muggs

So, I negotiated an acceptable written agreement a couple weeks ago with my dealer. My '08 nissan Frontier Nismo and my '08 Accord EL L V6 six speed and a few dollars for a 2011 TL Tech six speed.
Unfortunately, no 2010s around. The only one they could "locate" was being used by the manager. No thanks. In fact, I wasn't thrilled with the idea of swapping with another dealer
because the potential for abuse is much greater when a clutch is involved . I like the idea of getting the car right off of the truck so I can do all the breaking in myself. I'm happy about that, but there are so few of the manuals, we had to have the next black-on-black one redirected to my dealer in Wappingers Falls N.Y. It's scheduled to be built around Dec 15th, so I'm looking at three or four weeks. The thing that hurts is if I wanted an auto, Heart Acura has a great selection of colors and options on the lot now. I know it will be worth holding out for the six speed from everything I've read here plus so many reviews as well. Clutches are rapidly becoming a thing of the past, but to me, that's always at least half the fun of driving.
Frank

MrHeeltoe

iTrader: (1)

SAVE THE MANUALS!


http://www.facebook.com/#!/pages/Sav...25741200803024

winstrolvtec

Congrats, yeah the 6MT is a low production TL but is well worth the wait as there are not any 2010's or 2011's in our vacinty. Besides already being very rare, it seems no other luxury brand offers a car this large that combines AWD and 6MT, not to mention a great combo of everything else for a great price, one of the gems of industry IMO.

I have had lots of experiences with Heart Acura they usually do the right thing. Normally my first choice in the past but they changed out the staff of old and I am not really familiar with anyone there now.

They did quote me one of the best prices around for my 2010 but did not have any in stock that weren't overly test driven or fresh off the trunk, and the last thing I wanted to do was swap much like yourself. I tracked inventories at Cars.com and found a dealer that had one just come in and it was my color choice, naturally negotiating is easier when the car is already on the lot but it can be well worth having a car come in directly from the factory with your name on it already especially when there are none around.

lji

It'll definitely be worth the wait...

muggs

I've dealt with Heart a few times several years ago. All the "old-timers" have gone. Armando has been there four years. He helped me. Seems like a good guy. And thanks, I feel that it will be great to have a non-abused six speed right off the truck. I'm like a little kid though. I want it NOW!

Pete2010

The 6spd TL is an absolute dream, quick and nimble, you wouldn't even think you were throwing around a 2 ton car. Being a couple hundred lbs lighter than the 5AT also helps.

muggs

I wonder why there are so few six speeds. I know it wasn't offered in '09, and became available in 2010, less than five percent with this configuration. According to Edmund's Inside Line, the tranny was designed solely for this car with beefed-up mainshaft and axle half shafts. It seems like a lot of effort for a low production car.

winstrolvtec said: "Besides already being very rare, it seems no other luxury brand offers a car this large that combines AWD and 6MT, not to mention a great combo of everything else for a great price, one of the gems of industry IMO."

Honda is a mysterious company.

docboy

Sentence of the day. For some reason, it gave me a good laugh.

White92

We've only ever had 2. Sold 1 and the other is sitting on our showroom floor. It was the owner's demo and the last 2010 that we have. We haven't ordered any for 11.

Mr Marco

Wife can't drive a stick. Sucks for me, she'll never let me get an S2000.

Six Shifter

More proof about the demographic for this car. Using the 2nd gen CL as an example, they didn't introduce the Japanes built 6-spd until it's final year of production. And going back to my '90 Legend Coupe, the self-shifter was only available is (max) 10% of the production run.

Those people who perform these studies have convinced the Auto Manufacturers that the majority of the American public do not/NOT want to drive manual transmissions. Why do you thing the offerings in the U.S. for sticks in Benz's are limited to the SLK? Even backward 3rd world countries have sticks in Benz's.

muggs

I know that I'm in a very small minority. I wouldn't be buying the TL if I couldn't get the stick. To me, that's the best part of driving. I had a '99 TL, and while it was a nice car, I was bored.
I would still have my '03 S2000, but I have back problems, and I'm 6'3" which is the upper limit for that car. I'm puzzled that so few people in the US can't even drive a manual. I think they're missing out on the fun. The TSX isn't even offered with a manual with the V6. That would have been a fun car! I can understand that many people feel that a stick is maybe a bit out of place in a car like the current TL. But that's one of the major things that drew me to it in the first place. I think this is going to be perfect for me. Very comfortable, great seats, beautiful interior. Mainly, from what you guys say, and lots of car mag reviews, great handling, plenty of power, tons of techy toys, and of course, a nice short throw stick! That's why I can't wait to get my paws on it.
Wish I could have kept this one

