bucknerc

About to buy a new clutch (6mt 04 TL)

Was thinking about going with the spec stage 2 and also the spec lightweight flywheel.

Just wondering if anyone on here has any experience with this clutch or maybe someone has some advice on a different brand that I should go with

camrtm3

STAY WAY! I did the same thing, and none of it works!

JJH

iTrader: (1)

Want to explain cam? I have the spec stage 3+ clutch and the 14lb aluminum lightweight flywheel and everything works GREAT. Please consider explaining your claim that it doesn't work.

NWSTL

Mine has been working great for about 75k miles

camrtm3

Easy I have been dealing with this for 2 months. Haven't had a car since 12/21. The flywheel ring gear is still cut wrong after the RMA, they knifed it on the wrong side. They think the starter is coming from the engine. The clutch disc's spring pack hits the flywheel bolts if you install it like the labels. If you flip it so that the spring pack is in the pressure plate like a normal clutch the rivet plate is on the friction surface of my flywheel......

I mean in my RMA I gave them the following:
flywheel bolts
SPEC clutch
SPEC pressure plate
SPEC flywheel
OEM Flywheel (dual mass spring broken)

This video is what I got back. We (my shop and I) made a stand (OEM FLYWHEEL), put the flywheel on top and put the flywheel bolts in the SPEC flywheel. They are all the way down. Then we try to fit the clutch as the stickers say just like SPEC confirmed it would go.

camrtm3

Also here is a picture of the teeth on the ring gear compared to the OEM. Since once you get pasted the knifed area to allow the bendix to ender and retract the teeth on a start and starter ring must be straight teeth, not angled. This picture you can see my OEM flywheel on the left put into the SPEC flywheel on the right. This was the closest I was able to get it for the teeth going into each other. And this was the same way I got it back from SPEC......

FamilyGuy

About to install mine (stage 2) next week. I'll let you know how it goes.

Cam, what part numbers did you get? And what stage clutch is that?

FamilyGuy

Stage 2 clutch and flywheel:

camrtm3

Flywheel: SA40A-2
Clutch Kit: SA403H-2 (Stage 2+)

Between the 3.2L and the 3.5L the clutches are the same. But the flywheels are different. FG, Take a close up of those teeth. I am assuming you have a 07 3.5L. But from what I see there, you are going to have the same problems I am having FG. Notice the spring back is on the Flywheel side. Get some new flywheel bolts because they are stretch bolts also, but test it out before you have someone try to install it. And also compare you flywheel to this thread.

https://acurazine.com/forums/showthr...=spec+flywheel

As you can see, I have been dealing with this BS.... I have a clutchmaster set right now on order. The other thing is you will notice that the rivet plate will be touching ever so slightly on your friction surface on the flywheel if you flip the clutch.

FamilyGuy

Can you post a photo of the flywheel with the bolts in it (but no clutch blocking our view, take the clutch out)? Do it at an angle so we can see the height of the bolts.

I'll try to take a pic of my ring gear tonight.

Is the starter the same between your accord and a tl? Should be right? Bolts also the same?

Yes I did notice the sides on the clutch and it's not reversible, but everything fits right now, though I don't have the flywheel bolts to see if that clears. Clutch fits flywheel and pressure plate as it's supposed to, nothing rubs / hits. If you try to reverse it, then yeah things don't fit.

Some observations...your clutch doesn't match the photo on spec's website for a stage 2+, it looks a little different...website photo could be outdated...you double check your part number?

The clutchmasters flywheel unfortunately doesn't come with a ring gear, so you'll have to re-use your factory one. When are you going to do this?


Also from your other thread:

"It all bolted up nicely according to the Honda Tech and then he started it."

Your youtube video shows the clutch hitting the bolts underneath right? How did you / your tech say "it all bolted up nicely"...? Didn't it hit?

camrtm3

Unfortunately it will have to wait until Tuesday possible Wednesday. I live in MD and we keep getting hit by snow...and my only vehicle I have access to so I can drive to the shop is my RWD work van.

