Do you fear me now?
11-04-2003, 02:01 PM
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Do you fear me now?
Forbes Link
Do You Fear Me Now?
Scott Woolley, 11.10.03
Verizon Wireless wants to dominate the phone business and doesn't care who gets in the way--whether competitors or even its own parent company.
Dennis Strigl, chief executive of Verizon Wireless, fired a warning shot at his competitors in a June speech. The head of the nation's biggest wireless company came out in favor of a federal mandate that lets customers keep their cell phone numbers when they switch carriers, a rule his competitors have fought for fear it will spark an all-out war for customers in a business already shredded by competition.
Strigl's move shattered his industry's united front and helped smooth the way for number portability, now slated to take effect on Nov. 24. Regulators lauded Strigl, and customers deluged him with e-mails praising his decision. "We had a big fan club," recalls Strigl, "but we also had a hate club--which was our own industry saying: ‘You traitors!'"
Strigl was just getting warmed up. In Septemberhe announced another bold stroke. Verizon Wireless will also allow subscribers to transfer phone numbers to and from landlines owned by its parent, Verizon Communications, the nation's largest local phone company. (Verizon Communications owns a 55% stake; Vodafone, a U.K. wireless company and the largest in the industry, owns 45%.)
That Verizon père went along with the move was a startling admission of Strigl's clout. Letting landline customers cut their cord and go mobile-only promises to be a bad deal for the combined entity. A wireless customer typically generates under half the profit of a landline customer, but Verizon thought it better to give its growth engine the freedom to run hot. This is a trend it can't fight: 150 million Americans use cell phones, up 10% in a year. The major local phone companies now run 154 million landlines, down 4%.
"We have never slowed down the growth of wireless, even though to some extent it cannibalizes the other business," says Ivan Seidenberg, Verizon Communications' chief executive. "If you're going to disconnect a second line and go to Sprint, then the incremental operating income I get is zero."
Verizon Wireless has become perhaps the most potent and threatening force in all of telecom. Already the company has 37 million customers, up 4 million in a year. Its nearest cellular rival, Cingular, with 23 million subscribers, gained 1.5 million. Among U.S. phone companies only SBC, AT&T and Verizon have more customers, but all are shrinking, forced to fight rearguard actions to mitigate the growth of cellular.
Portability will throw millions of callers up for grabs. Nine million users are so fed up with their carriers that they want to switch the very first day of the new rules, according to a survey by telecom consultancy TMNG. Another 30 million are prepared to follow as soon as another carrier gives them a better deal. The industry is spending $1.5 billion a year on advertising to promote this churn, according to the Yankee Group. In this battle Verizon Wireless has the upper hand. It can land a new customer at a cost of $250, versus a $390 peer average. Its $4.7 billion capital budget (against a $2.5 billion average for its rivals) has let it build the most extensive network in the country. The company now covers several remote national forests and the Amtrak train tunnels under Manhattan.
Precise reads on quality are hard to come by, but one good proxy is the number of customers who leave. This year 22% of Verizon's customers will decamp. In the cellular industry, that's a win. Verizon's chief rivals lose 30%-plus a year; only Nextel does as well as Verizon.
Quality will be of ever greater importance as the cellular market matures, argues John Stratton, Verizon Wireless' chief marketing officer. First-time cellular customers tend to shop for a cheap plan. After that they start talking to their friends about blocked calls and abrupt disconnects. Two-thirds of the 12 million customers who will sign with Verizon Wireless this year are defectors from rivals.
What's going to come of the portability free-for-all? More consolidation, in all likelihood. Most countries have three or four carriers. The U.S. has six: Verizon, Cingular, AT&T Wireless, Sprint PCS, T-Mobile and Nextel. Per-minute prices in the U.S. are among the world's lowest, despite usage being among the highest. The cutthroat pricing begets low profits. Verizon Wireless is a standout for earning 10% after tax on invested capital, according to Raul Katz of Booz Allen Hamilton. Its peers scrape by with single digits.
Denny Strigl's likeliest acquisition target is Sprint PCS, which shares a technically compatible network. AT&T Wireless and Cingular would have to merge to match Verizon's size. "Sooner, rather than later, those that are not as profitable as their investors would like them to be will be seeking merger partners," says Strigl.
