point I've been totally consumed trying to fix my $34,000 car that looks like hell, because I've fucked it up trying to do something that is not easy.


Please do not tell people this is easy.

It surely is NOT!!!

 

hahaha no one is tryin to convince you to do it, this is the WASH/WAX forum, you came here. stop blaming people because you are doing something wrong.
and its a tsx, stop trying to make it seem like you have a lambo or something

 

Pat,
mine was probably how much pressure to apply. at some points it prob wasnt even rotating in the correct motion because of too much pressure lol
but after a few trys, and getting comfortable with speed 6, no more complaints!

 

I'm sorry, but who exactly am I blaming here, and for what???


I'm simply sharing my opinion and experience, from an amateur's perspective.

YOU detail cars for a living right?

Those are two different perspectives.



And I know you're young kid, but you are talking to a grown man.

Maybe YOU are caught up worrying about what kind of car somebody drives, but not everyone else is.

Maybe someday when you grow up, you will find that what matters is the person that YOU are, not what kind of car you drive.

I could drive the cheapest piece of shit in the world and I'd still be me.

And you could drive the most expensive car in the world and you'd still be you.

 

hahaha grown man, and yes you are the one talking about your 34k car. this is the last thing i am saying.
Sorry to everyone here for going back and forth with this guy

 

well, what exactly have you done? People are here to help you correct it. It is easy, but it takes a little practice to get very good at it. I'm not an expert and I just do my own cars, but have never had any issues, the PC is pretty much idiot proof (no pun intended, really). Please list the steps you have taken , the products you have used and how you used them.

 

I did all that on a different thread (list all the steps and products).

You have your story, and I have mine.

Maybe I'm not as smart as most. So be it.

You can assume that if you need to, or you can think I'm lying for whatever reason.


All I'm saying is that I have not had success, after spending a good amount of time, effort and money.

That is my experience.

 

And in different threads it was pointed out the issues and the shortfalls of proceedure and products.

Have you even taken the time and advise to try and do it right? I think if you follow the steps in my other posts you will have success.

Others have also tried to post suggestions and tried to help? I know that your paint was extreemly rough prior to you polishing and I suspect by not claying you have pulled some of the contaminats off the paint into your pads and from there the marring issues result.

Prior to your decission not to clay did you feel the paint surface? Even tho the car is new to you it may have sat numerous places since it was builr and picked up all kinds of stiff. I clay every car prior to polishing unless I can feel the surface is smooth.

The first time I did my own car it was a 1 year old VW that had been through a winter and not so great wash practices and even with the hard VW clear I spent less than 12 hours over a period of 4 days to bring it swirl free.

Thats not a lot of time unless you figured buying a PC was going to get it done in 2 hours.

 

That's a pretty nasty amd unwarranted response...I (and others) was trying to help you. If you don't want it, what's the point of posting here. I understand you had a bad experience, but enough already, either be willing to accept more help or stop posting and go away. There are very good people on here, one of the best detailing sites on the web...ever think what you did might be the problem and not what someone told you.

In the year or so I've been here, I haven't been steered wrong yet.

 

[QUOTE=TSXinSouthBayCalifornia;11030138]Point blank - IT DOESN'T WORK.


QUOTE]

You have express your negative views of the PC process in your own thread. Please respect the OP(Patrick is an valuable asset to the Acurazine community) and other members by not crapping all over other threads with your unsuccessful slandering.

 

I'm sorry, did I state how much time I've invested so far?

I think it's been a little more than "2 hours".

Why are you trying to distort what I have stated???

 

[quote=Rhlieu;11030663]
I'm so sorry.

Speaking as SOMEONE WHOM ACTUALLY PURCHASED A PC FROM PATRICK, I thought I qualified to share my honest feedback.

I didn't know only success stories were allowed.

 

Well "Dude" your full of crap .. you just stated your very into researching and now you say you didn't even know what claying was..

