Old Acura friend with a new ride
09-15-2013, 06:07 PM
#1
Suzuka Master
Thread Starter
Old Acura friend with a new ride
As some of you know I have been on this forum for about 9 years now and have owned 6 Acura TLs and my gf has owned 2 Acuras. I left the Acura family in 2010 when I just could not stand looking at the beak on my 09 AWD TL Tech any longer. The lack of a real silver color and the beak chased me away after 18 months.
Just as Acura’s styling has been polarizing so has Infiniti’s. Many thought my M37S looked like a whale and to each their own opinion. I loved my M37S styling and ride for the entire lease and 45K miles. What the Infiniti lacked was refinement and technology, no real voice commands other than a handful and interacting with the NAV was a chore and the BT voice quality was horrible. I was really hoping Acura would have stuck to their time table for model changes because I wanted to get back into a TL AWD. I did not want to extend my lease because the Infiniti would have needed tires and brakes.
I began the process over 6 months ago to look at my options and make a decision. I started with the RLX which I anxiously awaited and test drove one the first day they hit the lot. Needless to say if you wander over to the RLX forum you will see my impression. I considered another M37S, but they could not find a loaded M37S with Tech and I did not want to order a 13 so close to the end of the model year. I came close to an Audi S4 back in February, but the cramped cabin turned me off. The calendar was not my friend as the CTS would not be out in time either, nor would the next Genesis. My options were shrinking. I gave serious consideration to the Lexus GS350 both in regular and F Sport trim, but there were numerous turn offs in that car, first and foremost was that awful mouse controller.
Next was Lexus tech which is behind many others, you could not get Adaptive Cruise and Lane Departure. I hate a wood steering wheel and that meant F Sport, which was OK, but there were some things you can’t get in the F Sport. So after much debate the GS 350 was removed from the list. I came real close to getting a 13 TL AWD Advance, but knew next year when the TLX came out I would be kicking myself. I ruled out the BMW 5 and MB E class for various reasons. That left me back at Audi looking at the A6. Initially the A6 did not wow me, but I really wanted back into the active AWD game. I kept working up configurations and such for a while on an A6 as and the A6 the way I wanted it would be at the very top of my budget and could easily exceed it. After 2 months of test drives and finally working with dealers I decided to order a 14 Audi A6 Prestige.
Well I have had the car almost a month now and decided to drop back over hear (as I have never really left) and update some of my friends on my thoughts. I know from PMs that several of you are in similar situation that I am, you are nervous about Acura’s direction and looking at alternatives. This post is in no way meant to be a slam against Acura or anyone that still buys Acuras as I am still a huge Acura fan. Overall the Audi is a great car, like other makes they do some things good and other things not so good. I will post a link to the full review I posted over at AudiWorld.com, but I will summarize my overall impressions here and compare them to my Acura history and where I think Acura compares. Yes I know these cars in in different classes and honestly Audi only considers MB, BMW and Lexus (not even Infiniti) as their competitors for the A6 and in general.
Powertrain
Needless to say this is where I think Audi shines. The choice of smaller displacement and forced induction (Supercharger in my case with the 3.0T) and a silky smooth 8AT coupled with their latest generation of Quattro is really a statement of refinement and German engineering. The powertrain is just the gift that keeps on giving, silky smooth and power/torque on demand with very respectable MPG under normal use. We can argue the merits of SH-AWD, and while on paper technically superior, in reality it does not kick in all that much until you push the car. Quattro is there all the time 40/60 split F/R with the ability to go 15/85 F/R and 70/30 F/R and while in the A6 Quattro is not torque vectoring the use of ABS/EBC allows it to emulate it when needed. True Torque vectoring is available in the Audi S cars.
Handling
I did not get the Sport Package, but did drive it numerous times. Again German engineering shines through in a very refined and compliant ride in both regular and Sport suspensions. The TL AWD had a much more planted and firm ride that made me feel more confident pushing the TL to the edges in handling, but I also felt that came with a trade off in road compliance on less than ideal roads. The Audi leans far more in the corners. My car came with 19 inch 255/40R19 tires, but I swapped them out for Michelin Pilot Sport A/S 3 255/35R20 on 20x9 wheels. That helped handling and corning a bit without giving up ride comfort, but the TL AWD was still the beast to beat in turns. Where Audi falls down badly is with their electric power steering. It is too light at low speeds and is artificially boosted at higher speed so that you always feel very disconnected from the road. Acura does this so much better, although I miss my M37S as it had old style hydraulic power steering. Audi has also had their fair share of updates and fixes for their EPS as many have reported strange feedback from the steering wheel under certain conditions.