Strigl, a 57-year-old Bell industry lifer who ran Ameritech's cellular business way back in 1984, is exceedingly modest in person. But he's a strategic threat to everyone else in the phone business. Seidenberg compares him with ex-AlliedSignal chief Lawrence Bossidy. "Denny gets up every day and looks to fix something that's not right," says Seidenberg. "He can't stand it if you want to stop and smell the roses. He thinks it's an absolute waste of time."
Do You Fear Me Now?
Scott Woolley, 11.10.03
Verizon Wireless wants to dominate the phone business and doesn't care who gets in the way--whether competitors or even its own parent company.
Dennis Strigl, chief executive of Verizon Wireless, fired a warning shot at his competitors in a June speech. The head of the nation's biggest wireless company came out in favor of a federal mandate that lets customers keep their cell phone numbers when they switch carriers, a rule his competitors have fought for fear it will spark an all-out war for customers in a business already shredded by competition.
Strigl's move shattered his industry's united front and helped smooth the way for number portability, now slated to take effect on Nov. 24. Regulators lauded Strigl, and customers deluged him with e-mails praising his decision. "We had a big fan club," recalls Strigl, "but we also had a hate club--which was our own industry saying: ‘You traitors!'"
Strigl was just getting warmed up. In Septemberhe announced another bold stroke. Verizon Wireless will also allow subscribers to transfer phone numbers to and from landlines owned by its parent, Verizon Communications, the nation's largest local phone company. (Verizon Communications owns a 55% stake; Vodafone, a U.K. wireless company and the largest in the industry, owns 45%.)
That Verizon père went along with the move was a startling admission of Strigl's clout. Letting landline customers cut their cord and go mobile-only promises to be a bad deal for the combined entity. A wireless customer typically generates under half the profit of a landline customer, but Verizon thought it better to give its growth engine the freedom to run hot. This is a trend it can't fight: 150 million Americans use cell phones, up 10% in a year. The major local phone companies now run 154 million landlines, down 4%.
"We have never slowed down the growth of wireless, even though to some extent it cannibalizes the other business," says Ivan Seidenberg, Verizon Communications' chief executive. "If you're going to disconnect a second line and go to Sprint, then the incremental operating income I get is zero."
Verizon Wireless has become perhaps the most potent and threatening force in all of telecom. Already the company has 37 million customers, up 4 million in a year. Its nearest cellular rival, Cingular, with 23 million subscribers, gained 1.5 million. Among U.S. phone companies only SBC, AT&T and Verizon have more customers, but all are shrinking, forced to fight rearguard actions to mitigate the growth of cellular.
Portability will throw millions of callers up for grabs. Nine million users are so fed up with their carriers that they want to switch the very first day of the new rules, according to a survey by telecom consultancy TMNG. Another 30 million are prepared to follow as soon as another carrier gives them a better deal. The industry is spending $1.5 billion a year on advertising to promote this churn, according to the Yankee Group. In this battle Verizon Wireless has the upper hand. It can land a new customer at a cost of $250, versus a $390 peer average. Its $4.7 billion capital budget (against a $2.5 billion average for its rivals) has let it build the most extensive network in the country. The company now covers several remote national forests and the Amtrak train tunnels under Manhattan.
Precise reads on quality are hard to come by, but one good proxy is the number of customers who leave. This year 22% of Verizon's customers will decamp. In the cellular industry, that's a win. Verizon's chief rivals lose 30%-plus a year; only Nextel does as well as Verizon.
Quality will be of ever greater importance as the cellular market matures, argues John Stratton, Verizon Wireless' chief marketing officer. First-time cellular customers tend to shop for a cheap plan. After that they start talking to their friends about blocked calls and abrupt disconnects. Two-thirds of the 12 million customers who will sign with Verizon Wireless this year are defectors from rivals.
What's going to come of the portability free-for-all? More consolidation, in all likelihood. Most countries have three or four carriers. The U.S. has six: Verizon, Cingular, AT&T Wireless, Sprint PCS, T-Mobile and Nextel. Per-minute prices in the U.S. are among the world's lowest, despite usage being among the highest. The cutthroat pricing begets low profits. Verizon Wireless is a standout for earning 10% after tax on invested capital, according to Raul Katz of Booz Allen Hamilton. Its peers scrape by with single digits.
