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But for real now. Update ive ordered the pistons and have been seating my valves for my new heads. Going to be using the rl cams. One head has been cleaned and assembled.
Now i just got to order seals and bearings. Going with king bearings. I dont want to deal with the problems that ive heard about when ordering from Honda. There is also a little custom intake manifold that my dad has been working on if that goes well we might be making a few extra for sale to the j series community pics of that will be posted when it is close to done. Going low low for the pistons this time. 8.5:1
Unfortunately no the nearest one is like an hour drive from my place in the opposite direction of where i drive for school and work. Meth helped. Been thinking of going individual port injection soon for more of an octane boost than an air cooling factor. And the low compression should work with the poor gas better.
...There is also a little custom intake manifold that my dad has been working on if that goes well we might be making a few extra for sale to the j series community pics of that will be posted when it is close to done...
Very interested in the details. You plan to do a before/after dyno? Or other way to measure benefits?
Intake manifold is finished Just need to find some nice looking bolts for the plenum base that don't stick through like that, the fuel line wont be used we are putting a return fuel system on it,we have all the parts and machine work is finished, hopefully with the air and fuel even to all cylinders this one will last a long time and make tons of power, time to put this thing all together
Aside from the new manifold you so rudely showed off and smeared in our faces, what's been the situation on the car?
Obviously you guys still seem to feel like some of the cylinders may be suffering due to air distribution but do you care to explain what issues or results you've been experiencing?
Aside from the new manifold you so rudely showed off and smeared in our faces, what's been the situation on the car?
Obviously you guys still seem to feel like some of the cylinders may be suffering due to air distribution but do you care to explain what issues or results you've been experiencing?
Keep the thread going. Don't abandon it!
when breaking down the motor we noticed the the tops of the broken pistons had more buildup. And the intake ports for those cylinders were not as clean.1-4 had clean streaks where the methanol was contacting the port. 5 and 6 (both broken) so we are thinking that led to too rich mixture before meth and too lean after meth combine either issue with higher compression and.......
I hope you're referring to last time and not implying that more pistons have been damaged?
And on the WMI wall traces, that's a great observation. I actually was recently running 100% pure methanol injection but after realizing the risk in doing so (due to the manifolds natural wet flow characteristics), I reconsidered the choice and changed over to pure water injection instead. Not only did it help me pickup additional spool, I also was able to run the water injection transparent to the tune as water itself does not affect AFR. It required me to further advance timing roughly .5-1.00 everywhere but I figured this was better than the risk of tuning the ecu for meth in the event of a failure. So I'm content with the safety it now gives.
Other than this, no other problems?....or any other positive news even?
Originally Posted by UTAH Type-S
when breaking down the motor we noticed the the tops of the broken pistons had more buildup. And the intake ports for those cylinders were not as clean.1-4 had clean streaks where the methanol was contacting the port. 5 and 6 (both broken) so we are thinking that led to too rich mixture before meth and too lean after meth combine either issue with higher compression and.......
I thought about pure water once or twice, but here in Utah it does get cold enough to freeze water and I don't want to take that chance of forgetting to drain my tank and clear the lines before winter,
got all the necessary parts needed to start up again along with some changes my dad and I built a new intake manifold and we will be running return fuel next time we start up.
heres all the pics I remembered to take. been grinding this weekend to get her put together and dropped in. just need to attach one more motor mount and bolt up the fly wheel and the motor will be officially installed.
Shit, did I miss something in this thread somewhere? Why are we back into the motor again here? Was there additional carnage that happened since the last time?
Shit, did I miss something in this thread somewhere? Why are we back into the motor again here? Was there additional carnage that happened since the last time?
Geez, I must be getting old and senile. I even commented right below the post about the failed piston.
This sucks. These were failed Wiseco's right? Second set?
nope they were J and E's this is set 3 in here going low compression, return fuel and open plenum intake manifold this set is going to be weisco. Its been down since late February.
Yahoo for Weisco's! Looks like the top of a Chevy LSX intake!
Originally Posted by UTAH Type-S
nope they were J and E's this is set 3 in here going low compression, return fuel and open plenum intake manifold this set is going to be weisco. Its been down since late February.
Question: Are you blaming these failures based on the theory of airflow distribution problems?
Btw, where did you get the idea of using the Skunk plenum at?
Not as the sole issue but definitely a contributing factor. The biggest problem was getting the detonation under control and pushing it harder than i should have.
Not as the sole issue but definitely a contributing factor. The biggest problem was getting the detonation under control and pushing it harder than i should have.
You beat me to it This engine as seen rough times before tuning started... I'm still amazed how long it lasted
You beat me to it This engine as seen rough times before tuning started... I'm still amazed how long it lasted
Too true. You definitely kept her alive for a while though. Thus go around im shooting for reliability before power. Even though it will likely be a little more powerful than last time its gonna have to last a couple years.
