The TL and RL factory intakes are very similar. However on the RL we can remove our resonator without having to drill out the rivet.

The factory intake has a huge resonator and the pathway from the air inlet to the final suction point (the tb) is long and convoluted. The reason honda did this obviously was to keep the car quiet which it does, but at the cost of ultimate power.

The reason why the aem produces power is 1. short tract to the tb. 2. The air travels in a nice linear and smooth manor from the filter to the tb in the 3" tubing. There are no interruptions like on the factory system. 3. The filter is designed for more flow.

 

Sounds reasonable!

 

Bob,

I'm finally gonna get around to install my CAI this saturyda. Any tips on the install? I've seen couple of pictures of installed products but I'm not familiar with it. Is there a online manual on how to take off the bumpers and other parts of the car?

Thanks

John

 

John, the bumper is quite easy to remove -
1. remove the top plastic radiator shroud .
2. remove the clips that hold the rubber piece on the lower plastic tray and pull that piece out.
3. remove the 2 screws at each corner going from the bumper to the fender.
4. remove the 2 bolts and 1 plastic clip from the corner plastic pieces attached to the front bumper.
5. Then you have to pull the bumper outwards starting from the corner, then once at the headlight, pull forward.

 

Thanks Touge.

Any other wisdoms you might want to pass on?

I'll post pics once it's done.

John

 

I'm glad Touge responded because I didn't install mine. I paid to have it done. The guy who installed mine said he didn't remove the bumper. So far, nothing's broken and I haven't gotten any CELs, so I guess it worked. He did mention there was one deep screw that was hard to get to, but otherwise no big issues in installing it.

If you're doing it yourself, and taking off the bumper, please take a picture of what the intake looks like w/o the bumper on.

 

I did mine without taking off the bumper. It was a pain in the ass to install. I only had to bug Touge once with a question.

 

Maybe I should have taken some pics before I put my bumper back. But I did post some pictures of the car without the bumper and intake.

 

John, as mentioned there is one bolt you that is located in the upper front region above the fog light bracket that is a bit tough to reach. If you decide to remove the bumper then the bolt is easy to reach. Overall time to install will probably be very similar if you remove the bumper or not. Thanks.

 

Very nice dyno! I was waiting to see what the RL could do. Now all we need to see is an RL run down the 1/4 mile. I like the Exhaust on the RL it looks great!

The only thing is I was expecting the RL to dyno with higher numbers. With my 03 Accord V6 Auto I dynoed at 198.4WHP and 176.4wtq with just intake. And you dynoed 200 with your mods. Maybe you lose alot of power through AWD.

 

I have a question for you guys, once you change out the a OEM air intake, does that in any way do anything to your warranty? I have a Dodge SRT4, for fun of course and it had some serious issues at first. When I took it in they looked for these Mods, saying if I would have done anything it would have voided the warranty, is ther any truth to this? I am now getting around to changing out my rims and suspension to the Aspec, should be here next tuesday.

 

The law is on your side unless the mod can be proven to have caused the problem you are seeking warranty coverage for. My standard tome on the subject:

An explanation of the Magnuson-Moss Act

It helps if your dealer is mod-savvy like mine is.

 

I think the only way to see if the motor is truly making 290 HP is to actually take a RL motor and test it, out of the car. Of course, I'm not advocating or asking anyone to temporarily remove their engine from their fully functional car.

However, if someone who suffered the total loss of their RL could temporarily volunteer the motor from the totaled RL, then we could definitely get some real numbers....

 

True, that's why we do chassis dynos instead of engine dynos. The results here are what they are, and most likely represent major drivetrain loss through SH-AWD. If our car had RWD or FWD, we'd see much higher WHP than in my testing.

 

Some systems will allow water to get in the intake and destroy the engine, most are not worth it on Honda cars, their intakes are really good and safe, based on s2000, NSX and other forums of ownership. You will never feel 5 hp in this car, probably not even 20hp.

As with most companies, if they can save money by turning down your claim for doing something harmful to their system, you may loose.
Not worth it IMO.

 

I fully expect that if I have an engine problem, it won't be covered. It's a risk I was willing to take that others won't be.

However, if I have a rattling interior and I bring it to the dealer for warranty service, and am denied because of the intake and exhaust, that's what you're protected from with the M-M Act.

Luckily, we have many on our board with J-series engines (TLs mostly, some RLs) and intakes who have had no issues at all in tens of thousands of miles. As long as I don't (purposely) drive through deep puddles, I figure the intake will be OK. The intake opening location is the same with the AEM as with the OEM, as well, so the same puddles I avoided with my stock setup I avoid with my CAI.