Six Shifter

The existence of the stick is the only reason I got the TL when I decided to get out of my CL. That, coupled with the fact that the A5 did away with the sitck with their 3.2L, the BMW 3 series' didn't offer the range I wanted, I just couldn't get over the looks of the Subi Legacy, and I couldn't bring myself to buy a C300 4Matic with an auto tranny. However ... if the CTS +4 Coupe wudda been out in last year ... I don't know which I'd have today.

Pete2010

This is actually my first manual car, but it will not be my last. I've already told myself that any kids I ever had will have their first car be a stick, what they want to do down the road is up to them.

muggs - nice S2k up there. That's definitely a great car, one that I would love to have. I'm hoping they come out with an updated version to that or the NSX soon. I will be all over that.

docboy

+1

I wanted AWD, 6MT, and above average reliability (ie. not be nickled and dimed to death).

If the TL didn't come with a stick, to be honest, I would have likely turned to the Germans and be in a 335xi or B8 A4 today and have said, what the hell to reliability.

JrcTL

Congrats on the car, it will be worth the wait! I really can't say enough about how fun the manual TL is, the comfort and handling is ridiculous. My previous car was a 3000GT VR4, which itself is no slouch, but in my opinion the TL is just as fast and nimble, and much more reliable!

MyT6MT

The 3 main reasons I got the 2010 TL...

1. 6MT
2. AWD
3. The ELS Audio!

Spyris

Same here. If the TL didn't come out with stick, I wouldn't be driving it now

Ken1997TL

My next car will be a stick so i can keep the wife out of it

AckTL05

iTrader: (18)

Manual in 04-08 TLs were only 1:200 as well. I was hearing things such as the customer based group that purchases this car doesn't want stick. With the new TL being more luxury, ACURA started to gear away from the younger group and wanted to become more business like. AcuraZINE aside, the average person driving the TL is a older business man/woman or someone who doesn't know how or care to drive stick. Its like everyone on AcuraZINE has an a-spec kit but 1:50 cars I see on the road have it. Plus ACURAs and manual transmissions always have problems. The 03 Cls had problems, 02 TL (auto), 04-06 base TL 3rd gear and so on.

Plus believe it or not, being this rare doesn't matter when traded in/sold. Manual TLs actually have a lower trade in value than AUTOs.

Steve5.9

Whenever my TL shits the bed...in 200,000+ more miles... I'll hand it down to my son/daughter and get myself a 6MT.

I want one so bad! My first car was a 5MT Accord and I loved it; now I have a 5AT base 3G and it's still pretty sexy, but one of these days I'll up my game.

racegypsy

Been driving the 2010 6MT TL for about 2500 miles now and have some observations.
I don't think the linkage is as good on this car as my 2007 Type S 6MT. The six speed gearbox in general requires a strong detent spring to kick the lever into the slot between 3rd and 4th to let the driver "know" where the default position is in neutral. That way you don't downshift into 1st unless you intend to. (Saving some stress on the valve train from unintentional over-revving.) The downside to this is that you must make deliberate motions to the "outside" when shifting from 1st to 2nd, or 5th to 6th. In the 2010, unless I pull to the driver's side when going from 1st to 2nd I feel a notchy grab as it goes into 2nd. I don't think this is the gears but the linkage. I intend to have it inspected at the first scheduled maintenance.

Acura 6 speeds are sweet, flick of the wrist and you are there. Close ratios make it easy to be smooth. Because of the way the box is built, you know where you are at all times. My only complaint is the one mentioned above and that may be fixable.

Steering ratio in the car is a little too quick and over-assisted for my tastes but I'm getting used to it. I think it could be better for a car of this talent when it comes to handling, which is very good indeed. Say bye bye to understeer on those entrance ramps with the SHawd.