Let me bring you back to your original thread titled "I think I just ruined my TSX" and in that thread refer to your post #13 and your reference to I also referred to this link that was shared -

http://www.detailedimage.com/Auto-De...ide/Polishing/

And if you are research & detail oriented right up top of those instructions is this

"How-To Properly Polish
Properly polishing your paint to remove imperfections can take lots of practice to master, but if you follow these steps as closely as possible, you'll get the best results in the shortest amount of time. Before you polish your vehicle, the paint should already be washed and clayed for maximum results."

From there it went into great detail on how to do the polishing .. which included

Step 3: Apply 3 pea sized drops of polish in a triangular pattern towards the outer edge of the pad And you admittedly used a way to much.

Step 6: Turn the buffer on a low speed setting (1 ~ 3) and spread the polish evenly through the entire 12" x 12" working area
Step 7: Turn the speed dial of the buffer up to 5 or 6 and start in a corner of your 12" x 12" working area.

Step 8: Begin to apply roughly 15 ~ 20 lbs of pressure on the head of the buffer
and here is one of your posts. "I used the buffer mostly at speed 2 and 3, and applied gently."

I don't know where you get off calling us on the carpet on this and warning others that the PC is dangerous when in your own text YOU admit the problem is you not being able to follow instructions or the helping hands offered and given.

Nuff said ...... Its not the machine or the product .. its the operator. It sort of reminds me of the mom watching her son march in a parade with the army cadets "Oh look.. everyone is out of step except my son"

Have a nice day Grasshopper.

 

Great reply, you can only help someone that realy wants help. If all they want to do is gripe the best thing to do is ignore them. This forum is great, and most everyone on here is willing to help/advise anyone, lets keep it that way.

 

Wow, this was meant to be a constructive thread, not destructive.....
TSX, I instructed you EXACTLY as I have countless other enthusiasts, and will continue to do so. Im not certain exactly what the dilemma is with your progress. (Looking back on your order) You have polishing products that work for me and many others. You have the EXACT machine and pads, that have worked for countless others.
I think we are still awaiting pics to? Forgive me if you have posted them and I have not viewed them.
Before its too late (and maybe it is) dont turn this battle into a war.
Also, did you not go to CG's for a demo? Im trying to be inquisitive, not condescending. Was there anything you may have picked up that can be altered?
The whole process of polishing via a machine is probably more of a mental challenge than anything. Its figuring out how products respond to your technique, and then adjusting your technique. The products are stable, techniques are flexible.
Again, there is obviously a huge amount of room for improvement. I suggest, you settle down, and start with the basics of polishing. Alot of that has been reitterated in the threads you have supplied.
YOU CAN ALWAYS CALL ME ALSO. However, if we do not get in a constructive line of communication, the conversation may end abruptly. Support is free, aggrivation will have costed us both a waste of time.

 

Look Johnny Cochran, in you presenting a effing court case presentation, you totally distorted the facts.

#1 is that Patrick, the very OP of this thread, advised me not to clay.

What part of that don't you understand?

Or is it just that you have to overlook that, in order to distort what I've stated, and attempt to discredit my opinion???


And when I said I didn't know what claying was, I meant before I started this whole detailing pursuit.

You made it seem like it's common sense for a person who is an amateur, to look at their paint job, and run their hand over it, to consider whether they should "clay" the car or not.

Most people don't know what claying is!!!


So no, I'm NOT "full of crap".

As a matter of fact, I am a pretty honest individual, which is more than I can say for someone who attempts to discredit/attack somebody else, when they aren't successful at something.

 

I don't believe I've ever been anything less than respectful and appreciative when communicating with you, and giving you my money and business.

Do you disagree?

If so let me know privately, and we can deal with that.

Otherwise, I'd really like for you to show me what an idiot I am, with an in-person display, so we can BOTH come back here and tell everyone that I was wrong, and you were right, and live happily ever after. I would LOVE to be able to admit to everyone that I am a rare idiot, and apologize humbly to everyone, at the cost of having my paint look nice.


I started this whole process with you as my main source I was following. I really wanted to follow up only with you, but as your schedule is quite busy, I didn't want to be too much of a burden, so I tried to use other sources as well.

 

I stated it was not mandatory. I did not recommend or otherwise advise, you not clay. I felt confidant you would be "OK" by not doing so. I polish alot more then I clay......