Got my radiator and fans in. Reworked my wiring harness up top to something i can tuck in a little better. need to get some mounts for it tomorrow and im thinking of putting a gasket in my v-band flange. But that would be a little later.
Dayum, why so low? You must be pretty scared of something with this car. I realize you've went through a few sets of pistons now but I'm not too sure going to that level is the answer to your issue...whatever it may be. FYI, I literally hit pump gas limit at a tad bit over 10lbs but WMI helped keep me at 11.5lbs for a while. Then e85 has got me up to 18. This is still using my stock 11.2:1 CR and bottom end. Just saying...
I think 8.5:1 is perfect. These aren't small 4 cylinder engines that will be lazy off boost.
I forget where you are located Robert, but if wafer you have 93 pump available. There is a very large difference in the limit at 93 octane vs 91. 91 as high test is what I would call regular, lol. Add in e10, and it useful for a geo metro and not much else.
I'd still like to know what the root cause was of utah's failure, but it may never be pinpointed. Im glad yours is running so strong at the power it is, that makes me lean towards tuning and not just overall strength of components.
There is a guy on the j series fb page running 1000 up with twin gt35s @ 30 psi on stock pistons. He has China rods, but that's it. He said he didn't even change the ring endgap on the pistons.
Granted, it's a drag car, but I'd say 8.9 sec @ 1000 HP is a hell of a stress test.
I still think the knock response or off to on boost transition is a culprit.
We think it was horrible fuel distribution to cylinder 5&6 or the intake manifold was giving those cylinders more boost pressure than the others the rest of the pistons looked perfect and 5&6 were detonated to death
I think 8.5:1 is perfect. These aren't small 4 cylinder engines that will be lazy off boost.
I forget where you are located Robert, but if wafer you have 93 pump available. There is a very large difference in the limit at 93 octane vs 91. 91 as high test is what I would call regular, lol. Add in e10, and it useful for a geo metro and not much else.
I'd still like to know what the root cause was of utah's failure, but it may never be pinpointed. Im glad yours is running so strong at the power it is, that makes me lean towards tuning and not just overall strength of components.
There is a guy on the j series fb page running 1000 up with twin gt35s @ 30 psi on stock pistons. He has China rods, but that's it. He said he didn't even change the ring endgap on the pistons.
Granted, it's a drag car, but I'd say 8.9 sec @ 1000 HP is a hell of a stress test.
I still think the knock response or off to on boost transition is a culprit.
I didn't know/think about the 91 octane fuel that Utah uses and because I've never tuned with it, can't really say much about it. I imagine it would be able to run up to 7-8lbs reliably though. Especially with water injection. The way I look at it, the engine should be tuned for the fuel used. Wether it be q16 race or 87 pump, the tune should keep it reliable regardless. Guess what I'm getting at here really (and in response to Utahs last post made above) is if it's a cylinder distribution issue, shouldn't we be seeing more of this problem throughout the 3g TL's? Also, I would think if there were air and/or fuel distribution problems for cylinders 5 and 6, then I'm certain something would have been seen on your widebands gauges (assuming you have two) or even datalogs in the form of knock, factory widebands readings (in comparison to each other), fuel trims, injector pulse widths, etc. I know FlashPro doesn't offer some of these PID's but even a decent quality scanner would give you a better look within to confirm the assumption of distribution issues. Just seems to me that the problem should've been diagnosed long before the 3rd set of pistons went into this motor. And please don't take offense Utah, I'm all for ya man....I really am. I just feel like maybe you should do some more checking into things before going anywhere with this next setup. How are you going to confirm the distribution issues been resolved if you're still just assuming that's the problem? Just something to think about before you get there.
Btw z28, I know what the guy who you're referring to with the 1000hp j-series. It's the S2k you're talking about, right? That car simply amazes me as it proves that the strength of the j-series is even way beyond what I proclaim it to be. I've known through friends local to me and myself that these engines can withstand an immense amount of power in stock trim but the big thing is the tune. They have a hairline limit for ignition timing that will make power up to X, but as soon as you reach Y, the engine is gone without warning. Most engines will increase in power with timing, level out and then begin to detonate. But not the j-series. It's so sensitive at high power levels. Hondata mentioned something before that I believe strongly applies to the 2nd gen j-series and that was what they said about tuning the single port exhaust k-series engines and how they did NOT like timing added under boost. Even with e85 and water injection, I'm literally adding (at most) ONLY one degree in timing in both ignition tables but it ranges around 1/2 to 1 degree of advance throughout. Most other engines are known to take 2-4 degrees with e85 (and WMI) to make up for the fuels slower burn rate but it could be the j-series chambers are so well developed that they don't need the advance to make power. Or, maybe something to do with the single port exhaust design of the heads that require less timing. ***Whatever it may be, it's strength comes from its tune though for sure.*** They're hypersensitive motors that can and will deliver when they're happily tuned.
04-22-2016 | 09:23 PM
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