Denny Strigl's likeliest acquisition target is Sprint PCS, which shares a technically compatible network. AT&T Wireless and Cingular would have to merge to match Verizon's size. "Sooner, rather than later, those that are not as profitable as their investors would like them to be will be seeking merger partners," says Strigl.
Strigl, a 57-year-old Bell industry lifer who ran Ameritech's cellular business way back in 1984, is exceedingly modest in person. But he's a strategic threat to everyone else in the phone business. Seidenberg compares him with ex-AlliedSignal chief Lawrence Bossidy. "Denny gets up every day and looks to fix something that's not right," says Seidenberg. "He can't stand it if you want to stop and smell the roses. He thinks it's an absolute waste of time."
11-04-2003, 02:16 PM
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Originally posted by pgatour1
Basically. Except the T720 is a piece of shit. Can't wait till they come out with a Color PTT phone.
Basically. Except the T720 is a piece of shit. Can't wait till they come out with a Color PTT phone.
It only took a year to get some decent software out for that phone anyways
11-04-2003, 02:19 PM
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Originally posted by fbazakos
Well now you now how little the phone actually matters regarding how well a company does in the business world.
It only took a year to get some decent software out for that phone anyways
Well now you now how little the phone actually matters regarding how well a company does in the business world.
It only took a year to get some decent software out for that phone anyways
I just miss my Startac 7868W. That phone was the best.
Do you know anything about the PTT phones coming out like the V60p sucks.
Also yeah I finally after a year of having this phone got my software updated, it works like a phone should now.
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11-04-2003, 02:22 PM
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Originally posted by fbazakos
Well now you now how little the phone actually matters regarding how well a company does in the business world.
Well now you now how little the phone actually matters regarding how well a company does in the business world.
I hate Sprint, but I actually considered going back to them just for the phones. Verizon doesn't have anything cool, neither does T-Mobile. Cingulair has that cool Nokia phone, but noone stocks it to look at it. GET SOME BETTER PHONES YOU BASTARDS! OR SPRINT WILL O3N JOO!
:angry: 
:swear2: 
:o
11-04-2003, 02:25 PM
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Originally posted by proaudio22
Damn it I hate that attitude. That's my only beef w/ Nextel. I hate the damn phones. This is where I think Sprint has done it right, they have the most kick ass phones. I hate Sprint, but I actually considered going back to them just for the phones. Verizon doesn't have anything cool, neither does T-Mobile. Cingulair has that cool Nokia phone, but noone stocks it to look at it.
GET SOME BETTER PHONES YOU BASTARDS! OR SPRINT WILL O3N JOO!
:angry: :swear2: :o
Damn it I hate that attitude. That's my only beef w/ Nextel. I hate the damn phones. This is where I think Sprint has done it right, they have the most kick ass phones.
I hate Sprint, but I actually considered going back to them just for the phones. Verizon doesn't have anything cool, neither does T-Mobile. Cingulair has that cool Nokia phone, but noone stocks it to look at it. GET SOME BETTER PHONES YOU BASTARDS! OR SPRINT WILL O3N JOO!
:angry: :swear2: :o
I want my startac 7868 Back.
11-04-2003, 02:26 PM
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Originally posted by pgatour1
I'll take better service anyday over a phone that can fucking play games on and take pictures with audio or whatever bullshit is out there.
I want my startac 7868 Back.
I'll take better service anyday over a phone that can fucking play games on and take pictures with audio or whatever bullshit is out there.
I want my startac 7868 Back.
I agree, the startacs where great phones. My boss bitched and bitched when he broke his. :o
11-04-2003, 02:32 PM
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If you guys want startacs, i have a few.
Keep an eye out for several "cool" phones coming out from Verizon for the holidays... since it matters. of course, every provider will be tossing out new phones to sway you towards them. There will be another first in the wireless industry coming from verizon before the end of the year.
trust me, proaudio22, you are in the minority with your opinions. if phones really mattered more, don't you think sprint would be suceeding?
Keep an eye out for several "cool" phones coming out from Verizon for the holidays... since it matters. of course, every provider will be tossing out new phones to sway you towards them. There will be another first in the wireless industry coming from verizon before the end of the year.
trust me, proaudio22, you are in the minority with your opinions. if phones really mattered more, don't you think sprint would be suceeding?
11-04-2003, 03:42 PM
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Originally posted by fbazakos
If you guys want startacs, i have a few.
