E92Vancouver

Big fail having a CVT transmission. I was interested in this car for my daughter (really for me but that's how I would sell it). She can't drive manual, so I guess she will have to learn because a CVT is a non starter, How cheap of Acura!!!

https://www.caranddriver.com/news/g3...levels-colors/

ESHBG

It's another fail right out of the gate and a huge missed opportunity since the Integra has name recognition.

richii0207

What kind of recognition? The Integra was never “fast”.

ESHBG

This may be age specific but the Integra was a very popular car when I was younger and clearly has a lasting following if it was worth them reviving it.

richii0207

More demographic specific. I had an lsvtec. GSR was slow, along with the LS and GS. ITR was obviously the quickest Integra, but still not “fast”. It was only popular because of the aftermarket support. If it has the same aftermarket support as the Civic, there will be a following.

Although the K20 Civic Si was the better performer due to LSD, people still bought the RSX-Type S. Although not everyone has your same taste, it will cater to a specific buyers.

ESHBG

Sure but many do have my same tastes. We shall see how the sales figures are, particularly in comparison to the SI.

richii0207

Sales will likely not be equivalent to the 90s and 00s as the vehicle trend has shifted from
vans > coupes/sedans > suvs/crossover.

The trend or demand for larger interior space can be seen by the constant complaint of “small rear legroom” in numerous sedan reviews. If someone wanted to prioritize legroom that much, an SUV will always be a better buy for them. Coupe sales are abysmal in the current market and sedans will likely follow suit as the market shifts to larger vehicles once again.

This is likely why Acura didn’t even bother making a coupe and Honda already stopped making Si coupes. Who knows, maybe in the future, we’ll probably all be driving EV SUVs.

ESHBG

It's a fair point but there's still a solid market for smaller but practical cars, at least where I live (Philly) and the Civic hatchback is pretty popular here. But yes I will take this into consideration with the sales figures.

GhostTL09

iTrader: (1)

Not if we have a year with $4/$5 gas prices. The trend will see a boost in smaller economical vehicles like the Integra.

Nedmundo

I'm in Philly also, and no question many people prefer smaller practical cars in this environment. Subaru Crosstreks and compact SUVs are absolutely everywhere, and I also see lots of Civic hatchbacks, GTIs, Kia Souls, Minis, old Honda Elements, etc. I therefore expect the Integra to do well here, as the ILX has.

I'm very happy that the Integra is a hatch, because I like that extra load-hauling capability. I want to go electric next year (or at least PHEV), but if for some reason I don't, the Integra will be at the top of the list provided: (a) it has excellent fuel economy; and (b) I'm willing to stay with 6MT or I can tolerate the Integra's CVT. I think the sticking point will be the transmission, because I had hoped to go automatic with my next car. The traffic around here makes most driving a chore, and unfortunately that's slightly magnified with MT. I still prefer it much of the time, but no longer prefer it most of the time.

richii0207

The Civic Si will be a tough buy when there’s more that’s offered from the Integra like heated seats, ELS audio, adaptive dampers, and better warranty coverage.

Chargersix

Honda will sell more Civic Si’s than Acura sells Integras with manual transmissions. And it won’t be close.

richii0207

What do you think will make buyers choose the Si over the Integra?

Chargersix

Simple, equal, if not better performance (since it’s lighter), for less money. Especially to upgrade/upsell to the Integra with adaptive suspension.

richii0207

Can you show me the information on curb weight of the Integra? The adaptive suspension is a blessing when you want comfort vs sporty.

fiatlux

28K vs 35K. $7K is a big difference in this segment where buyers are price sensitive. Not to mention the CTR is available right above this for those who have the means, eating further into Integra 6MT sales.

richii0207

So they officially released the pricing as 35k for the A-Spec?

Chargersix

Check the first impressions that are out. They comment that the Integra is over six inches longer, despite having the same wheel base. And that it will undoubtedly have more sound suppression, because Acura owners (as they should) expect more creature comforts that Honda owners. That all equals additional weight. Also can’t deny an adaptive suspension can provide a more comfortable ride, if that’s what one desires, but at a cost. The previous gen Civic Si had an adaptive suspension. Don’t know why they left it on the cutting room floor for this gen (left to allow differentiation for the Integra? wasn’t worth the cost or complexity for typical Si buyers?). The things you mention are upgrades over what the Si offers. All I am saying is there will be many more people willing to forego these added comforts and pay less for equal performance in the Si.

fiatlux

A-Spec+Tech (which is the only way to get the 6MT) is expected to be right around $35K. The current ILX Aspec+Tech is $6K more than the base. The TLX A-Spec is almost $7K more than the base. $35K might even be low.

Legend2TL

No official pricing released yet

That's incorrect, the 6MT is available with either A-Spec or A-Spec+Tech package https://acuranews.com/en-US/releases...new-generation

fiatlux

The press release is being misleading. Both Acuras own website and dealer order guide shows that the 6MT is only available if you add the tech package.

ESHBG

I am with you and why I am so disappointed with the CVT and was hoping for something else. I don't want to do a manual again for my daily driver because they are all but dead unfortunately and I have a stop sign or a red light every few feet and I appreciate my current Auto due to the crazy traffic here.

Honda430

I'd argue that the typical Integra buyer won't even consider looking at let alone buying a Civic SI.

