Health & Fitness You're fat. Get skinny…

Creatine and the sickness!

Thread Tools
 
Old 02-24-2005, 05:31 PM
  #41  
Team ABP member
 
sxlova07's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Brockton, Ma
Age: 45
Posts: 980
Likes: 0
Received 2 Likes on 2 Posts
oh btw in case you are lookin for ephedra here is an auction for them: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...560685681&rd=1

the reason why these are probably the real thing is the exp date.....ephedra wasnt banned till a couple years ago and pills have a shelf life of a few years. in addition to that no where on the bottle do you see the label ephedra free, and of course the price is a clear give away.
Old 02-24-2005, 05:32 PM
  #42  
Moderator Alumnus
 
gavriil's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Washington DC (NOVA)
Age: 52
Posts: 16,399
Likes: 0
Received 8 Likes on 8 Posts
Originally Posted by oneilc
I take the GNC creatine burst. It's what they call their transport system. It's basically taurine and lots of sugars which enables the creatine to get to your muscles quicker.

Sugars wont do anything to make it go to your muscles faster. As long as it's micronized creatine, it will go as quickly as possible.
Old 02-24-2005, 05:36 PM
  #43  
Moderator Alumnus
 
gavriil's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Washington DC (NOVA)
Age: 52
Posts: 16,399
Likes: 0
Received 8 Likes on 8 Posts
Originally Posted by fdl
sugars? You can get creatine in a pure powder form and then just mix it with water.

But I would suggest you stay off the stuff all together. All it does is fill you with water and its hell on your kidneys. I was on the stuff for a long time and my kidneys were really hurting so I stopped. I hope I didnt do too much damage. I also lost between 5-10 pounds over the next few weeks. It was all water weight. The extra push it gives you in the gym is nice, but not really worth it IMO.

I am a little confused here. Your kidneys hurt because of creatine intake? I find that hard to believe. If anything, because you were drinking more water (because creative absorbs water), your kidneys were helped by that fact.

Did you go to the doctor for your kidneys? Sounds serious.

Finally, creative does not give you any extra push at the gym. It helps to build muscle which hopefully will give you that extra push.
Old 02-24-2005, 05:37 PM
  #44  
Moderator Alumnus
 
gavriil's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Washington DC (NOVA)
Age: 52
Posts: 16,399
Likes: 0
Received 8 Likes on 8 Posts
Originally Posted by BEETROOT
try pure (well, 99.9%) creatine mixed with a non acidic juice instead. I take 5mg/day with apple juice.

Why non-acid juice?
Old 02-24-2005, 05:39 PM
  #45  
Moderator Alumnus
 
gavriil's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Washington DC (NOVA)
Age: 52
Posts: 16,399
Likes: 0
Received 8 Likes on 8 Posts
Originally Posted by fdl
I think its not too bad if you cycle it and dont stay on it for years. But I was stupid and stayed on it straight for many months. I can only imagine how big my heart was.

Creatine can be taken in two "modes":

1. Loading mode
2. Maintenance mode

Maintainance mode can be taken after a loading mode.

But cycling between no creatine for 4 days and loading mode for the next 3 is better for adding even more muscle.
Old 02-24-2005, 05:40 PM
  #46  
Flap.
 
Hobo's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: St. Louis, Mo USA
Age: 38
Posts: 5,170
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Originally Posted by gavriil
Why non-acid juice?

acid = upset stomach, which was the original problem
Old 02-24-2005, 05:41 PM
  #47  
Moderator Alumnus
 
gavriil's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Washington DC (NOVA)
Age: 52
Posts: 16,399
Likes: 0
Received 8 Likes on 8 Posts
Originally Posted by oneilc
I just might try the apple juice mix.