I am unsure if my starter is the same. I know that the clutch and flywheel system from LUK Industries is the exact same for both cars. LUK is who makes our stuff, sells it to Acura and Honda, then those two put their names on it and part numbers...

Yes, I know the clutch doesn't match the picture. I even point that out to SPEC. I RMA'ed this entire system. They confirmed that this is all 100% perfect. So yes, all I, Honda, MA-Motorsports, and SPEC confirmed these are the correct parts for what is listed.

As for the clutchmaster, it does come with a starter ring gear. You can't pull the OEM one off because it is apart of mass side one (side that bolts to the crank)on the dual mass. I have another video to show how my OEM one is shot that will so you that also.

Now, the all Bolts up okay part was from Honda. They said lets flip it okay it works. I took it to MA-Motorsports because Honda was not willing to work with me to get the starter to disengage. The other part is I was getting tired of not being hands on with this so there might be come confusion because I was getting information for techs not seeing it first hand. When I got my hands on it again to look, there was a ton of marking that came from forcing the flywheel on to the crank. But yes, the clutch was in backwards from Honda. Surprised it didn't mark the friction surface.

FamilyGuy

I don't know how ours work, but I could swear CM came without a ring gear for the type s and we had to use the OEM one. I don't see that detail in the description anymore on CM and xlr8's websites so maybe that's changed. I've never seen our OEM DMF so don't know if it's one piece or not, but since CM required the OEM ring gear I always assumed it was removable.

Edit: on xlr8's page: "CM uses an OEM steel ring gear secured by bolts."

You sure the full part numbers are exactly the same between accord and type S?

Wow

thisaznboi88

iTrader: (7)

well that settles it. No SPEC clutch for me ever!! Sooo many bad reviews from both accord and TL owners. Wrong parts, mismatch parts, missing bearing, grinding, and etc.

FamilyGuy

A friend of mine has a stage 3 in his golf R works fine no issues. Seems to be hit or miss?

Josh at xlr8 confirms CM now has a type s flywheel and comes with a ring gear. If my spec has any issues I'll try theirs. Fingers crossed

JJH

iTrader: (1)

I had the same issue. The ring gear teeth didn't match up properly to the starter gear causing the bendix to occasionally get "mated" to the flywheel and the starter would then turn with the flywheel. After turning it off, it would then come loose and everything was fine. This only happened for the first couple thousand miles after it was installed. I spoke with Jeremy at Spec Clutch and he adamantly suggested that I have nothing to worry about and that this was the proper teeth angle and everything. We went back and forth on the phone for about a week or two. I finally just said screw it and went on my way. The only issue that it may cause in the long run is the start teeth becoming worn out but that's unlikely.

gerzand

iTrader: (3)

sucks for you because that's all Honda Manufacturing uses on their cars. Must work for someone. Hey, im one of them! Woot! Stage 3+ is wonderful

kingkong_dav

Gerzand where did u get ur parts for your 4 inch intake u sold

kingkong_dav

Ha

camrtm3

So I was able to get to the shop and pic everything up so I can pack it and ship it. But here are all my pictures to share.

Part one:
The clutch rivet plate is hitting the pressure plate fiction surface and causing issues. The following pictures/video will show you that alone it doesn't work and if I let this go I could of died from the clutch exploded.

Damage from testing and the rivet plate hitting the friction surface.


Damage to rivet plate from friction surface on flywheel.


Video -> Side note, I hate my voice.

camrtm3

Flywheel Bolts


OEM flywheel ->Ring gear is not removable. Thing weighs about 20+lbs




Video of clutch and flywheel

thisaznboi88

iTrader: (7)

you and kiet are the only 2. and honda does not use poor "spec". it is exedy or luk.

JJH

iTrader: (1)

I have a Spec stage 3+ too ^

gerzand

iTrader: (3)

Plus JJH. The race teams bud

thisaznboi88

iTrader: (7)

+ him also

I wondering if the XLR one is any good? They use southbend clutch

FamilyGuy

I don't see an xlr8 branded clutch/FW on their site for the type s, only clutchmasters.