As far as not feeling it....a very good point. That was the reason I started my little experiment in the first place. I got tired of hearing...I feel it in my butt-dyno! Turns out there is an objective power benefit to these particular modifications. You DO feel it in the upper rpm range, though, as third gear keeps going, and going, and going..... but in any case, in everyday driving, you're right, there's not that much of a difference other than you can hear the engine better.

 

I agree re: the results are most likely due to the SH-AWD. I imagine it's the system constantly adjusting to the "road" conditions..

 

Hey guys,

I just joined (I had been looking for a good RL forum for a while) and I am looking into modding my 06' RL. I had been looking at changing the exhaust but I dont know what I can do to the intake. Any suggestions? I read most of Bob's posts in this thread and it seems weird that the RL is supposedly losing 100 hp. I had always wondered why the RL had a 7 second 0-60, I guess that explains it. Usually AWD vehicles have a fast 0-60 because they maintain traction well. I think I am going to get a DYNO on my RL in a few days. I'll post the results when I get back, my car is stock btw. If or when I get my exhaust changed I will DYNO the car again and post the results. What intake did you use on your RL, Bob?

- Seth

 

I don't think the loses are to parasitic drag in the drive train, or else they would be felt right through the speed range. And the RL actually feels reasonably fast at higher speeds.

To me it feels like a two stage diminishing of the power. At take off, it seems particularily sluggish, which is most likely a combination of weight, gearing and perhaps some computer intervention to protect the drive-train. At middling to higher speeds, I swear my car experiences a "flat spot" in power delivery, which may be excessive slippage in the transmission/diff. I say this because it doesn't happen in all circumstances, but mainly on up-hill drags at full throttle. Experienced it every time on the race track, in that particular type of corner, but very occasionally on the road [probably because I'm not trying that hard on the road].

Love to know what it is?

I think v2 of our SH-AWD diff and a 6 speed 'box would make a world of difference to our car

 

I would LOVE to have the inventor of SH-AWD or a member of their engineering team in Japan explain this. Actually, it would be cool. I am no automotive engineer , so all my explanations are guesses based on my limited understanding of the system.

sadlerau, the RL does not feel as if it lost 100 hp at all. Since I put these mods on, the car is noticeably faster and there is more power in the lower part of the power band. This car is DEFINITELY an over 300 hp car now. My best guess is still that the bizarre dyno results are from the system thinking it's in an infinite slip situation and it applies limited power to protect itself.

dmaster3, welcome to AZ! Please do dyno your RL. My car was the second one dyno'ed on our site, and I got similar results (pre-mod) to the first one--seems to put down around 190 hp when using an AWD dyno. As you saw in this thread, I did two dynos on the same machine (pre- and post-mod) and one on a different machine post-mod.

The intake I used is an AEM intake for the 3GTL. This intake fits our J35 engines with a minor mod--a bracket to allow for proper fastening in the engine compartment. You can get it with full instructions from Touge, a vendor here and the person who developed the mod. Since you've got only one post, you can't PM him (spam prevention for our site), but you can email him at sales@VisionaryRacing.com . I also bought my 5zigen exhaust from him, but you can also find other exhausts such as the quieter Tanabe, the more expensive Mugen. You also have the option of adding either a underdrive or stock-size/lighter-weight pulley, which you can get from Touge; you can also buy the J32 TL model from Unorthodox Racing--it fits our J35 with no problem.

 

Bob, how do you like your mods now that you have had them for a while? I'm thinking of doing pretty much exactly what you did to your car. I am also going to change to a K&N air filter, they say it gives you around 6-9 extra hp. I'm hoping to get my car dynoed within the next week, I'll do a pre and post DYNO so you guys can see the results.

 

I don't buy the 6-9 additional HP claimed by K&N, unless they tested the RL itself before and after adding their filter. Given that the RL is so rare, I doubt they have done that testing. They also don't state whether this gain is at the flywheel (not a major increase) or at the wheels (that would be a huge increase for just a filter). You should therefore see that number as suspect.

Do I like the mods? Yes. My mods were installed at just under 7k miles, and I'm at just under 19.5k miles now. They provide great entertainment and make my unique ride even more unique. I originally did this as an experiment and was planning to get rid of them, but I like them enough that I've kept them, even though when the engine speed suddenly drops to below 1k rpm, I hear a small burble (not a backfire). It makes me wish for ECU tuning, but with so few cars on the road, I doubt this will happen. (Amuse reportedly has an ECU kit for the RL, but no one here actually has it.)

 

Is this the Air Intake that you have Bob? http://www.autocarparts.com/part/40/0/

3 questions:

1- Can you give me a link to the 5Zigen exhaust that you have so I can take a look at it.

2- Does anyone make headers for the RL, I can't find any.

3- How posts do I need to have before I can PM?

Thanks,

- Seth

 

Seth, there are no headers for the RL. Feel free to shoot me a email if you need the RL intake w/ bracket and exhaust as there items we carry.