The stuff I'm taking now definitely makes a difference in the gym. I have a greater endurance because of the creatine. As a side effect I can perform more reps and thus grow stronger.
I am sorry but:

1. Creatine does nothing to increase endurance (or if it does, that's not its primary benefit, not even secondary probably)

2. More reps do not "grow you stronger"
Old 02-24-2005, 05:42 PM
  #48  
Moderator Alumnus
 
gavriil's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Washington DC (NOVA)
Age: 52
Posts: 16,399
Likes: 0
Received 8 Likes on 8 Posts
Originally Posted by Hobo
acid = upset stomach, which was the original problem

Got it. To me, I take it with orange juice some time and have no issues.
Old 02-24-2005, 05:45 PM
  #49  
Moderator Alumnus
 
gavriil's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Washington DC (NOVA)
Age: 52
Posts: 16,399
Likes: 0
Received 8 Likes on 8 Posts
Originally Posted by fdl
You become bloated and retain lots of water (which is why you need to keep drinking). Since your muscles become bloated and enlarged, and your heart is a muscle, this can be dangerous.

As for your kidneys, well your kidneys have to process this stuff every time you take it, and over time it can cause damage. Same holds true for many pharamcuticals. I dont need proof, i know what I felt and my kidneys started to develop a constant dull pain which went away when i stopped. But as I mentioned, i took it in high dosages and did not cycle.
Maybe you either overdosed or the product was bad.
Old 02-24-2005, 05:46 PM
  #50  
Moderator Alumnus
 
gavriil's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Washington DC (NOVA)
Age: 52
Posts: 16,399
Likes: 0
Received 8 Likes on 8 Posts
Originally Posted by oneilc
I've never tried just the regular creatine. I've always used the creatine that came mixed with its own little transport system.

The main reason is for strength gains I would have to say.
There is no such thing as a transport sytem for creatine. Water is the only thing you got to take when adding creatine.

It's a gimic.
Old 02-24-2005, 05:48 PM
  #51  
Moderator Alumnus
 
gavriil's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Washington DC (NOVA)
Age: 52
Posts: 16,399
Likes: 0
Received 8 Likes on 8 Posts
Originally Posted by rise
Take pure creatine monohydrate. Spoon it into your mouth then wash it down with water since creatine is unstable in water and quickly becomes creatinine.
the ultimate CREATINE FAQ:
http://www.abcbodybuilding.com/forum...&page=0#870836

Really? Never heard of that one before.
Old 02-24-2005, 06:05 PM
  #52  
Suzuka Master
 
KCPreki11's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2001
Location: PA
Posts: 5,773
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Originally Posted by gavriil
Creatine can be taken in two "modes":

1. Loading mode
2. Maintenance mode

Maintainance mode can be taken after a loading mode.

But cycling between no creatine for 4 days and loading mode for the next 3 is better for adding even more muscle.
Did you post enough times?

BTW, no need to load.

And like Hobo sad, drop the mono and pick up some CEE.

BEET, PM me if you want a site for ephedra.
Old 02-24-2005, 07:03 PM
  #53  
Kenpachi Teichou
Thread Starter
 
oneilc's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: San Diego, CA
Posts: 1,907
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Originally Posted by Adam_Schwartz
Same here man - in the morning when I do cardio, I have to drop a bomb after about 15 min. It must be all that moving that gets stuff headed toward the emergency exit.
I never had that problem when I did cardio. Well, that's probably because I utilize a good 20 minutes of work time to drop the kids off at the pool each day (not I'm not ing it)
Old 02-24-2005, 07:08 PM
  #54  
Kenpachi Teichou
Thread Starter
 
oneilc's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: San Diego, CA
Posts: 1,907
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Damn gavrill! Enough messages already

Creatine does give you more energy (see the breakdown of ATP to ADP) so you can do more reps. That is the primary benifit of using it. As a side effect of being able to do more reps you can push your muscles harder and they rebuild bigger and stronger. The creatine itself does nothing to build your muscles. If you take it and just sit and watch tv, you shall see no strength gain.
Old 02-25-2005, 12:16 AM
  #55  
fdl
Senior Moderator
 
fdl's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Toronto
Age: 49
Posts: 21,672
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
Originally Posted by gavriil
I am a little confused here. Your kidneys hurt because of creatine intake? I find that hard to believe. If anything, because you were drinking more water (because creative absorbs water), your kidneys were helped by that fact.

Did you go to the doctor for your kidneys? Sounds serious.

Finally, creative does not give you any extra push at the gym. It helps to build muscle which hopefully will give you that extra push.

gavrill, creatine gets processed by the kidneys, its a fact. And it is documented that it may cause kidney problems, although not yet proven.