Keep an eye out for several "cool" phones coming out from Verizon for the holidays... since it matters. of course, every provider will be tossing out new phones to sway you towards them. There will be another first in the wireless industry coming from verizon before the end of the year.
trust me, proaudio22, you are in the minority with your opinions. if phones really mattered more, don't you think sprint would be suceeding?
If you guys want startacs, i have a few.
Keep an eye out for several "cool" phones coming out from Verizon for the holidays... since it matters. of course, every provider will be tossing out new phones to sway you towards them. There will be another first in the wireless industry coming from verizon before the end of the year.
trust me, proaudio22, you are in the minority with your opinions. if phones really mattered more, don't you think sprint would be suceeding?
To answer your question, Sprint is succeeding. All of the top 6 US carriers are succeeding...maybe not as well as Verizon is succeeding but doing very well nonetheless.
Cellphones are my life right now. I live and work everyday to bring the finest cellphones and related services to the public...thru Sprint. It's funny you weren't saying all this a year or two ago when Verizon wasn't doing as well as the rest. The numbers use to be exactly reversed...Sprint had all the most nets add per quarter by a long shot because we were growing...I posted it here and no one said anything. We had the millions per quarter, Verizon had a handful.
As long as Verizon continues with the attitude that phones mean nothing to the consumer, they will not totally dominate and are not going to do as well as they probably could be doing. Just keep adding all those prepaid customers on free "cheap" phones by the millions....you'll find out what that does in the long run. Maybe phones don't mean everything but if Sprint didn't have the phones, meaning if we carried the exact same phones as Verizon did, we would probably be hurting.
I'm going to say this again, because Fotis gives everyone the wrong impression. I like the article. It says good things about Verizon and their future. They have a strong leader. But they didn't attract 40 million customers with great advertising, competitive pricing, a cutting edge phone lineup, and a perfect network. They purchased those customers...bought and paid for. And they keep them with long-term 2 and 3 year contracts. Smart move, great marketing...yes. But make no mistake about it, they didn't earn all those customers because what they have is better than anyone else. You wait till ATT and Cingular merge together and become bigger than Verizon...overnight. Sprint and Verizon will never merge.
I'm done.
11-04-2003, 04:36 PM
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Originally posted by fbazakos
trust me, proaudio22, you are in the minority with your opinions. if phones really mattered more, don't you think sprint would be suceeding?
trust me, proaudio22, you are in the minority with your opinions. if phones really mattered more, don't you think sprint would be suceeding?
So, I would say I'm in the majority. People want both great service AND great phones. I've already got the first, now I want the second.
:P 
11-04-2003, 05:04 PM
#16
Moderator Alumnus
Verizon is $$ postive right now. Sprint is not. Sprint is making a bunch of changes very soon to deal with their internal problems.
Hopefully it will help the company in the long run.
Fotis to me is bascially saying. We have more money and bought all of this stuff... (and they built some too)
na na na na
na na na na
:P
my
Either way it's entertaining 
Hopefully it will help the company in the long run.
Fotis to me is bascially saying. We have more money and bought all of this stuff... (and they built some too)
na na na na
na na na na
:P
my
Either way it's entertaining
11-04-2003, 06:49 PM
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Originally posted by pgatour1
I'll take better service anyday over a phone that can fucking play games on and take pictures with audio or whatever bullshit is out there.
I want my startac 7868 Back.
I'll take better service anyday over a phone that can fucking play games on and take pictures with audio or whatever bullshit is out there.
I want my startac 7868 Back.
11-04-2003, 07:33 PM
#21
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only Nextel does as well as Verizon.
Sprint sucks ass, they have amazin phones, but I had it for a year and I understand why so many people are leaving.
11-04-2003, 07:50 PM
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Ken,
I am not giving anybody the wrong impression. Scott Woolley is giving the impressions here and he works for Forbes. Scott is saying that whatever Verizon is doing (Ken seems to have discounted everything -- but they are doing SOMETHING) is working ... and what all the other providers are doing is not working. Everybody has their competative advantages. Verizon has the network, Sprint has the phones, Nextel has the PTT, Cingular has rollover, T-Mobile (well ....) is cheap ... some of these advantages mean move to customers than others. I am just posting up public information to help the uniformed realize what is going on in the industry.
Oh, Ken, I will be in Kansas City the 16-21 ... lotta vendor dinners i'm sure but let me know when Siggy's free and we can meet up for a drink or lunch or whatever.
