Need advice on paint issues on a newly purchased car.
06-28-2010, 08:31 PM
#1
FTW
Thread Starter
Need advice on paint issues on a newly purchased car.
Hello Gang,
I'm looking for some advice here. My brother purchased a new car from a Toyota Dealership. The car had 120miles because they had to bring it form some other dealership. Okay to the problem.
1. When my parents went to go pick up the car the sun was set.. and the detailer was a kid... I was not a part of this buying process at all until this crap hit the fan.
2. My brother inspects the paint the next morning and noticed tons of micro maring / scratches due to a terrible prep/detail job.
3. My dad / bro go back to the dealership the next day to see what remedies they could provide. And their solution was to get the head detail guy to re-buff it out with his dewalt + who knows what kind of pad. Probably wool
4. We get the car, okay looks good due to the fillers the guy used. But once the fillers washed away after a week of solid rain, OH MY GOD, it looked like someone took steel wool and went in a million circles ALL OVER THE CAR.
5. Take it in again, they off the same solution, so we say OKAY, this is your LAST chance. FIX it... okay so more fillers + terrible swirls still on the car.
6. What do we do next? They can't fix the issue at hand and I'm all out of options? Do I ask them to take this to a new shop that specializes in paint correction?
A NEW CAR SHOULD NOT HAVE SWIRLS. God this is obnoxious.
I apologize in advanced that this is long but I'm trying to get all my options before going in tomorrow. I'm going to see the manager. I think I need to start telling them that I'll give them 0's on the survey or something because this is nuts.
Thanks for the replies.
I'm looking for some advice here. My brother purchased a new car from a Toyota Dealership. The car had 120miles because they had to bring it form some other dealership. Okay to the problem.
1. When my parents went to go pick up the car the sun was set.. and the detailer was a kid... I was not a part of this buying process at all until this crap hit the fan.
2. My brother inspects the paint the next morning and noticed tons of micro maring / scratches due to a terrible prep/detail job.
3. My dad / bro go back to the dealership the next day to see what remedies they could provide. And their solution was to get the head detail guy to re-buff it out with his dewalt + who knows what kind of pad. Probably wool
4. We get the car, okay looks good due to the fillers the guy used. But once the fillers washed away after a week of solid rain, OH MY GOD, it looked like someone took steel wool and went in a million circles ALL OVER THE CAR.
5. Take it in again, they off the same solution, so we say OKAY, this is your LAST chance. FIX it... okay so more fillers + terrible swirls still on the car.
6. What do we do next? They can't fix the issue at hand and I'm all out of options? Do I ask them to take this to a new shop that specializes in paint correction?
A NEW CAR SHOULD NOT HAVE SWIRLS. God this is obnoxious.
I apologize in advanced that this is long but I'm trying to get all my options before going in tomorrow. I'm going to see the manager. I think I need to start telling them that I'll give them 0's on the survey or something because this is nuts.
Thanks for the replies.
06-28-2010, 09:29 PM
#2
Former Sponsor
Wow, I hear this way too much......What would be interesting is to detect the amount of clear that has been removed with several buff attempts (Your vs. new). Im certain a pro detailer could remove the marring. Give me a better idea of your location and I'll see what I can find for you. I would ask for some free oil changes or service or something being as they screwed the paint up, also make them flip the bill for the correction. A call to the BBB may motivate them as well. Wouldnt hurt to drop that on them as well. Let them know of your disappointment. Good businesses will make amends.
06-28-2010, 09:31 PM
#3
Suzuka Master
You gave them thier chance ... now ask them to ok you to get it done right.
If they say no and want to do it themselves again .. when you pick it up .. pick it up in the sun and take a bottle of rubbing alcohol with you and a very soft M/F cloth .. select a panel thats in the sun and wipe it down and dry it .. see if it is swirl free... I get a few cars the "head" detailer fixed up.
If they say no and want to do it themselves again .. when you pick it up .. pick it up in the sun and take a bottle of rubbing alcohol with you and a very soft M/F cloth .. select a panel thats in the sun and wipe it down and dry it .. see if it is swirl free... I get a few cars the "head" detailer fixed up.
06-28-2010, 09:44 PM
#4
FTW
Thread Starter
Hey thanks guys for the quick response. I was furious because I wasn't a part of this purchasing deal but what can you do? Live and learn is what I told the parents.
The head detailer is an absolute moron, we gave him IMO one too many times to fix the problem and they insisted on one more chance. I told them this is your last chance and I recall the assistant service manager mentioning MAACO as their outsource work.. I'll drop dead first before I take that offer.
Patrick I'm out in the Twin Cities, MN (specifically 55448).
