OK, this may be a stretch... Or perhaps it's doable. Need some thoughts.

Currently (see image), we have one flush-mount light in our "kitchen". What I'd like to do is install some sort of a pendant light that hangs down from the ceiling. That part is easy.

My fear is that we'd lose quite a bit of light doing this.. So, I'd like to install 6 can lights... Three along the left side between the island and cabinets and three along the right side between the island and sink area. BTW, the can lights over the sink are on a separate switch and the pendant light for the kitchen table is as well.

I know they make can lights that can be installed after the fact. But how easy/hard is it to pull the wire for the cans? Code in this county is conduit, so would I have to tear out the drywall and install conduit? Would/could romex work? Is there an easy way to fish wire through the ceiling? I have no access from above... So I guess I'd have to drill a bunch of holes? What about going through the joists?

Pain in the ass?

 

Sounds/looks like it would be a bit of work, without access from above.

You might consider some low voltage track lighting. You could put a new ceiling box near the main kitchen light, add a short run of donduit connecting the boxes and fish the wire through the existing conduit to the switch. Then replace the switch with a dual switch/dimmer. Not quite the same thing, but might do the same job.

BTW, it might be easier to replace the existing wire - i.e. running two sets of new wires by temporarily tying them to the existing wire and pulling the existing wire out of the wall box, bringing the new wires to it.

BTW #2 - where did you get those cabinets from?

 

Not a huge fan of track lighting... I like the clean look of can lights. It is an idea, however.

I need to think about this. This may require some professional help. I do know an electrician, but that only gets me half way. I may need a drywall guy to finish up on all the mess that would be made.

Cabinets.. Our builder put them in. Made by HomeCrest. http://www.homecrestcab.com/

 

Can you tell which way the joists run? If they run parallel to the window wall, it should be a piece of cake. Assuming you don't need to run conduit. I did a similar project in my living room.

So all the wiring has to be run through conduit? In that case, you could cut out a 6" or so strip of sheetrock, drill your holes through the joists, assuming they run perdendicular, then patch the sheetrock. I hope you're good with blending seams.

Are both lights on the same switch? Are you looking to tap into the existing wiring from one of those lights?

 

if you're able to use Romex then it's a simple job.

use the existing hole for the pendant and run along the joists to the center lights, then feed from the center lights through the joists to the two lights on each side using a flexible auger:

http://www.amazon.com/Greenlee-Textr...1813223&sr=8-8

 

If you HAVE to use conduit, can you at least get away with using flexible tubing? you'd be able to run that just as you would romex.

 

I'll have to call my buddy who is an electrician and see what he thinks. I'm guessing he's going to say conduit.

Not sure on the flexible stuff, Adam. I can look into that.

I'm going to tap into the exsiting power on the flush-mount light. The pendant light is on a seperate switch.

 

Oh and the joists run perpendicular to the walls (left and right in the picture).

 

But are they solid joists or that other type made from multiple pieces of 2x4 (for lack of a technical description)?

 

How is anybody ever going to know if you used conduit or not?

There are low voltage recessed lighting systems you can get if you absolutely cannot run the romex. It is pretty easy to do once you make a bunch of 6" holes in the ceiling no matter which way the joists run so long as you don't run into a firewall or lots of HVAC ducting.

I'd just get the cans and do it. The remodel cans have some little ears on them. You connect the wiring, put the can in the hole, and push out the ears. They snap in place and hold the light. Then you add your trim.

I'd suggest getting a drywall hole cutter if you don't have one. they sell tham at home depot and it is this contraption you put on a drill with a bit for the center and a little blade that spins around to make your cutout.

Before you cut the hole though - CHECK IT FIRST. Get a coat hanger, punch a little hole and feel around for vents, etc. Or, you could be like me and cut the hole and realize you can't fit the can there becase a duct is in the way.

 

I bought my Greelee flex bit at Home Depot.


What you're looking to do is fairly complex, but doable (if you aren't requiredto use conduit). I am doing something similar in the hall in my entrance way; replacing hanging lights with cans and adding 3 can lights. Fortunatley the I'll only have to drill across 2 floor joists and I can use Romex

Good luck!

 

Solid.

 

I used something like this in my house. Complexity really depends on which way your joists run.

 

[QUOTE=hypertech]How is anybody ever going to know if you used conduit or not?[/quot]

Seriously. 99% of the country is bare Romex, I don't understand this whole conduit thing you got going on out there.

Every house here since probably 1970 is plain old Romex.

It's not going to hurt your house. If your house burns down, it's not going to be because you ran a little Romex in your kitchen ceiling, so it's not going to affect your insurance coverage.

If you sell your house, an inspector is never going to look at the wiring in your kitchen ceiling.