I am not giving anybody the wrong impression. Scott Woolley is giving the impressions here and he works for Forbes. Scott is saying that whatever Verizon is doing (Ken seems to have discounted everything -- but they are doing SOMETHING) is working ... and what all the other providers are doing is not working. Everybody has their competative advantages. Verizon has the network, Sprint has the phones, Nextel has the PTT, Cingular has rollover, T-Mobile (well ....) is cheap ... some of these advantages mean move to customers than others. I am just posting up public information to help the uniformed realize what is going on in the industry.
Oh, Ken, I will be in Kansas City the 16-21 ... lotta vendor dinners i'm sure but let me know when Siggy's free and we can meet up for a drink or lunch or whatever.
11-04-2003, 11:30 PM
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Originally posted by 2001CL
Yes my only beef with nextel is also the phones but i love the service.
Sprint sucks ass, they have amazin phones, but I had it for a year and I understand why so many people are leaving.
Yes my only beef with nextel is also the phones but i love the service.
Sprint sucks ass, they have amazin phones, but I had it for a year and I understand why so many people are leaving.
to all of that. Same exact thing w/e me. I think I'll modify a Sprint phone to work on my Nextel network.
11-05-2003, 06:47 AM
#26
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Originally posted by fbazakos
Ken,
I am not giving anybody the wrong impression. Scott Woolley is giving the impressions here and he works for Forbes. Scott is saying that whatever Verizon is doing (Ken seems to have discounted everything -- but they are doing SOMETHING) is working ... and what all the other providers are doing is not working. Everybody has their competative advantages. Verizon has the network, Sprint has the phones, Nextel has the PTT, Cingular has rollover, T-Mobile (well ....) is cheap ... some of these advantages mean move to customers than others. I am just posting up public information to help the uniformed realize what is going on in the industry.
Oh, Ken, I will be in Kansas City the 16-21 ... lotta vendor dinners i'm sure but let me know when Siggy's free and we can meet up for a drink or lunch or whatever.
Ken,
I am not giving anybody the wrong impression. Scott Woolley is giving the impressions here and he works for Forbes. Scott is saying that whatever Verizon is doing (Ken seems to have discounted everything -- but they are doing SOMETHING) is working ... and what all the other providers are doing is not working. Everybody has their competative advantages. Verizon has the network, Sprint has the phones, Nextel has the PTT, Cingular has rollover, T-Mobile (well ....) is cheap ... some of these advantages mean move to customers than others. I am just posting up public information to help the uniformed realize what is going on in the industry.
Oh, Ken, I will be in Kansas City the 16-21 ... lotta vendor dinners i'm sure but let me know when Siggy's free and we can meet up for a drink or lunch or whatever.
cya soon Fotis
11-05-2003, 07:34 AM
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mt6forlife, i missed that little text at the bottom. 
about the EV-DO in areas other than San Diego or Washington DC/Baltimore, I will not be posting up what the buildout is for that network.
about the EV-DO in areas other than San Diego or Washington DC/Baltimore, I will not be posting up what the buildout is for that network.
11-05-2003, 08:00 AM
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Originally posted by fbazakos
mt6forlife, i missed that little text at the bottom.
about the EV-DO in areas other than San Diego or Washington DC/Baltimore, I will not be posting up what the buildout is for that network.
mt6forlife, i missed that little text at the bottom.
about the EV-DO in areas other than San Diego or Washington DC/Baltimore, I will not be posting up what the buildout is for that network.
11-05-2003, 09:04 AM
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Originally posted by mt6forlife
Do you know if the EV-DO compatible PC card they're selling will also work on the Express Network I have available here today? I'd hate to buy a card and then have to buy another one in a few months months to take advantage of the higher speed.
Do you know if the EV-DO compatible PC card they're selling will also work on the Express Network I have available here today? I'd hate to buy a card and then have to buy another one in a few months months to take advantage of the higher speed.
11-05-2003, 09:19 AM
#30
The Creator
i think phones matter alot.
the whole reason i switched to Sprint from Verizon as my primary service provider about 4 years ago was simply because of the phones.
and to this day Verizon has yet to put out a phone competitive enough with Sprint's offerings to lure me to switch back.