The head detailer is an absolute moron, we gave him IMO one too many times to fix the problem and they insisted on one more chance. I told them this is your last chance and I recall the assistant service manager mentioning MAACO as their outsource work.. I'll drop dead first before I take that offer.
Patrick I'm out in the Twin Cities, MN (specifically 55448).
06-30-2010, 09:21 AM
#6
FTW
Thread Starter
Update-
The letter below is what I handed them. Straight and to the point and I wanted a paper trail for future problems that might arise.
The assistant service manager kept blaming the COLOR of the car which is Black was the root of the problem and that you typically see these kinds of marks on a black car. I told him LOOK, this is a NEWLY purchased car, from here on out never make the comment about how because the car is black the car is more prone to having marks. I told him to look at his showroom cars and to show me where on the show cars they had swirls on it. He later went to the car outside in the sun and confirmed I was correct on the swirls/holograms.
Basically the response was - we will send the car out to an auto body shop that is not within the dealership. If they don't fix the issue this time, we would file a complaint for not being able to handle the situation.
They CLAIM that the job will be finished by today sometime. So before we pick up the car, I should take some rubbing alcohol + water 50/50 mix ratio and wipe off the wax / fillers?
The letter below is what I handed them. Straight and to the point and I wanted a paper trail for future problems that might arise.
The assistant service manager kept blaming the COLOR of the car which is Black was the root of the problem and that you typically see these kinds of marks on a black car. I told him LOOK, this is a NEWLY purchased car, from here on out never make the comment about how because the car is black the car is more prone to having marks. I told him to look at his showroom cars and to show me where on the show cars they had swirls on it. He later went to the car outside in the sun and confirmed I was correct on the swirls/holograms.
Basically the response was - we will send the car out to an auto body shop that is not within the dealership. If they don't fix the issue this time, we would file a complaint for not being able to handle the situation.
They CLAIM that the job will be finished by today sometime. So before we pick up the car, I should take some rubbing alcohol + water 50/50 mix ratio and wipe off the wax / fillers?
June 29, 2010
Carlson Toyota of ____ _____
address
###-###-####
ADDRESS
RE: Clear coat paint swirls on newly purchased 2011 Camry SE (5th meet, 3rd correction)
Dear Carlson Toyota, General Sales Manager, New Vehicle Manager, and Master Service Manager,
We currently have an on going problem on the newly purchased Toyota Camry SE on June 7th, 2010. Currently, the car is 90% covered in either swirls or holograms caused by the misuse of the rotary buffing tool. Applying wax only does not fix the problem it only masks the problem for a few days then the problem will reoccur.
Clear coat typically has a thickness of 1.5 – 2.0 Mils, and each time we had the car detailed using the rotary buffing tool, it removes an average of 0.025 Mil of paint. I’m starting to worry because of the severity of the current condition of the clear coat that more damage has been done then good.
We have gone in a total of three times and the detailer has used the rotary tool on the car. This puts the removal of clear coat at 0.025 Mils x 2 = 0.050 Mils removed. This may not be a lot but we are now looking at a third time because this is the only way to correct the prior two mistakes that your detailer has caused. This will put us at 0.075 Mils removed by the third attempt, at the 0.4 Mil removed mark you will enter clear coat failure danger range. We are close to one fourth of the way there.
Another issue at hand is the time it takes for us to solve the swirl / hologram problem. Each time we drive out to see you guys for a remedy it turns into a new problem or the problem just goes unsolved. Each visit lasts more than 40 minutes (drive time included) and in addition takes up the time of whoever is also involved. Addressed below chronologically are the events we had to drive over to Carlson Toyota to address the issue:
• 1st time – 6.8.10 only visual inspection #1
• 2nd time – 6.11.10 rotary detail (caused more damage)
• 3rd time – 6.xx.10 visual inspection #2
• 4th time – 6.24.10 rotary (caused even more damage)
• 5th time – today 6.29.10 visual inspection with manager
We need a resolution to the problem and we are not interested in another detailing job because clearly that option is not working. Furthermore, the assistant service manager mentioned MAACO on our 3rd visit and I am not interested in this option because I don’t think they are up to Toyota’s standards.
What we are interested in is an outside third party professional detailer of my choice and the bill will be footed by Carlson Toyota. I also expect to be compensated for lost time due to all this driving back and forth, via free oil changes or other free services. Once completed and finished and I am completely satisfied with the end result, we will conclude this matter in full. If we are still not completely satisfied we can then discuss other alternatives such as a repaint job or exchange/trade for a new car with less or equal miles and the same 2011 Camry SE options we currently own.
During the downtime we also request a new Toyota loaner car of equal or more in value of our current 2011 Camry SE that is currently being addressed. The last loaner car was unacceptable and we didn’t feel safe driving it.
