Jakes_tl

Has anyone on this forum gone through Dave Ramsey's Financial Peace University? Would be interesting to hear some feedback and results..

thoiboi

Is it anything like Trump University?

justnspace

iTrader: (1)

the school of hard knocks taught me to buy clothes, cars, and jewelry

Jakes_tl

I think he has a lot of good information for a lot of people, something that should be taught in school. I guess the real secret is discipline but that is something a lot of people lack.

justnspace

iTrader: (1)

I've never listened to Dave, but his general information is great for the masses!

I learned everything from my strict asian momma.
she would whoop me for not saving.

Jakes_tl

Nothing wrong with that, better then being spoiled!

justnspace

iTrader: (1)

we're conditioned to want things now! it does take discipline to control spending!!
but I equate it to a physical fitness journey.
if the end goal is to be financially stable or physically fit, one needs to take steps to get there!

TacoBello

Fuck that.

spend money, fuck bitches, as I always like to say.

thoiboi

It's all about instant gratification..

justnspace

iTrader: (1)

that's how I ended up with crabz.

Anachostic

I'm not a fan of Ramsey's motivational style, but some people need tough talk to take action. I don't think you could go wrong with it; both he and Clark Howard give solid advice.

Jakes_tl

Never heard of Clark Howard

Jakes_tl

I don't really think that Dave is tough, I think his straightforward and it works well for most people.

atomlinks

I went through one of his programs about 10 years ago, totally worth it. I don't agree with absolutely everything but follow the plan and you'll surely be better off. We did the rice and beans thing for about 3-4 years until we were debt free/mortgage free. I'd probably still be in debt and have a house payment if I never went through Dave's stuff.
Drive Free, Retire Rich - daveramsey.com

Jakes_tl

It would be awesome to not having to pay a mortgage very month.

atomlinks

It was a rough time for those 3-4 yrs as we were living off of my wife's small paycheck. My entire paycheck went toward the mortgage making triple payments. The wife thought I was completely nuts when I told her that I wanted to pay off the house by the time I was 30 yrs old. But when I showed her the math and how much we would save in the long run(7% interest at the time) it was a no-brainer. It's really amazing how much of a difference it makes just making even a small extra payment toward the principal every month.

Excel calc was something like this:
https://www.vertex42.com/ExcelTempla...-payments.html

Rapture

I've heard a lot about it, but from my understanding it's mostly just adopting a frugal lifestyle, differentiating needs from wants, saving for retirement, compounding interest, etc. etc.

Is there more to it? I'm a pretty lame person when it comes to money and spending it Being frugal is 2nd nature to me.

nist7

When I started learning about money and investing a few months before my first real job...I watched Dave Ramsey's videos since his name was being floated around...and I found 0 usefulness in his videos. The main reason is because I was already having his baseline beliefs about frugal spending and tackling debt hardcore (my only huge debt is school, no credit card/car/consumer debt of other kinds).

And as I watched I realized that his program is geared towards people in lot of debt or high interest debt and need to get their wasteful spending under control. His steps are highly geared towards eliminating debt as the main driving force to financial success...which is alot of the american public and why he has been very very successful (he does believe strongly in the prosperity gospel....as he has been criticized by other Christians for profiting off of people in debt and living a fairly lavish lifestyle).

So I think Dave Ramsey is a useful starting point for people who need to control their impulsive spending and those who are in debt already. He is more of a psychological motivator to get debt/spending under control than actual technical/financial advisor imo.

But for me who were looking for investment and retirement advice on how to further your money....other's are way better. Ramsey gives little useful advice on investing and many have criticized him for his over-simplification/optimistic view of mutual fund returns claiming 12% annual returns which has been widely criticized as grossly over-optimistic to the point of dangerous to those who may be counting on that number to retire. I do like his basic idea of doing mutual funds though and NOT to try pick single stock winners.

After some work my own core group of advice for investment/retirement consist of the following:

Watch Full Episodes Online of FRONTLINE on PBS | The Retirement Gamble
PBS Frontline investigation into how woefully inadequate the average american is aware of how retirement funds work. I knew 0 about investing/retirement before this video when I watched this it was very eye-opening.

https://www.bogleheads.org/wiki/Bogl...ent_philosophy
I do love Jack Bogle's story and Vanguard as a financial company. Great philosophy imo. The forums are a great community/resource and they have discussed Dave Ramsey passionately in the past....

Here's a great starting point to lazy portfolios: https://www.bogleheads.org/wiki/Lazy_portfolios

A few other names imo that are great resources:
Jim Dahle - Emergency Medicine physician now turned part time consumer/physician-investor advocate/educator. I came onto this due to my own profession but his investment and financial advice are very sound and can apply to all walks of life. Some advice are obviously geared towards more higher than average earning professionals (MDs, DDS, JD, etc.) HIs blog whitecoatinvestor is a great resource.