Exterior
Styling is always a subjective, but I think Audi is on a tear because they offer great styled cars with luxury features at prices that undercut their direct competitors. I have seen them a few times referred to as the Hyundai of the Germans and I can see why. When I considered another M37S loaded with Tech the Audi was only $500 more and the M37S was not going to be AWD, granted I would have gotten better discounts on the M37S, but resale on Infiniti sucks the first 4 years and Audi is near the top of the resale ladder. I loved looking at my M37, I have only owned 2 cars that I really enjoyed looking at all the time, my M37S and my 08 TL Type-S. The Audi is right up there, the styling is as I like to say simple elegance, not in your face, but not Camry dull. They style cars that look current and age well. I got the LED Headlights and while others are catching up I still feel Audi is the leader in LED lighting. It produces a bright white light and it has adaptive leveling so when corning side LEDs illuminate the road shoulders. While Acura has tamed the beak I still think Acura does not have a real good styling statement. That said the 12+ MMC Acura is a much better looking car than prior 4G TL, but in the end I have to give the huge edge to Audi.
Interior
Here is where things get a bit muddy. Audi and Infiniti are at opposite ends of the spectrum here, with Acura more with Infiniti. The Japanese have learned that everything you touch needs to feel more expensive that it is and you will feel like you are in a car more luxurious that you are. My M37S interior felt far more expensive than the A6 or even BMW and MB cars I test drove. I opted for the “Premium textile” Audi mats and they should be sued for using the word Premium in their description ;-) . I feel that Acura (SH-AWD Advance) and Infiniti (Toruing and above) leather is far more luxurious than Audi. The Steering wheel and control stalks in the Audi feel very cheap. The Interior overall is styled very nice and while many rave about it, there is nothing about it that hits me as being really above what others are doing. I really liked my Infiniti interior, it flowed well and just made sense. Even the TL interior to me competes well other than I don’t like the number of Acura buttons on the center stack. Where Acura and Infiniti kill Audi for me is in ergonomics. I feel the A6 seats lack thigh support and are just difficult to find that “just right” seat adjustment, the seat bottom are narrow and strangely bolstered with no adjustments, I assume designed with skinny Europeans in mind. I would take the Acura (SH-AWD) or Infiniti seats over the Audi any day. For as good as the Germans are at mechanical engineering, they are that bad with ergonomics. Looks at a picture of the A6 center console and you will see the Ignition button and Volume control on the far right side of the center console. Also look at Audi’s MMI interface on the center console, while it is great, there is cup holders between it and the center armrest, meaning difficult to use MMI if you have something in the cup holders. What are they thinking?
Where the Audi shines at the top is the MMI and gauge cluster, in a word WOW! The gauges are stunning and the info panel between the gauges is crisp and configurable to display anything from trip computer info, nav instructions, telephone directory and any of the multiple media sources. And while I usually hate pop up nav screens Audi does it the best, it looks like it belongs and is a colorful and sharp display.
The Audi cabin is very quiet, far better than my M37S which even with noise cancellation was horrible. I test drove a 13 TL AWD Advance and would say the Acura and Audi are close in cabin quietness.
Electronics/Tech
Audi’s MMI is a huge plus for me. I missed Acura once I went to Infiniti, because Infiniti was in the stone ages, although I hear the new Q50 interfaces are great. Audi really has nailed this. The control knob and surrounding buttons are logical and flow with what is on the screen. The MMI just works, it makes perfect sense and is learned easily. You can customize certain aspects of the car, such as steering response, seat belt tensioners, engine/shift points with Drive Select through the MMI screen. The Audi has a cell connection to T-Mobile (horrible choice) that enables Google integration. This feature alone is enough reason for me to love this car. First you get up to date Google voice fuzzy search and Google comes back with all the items that match as well as the ability to show additional information about those places. And did I mention the Nav voice input is natural language input, no need to pause for each portion of the address, just say “123 Main Street, Hometown State” and it will pull it up. The MMI also has a touch pad input that acts as your presets for media and then is a writable touchpad for entering addresses and numbers (nav and telephone) rather than spinning a control knob or having to say it. The touchpad has excellent recognition even when you barely can scratch the letter.