If by this current meeting 6.29.10 we can’t fix or rectify the problem we will promptly fill out the online survey in the reflected manner to date and express our dissatisfaction with Carlson Toyota’s way of handling this issue. We will also contact Toyota, Consumer Affairs Department, Attorney General, and lastly the Better Business Bureau regarding the same issues as addressed above.
Sincerely,
NAME
Carlson Toyota of ____ _____
address
###-###-####
ADDRESS
RE: Clear coat paint swirls on newly purchased 2011 Camry SE (5th meet, 3rd correction)
Dear Carlson Toyota, General Sales Manager, New Vehicle Manager, and Master Service Manager,
We currently have an on going problem on the newly purchased Toyota Camry SE on June 7th, 2010. Currently, the car is 90% covered in either swirls or holograms caused by the misuse of the rotary buffing tool. Applying wax only does not fix the problem it only masks the problem for a few days then the problem will reoccur.
Clear coat typically has a thickness of 1.5 – 2.0 Mils, and each time we had the car detailed using the rotary buffing tool, it removes an average of 0.025 Mil of paint. I’m starting to worry because of the severity of the current condition of the clear coat that more damage has been done then good.
We have gone in a total of three times and the detailer has used the rotary tool on the car. This puts the removal of clear coat at 0.025 Mils x 2 = 0.050 Mils removed. This may not be a lot but we are now looking at a third time because this is the only way to correct the prior two mistakes that your detailer has caused. This will put us at 0.075 Mils removed by the third attempt, at the 0.4 Mil removed mark you will enter clear coat failure danger range. We are close to one fourth of the way there.
Another issue at hand is the time it takes for us to solve the swirl / hologram problem. Each time we drive out to see you guys for a remedy it turns into a new problem or the problem just goes unsolved. Each visit lasts more than 40 minutes (drive time included) and in addition takes up the time of whoever is also involved. Addressed below chronologically are the events we had to drive over to Carlson Toyota to address the issue:
• 1st time – 6.8.10 only visual inspection #1
• 2nd time – 6.11.10 rotary detail (caused more damage)
• 3rd time – 6.xx.10 visual inspection #2
• 4th time – 6.24.10 rotary (caused even more damage)
• 5th time – today 6.29.10 visual inspection with manager
We need a resolution to the problem and we are not interested in another detailing job because clearly that option is not working. Furthermore, the assistant service manager mentioned MAACO on our 3rd visit and I am not interested in this option because I don’t think they are up to Toyota’s standards.
What we are interested in is an outside third party professional detailer of my choice and the bill will be footed by Carlson Toyota. I also expect to be compensated for lost time due to all this driving back and forth, via free oil changes or other free services. Once completed and finished and I am completely satisfied with the end result, we will conclude this matter in full. If we are still not completely satisfied we can then discuss other alternatives such as a repaint job or exchange/trade for a new car with less or equal miles and the same 2011 Camry SE options we currently own.
During the downtime we also request a new Toyota loaner car of equal or more in value of our current 2011 Camry SE that is currently being addressed. The last loaner car was unacceptable and we didn’t feel safe driving it.
If by this current meeting 6.29.10 we can’t fix or rectify the problem we will promptly fill out the online survey in the reflected manner to date and express our dissatisfaction with Carlson Toyota’s way of handling this issue. We will also contact Toyota, Consumer Affairs Department, Attorney General, and lastly the Better Business Bureau regarding the same issues as addressed above.
Sincerely,
NAME
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07-27-2010, 11:12 AM
#8
FTW
Thread Starter
Figure I give you guys an update because we are at 99% problem solved.
The dealership gave us an allowance of 400.00 to find someone we wanted to detail the car. I found someone and I will check out the paint correction sometime today.
Here is something funny I will add, the New car sales manager asked my dad what I did for a job, then asked if I was a lawyer. I found that comment pretty funny
My day job is accountant for those who were wondering.
Cheers!
The dealership gave us an allowance of 400.00 to find someone we wanted to detail the car. I found someone and I will check out the paint correction sometime today.
Here is something funny I will add, the New car sales manager asked my dad what I did for a job, then asked if I was a lawyer. I found that comment pretty funny
My day job is accountant for those who were wondering. Cheers!
07-27-2010, 12:33 PM
#9
I hope the detailer this time knows what he's doing, lol.
Make sure he polish the Toyota with a DA and a fine polish.
I haven't seen anyone finish with a rotary (to flawless 100% hologram free finish. close, but not 100%)
Make sure he polish the Toyota with a DA and a fine polish.
I haven't seen anyone finish with a rotary (to flawless 100% hologram free finish. close, but not 100%)
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