The only other choice for me would be T-Mobile because of the infinite selection of phones. But T-Mobile has its fair share of other problems that I wouldn't be able to justify the move.
Don't get me wrong, i'm not dissing Verizon... very recently they have finally released some competitive phones. Still nothing worth switching to tho. and Verizon's network does trounce Sprint's... and Verizon's messaging works 1000000000 times better.
But like I said... the phone matters so much to me that Verizon has not yet been able to entice me to return.
Sprint remains the innovator in the CDMA handset market IMO.
However, if Verizon could remain competitive with their phones... and Sprint continues to have issues with text messaging etc. I can see how the phone number portability law would scare Sprint/etc because I, like most people, would have less hesitation about switching.
But my point is... on my scale of importance when comparing wireless service providers the phone itself ranks No. 1 mainly because there is far more of a divide between quality of phones then quality of service between the networks.
In otherwords... until recently... Sprint phones have always been significantly better than Verizon's. While the difference between Verizon's network and Sprint's network has never, in my market at least, been extremely different. In fact... Verizon, Sprint, Nextel, T-Mobile all have comparable networks in my market IMO.
the whole reason i switched to Sprint from Verizon as my primary service provider about 4 years ago was simply because of the phones.
and to this day Verizon has yet to put out a phone competitive enough with Sprint's offerings to lure me to switch back.
The only other choice for me would be T-Mobile because of the infinite selection of phones. But T-Mobile has its fair share of other problems that I wouldn't be able to justify the move.
Don't get me wrong, i'm not dissing Verizon... very recently they have finally released some competitive phones. Still nothing worth switching to tho. and Verizon's network does trounce Sprint's... and Verizon's messaging works 1000000000 times better.
But like I said... the phone matters so much to me that Verizon has not yet been able to entice me to return.
Sprint remains the innovator in the CDMA handset market IMO.
However, if Verizon could remain competitive with their phones... and Sprint continues to have issues with text messaging etc. I can see how the phone number portability law would scare Sprint/etc because I, like most people, would have less hesitation about switching.
But my point is... on my scale of importance when comparing wireless service providers the phone itself ranks No. 1 mainly because there is far more of a divide between quality of phones then quality of service between the networks.
In otherwords... until recently... Sprint phones have always been significantly better than Verizon's. While the difference between Verizon's network and Sprint's network has never, in my market at least, been extremely different. In fact... Verizon, Sprint, Nextel, T-Mobile all have comparable networks in my market IMO.
11-05-2003, 09:21 AM
#31
The Creator
on a 1-10 scale this is how I would rank each provider in different aspects of their service in MY market TODAY.
Verizon
Phones: 8
Network: 10
Sprint
Phones: 9
Network: 9
T-Mobile
Phones: 10
Network: 8
Nextel
Phones: 5
Network: 8
that my give you an idea of why TODAY i don't see any reason to switch off of Sprint.
Verizon
Phones: 8
Network: 10
Sprint
Phones: 9
Network: 9
T-Mobile
Phones: 10
Network: 8
Nextel
Phones: 5
Network: 8
that my give you an idea of why TODAY i don't see any reason to switch off of Sprint.
11-05-2003, 09:25 AM
#32
The Creator
let me also rank them 1-10 on this one thing..... which is the main disperity that sways my thinking from time to time.
TEXT MESSAGING
Verizon: 10
Sprint: 6
T-Mobile: 9
Nextel: 8
as you can see... that is my biggest complaint against sprint. if not for their text messaging woes Sprint would clearly be the lead choice if I were to be shopping for new coverage TODAY.
nevertheless... Sprint is still the winner by a margin.
TEXT MESSAGING
Verizon: 10
Sprint: 6
T-Mobile: 9
Nextel: 8
as you can see... that is my biggest complaint against sprint. if not for their text messaging woes Sprint would clearly be the lead choice if I were to be shopping for new coverage TODAY.
nevertheless... Sprint is still the winner by a margin.