I opted for the Driver Assistance package which included Audi Pre Sense Plus (collision mitigation), Lane Departure Mitigation, Adaptive cruise and blind spot warning. These technologies work great, although some are a little conservatively set by Audi. As the current TL has on Blind Spot warning Audi is out in front here, but since I extensively test drove the RLX I would say that overall Acura has the edge with driver assisted technology. The Audi can be gotten with a B&O sound system which I hear is great, but for $6K was too far outside my budget. The Bose system in the A6 is decent, better than my Infiniti’s Bose, but not as good as the ELS in the TL AWD I had. The Audi has 2 SD Card slots, DVD, 20GB Jukebox iPod integration and more. You can import the MP3/AAC files from the SD Cards to the Jukebox and really carry lifetime of music with you, between SD, Jukebox, BT and attached iPOD. For me Audi technology ergonomics, how you invoke and interact with it, is among the best, Acura is right up there too. My hesitation comes from the new dual screen schizophrenic personality. Also Acura needs to get rid of those flat monotone looking NAV maps, either get with Google integration or do a deal like Mazda and offer Tom Tom or Garmin based Navi system to stay relevant. If Acura can fix some of those minor things they could be king of technology as they were when the RL initially came out.
Overall
Overall I am happy with my purchase, I still wish the RLX would have appealed to me more as I know Acura builds a more reliable workhorse with better technology implementation. The Audi invokes a great emotional feeling as well as sensory appeal from styling and ride that satisfies the right half of my brain where the Acura satisfies the left, this time the right side won. Back in my Type-S days both sides of my brain were equally happy. I would do this again if I had the same choice, the only change I would have made would be to get the Sport Package and Audi 20 inch wheels. I do still feel Acurazine is a great place and I will continue to visit and participate. I plan on test driving the TLX as soon as the AWD version is out. My girlfriend’s TSX has a year left on the lease and she is leaning RDX or maybe TLX depending on what it turns out to be. Where Acura needs to stay on their game is with the competition, you have MB and Audi with entry level sedans coming (A3 and CLA) which will easily appeal to the demographic they are targeted for. Infiniti is re-inventing itself and has plans for at least one halo car and I suspect 2 (a sedan and a coupe). Audi seems like a natural progression for Acura people as Audi is value brand that embraces technology. I have run across a few other Acurazine ex-Acura owners over at AudiWorld and suspect I will see a few others.
Just as Acura’s styling has been polarizing so has Infiniti’s. Many thought my M37S looked like a whale and to each their own opinion. I loved my M37S styling and ride for the entire lease and 45K miles. What the Infiniti lacked was refinement and technology, no real voice commands other than a handful and interacting with the NAV was a chore and the BT voice quality was horrible. I was really hoping Acura would have stuck to their time table for model changes because I wanted to get back into a TL AWD. I did not want to extend my lease because the Infiniti would have needed tires and brakes.
I began the process over 6 months ago to look at my options and make a decision. I started with the RLX which I anxiously awaited and test drove one the first day they hit the lot. Needless to say if you wander over to the RLX forum you will see my impression. I considered another M37S, but they could not find a loaded M37S with Tech and I did not want to order a 13 so close to the end of the model year. I came close to an Audi S4 back in February, but the cramped cabin turned me off. The calendar was not my friend as the CTS would not be out in time either, nor would the next Genesis. My options were shrinking. I gave serious consideration to the Lexus GS350 both in regular and F Sport trim, but there were numerous turn offs in that car, first and foremost was that awful mouse controller.
Next was Lexus tech which is behind many others, you could not get Adaptive Cruise and Lane Departure. I hate a wood steering wheel and that meant F Sport, which was OK, but there were some things you can’t get in the F Sport. So after much debate the GS 350 was removed from the list. I came real close to getting a 13 TL AWD Advance, but knew next year when the TLX came out I would be kicking myself. I ruled out the BMW 5 and MB E class for various reasons. That left me back at Audi looking at the A6. Initially the A6 did not wow me, but I really wanted back into the active AWD game. I kept working up configurations and such for a while on an A6 as and the A6 the way I wanted it would be at the very top of my budget and could easily exceed it. After 2 months of test drives and finally working with dealers I decided to order a 14 Audi A6 Prestige.
