I'm a hardgainer, and I was wondering if mass gainers are EVER good to use, even sparingly. I've heard they're essential for ectomorphs, but others say they're just sugar + supplements. What do you guys think?

I'm just having a hard time getting in extra GOOD calories when I don't really have much of an appetite in the first place. Of course I do prefer whole foods however it's kinda difficult to get 450+ calories in a meal that won't make a small guy feel bloated.

 

How much is eating too little calories? I am lifting not too hard 2-3 times a week, and 30-40 minutes on elliptical 6 days a week. I am eating 1500-1750 calories a day and I am 5 8 185lbs

 

wow, thats like basically what i eat as well.

and im about 5'8" 185-190ish as well

 

I'm 5'10" about 200lbs and looking to lose at least 20lbs and tone up a bit in 17 weeks.

Any idea how I could achieve this? What foods I should eat? Workouts to do?

I currently don't attend a gym, but I do push-ups and crunches before going to bed and when I wake up (if that helps any, lol). I plan on signing up for my local gym tomorrow.

All input is appreciated!

 

Simple way is calories in are less than calories out. Diet is seriously about 80% of weight loss. Start running or riding a bike. That helps more than anything you can get from a gym.

 

And try to limit alcohol consumption to one day a week.

 

If you really want to burn fat, cardio is a must along with a healthy diet. Jogging anywhere from 30-40 mins 2x-3x a week is good. If you can't manage 30-40 mins, start off with 20 mins or even 15. Alternatively, you could jump rope (or speed rope when you get better) for 12-15 minutes a day 4x-5x a week. There are many other exercises you can try but these are a good start and the easiest to get into cardio IMO. Make sure you have proper running shoes or else you will get shin splints. Not cool and very painful.

 

Want to chime in here on the calories in calories out mantra we've been told for years. The idea that a calorie is a calorie your body will treat it the same whether it came from fats, carbs or protein is bullshit. The 1st law of thermodynamics has nothing to do with why you get fat
Carbs especially sugar makes you fat.

 

Probably should rename carbs to processed or simple carbs.

Because complex carbs are different...
any one with diabetes can tell you this

 

Yes and no. Now a days many of us have had so much sugar over our lifetime that complex carbs can cause fat gain as well. If you never ate shit tons of sugar than the complex carbs wouldn’t be an issue but many of us have so they can be

 

then why does (complex) carb loading paired with intense lifting facilitate fat loss? we can thank our own DEATHMETAL for showing the results of his carb loading program.
going by the flow-chart/diagram, we dont want our insulin to spike, right?
complex carbs help maintain blood sugar because it's a slower release (complex) than a processed flour (simple)

 

Complex carbs aren't an issue for everyone. If you never ate shit tons of sugar than the complex carbs wouldn’t be an issue but many of us have so they can be

 

my immediate family has diabetes, mostly type 2..which is adult diabetes that can be controlled through diet.
as I understand it, complex carbs can help them too!!!! (maintaining blood sugar!)
but no, that's not what they eat. they eat processed carbs to spike the insulin at the time of need.

you can keep the blood sugar maintained and level by eating the correct foods at the correct times, never needing a "insulin spike" by the way of simple carbs..
but it's hard!!! and most people like things easy

 

 

What would you classify as complex carbs? Bread, rice, pasta, potatoes?

 

this plus when you eat your carbs is key to fat/weight loss.

also, concentrating on weight loss is also flawed as muscle weighs more than fat. people with low weight are often "skinny fat" where they have low fat levels but are also in terrible shape.

 

Look at your chart, mayne!!!
Bread, rice, pasta, potatoes increase insulin very fast!!!! those are simple carbs and can cause a crash as well!
thus why my family's blood sugar is always riding a wave. and instead of controlling it with diet, they are forced to control it with medicine

grains, sweet potatoes, fruits and veggies are complex carbs. they help sustain blood sugar levels!

 

Those are considered complex carbs



https://medlineplus.gov/ency/imagepages/19529.htm

 

 

^yes, whole grain breads. Whole grain rice, whole grain pasta, fruits and veggies.

that's not what we are putting in our bodies tho.
take a look at white bread that we all love to eat. thats a processed carbohydrate that doesnt have any of the nutrients that a whole grain bread has.

I know the pasta that we eat is also not whole grain. it's a processed simple carbohydrate.

the cereals we eat are also not whole grain...they are processed, chock full of sugar!

I assume the food industry did this in order to scale production!
young kids cant get enough of their fruity pebbles.

 

a better way to distinguish other than simple vs complex, would be their glycemic index

a low glycemic index will help maintain sugar levels because of the slower rise of the sugar spike (afterall, all carbohydrates turn to sugar)

i'm gonna keep bringing up my family's diabetes, because this is what they have to deal with EVERYDAY of their lives.