11-05-2003, 09:34 AM
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i could care less what kind of phone i use. as long as its small and reliable i'm cool with that.
nov 24th is gonna be an awesome day for vzw. we're expecting an unbelieveable amount of people to jump ship that some day onto our network. funny how we're the only people not nervous bout that day....
fotis, good find.
this story kinda made me chuckle as well
Full Story: http://www.thestreet.com/_tscana/tec.../10121888.html
nov 24th is gonna be an awesome day for vzw. we're expecting an unbelieveable amount of people to jump ship that some day onto our network. funny how we're the only people not nervous bout that day....
fotis, good find.
this story kinda made me chuckle as well
Wireless Churn Creams Laggards
By Scott Moritz
Senior Writer
10/24/2003 07:11 AM EDT
Click here for more stories by Scott Moritz
Wireless investors got a sneak peek at the future this week, and the preview was anything but pretty for AT&T Wireless (AWE:NYSE - commentary - research) and Sprint PCS (PCS:NYSE - commentary - research).
The big wireless service providers saw their shares plunge Thursday after they posted soft growth and noted a rise in subscriber defections. Worse yet, observers expect those trends to intensify in the next month with the phase-in of so-called number portability.
By Scott Moritz
Senior Writer
10/24/2003 07:11 AM EDT
Click here for more stories by Scott Moritz
Wireless investors got a sneak peek at the future this week, and the preview was anything but pretty for AT&T Wireless (AWE:NYSE - commentary - research) and Sprint PCS (PCS:NYSE - commentary - research).
The big wireless service providers saw their shares plunge Thursday after they posted soft growth and noted a rise in subscriber defections. Worse yet, observers expect those trends to intensify in the next month with the phase-in of so-called number portability.
11-05-2003, 09:36 AM
#34
The Creator
Originally posted by YuppieCL
i could care less what kind of phone i use. as long as its small and reliable i'm cool with that.
i could care less what kind of phone i use. as long as its small and reliable i'm cool with that.
you say that now as a verizon employee. sure.but you know damn well as a typical guy... how cool your gadget is means tons.
boys need cool toys.
11-05-2003, 09:41 AM
#35
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Originally posted by soopa
but you know damn well as a typical guy... how cool your gadget is means tons.
boys need cool toys.
but you know damn well as a typical guy... how cool your gadget is means tons.
boys need cool toys.
i'd love to have some of the gsm phones out there with bluetooth or whateverthefuck, but i'd rather be able to make a phonecall from where ever i am.... vzw just works.....
11-05-2003, 09:45 AM
#36
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Originally posted by soopa
you say that now as a verizon employee. sure.
but you know damn well as a typical guy... how cool your gadget is means tons.
boys need cool toys.
you say that now as a verizon employee. sure.but you know damn well as a typical guy... how cool your gadget is means tons.
boys need cool toys.
11-05-2003, 10:38 AM
#37
The Creator
those are good points.
but like i said, for me, in my network... Verizon's network isn't so far superior that it outweighs the negative impact of their traditionally inferior phones.
I guess if I moved to the woods or up into the mountains I might change my tune...
I still think Yuppie is just being bias tho... I know people will argue this with me since people tend to defend whoever they pay money to every month... but in Jersey, in North Jersey at least... I've never ever ever ever been in a spot where I'm not getting service with sprint but my girlfriend IS getting service with Verizon.
i think it is pretty rare in most parts of the Northeast that there is great difference between Verizon and Sprint.
The only exceptions are analog coverage in the boonies and in the urban jungle of Manhattan. which is a whole other story.
but like i said, for me, in my network... Verizon's network isn't so far superior that it outweighs the negative impact of their traditionally inferior phones.
I guess if I moved to the woods or up into the mountains I might change my tune...
I still think Yuppie is just being bias tho... I know people will argue this with me since people tend to defend whoever they pay money to every month... but in Jersey, in North Jersey at least... I've never ever ever ever been in a spot where I'm not getting service with sprint but my girlfriend IS getting service with Verizon.
i think it is pretty rare in most parts of the Northeast that there is great difference between Verizon and Sprint.
The only exceptions are analog coverage in the boonies and in the urban jungle of Manhattan. which is a whole other story.
11-05-2003, 10:40 AM
#38
The Creator
Originally posted by YuppieCL
you're right to a point. i would enjoy having the most versatile wireless device out there on the vzw network, but i'd so much rather have superior service than a fancy device. otherwise, all you're doing is carrying around an expensive phonebook.
i'd love to have some of the gsm phones out there with bluetooth or whateverthefuck, but i'd rather be able to make a phonecall from where ever i am.... vzw just works.....
you're right to a point. i would enjoy having the most versatile wireless device out there on the vzw network, but i'd so much rather have superior service than a fancy device. otherwise, all you're doing is carrying around an expensive phonebook.
i'd love to have some of the gsm phones out there with bluetooth or whateverthefuck, but i'd rather be able to make a phonecall from where ever i am.... vzw just works.....
and this is awfully exaggerated. as if your phone doesnt work 99.9% of the time on any network other than Verizon
get serious. I am first to admit Verizon has a superior network... but you know the difference isnt anywhere near this drastic.