 

5Zigen Fireball Mega Exhaust--5Zigen web site

What the exhaust looks like out of the box

AEM Cold Air intake for Acura J32/J35 engine (TL)--Touge sells this same intake with the bracket needed for RL installation.

No headers for the RL. Market is too small.

You need 5 posts to be able to PM IIRC.

 

I just got this from Visionary Racing: http://www.visionaryracing.com/store...&productId=155
Can't wait for it to get here!

 

Here's some food for thought...

I've got a saturn vue with the J35. Mine is FWD.

I put down 217hp/210ft-lbs to the front wheels.

Since your car is AWD, that would explain why you're right around 200AWHP. The drivetrain loss would be about correct.

However, my J35 is rated at 250hp, while yours is rated around 300 I presume? The cams are different I'm pretty sure.

Technically, you should STILL have more HP than me. I guess the SH-AWD really does screw with things a little bit!

 

Make sure you do a dyno before and after so we can quantify the gains from this part.

(It may get me off the fence in ordering it. )

P.S. The link to Touge's modded AEM intake is HERE. I didn't know Touge had put it on his web site, but then again, it's been almost a year since I ordered.

 

Sure thing, I might be able to get the dyno tomorrow.

 

Great! I'll be checking in from Kentucky (taking a quick family trip).

burnout, that's what we think as well. The Temple of VTEC tested engine power in an RDX by decoupling the SH-AWD; they did a dyno in FWD mode. I didn't want my car taken apart like that just for a dyno, so I used an AWD dyno and all the issues that entails.

 

Hey, has anyone here tried putting a throttle body spacer in their RL? Any effect?

I'm thinking about taking advantage of the recall repair to get this done as the dealer has to detach the CAI anyway.

 

What could it do? And do I have to go in for the recall?

 

Apologies for the delayed reply, I've been out of town.

A throttle body spacer adds material that does not conduct, or conducts less heat, from the air intake (not the air in it), than when the system is stock. This leads to slightly cooler air coming into the engine and this theoretically adds power. The TL guys claim (with precious little dyno evidence ) a few whp gain.

 

Very interesting read for sure. Thanks for posting.
I have the following in mind:
Intake
Exhaust-my own custom as I am not big on the available options.
Throtle Body spacer
Pulley

Just to start. Still looking at other items such as torque converter, lighter flywheel, NOS,etc.

My dyno shop is popular amongst STI owners and which I have dyno'd all of my Lexus's in the past. Perhaps I will post some results here.

 

Cant wait for the dyno with the mods!

 

Wow, that really is a large drop in bHP compared to wHP!! I always thought that you only lost 15-20% through the drivetrain, which should make it closer to 250 wHP with mods. Do the dynos account for AWD drivetrains?? I would have assumed they would due to the fact many vehicles are available with AWD. Thank you, Bob, for the automotive controlled trial!!

 

Holy thread revival! The ultimate RL mod thread lives on!

@470hp: PLEASE post dyno results. Pretty please. I'm still awaiting proven gains with the throttle body spacer and underdrive pully in the RL so I can decide whether to put them on. I was a guinea pig once....time for others to help out.

@DoctorTuna: 35% drivetrain loss is apparently not that unusual with AWD. When I spoke with Bushur about the loss, he indicated that it was about right as he achieved similar results with the Evos and WRXs that make up his primary business. Given that Bushur built a 9-second 1/4 mile Evo recently, I think the man knows what he's talking about. Adding to the confusion is that we can't turn off SH-AWD without removing the driveshaft so we can test power through the front wheels. I wasn't willing to do that with my car.

You know another advantage to my mods? Now I don't have to seriously consider the 4G TL. 305 hp? Hmph. Allowing for 35% drivetrain loss, my estimate is (as posted above) as much as 340 hp at the flywheel. In a race, I should be able to kick the TL's butt. That is, if I was willing to race.

One last item: I've put 24k miles on the car with these mods and haven't recognized any engine issues.

 

okay yesterday I read through this entire thread and those numbers seem very wrong for me. only 200whp with all those mods? SooOO I spoke to a guy who does Dynos and told him the numbers...he automatically told me ....the numbers seem off because of the RL SH-AWD.................so

 

Nice post. Intresting info. Nice going Bob.

 

Will dyno in a couple of weeks. Have new brakes/rotors, rear wing, wheels (deciding still) , etc. coming shortly. I already decided on the first stage of engine mods so look out for the post. I will not be doing a dyno to dyno with each addition however. Dyno is pricey and frankly I have done so many with my other cars I will do a baseline 3 runs then install the TBS, exhaust, intake, jet computer, pulley and then take another dyno run with those mods. Hopefully we will see the j-pipe before then so that I can pick up one of those as well.