William Bernstein - a former neurologist, iirc, and turned into investment professional. Very useful free PDF book he has on his site on how millenials can get rich slowly (no get rich quick schemes here): If You Can and Rational Expectations

David Swensen - endowment manager at Yale. His book "Unconventional Success" can be a bit of a dry/technical read. Great resource that is still accessible to lay public for more indepth reading on investing topics.

And of course classics like Benjamin Graham's classic books and also Warren Buffett has some sensible advice, imo, for the lay public as well. He once was asked what he recommends for the average public and he pretty much said to do a low cost index fund in the SP500. He does have lot of quotable sayings though.

In general I avoid these names (which unfortunately are very popular and can dish out questionable advice):
-Suze Orman
-Dave Ramsey (somewhat mixed feeling, good for getting rid of high debt, then turn else where for more indepth investing info)
-Jim Cramer
-Robert Kiyosaki (of Rich Dad Poor Dad fame)
-Tony Robbins (meh, not bad advice at times but his works seem more self-promoting and life-coachy)
-etc.

atomlinks

I would say it really is all of the things you mentioned and not a lot more to it. But I do see his course as a pretty organized plan with steps to follow for most people that just don't know how or where to start.

One of the big things is to never again be a slave to banks by going into debt. If you are in debt, get a plan to get out as soon as you can and never again think about getting any type of loan. If you don't have the $ to buy something with cash don't do it. Pay yourself the interest that you would have been paying the bank.

Honestly those few years I was obsessed with the dude and learned quite a bit from watching his daily show/past video's of people calling in and the advice that he gave them. I remember listening to an audio book called "The millionare next door" (old book) and then finding Dave's stuff and it really changed my perception on life, money, and building wealth.

Jakes_tl

Being frugal is a good trait to have

StealthTL-S

They have this at my church. Many people say it helps them learn to get out of debt and live out of debt. Not charging things too much, paying cash more, and really living within your means. I may take the course myself I think it could help anybody to live wisely with money.

Jakes_tl

I would recommend it to anyone!

justnspace

iTrader: (1)

just grow up asian.

Jakes_tl

Are you are referring "grow up Asian" as in grow up being cheap? Financial Peace is not about being cheap, it is about financial subjects all across the board including saving, investing, retirement ect. You can live cheap and still have nothing if you don't watch / tell your money where to go.

justnspace

iTrader: (1)

that's all apart of being

we excel in school, business, money. everyting.

justnspace

iTrader: (1)

except sports. we dont do well in sports...save Jeremy Lin

wackjum

Dave Ramsey is inspirational and gives good advice for a specific situation, which is getting out of debt. We have a chromecast TV in our breakfast and about once a week or so I will stream some of his youtube clips while we eat dinner. We've learned some things, gotten motivated to do some things, and are in awe at how badly some people have gotten themselves into.

But credit is a powerful tool if used properly so I don't necessarily agree with him on that. The heart of it is that his message is tailored for the large percent of the population who already have had their chance with credit and messed up, so strong black-letter rules are important for them. Otherwise it becomes too easy to go down that slippery slope once they set small cheats for themselves.

The vast majority of Asians do not impress me with their money management skills. I am Chinese/Vietnamese (Mother Chinese, Father Vietnamese). What I've seen is a singular focus on ostentatious wealth. You've got the big house that is empty of furnishings, the non-existent yard work and zero maintenance done to the house, the luxury badged cars that aren't actually luxurious (Lexus ES-class, Base 3 or 5 series, etc), no retirement savings to speak of, no investments.

The difference, and where the perception that Asians are good with money comes, is that they do have these icons of traditional wealth (big houses, fancy cars) but what nobody sees is how they're severely leveraged they are to keep this up at the cost of their savings and retirement. They also gamble a lot.

Asian households tend to spend their money on tangible purchases. I've noticed that traditional American households tend to fritter away their money on things like eating out, cable/cell phone/other recurring service charges, vacations. But in the end, the results are the same.

Jakes_tl

That is exactly the way i see it too! I used to have a lot of Asian friends and that is what noticed. Now the Asians that live in Asia might be different.