 

I'm not discrediting or attacking you .. just pointing out the facts ... Your supplying the rest. Reread my post above and all your posts from the start .. YOU are the one that says YOU did the reading and the research not me. If you did the research you would have known what claying is .. , you would have known the proper steps and buffer speeds. the site you yourself used as reference recommended them .. you ignored it or asked for advice that suited your needs not the requirements.


Right now with the attitude your showing and the confrontational posts, I as a detailer wouldn't take your car on for correction fearing a reputation damaging post once done. Or a law suit.

I have suggested to you steps to try to correct this

Like I said in my other posts in many of your other threads ... slow down .. and be patient ... if you attempt to detail like you post no wonder your in trouble.

Your paint is in this shape because YOU didn't follow what you read. You even posted a link in one of your other whiny threads showing the procedure you used for reference and at the same time said you didn't follow it .. you used too much product, tried to polish at the wrong speed, didn't clay the car, showed up at a seminar with dirty pads. Etc etc...

Now try and correct your mess by trying this.

All this will be done on one front fender.

1) wash the panel ( fender in case your confused )
2) Clay bar the panel and wipe off the residue with a good quality "clean" M/F towel.
3) With a clean or new orange pad and Optimum Compound or equal set the speed at 3 to distrubute the product over 1/2 the fender then step it up to 5.5 or so and make a few passes over the area.
4) Wipe off polish.
5) Spray the area with 50/50 mix of RA & water and inspect.
6) Repeat 3,4 & 5 if needed.
7) Once happy use a clean or new white pad and Optimum polish and do the same as in 3,4 & 5. Repeat if necessary
8) Step back and look at it from 10 feet. If happy apply sealant of choise.

Once you perfect 1 panel then remember it all for the rest.


Its not hard ... 1000's have suceeded. So don't fear monger , your just making yourself look bad. Life isn't easy and there is speed bumps .. just slow down and go over them one at a time.

You have 2 choises.
A) Perfect it
B) Sell you stuff .. admit defeat and find a detailer.

I have seen more than my fair share of new people think they know more than the rest suggest and in the end blame the product of the system where patience and proceedure would show success.

And what I got in response was this

Jess,

While I appreciate when you give feedback, I do NOT appreciate the lack of respect, and your pathetic attitude. Makes me and others feel like helping you

It's pretty easy to be condescending and insulting to others who are attempting to do something new, which you are an expert at.

If that's what gets you off, I understand, but speaking of what is making people look bad????



Your instructions alone show that the process is anything but simple.

Secondly, a leader of this very forum instructed me that I needn't clay the car.

Thirdly, YOUR instructions are different than other instructions I've been given, and FROM THE PERSPECTIVE OF AN AMATEUR, a person doesn't know whom to believe and what to try/follow.

I ATTEMPTED to follow the instructions as best I could, but yes, I got confused, I made mistakes, AND THAT IS THE POINT!

If it were that easy, maybe I wouldn't have made those mistakes.

But no, feel free to talk to me like I'm an idiot, and denigrate me, all because I'm not being all "rah rah" about people detailing their own cars.


And about this comment "Look Johnny Cochran, in you presenting a effing court case presentation, you totally distorted the facts." I distoreted nothing ... those were cut and pastes from your posts and reference material.

 

Good professional response^^^

Nicely put.

 

this is unbelievable. TSX, seriously. stop whining, no one is trying to be aggressive here (except the people who's tempers have flared because of your attitude). The name calling, "capitalization yelling" and blaming are completely un-necessary.

Firstly. I do not know if you read many posts before attempting to detail your car, but if you did you probably noticed that almost all of the professional threads begin with a wash and claying, now, I agree that most people do not know what the term "claying" means, but by the time you decided to detail your car, you probably should have understood the various options before you, if you did not, that is simply poor planning and no one's fault but your own. It is certainly not Pat's fault, all he said was that claying is not necessary, he did not know the condition of your car and was talking on the basis of a hypothetical car.