And creatine DOES give you an extra push at the gym by decreasing your recovery time between sets, and giving you an extra push to do 1 or 2 more reps. Thats how it works. Its not a steroid. And it does not build muscle.

Im aware of the loading phase, etc. However my mistake was that i continued to take it every day for several months, vs cycling it (6 weeks on, 4 weeks, etc). I really got hooked on the pumped feeling it gave me in the gym because of all the water retention. Sometimes it would feel like my skin was going to rip because of how pumped I got. I loved it, but Im pretty sure I was doing damage to my kidneys.


By the way check out this link for more info. http://www.vitacost.com/science/hn/S...onohydrate.htm

Details of this case strongly suggest that creatine supplementation triggered this case of kidney disease. Creatine supplementation may also be dangerous for people with existing kidney disease. In one report, a patient with nephrotic syndrome (a kidney disorder) developed glomerulosclerosis (another serious kidney condition) while taking creatine. when the creatine was discontinued, the glomerulosclerosis resolved.
Old 02-25-2005, 09:16 AM
  #56  
Yeehaw
 
BEETROOT's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Chandler, Arizona
Age: 44
Posts: 20,972
Received 26 Likes on 5 Posts
Originally Posted by gavriil

1. Creatine does nothing to increase endurance (or if it does, that's not its primary benefit, not even secondary probably)

it most definitely does.


gavriil, are you a lifter?
Old 02-25-2005, 09:24 AM
  #57  
Moderator Alumnus
 
gavriil's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Washington DC (NOVA)
Age: 52
Posts: 16,399
Likes: 0
Received 8 Likes on 8 Posts
Originally Posted by oneilc
The creatine itself does nothing to build your muscles. If you take it and just sit and watch tv, you shall see no strength gain.
Absolutely. Even if you take the most powerful steroids and sit on the couch your muscles wont grow.
Old 02-25-2005, 09:28 AM
  #58  
Moderator Alumnus
 
gavriil's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Washington DC (NOVA)
Age: 52
Posts: 16,399
Likes: 0
Received 8 Likes on 8 Posts
Originally Posted by oneilc
Creatine does give you more energy (see the breakdown of ATP to ADP) so you can do more reps. That is the primary benifit of using it. As a side effect of being able to do more reps you can push your muscles harder and they rebuild bigger and stronger. =.
Most bodybuilders think of creatine as a supplement that aids recovery and enhances muscle gains over the duration of a training program.

Now, a recent study completed by researchers at Craighton University has shown that a loading phase (20grams/day) for 5 days resulted in boost in power but that is just one study for now. Too ealry to tell at this point.
Old 02-25-2005, 09:30 AM
  #59  
Moderator Alumnus
 
gavriil's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Washington DC (NOVA)
Age: 52
Posts: 16,399
Likes: 0
Received 8 Likes on 8 Posts
Originally Posted by fdl

gavrill, creatine gets processed by the kidneys, its a fact. And it is documented that it may cause kidney problems, although not yet proven.

Interesting. I have never heard of those claims. Maybe because they are not proven.

Originally Posted by fdl

And creatine DOES give you an extra push at the gym by decreasing your recovery time between sets, and giving you an extra push to do 1 or 2 more reps. Thats how it works. Its not a steroid. And it does not build muscle.
See above message about that.

It does decrease recovery time but not STR (short term recovery = in between sets recovery), but only LTR (long term recovery = when you "sit at home").


Originally Posted by fdl

Im aware of the loading phase, etc. However my mistake was that i continued to take it every day for several months, vs cycling it (6 weeks on, 4 weeks, etc). I really got hooked on the pumped feeling it gave me in the gym because of all the water retention. Sometimes it would feel like my skin was going to rip because of how pumped I got. I loved it, but Im pretty sure I was doing damage to my kidneys.
Hmm...
Old 02-25-2005, 09:31 AM
  #60  
Moderator Alumnus
 
gavriil's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Washington DC (NOVA)
Age: 52
Posts: 16,399
Likes: 0
Received 8 Likes on 8 Posts
Originally Posted by BEETROOT
it most definitely does.


gavriil, are you a lifter?
I lift with my brains
Old 02-25-2005, 09:47 AM
  #61  
Yeehaw
 