But honestly it doesn't matter on your nationality everybody needs financial training, where and how we get it is what matters

justnspace

iTrader: (1)

obviously, i was playing.


lighten up francieseses,

*edit* there's a tight wad joke in there somewhere

justnspace

iTrader: (1)

I usually try not to create blanket statements or generalize.
and if i do, i'm MOST likely having fun

sorry, gentlemen!
carry on

justnspace

iTrader: (1)

and on that serious note;

I do have 20% and closing costs for a $150,000 home. saving a bit more for cushion/emergency fund/taxes/furniture.
car is paid off.
0 credit card debt. just use CC's for points/rewards.
contributing to 401k and Roth IRA

my asian mom taught me well!

wackjum

I haven't gone through the class itself, and I don't intend to. But I would imagine that aside from being motivational and providing resources and forcing people to go through the steps, FPU is going to outline his 7 baby steps, which you can find on youtube.


I think if you're in a mountain of debt and living paycheck to paycheck, FPU can help you. But if you're not in that situation, maybe all you need is just some inspiration from watching his youtube. I've watched hours of his youtube channel. Prior to finding out about him, we lived reasonably modest. We never carried a credit card balance and had decent savings and retirement accounts. And despite all the cars I have, I only have one car payment.

But the biggest problem was my student loans which I was just mindlessly paying the minimums on.

Then one day I came across his youtube channel and I was hooked and excited about dumping my student loans. I went to each one of them and finally actually looked at the statements. When I got out of school, I had $71,000 in student loans. After 9 years of paying on them (and paying over $75,000), I had $40,000~ left. This was a humbling experience, and I set off on a mission to pay them off. Over the past 9 months, I've been working on that and now I only have $11,000 left. Next, I am focusing on paying off our little debts (some 0% furniture and home appliance purchases) and then taking care of the mortgage in 6 years.

One of his biggest tips for us was to create a budget: EveryDollar - Dave Ramsey Budget Tool - daveramsey.com

I am self-employed and it is a little difficult for me to plan in as much detail as he would like you to, but we did put my wife's income through a budget and it helped her a lot and pulled out some savings every month.

A few other tips (not from Dave Ramsey) I have found that helped save us quite a bit of money:

1) Focus first on the monthly recurring charges for the biggest savings. Be on constant lookout for competitor's ads (say you have Comcast and AT&T sends a flier). Call up Comcast and tell them about the ad. They'll usually counter with something. This can knock $20-$30 off your monthly internet (I don't have cable) which comes out to $200-$300 a year. The same with cell-phones. Don't ever buy another new phone again. I buy all of the household's phones on Swappa.com. I haven't been on a contract in over a year and I am constantly threatening to cancel my Verizon and they'll slash $10-$20 off the phone bill or add services each time. Again do the same with your car/home insurance. Companies do screw over "loyal" customers and instead focus on bringing new people on. Don't be afraid to switch.

2) Buy a Nest thermostat. (Maybe not Nest because their eco-system leaves much to be desired, but these smart thermostats really work. Check out Ecobee instead). It cut our electric bill by half each month.

3) Put your grocery receipt on the fridge and cross out items as you use them, so you don't forget about something and end up throwing away food.

4) I would develop a list of little things to do around the house (fix leaking faucet, clean garage, change oil, etc) but never got the time to actually do them. Some of the things, like the leaking faucet, was costing money. But it just kept getting postponed. Nowadays I schedule a day of the week or month depending on how many things there are, and then just devote that entire day to knocking out the tasks on the list. Since you've created the time, you will actually get to them.

wackjum

I'm not insulted at all. I'm just making a note, I haven't been impressed by Asian households managing money. Even my own parents weren't too great, although they did pretty well for being immigrants. I don't know that I could have been half as successful if it were me.

justnspace

iTrader: (1)

I like that fridge receipt idea.
sometimes food gets pushed back into the fridge and dont know until it becomes spoiled

justnspace

iTrader: (1)

when I first joined acurazine, SVTmike, offered some advice to some one...and I held it to heart ever since!!

he said, a high credit score shouldnt be a goal, rather it should be used as a tool to help you gain wealth.

gatrhumpy

iTrader: (1)

I used my CC to get Hilton hotel points, and at the end of March, will collect roughly $1200 in rewards with two free nights for two rooms in Washington DC.

gatrhumpy

iTrader: (1)

Oh! And our net worth just hit a major milestone, so we're happy about that!

Jakes_tl

Lots of great stuff posted above! People with a good plan always succeed.

nist7

I see lot of Asians put lot of money into real estate...and not as much of the show off vehicles. Though with my own mom and her acquiantances it's more Honda/Toyotas in the Driveway and then a large home in a upper middle class neighborhood.

A few people who are a bit more showy/seemingly elf-absorbed types do get better cars in my experience.

My post above has my fleshed out thoughts and honestly people should get the basics of frugality down and get out of debit (use Ramsey if you need to) and then learn about smart/sound investing and use those IRAs and 401ks!