Still deciding what to do about the "beak" but I feel that I must make a statement. Probably paint it even though I have the "silver" color. I know that a lot of TL owners are upset that we went from Audrey Hepburn styling with our refined Little Black Dress, to Lady Gaga with a "grinning jack o' lantern" smirk but it could be worse. Every time I see a Mazda 3 I say thank God that design was already taken.

But I digress; I've been driving manuals for 45 years and my coffin will have one too.

Six Shifter

Really? News to me ... considering I still had the original clutch and zero tranny problems with mine during ownership. Now, the 03 CLs with automatics ... that's another story altogether. Never heard one problem on the CL board regarding the Jap built 6 speed in the CL.

JM2010 SH-AWD

Not so sure about that. My 18-year old Legend 5MT had zero issues, original clutch, when I sold it after purchasing my TL this year. I know there were some issues with 3G TL MTs, but I think your statement is a little overbroad.

nj2pa2nc

good to hear you are waiting for a 6MT-worth the wait. We once settled for a car with automatic-never again. Luckily both my husband and I love manual transmission.

saturno_v

You guys do not understand....how the TL is inferior with its FWD layout...how the Germans are superior more refined products, better on every aspect...you do not get it...



...............................J U S T K I D D I N G.....


I love my TL every day even more.....

How so?? The stated curb weight differences between the AT and the MT in the Acura web site is only 14 pounds (3948 vs. 3962 lbs)

In addition to that, automatic gearboxes is more maintenance intensive (and more prone to failure in the long run) which creates better revenue opportunities for the manufacturers....

Dual clutch reliability is even worse in many cases so far...

In Europe I heard of people having to fork 6-7K to fix or replace their dual clutch transmissions in their VW....

+1 as well

It would have been a hard pill o swallow for me going to the Germans...I know how much can hurt owning them, I have the scars to prove it....


As far as I have the option I will never own an automatic car in my life as primary vehicle....the things that upsets me the most is that in Italy, the country where I was born and raised and supposedly the land of "sport car people" and driving enthusiast the automatic is spreading like wildfire (20 or even 10-15 years ago the market penetration of slushboxes was a rounding error int hat country).....when I showed to some of my Italian friends the pics of my car some did ask "How come such a big sedan and not automatic?? How you deal with it in everyday traffic??"...I just rolled my eyes......

I almost convinced my wife to switch back to a manual for her next car....

The reasons why I bought the TL:

1 - Engineering, engine and the SH-AWD
2 - Looks...yes I love the beak too......
3 - The MT option is such large sedan
4 - Honda reliability and quality

muggs

I'm sure it will be worth the wait. It's scheduled to be built in the Dec.15-17 range and then get a ride to New York. From what I've read, Honda built this tranny for the TL and so far, this is the only application. It seems that they went through a lot for an extremely low production car. It's also worth waiting for a car that I know couldn't have been abused either on an aggressive test drive or dealer swap (I've heard stories ).
It's just one of those cars that should be broken in with a little TLC early on, before the fun starts.

saturno_v

Muggs


The first time you will drive that baby (I don't know if you already did), once you enter the cabin you will feel like you stepped into the cockpit of a modern airliner

This quote about the TL is from Motor Trend:

"Inside the sculptural, 'dual-cockpit' cabin awaits a feast of advanced technology, enough to make the commander of a Los Angeles-class submarine jealous."

What color (outside and inside) did you get??

JM2010 SH-AWD

The cockpit is a little intimidating at first. When I picked mine up, I just sat and stared at the dash for a few minutes, trying to make sure I knew what to do to drive the thing out of the dealership without making a foolish mistake. (I guess that is the source of the "too many buttons" comments a lot of the mags seem to have). Once you live with the car a few weeks, it's all very logical and user friendly.

10 months later, I couldn't be happier. This car (especially with the 6MT) is a fantastic sport sedan. As icing on the cake, in about 50/50 highway versus suburban/urban driving, I'm averaging 24.7 MPG.

saturno_v

In addition to that...I really really hope and pray that Acura doesn't screw things up by not making a worthy successor (I felt "betrayed" by Nissan for dropping the manual transmission and softening up a bit the otherwise gorgeaous new Maxima and not putting a clutch pedal option in their AWD Infiniti G37)

This car has absolutely everything I wanted (except for a turbocharged engine......can you imagine a dual turbocharged TL SH-AWD with its 3.7 liter V6 pumped up to let's say 400 hp?? Somethign to kill for.....) up to the little details like the quad exhaust tips.....The crease in the butt is so nice and aggressive especially in black...I hope I do not have to keep it for ever as collector vehicle if another car doens't come around in the future worth to replace it.....sometimes I feel I should buy another one to keep it under wrap as spare car before the current iteration runs out.