Well I have had the car almost a month now and decided to drop back over hear (as I have never really left) and update some of my friends on my thoughts. I know from PMs that several of you are in similar situation that I am, you are nervous about Acura’s direction and looking at alternatives. This post is in no way meant to be a slam against Acura or anyone that still buys Acuras as I am still a huge Acura fan. Overall the Audi is a great car, like other makes they do some things good and other things not so good. I will post a link to the full review I posted over at AudiWorld.com, but I will summarize my overall impressions here and compare them to my Acura history and where I think Acura compares. Yes I know these cars in in different classes and honestly Audi only considers MB, BMW and Lexus (not even Infiniti) as their competitors for the A6 and in general.
Powertrain
Needless to say this is where I think Audi shines. The choice of smaller displacement and forced induction (Supercharger in my case with the 3.0T) and a silky smooth 8AT coupled with their latest generation of Quattro is really a statement of refinement and German engineering. The powertrain is just the gift that keeps on giving, silky smooth and power/torque on demand with very respectable MPG under normal use. We can argue the merits of SH-AWD, and while on paper technically superior, in reality it does not kick in all that much until you push the car. Quattro is there all the time 40/60 split F/R with the ability to go 15/85 F/R and 70/30 F/R and while in the A6 Quattro is not torque vectoring the use of ABS/EBC allows it to emulate it when needed. True Torque vectoring is available in the Audi S cars.
Handling
I did not get the Sport Package, but did drive it numerous times. Again German engineering shines through in a very refined and compliant ride in both regular and Sport suspensions. The TL AWD had a much more planted and firm ride that made me feel more confident pushing the TL to the edges in handling, but I also felt that came with a trade off in road compliance on less than ideal roads. The Audi leans far more in the corners. My car came with 19 inch 255/40R19 tires, but I swapped them out for Michelin Pilot Sport A/S 3 255/35R20 on 20x9 wheels. That helped handling and corning a bit without giving up ride comfort, but the TL AWD was still the beast to beat in turns. Where Audi falls down badly is with their electric power steering. It is too light at low speeds and is artificially boosted at higher speed so that you always feel very disconnected from the road. Acura does this so much better, although I miss my M37S as it had old style hydraulic power steering. Audi has also had their fair share of updates and fixes for their EPS as many have reported strange feedback from the steering wheel under certain conditions.
Exterior
Styling is always a subjective, but I think Audi is on a tear because they offer great styled cars with luxury features at prices that undercut their direct competitors. I have seen them a few times referred to as the Hyundai of the Germans and I can see why. When I considered another M37S loaded with Tech the Audi was only $500 more and the M37S was not going to be AWD, granted I would have gotten better discounts on the M37S, but resale on Infiniti sucks the first 4 years and Audi is near the top of the resale ladder. I loved looking at my M37, I have only owned 2 cars that I really enjoyed looking at all the time, my M37S and my 08 TL Type-S. The Audi is right up there, the styling is as I like to say simple elegance, not in your face, but not Camry dull. They style cars that look current and age well. I got the LED Headlights and while others are catching up I still feel Audi is the leader in LED lighting. It produces a bright white light and it has adaptive leveling so when corning side LEDs illuminate the road shoulders. While Acura has tamed the beak I still think Acura does not have a real good styling statement. That said the 12+ MMC Acura is a much better looking car than prior 4G TL, but in the end I have to give the huge edge to Audi.
Interior
Here is where things get a bit muddy. Audi and Infiniti are at opposite ends of the spectrum here, with Acura more with Infiniti. The Japanese have learned that everything you touch needs to feel more expensive that it is and you will feel like you are in a car more luxurious that you are. My M37S interior felt far more expensive than the A6 or even BMW and MB cars I test drove. I opted for the “Premium textile” Audi mats and they should be sued for using the word Premium in their description ;-) . I feel that Acura (SH-AWD Advance) and Infiniti (Toruing and above) leather is far more luxurious than Audi. The Steering wheel and control stalks in the Audi feel very cheap. The Interior overall is styled very nice and while many rave about it, there is nothing about it that hits me as being really above what others are doing. I really liked my Infiniti interior, it flowed well and just made sense. Even the TL interior to me competes well other than I don’t like the number of Acura buttons on the center stack. Where Acura and Infiniti kill Audi for me is in ergonomics. I feel the A6 seats lack thigh support and are just difficult to find that “just right” seat adjustment, the seat bottom are narrow and strangely bolstered with no adjustments, I assume designed with skinny Europeans in mind. I would take the Acura (SH-AWD) or Infiniti seats over the Audi any day. For as good as the Germans are at mechanical engineering, they are that bad with ergonomics. Looks at a picture of the A6 center console and you will see the Ignition button and Volume control on the far right side of the center console. Also look at Audi’s MMI interface on the center console, while it is great, there is cup holders between it and the center armrest, meaning difficult to use MMI if you have something in the cup holders. What are they thinking?