Legend2TL

Actually conundrum is on Acura's website which also points to the same press release under the spec section for the Integra so it's not clear. The reservation also does not show the base Integra so it's confusing to say the least.

https://www.acura.com/future-vehicles/integra

Chargersix

In a previous post I acknowledged the two vehicles attract different demographics. So while I agree with you, if they are looking at an Integra with a manual transmission, it’s worth their time to look at both.

fiatlux

Not to mention taking a look at the upcoming CTR and ITS. The put the regular 6MT Integra into a weird middle spot. Folks on a budget will likely fall back to the Si, and folks with money will likely spring for the CTR or ITS. Sort of the same issue Audi has with the Golf R DSG, S3, and RS3 (except funnily enough pre-pandemic you can get an S3 for less money than the Golf R around these parts)

richii0207

We don’t know how much the manual Integra would cost. But let’s just say that it’s $4,000 more (32.5 total). That is for:

• adaptive suspension (loved it on the 10th gen Si and FK8, back-saver)
• extended warranty compared to Honda (6yr/70k) included maintenance,
• ELS speakers (Much better than the Si, at least compared to the 10th gen Si)
• convenient features
  • HUD
  • heated seats
  • leather seats front and back
  • power adjustable seats
  • memory seats
  • hatchback space
  • wireless charging

Plus more and that seems like a good deal, it’s almost like an “advance” trim for the Si.

fiatlux

Lol you think the Aspec+tech is going to be less than $2500 more expensive than the base Integra? Not going to happen.

If anything, the Integra 6MT will probably be priced closer to the ITS than the Si. Acura already said the Integra will start at around $30K. In the ILX, the Aspec+Tech package is an extra $6K. Let's be optimistic and say it's just a $5K premium in the Integra; that brings it to ~$35K. In the TLX, the premium between the Type S and the A-Spec SH-AWD is $6K as well. If that's the same for the ITS, then you're looking at ~$41K for the ITS. Let's say for sake of making room for the CTR, they even bump it up to ~$42K. You'd be looking at ~$42K for an ITS, ~$40K for the CTR, ~$35K for an Integra 6MT, ~$30K for a base Integra, and $27.3K for the Si. With this type of pricing, it's going to be a narrow set of folks who would buy the Integra 6MT when these other options exist on both sides of the pricing structure.

richii0207

The $4k more estimate was based off of how much a base ILX cost ($27.3k) compared to the ASpec ($31.3k)

fiatlux

So you expect the Integra to cost the same as the Si? If not, you should add the $4K to the base price of the Integra which is ~$30K.

And for that matter, you can’t get the 6MT on the A-Spec Integra without also getting the Tech package. On the current ILX that’s $6K over the base ILX.

richii0207

How much does a Civic Si cost near you?

fiatlux

MSRP is $27.3K, but how is that relevant? It seems like you're suggesting that since Base ILX = Civic Si, and A-Spec ILX = Base ILX + $4K, that means by susbstitutive property A-Spec ILX = Si + $4K, and thus somehow A-Spec Integra = Si + $4K. I'm not sure how the last part makes any sense because the Base Integra != Base ILX in terms of pricing, as we already know the Base Integra will be ~$30K.

richii0207

We shall see

DaIll1

and don't forget the 10k dealer markup because... Integra

fiatlux

My dude, Acura has already said the Integra is priced at around ~$30K. There is no "we shall see"; it's aleady a known fact unless you think Acura is bullshitting all of us.

Chargersix

Just read on a Civic forum from someone cross shopping the Si and a manual Integra (so they do cross pollinate to some degree) was told by their local Acura dealer that the Integra with A-Spec and tech packages will be around $36k plus destination. May be hearsay, but we are all just speculating. Regardless, while the new Integra may be comfy, that is a lot of money for a 200hp “sporty” compact.

fiatlux

I imagine the dealer is doing the same thing most (but apparently not all) folks have been doing with regards to pricing; looking at the delta between the ILX A-Spec+Tech ($6K), and adding that to the $30K estimate Acura provided for the base model.

I suspect what Acura is doing is trying to capture all the hardcore enthusiasts who really wants a 6MT Integra by selling them the more profitable top trim models, and then once they have that, release the CTR and ITS, and once sales of the 6MT falls off the face of the earth by the mid cycle refresh, either also make it available on the base models (optimistic) or kill the option entirely (pessimistic). Unfortunately, I think it'll be the latter.

richii0207

The A4 is much more than $35k for 201hp!

cruiserchuck

The A3 is also much more than $35k for 201hp. At least they have a 7 speed auto (A3) and 7 speed DCT (A4).

I had an A4 with the DCT and really liked it. It did not have any of the problems I recall reading about here regarding the DCT on the 1st gen TLX. I never read the threads about the ILX, so I am not aware of how the DCT worked out on the ILX.

Tony Pac

Wait and see! There is no big fail, people think Integra was NSX

Integra was always a Civic based car with some minim updates and handled well. If ILX was outselling A3, 2 series and A Class, then this new design will be even more successful. What was ILX's key to success? Price. It was significantly more expensive than Civic but much lower than its German competitors. The issue is most people don't know Integra and just like to comment. Watch this and you will learn everything about Integra in less than 15 minutes.

Last but not least, check who is driving the new Integra when Acura first revealed it last week: a young (<30 year) old guy. As AOA says, this is Acura's way to attract young people to the brand and then once they have better job or family, they switch to either TLX, RDX or MDX.