Cam, thanks for the pics and video bud, I'm gonna test fit first with some extra flywheel bolts to see if mine rubs / hits, before I start taking the car apart. Something isn't right, we have some with a spec setup and it works, ring gear issues aside. If mine is screwed up I'll be returning it as well. I hope not, since CM is a few hundred more expensive. What are you planning on doing now? Clutchmasters? Back to OEM parts?

thisaznboi88

iTrader: (7)

^ PM XLR8. I think they are made to order.

camrtm3

Slow down. Now look. My intentions here are not to make anyone panic or flip out. It was to simply stop something from going from bad to worse like my situation. Now for Gerand, and JJH... I am guessing that you are lucky with your install. I have a guy I know in cali with your set up and his is messed up. More or less the flywheel still takes a while to disengage from the starter.

Now the clutchmaster flywheel, I talked to clutchmaster about. Both guys I spoke to opened the info on it and both times when I brought up the starter ring they spat out the exact difference between the 3.0/3.2L flywheel and the 3.5L. The sad part wasn't even that, it was when they both said "you wont believe how many times we get this exact call"

FamilyGuy

You gonna try CM's setup?

How do I know if the starter doesn't release like it's supposed to? Any way to test this without installing?

camrtm3

yes. I will definitely post pics of the CM. but the spring pack is confirmed to go inside the pressure plate. The starter thing, I till take some pics of my teeth tomorrow of my OEM flywheel. they should be close to that. but the thing is that of the teeth. I think the issue is that the angle of approach on my ring gear was not deep enough so it want able to "spit" out the starter.

FamilyGuy

Cam when are you getting the CM in the mail?

callahan

I'm running stage 3 cm with aasco flywheel with 0 problems. Hopefully your kit works out for you.

camrtm3

Hopefully sometime this week. It was rushed but still awaiting tracking number.

FamilyGuy

Let us know and post some pics when u get it if u can. My mechanic doesn't have extra bolts laying around, so either I take a chance installing it or return now and order the CM. This sucks.

And please post your part numbers. I wanna see if they're the same as the type s parts. Thx!

FamilyGuy

Here's a close up of the spec ring gear.

Clutch side:




Engine side:

camrtm3

EUREKA! Got that from Malen, the gentleman that got me these parts. Well the moment of truth.... Clutchmasters AL flywheel and clutch (350 series).

FamilyGuy

Awesome. What's the weight on it? And what's your feeling on build quality vs the Spec?

I'm not familiar with the OEM clutch. What is that "speed ring" or whatever you called it? This must be the design Spec mentions that they eliminate with their setup? That doesn't look as robust as a regular pressure plate design.

Looks just like the AASCO one I've been looking at:

camrtm3

That is hilarious! That flywheel does look exactly the same. I bet the only difference is that Clutchmasters grabs the pins for the pressure plate alignment and just stuck it on. The ring is just something stupid if at a certain speed. When your high in RPMs the centripetal force on the pressure plate it going so the springs have some pressure on it already. So when you go to push in the clutch you don't need to push as far for a full release. So what happens is there are 3 fingers of this pressure plate, they are one designed to stop your foot from pushing too much futher and putting the throw out bearing through the clutch disc causing fiction again. The other part from what I am trying to get more info on is it locks in place until the rotational speed comes down low enough that the centripetal force is low to not cause trouble point again in the clutch operation. Only able to find it on the V6 Hondas/Acuras.

LUK/OEM Kit. Check out the pressure plate.
http://www.rockauto.com/catalog/more...494&cc=1443202

FamilyGuy

Wow never seen that before. The prongs look weak in comparison.

AASCO charges 499 for their flywheel on heeltoe. I think CM is just over 600 at xlr8.

AASCO says theirs is 14.2lbs and CM says theirs is 13lbs, which seems a bit light. I'd like to be closer to 15lbs than 12lbs.

My flywheel bolts are coming in Thursday, to test the spec's clearance.

thisaznboi88

iTrader: (7)

why does your pressure plate look like OEM painted white? It has those stupid springs on it

camrtm3

because it is? haha