Where the Audi shines at the top is the MMI and gauge cluster, in a word WOW! The gauges are stunning and the info panel between the gauges is crisp and configurable to display anything from trip computer info, nav instructions, telephone directory and any of the multiple media sources. And while I usually hate pop up nav screens Audi does it the best, it looks like it belongs and is a colorful and sharp display.
The Audi cabin is very quiet, far better than my M37S which even with noise cancellation was horrible. I test drove a 13 TL AWD Advance and would say the Acura and Audi are close in cabin quietness.
Electronics/Tech
Audi’s MMI is a huge plus for me. I missed Acura once I went to Infiniti, because Infiniti was in the stone ages, although I hear the new Q50 interfaces are great. Audi really has nailed this. The control knob and surrounding buttons are logical and flow with what is on the screen. The MMI just works, it makes perfect sense and is learned easily. You can customize certain aspects of the car, such as steering response, seat belt tensioners, engine/shift points with Drive Select through the MMI screen. The Audi has a cell connection to T-Mobile (horrible choice) that enables Google integration. This feature alone is enough reason for me to love this car. First you get up to date Google voice fuzzy search and Google comes back with all the items that match as well as the ability to show additional information about those places. And did I mention the Nav voice input is natural language input, no need to pause for each portion of the address, just say “123 Main Street, Hometown State” and it will pull it up. The MMI also has a touch pad input that acts as your presets for media and then is a writable touchpad for entering addresses and numbers (nav and telephone) rather than spinning a control knob or having to say it. The touchpad has excellent recognition even when you barely can scratch the letter.
I opted for the Driver Assistance package which included Audi Pre Sense Plus (collision mitigation), Lane Departure Mitigation, Adaptive cruise and blind spot warning. These technologies work great, although some are a little conservatively set by Audi. As the current TL has on Blind Spot warning Audi is out in front here, but since I extensively test drove the RLX I would say that overall Acura has the edge with driver assisted technology. The Audi can be gotten with a B&O sound system which I hear is great, but for $6K was too far outside my budget. The Bose system in the A6 is decent, better than my Infiniti’s Bose, but not as good as the ELS in the TL AWD I had. The Audi has 2 SD Card slots, DVD, 20GB Jukebox iPod integration and more. You can import the MP3/AAC files from the SD Cards to the Jukebox and really carry lifetime of music with you, between SD, Jukebox, BT and attached iPOD. For me Audi technology ergonomics, how you invoke and interact with it, is among the best, Acura is right up there too. My hesitation comes from the new dual screen schizophrenic personality. Also Acura needs to get rid of those flat monotone looking NAV maps, either get with Google integration or do a deal like Mazda and offer Tom Tom or Garmin based Navi system to stay relevant. If Acura can fix some of those minor things they could be king of technology as they were when the RL initially came out.
Overall
Overall I am happy with my purchase, I still wish the RLX would have appealed to me more as I know Acura builds a more reliable workhorse with better technology implementation. The Audi invokes a great emotional feeling as well as sensory appeal from styling and ride that satisfies the right half of my brain where the Acura satisfies the left, this time the right side won. Back in my Type-S days both sides of my brain were equally happy. I would do this again if I had the same choice, the only change I would have made would be to get the Sport Package and Audi 20 inch wheels. I do still feel Acurazine is a great place and I will continue to visit and participate. I plan on test driving the TLX as soon as the AWD version is out. My girlfriend’s TSX has a year left on the lease and she is leaning RDX or maybe TLX depending on what it turns out to be. Where Acura needs to stay on their game is with the competition, you have MB and Audi with entry level sedans coming (A3 and CLA) which will easily appeal to the demographic they are targeted for. Infiniti is re-inventing itself and has plans for at least one halo car and I suspect 2 (a sedan and a coupe). Audi seems like a natural progression for Acura people as Audi is value brand that embraces technology. I have run across a few other Acurazine ex-Acura owners over at AudiWorld and suspect I will see a few others.