Secondly, I personally have not read all of your threads, but assuming that not everyone who has commented so far is guilty of libel, you admittedly did not polish properly, failing to follow the proper steps (ie. speed control etc.). This is also no one's fault but your own and does not reflect the effectivity of the process. It is an honest mistake, and nothing to be ashamed of, but it does not mean that "Point blank - IT DOESN'T WORK."

Thirdly, from the perspective of a (sometimes) contributing member of these forums, and someone who likes it when things go smoothly, I'd like to make it clear that your aggressive manor will not be tolerated for much longer, I am not saying this as a threat, as I am only a "registered member" like most of us, but I do speak from experience, I have seen a number of people with your kind of mentality come and go.

Lastly, I would appreciate it if you didn't ridicule or attack me in a reply to this post, I have not purposely insulted you in this post, if you do decide that you need too make a reply that is impolite to the point that it violates forum rules it will result in the moderators being contacted.

I hope I have helped. I would try to let go of your anger and start fresh assuming you know nothing (read this, it may help. http://www.detailingworld.co.uk/foru...ad.php?t=63859)

 

This is simply more slander from you.

You are trying to attack me personally, because you want to force your view, and discredit mine.

That's pretty pathetic.

A person can't bring a lawsuit, unless there is a signed contract. So let's blow half your bullish out the water right there.

As for the "reputation damaging post", you could just as easily write that one off as you are writing my post off here, so wtf are you talkin about?

Talk about being full of crap.



It's real easy to run your mouth on an internet forum, yet when it comes time to show and prove, you want to come up with lame excuses.

I just stated that I was willing to be shut up, and totally change my take, if you or Patrick or ANYONE could prove it to me.

You want to list all these "instructions" out, and then blame the newbie when they don't have success.

That pretty much says it all.




And by the way, as for this? -

While I appreciate when you give feedback, I do NOT appreciate the lack of respect, and your pathetic attitude. Makes me and others feel like helping you


If you GENUINELY wanted to help somebody, you wouldn't require them to kiss your ass, and put up with your disrespectful and insulting approach.

If you don't feel like helping somebody when they ask you to treat them with respect, and not be condescending, then again, that pretty much says it all about YOU.

 

Yeah right. You're really trying to help.

Like you're really fooling anybody with this passive-aggressive bs.

Who are YOU again, to tell me to "let go of my anger"?

What, I don't have a right as a grown man to be frustrated, if things haven't gone well???

Talk about unbelievable!!!

 

I'm very sorry some of you may not want to hear that things didn't go perfectly, as maybe some of you would like to profess.

The bottom line is that this newcomer has been trying for FOUR weeks, and has a paint job that is messed up.


As stated before, I welcome ANYONE that is willing to actually PROVE the methods being talked about.


Other than that, I'm done with going back and forth, with people who just want to discredit me and argue, because they don't want to hear my experience.


And if making threats of removing and deleting the experiences of those who don't share a success story is the way some think things should work around here, well that pretty much says it all.

 

^please. Actually prove the methods? the whole forum is full of threads that do that. (See anything by Wes or Denzil).

now, to respond to your comments.

Your first reply states that I am blaming you, blaming you for what?
your second reply is a complete contradiction of earlier statements by others and yourself, and I have no reply for it.

your third reply has me "blaming" you. Now, The Oxford English Dictionary has that to blame is to assign fault for something done to you on someone else. A) Nothing was done to me. B) Nothing was done to you by anyone else. All I did say was that it is pure fiction for you to blame anyone else.

your fourth reply has me complaining that you have posted a non-success story, while if you actually read what I wrote, I am pointing out your aggressive attitude and absurd compulsion to blame other people for what you decided to do to your car. It was no one else saying you had to do it. They said they had success by doing it, but you are the one who decided to detail your car. Before you tell me about not telling a "Grown man" about attitude, let me try to make something clear. Adulthood is not about chronological age, it is about taking responsibility for ones own actions, something you have proven constantly for the last few days you do not do.

In your fifth reply you comment that it is easy for me to decide that I am not attacking you, by my own standards of what an attack is, which would be fair enough if I had not explicitly put forward that I did not Intend to insult you.