So just run Romex and you'll be done in a couple hours, no mess.

Good tip. HVAC ductwork is a major PITA.

 

i am going to do the same thing.

we have a flourescent "box" on our vaulted ceiling.

i am going to use that junction box and run the wire from recessed light to recessed light.


should take a few hours but will be nicer than my current lighting.

 

it will not be worth the headaches...you will destroy your kitchen ceiling, the wife will be livid, it will be a mess. just do the right thing, man up, dont be cheap, hire people to do the job right, quickly, legally, and clean up their mess. you are opening 10 cans of worms tearing into a ceiling like that....ESPECIALLY with the joists oriented the way they are...

that kitchen is way too new and too nice to have (no offense) an amateur home owner start hacking away at it. somethings are best left to professionals. if the house as 70 years old and youre trying to upgrade, thats one thing, but hacking apart a nearly new house...not smart...just for the wife headaches alone!

 

I agree with Bubba. And I'll bet it's not that terribly expensive.

 

For the record, it's 100000 times easier to do the job in a newer house then a 70 year old or older house.

Also, those bits you use that attach to your drill to cutout the hole makes a gigantic mess. You also will not be able to feel anything as you cut. With a run of the mill sheetrock saw, you can feel where the joists are. Of course you want to use a stud finder, but depending on whats up there, it may not be 100% accurate. I would also invest in a set of fiberglass glow rods. They are bendable, and help run from one can to another. If the ceiling is insulated, the rods come with a bullet tip that will push right through the insulation, where a snake would get wound up. I almost never use a snake, just glow rods.

I would say anything is possible, and you could get the job done if you have the patience and the know how. It would be easier to hire an electrician, but some people just like to tackle projects on their own, if for nothing else to be able to say they did it. I'd say practice up on taping, and painting, cause you may want to end up cutting a channel, and probably have to cut access to run wires down the wall, unless you are tapping off existing lighting (I forget if you mentioned if you are or running the line directly to a switch.

 

I'll give this some thought over the next few days... See what happens.

Thanks all.

 

just be happy you don't have a foam filled house. even the simplest tasks here leave me scratching my head.

 

I had the same problem myself when I installed 6 cans in my family room and although what I did is not up to code it worked. I connected off my main light and fished it to the light following the beams connected the can then pulled it back out where the ceiling and wall meet then ran it behind some thick crown molding to th next row etc.

 

that is so phil of you.

 

its custom

 

I still can't believe they have that conduit rule. Such a waste of time/money.

Hopefully they let you use the Flex Cable.


This project is definitely doable. Where do you plan on putting the switches?

 

That doesn't sound like the safest way to go about it. I'm considering doing the same thing with coax. Just as cheesey, but not as risky.

 

I just need run the cable and install the cans. The switch is already there.

 

When you say run conduit, are you referring to BX cable? Or are you referring to a pvc conduit?

 

I'm talking about real conduit... BX is crap and is not code.

Part of my handy work during my basement project...

 

looks like a photo from 1950

 

Conduit is code in my neck of the woods too.

One thing I did when we had our house built was walk through right before drywalling and take a picture of every wall in the house. Now if I want to know what's in a wall I just have to take out my photo album. Comes in very handy.

 

wow, that look s like alot of work. Totally unnecessary.

 

hater

 

Hmm. Did you talk to your Electrician friend yet?

 

Nothing against Scrib and his work (because he did a great job), but it really is unnecessary in my professional opinion.


For a residential house, I just can't justify why that is code. It almost blows my mind.

 

Agree. I would tackle this job in no time. Just take your time and figure things out before you dive in too deep. Find where the joists are, figure out where your cans are going to be placed. Find out if there is any vent work in the way. Plan out you plan of attack. Also if you have insulation in the ceiling, purchase the IC (in contact) cans. They are very simple to install as after the fact.
I too find the conduit code stupid in residential and dont wee any reason to run it in the ceiling like that. No one can see it, so i would run romex

 

J/k . Nice job.

 

most are just the wires fished through the 2x4's, nothing inside conduit

 

That's all we ever did at my old work, except for wiring in an unfinished basement, which would only get conduit if it was on the walls (nothing in the ceiling got conduit)


Conduit would protect the wire from people sawing into their walls, or possibly someone driving a really long nail/screw. But the cost far outweighs the benefits.

 

Copper pipe is also code here. Seems like the flexible shit is becoming the norm.

Some of the residential codess on Illinois are pretty funny. For new construction, you have to install outlets in the horizontal, instead of the vertical. Why??? In case you were to drop something on a plug that was partially exposed you wouldn't complete the circuit. LOL

 

Yes, but he is not able to come by until next week. Should know more then.