The following 7 users liked this post by KeithL:
deuce415 (09-15-2013),
ggesq (09-17-2013),
Oswald Vater (09-16-2013),
Rocket_man (09-19-2013),
shurik74 (09-16-2013),
and 2 others liked this post.
09-15-2013, 06:23 PM
#2
Suzuka Master
Thread Starter
Here is the link to my full A6 review at AudiWorld.com
http://forums.audiworld.com/showthre...6#post24488186
http://forums.audiworld.com/showthre...6#post24488186
09-15-2013, 06:36 PM
#4
Keith, good to see such a detailed review, however I think this would be better received in Car Talk.
09-15-2013, 06:42 PM
#6
KeithL....Simply stunning!! I am so envious of your Audi, it is just GORGEOUS. I appreciate the time you took to write the detailed post and look forward to your continued contribution here, and your on going update of the new wheels.....As you know, if the TLX doesn't excite me, Audi will likely be the route I'll be good too (S4 or S5).
PS...Are you planning on posting some interior pics?
PS...Are you planning on posting some interior pics?
Last edited by weather; 09-15-2013 at 06:47 PM.
09-15-2013, 06:48 PM
#7
Trending Topics
09-15-2013, 06:51 PM
#8
^^^ I second that about the quality of KeithL's posts.....we have a few excellent contributors to this site and KeithL and TLtrigirl are great example that come to mind without limiting my list of favorite to these two.
09-15-2013, 08:19 PM
#10
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That's gorgeous Keith....I'm jealous.
When I need to replace my Type S, I'm definitely considering Audi.
When I need to replace my Type S, I'm definitely considering Audi.
09-15-2013, 08:23 PM
#11
Drifting
KeithL....Simply stunning!! I am so envious of your Audi, it is just GORGEOUS. I appreciate the time you took to write the detailed post and look forward to your continued contribution here, and your on going update of the new wheels.....As you know, if the TLX doesn't excite me, Audi will likely be the route I'll be good too (S4 or S5).
PS...Are you planning on posting some interior pics?
PS...Are you planning on posting some interior pics?
I will probably be an Audi owner too depending on what Acura does with the TLX.
09-15-2013, 09:41 PM
#13
2010 TL AWD 6MT: New King
Nice review Keith, and nice pics as well.
I'm keeping a close eye on a few scant makes, and Audi is also on my short list.
I'd be interested in hearing a 10k and 20k review as well. Congratz again!
I'm keeping a close eye on a few scant makes, and Audi is also on my short list.
I'd be interested in hearing a 10k and 20k review as well. Congratz again!
09-15-2013, 10:33 PM
#14
6G TLX-S
KeithL, congrats on your new A6. I must agree that the Audi interior is extremely well laid out, and is simply 1st class.
I also had a C6 A6. My wife totaled it 3 months ago. It was good that the balance of the extended warranty was refundable.
AWD is a must in our family, since we go skiing up the snowy mountains every winters.
I looked at the new A6, but the Quattro car has got far too expensive over the years. The AWD RLX still doesn't even have a tentative release date, let alone checking out one.
I picked the Quattro A6 eight years ago rather than the "fully-loaded-or-no-car" 2G SH-AWD RL, because then, my custom optioned A6 ended up cheaper than the 1-trim-only RL, plus the bonus of the much better prestige with the Audi brand name.
This time around, I end up buying the 2014 AWD MDX. I have waited for almost a month even after having jumped the queue. Just wish that the RLX is also as popular as the new MDX.
I also had a C6 A6. My wife totaled it 3 months ago. It was good that the balance of the extended warranty was refundable.
AWD is a must in our family, since we go skiing up the snowy mountains every winters.
I looked at the new A6, but the Quattro car has got far too expensive over the years. The AWD RLX still doesn't even have a tentative release date, let alone checking out one.
I picked the Quattro A6 eight years ago rather than the "fully-loaded-or-no-car" 2G SH-AWD RL, because then, my custom optioned A6 ended up cheaper than the 1-trim-only RL, plus the bonus of the much better prestige with the Audi brand name.