In your final conclusion you sarcastically imply that I am really just trying to put you down or feed my own ego, but I actually am trying to help. Trying to help you not come across as such an utter asshole.

And yes as a "Grown man" you do have the right to be frustrated, you do not however have the right to put down and insult everyone who tries to help you, or share their experience.

As a final note. This forum does not delete negative reviews of products or processes. It does however deter ignorant and belligerent users from utilizing the information it holds. People are not resistant to hearing your experience, they were trying to put in their two cents on how you can go about fixing your problem, now they are simply pissed off that you have decided to badmouth them for no reason.

 

Ok.


Again, maybe you should contact the moderators on YOUR SELF pal.


And thank you for exposing yourself.

I rest my case.

 

so if you rest your case... does that mean you're finally shutting up and saving us your constant bullshit?

 

I guess if you've exposed yourself, you might as well expose it all the way eh?

Thanks, I appreciate it.

And the bullshit is you talking about you're "just trying to help".

So really, you should focus on shutting YOUR SELF up.


I made my point about the difficulties of detailing/using the buffer. I shared my honest experience, and was done after the first post. (and I don't think it's "bullshit", for me to share that things didn't work well for me.... not bullshit at all. As a matter of fact, it's REAL shit.)

At the same time, I will stand up to attempts at bullying somebody, simply because you don't want any real difficulties to be heard.

As far as I can tell, this is an open forum, for people to share their opinions and experiences, and I didn't attempt to do anything except for just that.

That's more that can be said for those of you whom attacked me because you didn't want my opinion to be heard.

 

Seriously, man...you're acting like a child.

Everybody (myself included) has tried to help you and all you've done is spit it back at them. For the first time ever, I wish this forum had an ignore user feature.

 

1.Click on user name
2.View Public Profile
3.User Lists
4.Add to ignore list
5.?????
6.Profit!

 

Sometimes a change in proceedure and product use and a little bit of patience can make a huge difference.

I'd like to suggest the following to help you out. You should be able to get it down in a couple of hours at the most then follow up on the rest of the car. Don't get discouraged.



All this will be done on one front fender.

1) wash the panel
2) Clay bar the panel and wipe off the residue with a good quality "clean" M/F towel.
3) With a clean or new orange pad and Optimum Compound or equal set the speed at 3 to distrubute the product over 1/2 the fender then step it up to 5.5 or so and make a few passes over the area.
4) Wipe off polish.
5) Spray the area with 50/50 mix of RA & water and inspect.
6) Repeat 3,4 & 5 if needed.
7) Once happy use a clean or new white pad and Optimum polish and do the same as in 3,4 & 5. Repeat if necessary
8) Step back and look at it from 10 feet. If happy apply sealant of choise.

Once you perfect 1 panel then remember it all for the rest.

Happy detailing .. once you get it all done the pride part sets in and you just need to hone up the wash/dry proceedures to keep it that way. Once you have the right products to wash/dry my washing/drying including wheels and all door edges and an engine wipe is about 40 minutes if done weekly.

Good wash/dry practices will help heep the swirls from coming back.

 

I'd like to add this to the above but the 5 min edit rule got me ;

Others may suggest different methods but in reality they are just variations or this is a variation of thiers. I suggest this method because from experience I know it works and will give you results above and beyond the weekend warrior results.

 

Yup.

One thing I've learned is to take many different opinions, filter through them, and form your own. I don't doubt what anyone says here as an individual, but I like a much larger pool to work from. 'This works for him, this works for someone else...' It never prevents me from changing course or trying something new.

It's like statistics - you get a much more accurate representation from a larger population.

 

TSX, you have made at least a dozen threads over the last couple weeks, there is no reason to be attacking members and ruining a legit thread for people to share experiences, your frustration has gone beyond frustration by posting threads about Don't do it yada yada. Just like everyone on here has said, you need to slow down and be patient. People have tirelessly tried to help you. What I find ironic, is I have been on this forum for the last few months and I applied the lessons that I learned and had great success with my paint job following the exact advice of people like Patrick, Jesstzn, and Todd, maybe you need to realize that the problem is with you and your methods and stop lashing out at the people that are trying to help you and tell you how to fix your issues.