 

for example; Basmatti rice has a low glycemic index of 55.
white rice has a high glycemic index of 80

 

I prefer Cocoa Puffs over Fruity Pebbles.

 

justn I don't disagree with what you're saying, whole grain is better, brown rice is better than white rice, glycemic index, glycemic load, etc. maybe I should classify them (most bread and pasta) as refined carbs not complex carbs. Technically I think they still qualify as complex carbs since they aren't pure sugar like simple carbs, they've just had all the healthy fiber removed that slows down digestion. Though potatoes are a complex carb with a high glycemic index of 85.

I'm avoiding bread, pasta, and potatoes myself. I've substituted spiralized zucchini for pasta, it tastes great and has a similar texture to a firm pasta.

I'm not doing zero carb just low carb

 

Chickpea pasta is better than zuchini IMO. It still has carbs, though far less, and doesn't taste like Zuchini.

 

gonna look into that.

 

JKFC Stunna.. another chart.
Stop being a pussy... overload the system.. it'll freak out and piss away everything or put you in a coma.
Either way you'll lose 5-10 lbs easy.

 

Available at Costco. Makes for a killer pesto pasta with some pesto (obv) and montreal seasoned chicken.

 

gonna look into that.

 

Shiiiet when I was slimming down I was eating 2100 calories per day. I was losing about 1.5 pounds of fat, per week. I ended up dropping 40 pounds in total in about 6 months.

I've now started my bulking diet and im eating 3250 calories a day. it's all clean eating, so it ends up being a metric shit ton of food. Eating is a chore. I eat even though I'm not hungry. I just force it down. You eat for fuel, not enjoyment, haha. It really is the worst part of working out.

by the end of the day, it all comes down to whether you're hitting your macros everyday, or not. You can substitute some of the clean good eating for something a bit nasty, as long as your protein, fat, carbs and calories don't go out of whack.

Justin is right about the complex carbs. Brown anything is the way to go (), over white.

 

Back when I was 17-19, I used to workout a metric fuck ton. But I never gained much size. And I wasn't really getting stronger, no matter how hard I pushed. I was wondering how everyone else would gain size so much easier than I would and how they could lift so much more than me in comparison.. turns out, I didn't know shit about eating right. I would eat twice a day, shitty meals, loaded with carbs and fats, not protein. Well shiiiet... how the hell was I expecting to grow?

turns out your diet is just as important as what you do in the gym, if not more. These days, I can lift as much as 30 pounds more on certain workouts on days that I've hit all my meals right. Days where I am one meal behind, I can't hit the same numbers for the life of me.

what's more fucked is once you get your meals under control, you can quite literally make yourself look however you want. It just takes time. I eat the same 5 meals everyday, 6.5 days a week. It gives me a way to consistently track progress and whether i need to up or down my caloric intake, based on my weight and looks. It blows my mind what I look like these days, and it's been barely over 6 months. I weigh every portion, and it's the same basic meals every day, so prep work is fast as fuck.

I actually find it hard to enjoy cheat days. I still have them. And sometimes, boy, do I ever have them- I'll crush near 6000 calories worth of shit in one day (LOL), but for the most part, I have little desire to eat out anymore. I'm just so used to it now. That, and hot sauce goes a long way LOL.

 

Must be nice

 

I need to remember what I did when I dropped from 230lbs down to 170lbs.

Obviously harder to do now that I'm powerlifting, but damn i swear I was probably in the teens in terms of BF%.

I got down to 178ish lbs while lifting and 20% BF, still can't fit that one shirt I bought when I was 170lbs

 

we're on the same page; i just like arguing semantics.

even low carb is a misnomer, LOL
cuz I eat the FUCK outta some complex carbs and I'm fucking tiny! 143lbs!!!!
at my heaviest, I was 185lbs eating simple carbs and was FAT as fuck

 

That's a fuckload of calories. I'm targeting ~2000 per day to slim down and it's definitely working. I usually end up eating in the neighborhood of 2500 and assume CF will burn off 500 a day.

What I really need to work on is targeting the right ratio of macros now. I've basically switched to a low carb, high protein, medium fat diet. Which is awesome until I smell a beer...

 

1600 cal / day 'net' with reduced proteins/fat intake. I logged everything on myfitnesspal

 

I'm in bulk season and yes, eating is a damn chore. Should have seen me at Costco last week. Today, I left my lunch at home, so I had to drive back home to get it. People were like just go get some McDonalds next door.

 

Bump.

Hit a plateau over the past few months so I decided to get some extra help. Started a new guided diet yesterday where everything for my macros and timing is planned out for me. Just need to eat what's on the list and go from there. Starting weight yesterday (April 23rd) was 174.1. Hoping to be down at 165 in 12 weeks.

...

Can someone get me a beer?