This time around, I end up buying the 2014 AWD MDX. I have waited for almost a month even after having jumped the queue. Just wish that the RLX is also as popular as the new MDX.
09-15-2013, 10:46 PM
#15
Great review, thanks for taking the time to write it up!
You mentioned that you cross shopped the Lexus GS350 Fsport. Could you give more details on the lack of tech and some of the other things that you found unappealing? My son will be taking over my TL when he starts driving in a few years and the GS FSport was on the top of my list of prospective cars.
I buy cars with the goal of keeping them around for 10 years. Still not sure if I'd want to own a German car for that long. It seems that they are expensive to fix if something goes wrong, and a lot of my friends have had some problems with their German cars.
You mentioned that you cross shopped the Lexus GS350 Fsport. Could you give more details on the lack of tech and some of the other things that you found unappealing? My son will be taking over my TL when he starts driving in a few years and the GS FSport was on the top of my list of prospective cars.
I buy cars with the goal of keeping them around for 10 years. Still not sure if I'd want to own a German car for that long. It seems that they are expensive to fix if something goes wrong, and a lot of my friends have had some problems with their German cars.
09-16-2013, 06:07 AM
#16
Suzuka Master
Thread Starter
Great review, thanks for taking the time to write it up!
You mentioned that you cross shopped the Lexus GS350 Fsport. Could you give more details on the lack of tech and some of the other things that you found unappealing? My son will be taking over my TL when he starts driving in a few years and the GS FSport was on the top of my list of prospective cars.
I buy cars with the goal of keeping them around for 10 years. Still not sure if I'd want to own a German car for that long. It seems that they are expensive to fix if something goes wrong, and a lot of my friends have had some problems with their German cars.
You mentioned that you cross shopped the Lexus GS350 Fsport. Could you give more details on the lack of tech and some of the other things that you found unappealing? My son will be taking over my TL when he starts driving in a few years and the GS FSport was on the top of my list of prospective cars.
I buy cars with the goal of keeping them around for 10 years. Still not sure if I'd want to own a German car for that long. It seems that they are expensive to fix if something goes wrong, and a lot of my friends have had some problems with their German cars.
09-16-2013, 07:25 AM
#17
Grandpa
Join Date: Dec 2003
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This comment interested me.
Do I understand from this comment that in 2014 model year the Sport Differential (vectoring AWD) is available in the A6 again?
The last time I configured an Audi for myself, it was only available on the "S" lines.
Did you compare your Audi choices with the 2014 Mercedes E-Classes?
Do I understand from this comment that in 2014 model year the Sport Differential (vectoring AWD) is available in the A6 again?
The last time I configured an Audi for myself, it was only available on the "S" lines.
Did you compare your Audi choices with the 2014 Mercedes E-Classes?
09-16-2013, 07:59 AM
#18
Suzuka Master
Thread Starter
This comment interested me.
Do I understand from this comment that in 2014 model year the Sport Differential (vectoring AWD) is available in the A6 again?
The last time I configured an Audi for myself, it was only available on the "S" lines.
Did you compare your Audi choices with the 2014 Mercedes E-Classes?
Do I understand from this comment that in 2014 model year the Sport Differential (vectoring AWD) is available in the A6 again?
The last time I configured an Audi for myself, it was only available on the "S" lines.
Did you compare your Audi choices with the 2014 Mercedes E-Classes?
Sport Differential is only in S cars, but Quattro is power to all 4 wheels all the time and they use ABS/EBC to brake a slipping wheel on a given axle so while not as good as torque vectoring it will be acceptable. I wanted all 4 wheels driving power to the ground all the time.
09-16-2013, 09:03 AM
#19
Three Wheelin'
Thanks for your great review and the A6 is a beautiful car. I'm one of those in a quandary about what to do with my Acura whose lease expires next month. If I had to decide today I would extend the lease for 6 months in order to at least give the TLX a chance to earn my dollars. I had considered the Germans but being a few years older than you I'm trying to stay away from turbos and superchargers for reliability reasons as my next car will probably be a keeper for many years.
Still considering the ES (maybe even hybrid). May consider RLX depending on test drive and deals offered. I've checked out the Cadenza as we have a local dealer here and it seems to be the new "value" leader in near-luxury class but need to take a test drive and get over the emasculation of owning a Kia. I may even switch classes altogether and look at the new MDX. In any event, glad you're happy with your choice and look forward to hearing more about your ownership experience.