I don't think I've ever been anywhere outside of the mountains where Sprint doesn't work and Verizon does.
Its usually both or nothing.
11-05-2003, 02:10 PM
#39
on bin laden
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Soopa,
The differentiation between networks is huge. It's like drag racing a car ... or getting power out of a car. The first huge chunk is easy, it's those last few tenths of a second that take the most effort, and are hardest to acheive.
If you knew the infrastructure difference between the two networks like I do, you wouldn't be saying that. As a casual consumer, I don't blame you. I've showed the guys that have visited me the difference. If you walked into a sprint facility, you'd see the difference. Unfortunately all you see is the plastic in your hand, and the marketing on TV. I can get into more details if you like. But here is one piece that will help you understand. Sprint spent $2 billion dollars on their network this year. They just annouced another $2 billion dollars for next year. And they are proud of that. Verizon has been spending $5 billion a year for the past several years, and you will see the same amount next year. The gap in quality will only widen. That is simple math ...
However the end result is what you see here and the other thread about 3rd quarter results, and it proves myself and yuppie correct. execution through quality service will win you the market in the wireless industry in america.
The differentiation between networks is huge. It's like drag racing a car ... or getting power out of a car. The first huge chunk is easy, it's those last few tenths of a second that take the most effort, and are hardest to acheive.
If you knew the infrastructure difference between the two networks like I do, you wouldn't be saying that. As a casual consumer, I don't blame you. I've showed the guys that have visited me the difference. If you walked into a sprint facility, you'd see the difference. Unfortunately all you see is the plastic in your hand, and the marketing on TV. I can get into more details if you like. But here is one piece that will help you understand. Sprint spent $2 billion dollars on their network this year. They just annouced another $2 billion dollars for next year. And they are proud of that. Verizon has been spending $5 billion a year for the past several years, and you will see the same amount next year. The gap in quality will only widen. That is simple math ...
However the end result is what you see here and the other thread about 3rd quarter results, and it proves myself and yuppie correct. execution through quality service will win you the market in the wireless industry in america.
11-05-2003, 03:27 PM
#40
Moderator Alumnus
Originally posted by fbazakos
I've showed the guys that have visited me the difference. If you walked into a sprint facility, you'd see the difference. Unfortunately all you see is the plastic in your hand, and the marketing on TV. I can get into more details if you like. But here is one piece that will help you understand. Sprint spent $2 billion dollars on their network this year. They just annouced another $2 billion dollars for next year. And they are proud of that. Verizon has been spending $5 billion a year for the past several years, and you will see the same amount next year. The gap in quality will only widen. That is simple math ...
I've showed the guys that have visited me the difference. If you walked into a sprint facility, you'd see the difference. Unfortunately all you see is the plastic in your hand, and the marketing on TV. I can get into more details if you like. But here is one piece that will help you understand. Sprint spent $2 billion dollars on their network this year. They just annouced another $2 billion dollars for next year. And they are proud of that. Verizon has been spending $5 billion a year for the past several years, and you will see the same amount next year. The gap in quality will only widen. That is simple math ...
Have you seen the Sprint PCS NOC? have you seen the Sprint PCS stick labs?
Really all of those mean shit for how your service is. It's the backhaul and ewireless quipment used. And it's utilization.
As I said before, your the little kid sitting there with the better toy going " na na na, na na na"
Sprint has other financial focuses right now. Verizon just went and bought everything. How long has verizon been around?
Sprint has reached some of it's growing problems. And is dealing with them. Verizon hasn't quite reached that yet.
Verizon Communications Inc., based in New York and incorporated in Delaware, was formed on June 30, 2000
No I don't fear you...
Sun and Cisco. Prime examples of not the best products and good marketing. It doesn't take the best to be considered the top. It does take smarts.
And how is sun's stock doing? SGI makes computers that make SUNs look like little toys. But sun blew them away with marketing. Sometimes mistakes take awhile to come back from, if ever.