BEETROOT's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Chandler, Arizona
Age: 44
Posts: 20,972
Received 26 Likes on 5 Posts
Originally Posted by gavriil
I lift with my brains

yer one of them book learners are ya?
Old 02-25-2005, 01:31 PM
  #62  
Kenpachi Teichou
Thread Starter
 
oneilc's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: San Diego, CA
Posts: 1,907
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
I'm going to switch from taking 10g of creatine a day to 10g on my workout day and 5g on non-workout days. That should hopefully reduce the sickness. I guess I really only need 5g a day anyway. The instructions on the creatine call for 10g in case you were wondering.
Old 02-25-2005, 02:57 PM
  #63  
Banned
 
Adam_Schwartz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Spring, TX
Age: 48
Posts: 3,146
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
Originally Posted by gavriil
I lift with my brains
What does that mean?
Old 02-25-2005, 03:05 PM
  #64  
Three Wheelin'
 
bigwilliestyle's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Massachusetts
Posts: 1,758
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Originally Posted by Adam_Schwartz
What does that mean?
Means he doesn't do sh!t.

Old 02-26-2005, 03:00 PM
  #65  
Moderator Alumnus
 
gavriil's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Washington DC (NOVA)
Age: 52
Posts: 16,399
Likes: 0
Received 8 Likes on 8 Posts
Originally Posted by Adam_Schwartz
What does that mean?

I was kidding. I have being back to lifting during the past 14 months after a 10 year break. But I also started playing indoor VB again (during the past 6 months) so there are several conflicts there.
Old 02-26-2005, 06:07 PM
  #66  
Banned
 
Adam_Schwartz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Spring, TX
Age: 48
Posts: 3,146
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
It's all good man, just wasn't sure what you meant. Gald you are lifting and playing VB again.

I used to LOVE basketball and got pretty damn good at it but my left ankle is now a POS. In a game I sprained it as much as possible without breaking it and to this day it's really weak, so I am aprehensive on the court.
Old 02-27-2005, 10:12 AM
  #67  
Moderator Alumnus
 
gavriil's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Washington DC (NOVA)
Age: 52
Posts: 16,399
Likes: 0
Received 8 Likes on 8 Posts
Originally Posted by Adam_Schwartz
I used to LOVE basketball and got pretty damn good at it but my left ankle is now a POS. In a game I sprained it as much as possible without breaking it and to this day it's really weak, so I am aprehensive on the court.

Havent squats help heal it? Not that they always do, but in cases of weakness from small injuries they do help.

Before I started lifting again, both knees were hurting just going up stairs, now the left is 100% healed and the right knee is about 70% good.

Also how can you lift such serious weight with dead lifts and squats with a f!cked up knee?
Old 02-27-2005, 10:34 AM
  #68  
Banned
 
Adam_Schwartz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Spring, TX
Age: 48
Posts: 3,146
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
My knee is fine man, it's my ankle that is weak. And by weak, I mean that I can twist it much easier than most other people when coming down on someone's shoe, for instance. Squats and deads don't have the same effect on my ankle as does landing on someone' size 12. Know what I mean?

But while we are on the topic, I used to have a so-so right knee and squats indeed helped it a great deal.
Old 02-27-2005, 12:13 PM
  #69  
1999 CL3.0
 
dragon084's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Pasadena, CA
Age: 39
Posts: 5,548
Received 4 Likes on 4 Posts
that shit is synthetic.
Old 02-27-2005, 02:48 PM
  #70  
Drifting
 
jayhawk815's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Dodge City, KS
Age: 43
Posts: 2,079
Received 22 Likes on 19 Posts
Originally Posted by dragon084
that shit is synthetic.


I take creatine everday I lift which tends to be 3-4 times a week. I take it before I go work out, then afterwards in a smaller dose with whey protein and glutamine. I'd always read that creatine's main benefit was to give you more edurance, i.e., more reps when lifting. I'd read this both in various fitness/lifting magazines as well as a number of websites. I've acheived large gains in the last two years with the creatine/whey protein/glutamine combo.
Related Topics
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
jterp7
3G MDX (2014-2020)
0
09-21-2015 11:02 AM



Quick Reply: Creatine and the sickness!



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 03:23 AM.