Keep going Acura and please do not listen to the critics by toning down the style of this car in order to make it another A4/3 Series/G37 look-alike...we have already too many of them.....this car turn serious heads driving it around...

muggs

It's a black/black. Very few color choices on the M/T.
I test-drove the A/T TL. My Accord has a busy center stack as well. I checked out all the videos on the Owners' Link site.
Even bought a DVD-A to check out the ELS. I was leaning toward the white/taupe, but the black is exceptional on this car.
Also, you're right about the Maxima. Not only did they axe the manual, but they put a cvt in the car.
I had a '95 Max. 190 hp and the M/T. That thing could go. The Accord V6 with the six speed just flies.

nj2pa2nc

when I purchased my 06 6MT tsx in Nov. 06 the dealer did a dealer swap with one that was 138 miles away. It must have been ok as my car now has almost 118K problem free miles. I was thinking of trading it in on the 2010 6MT TL when they first arrived at the dealer. Changed my mind-love my red tsx.

winstrolvtec

My car and several other brand new SH 6MT owners have had this notchiness at first. It was the first thing I noticed but having been on this site for a while I knew about it before hand. It starts to deminish with mileage and eventually goes away. I still feel it a little in first to second at times but then again I don't have much mileage on mine.

Pete2010

Saturno - Here is where I saw it say that the 6MT was 110 lighter than the 5AT. Not sure how accurate it is, but it does list out all the other features/benefits of the 6MT TL

http://www.templeofvtec.net/articles...icle_id=791061

kewlblu

Amen brother! My wife's 05 TL is the only auto in the fleet. My 85 V8 S10 Blazer and 2006 SSR have three pedals...plus I have a HD FLHT.

black label

You can't actually blame the corporation on this one, look at White92 has to say.

It's not that Acura doesn't produce enough 6MT's, the dealers are ultimately responsible for ordering the cars they want (with some restrictions but not many). If a dealership wanted to order all of their AWD tech cars as a 6MT, they could, but it would be an extremely foolish decision as there is a very limited market for the car.



Ohio is part of Japan now?

muggs

Absolutely. I understand, but if you look at the laundry list of all the changes Honda put into this particular car http://www.templeofvtec.net/articles...icle_id=791061
(thanks, petec2010)

either they thought they would be selling many more six speeds,
or they went way overboard to make sure the car was done right.
Check out the link. It's impressive!

black label

^^^
I have a tendencey to think it was the latter. They did the same type of over engineering on the TSX manual transmission as well. The TSX certainly didn't need a magnesium bell housing for the transmission but it has one. I think it comes down to the fact that the manual transmission Acuras are no less expensive than the automatics. Acura knows that the people who are buying the manual transmission are doing it for no other reason than they truly like working the gearbox themselves. Historically, Acura's manual transmission customers are a bit more performance focused than the automatic buyers. Knowing this Acura goes the extra mile on the 6MT cars knowing that the little details won't be lost on those of us who buy them.

cyniclaus

I applaud Acura for putting the six-speed in, even if it was probably a poor business decision.

In doing so, they entered a very exclusive and ever-shrinking pantheon of AWD sedans currently available with manual in the USA:

Acura TL SH-AWD 6MT
Audi 4 & 5-series
BMW 3 & 5-series
Subaru Legacy / GT / Outback
Mitsubishi Lancer / Evo
Subaru Impreza / WRX / STI
Saab 9-3 Aero XWD
Volvo S40
...and if you count micro sedans,
Mini Cooper Countryman
Suzuki SX4

...notice none are American cars. Buick was poised to launch the first American AWD 6MT with the Regal GS....then last month they reneged and announced it will be FWD

Six Shifter

The 6-speed manual transmission found in the 2003 CL Type S was built in Japan, imported into the US and installed in the vehicle on the assembly line in Marysville Ohio (I believe is where the assembly line is, but someone will correct me if I've gotten this wrong). I presume the same holds true for the self-shifter found in the 4G TL.

You question proves you have to come from Red Sox nation.