Still considering the ES (maybe even hybrid). May consider RLX depending on test drive and deals offered. I've checked out the Cadenza as we have a local dealer here and it seems to be the new "value" leader in near-luxury class but need to take a test drive and get over the emasculation of owning a Kia. I may even switch classes altogether and look at the new MDX. In any event, glad you're happy with your choice and look forward to hearing more about your ownership experience.
09-16-2013, 11:21 AM
#20
Suzuka Master
Thread Starter
Still considering the ES (maybe even hybrid). May consider RLX depending on test drive and deals offered. I've checked out the Cadenza as we have a local dealer here and it seems to be the new "value" leader in near-luxury class but need to take a test drive and get over the emasculation of owning a Kia. I may even switch classes altogether and look at the new MDX. In any event, glad you're happy with your choice and look forward to hearing more about your ownership experience.
09-16-2013, 02:07 PM
#21
Three Wheelin'
I would have to test drive the ES (both models) as well to decide if its right for me or not. I test drove the last gen before I re-leased with Acura and found the ride too soft but now I'm a few years older and soft is good. Wood wheel is no biggie for me but I've also heard complaints about the mouse. I think the GS will be more than I want to pay but then again it depends on the motivation of the dealer and the incentives offered.
09-17-2013, 08:43 AM
#24
Burning Brakes
Congrats! Nice unbiased review KeithL. 
Nice color too but I'm partial to white lol. I think it's an appealing color on any luxury car.
Nice color too but I'm partial to white lol. I think it's an appealing color on any luxury car.
09-17-2013, 11:43 AM
#26
Burning Brakes
Your car will look so much more agressive with lower springs. 
Just a slight drop....
Just a slight drop....
09-17-2013, 01:01 PM
#27
Burning Brakes
This is the 2013 A6 prestige
09-18-2013, 04:35 PM
#28
an adult perspective
Only complaint I have with my S5 vs the TL is the number of button "pushes" (or steps) necessary to rip a CD to the HD. With the Acura, it was always a case of load and rip. With the Audi, there are a definite number of button pushes that have to be done in precise order to accomplish this seeming minor function. Maybe its different in the A6 (although the 13 A6's couldn't rip CD's) ... and even my dealer techs/salespeople didn't know you could rip CD's in the S5 until I showed them how.
09-18-2013, 05:05 PM
#29
Suzuka Master
Thread Starter
The A6 can rip CD, but I believe it is disabled by default and the dealer has to enable it and then it auto rips ever disc inserted. They asked me if I wanted that enabled and I said no. I gave up ripping CDs to the HDD. What Audi does that is sweet is I can tell it to import the AAC/MP3 files form the SD card to the HDD and I can select by song, folder or all. For me Audi MMI is the gold standard right now, between the natural voice non parsed input of Nav addresses to the flexibility of media selections Acura and Infiniti can't come close to. Add in Google integration when I can just speak a fuzzy search and it goes to Google and finds what I want and that alone is monumental.
09-20-2013, 07:14 AM
#30
Three Wheelin'
Kieth, I appreciate the great review. You and I have a lot in common. My first two Acuras go back to the early 90s, then I had a 2004 TL. After that an M45, CTS, GS350 and now drive a BMW 550. Like you, I am very picky and there are things I don't like about every car. My 550 is a great car, but it too has some pretty annoying quirks.
I also am thinking of an Audi for my next car - which is a little over a year away. I have a friend who just bought a 2014 S8, and for six months he had an A8 while waiting for the S. I have driven both of them. I agree completely on the dash and the MMI. I'm tired of reading articles on how great BMW's I-Drive has become. I think it still sucks. The MMI is in another universe better.
I also am thinking of an Audi for my next car - which is a little over a year away. I have a friend who just bought a 2014 S8, and for six months he had an A8 while waiting for the S. I have driven both of them. I agree completely on the dash and the MMI. I'm tired of reading articles on how great BMW's I-Drive has become. I think it still sucks. The MMI is in another universe better.
09-23-2013, 03:41 AM
#31
6G TLX-S
10-02-2013, 08:27 PM
#33
Suzuka Master
Thread Starter
Thought I would add a quick 1200 mile update. Loving the car so far, still have not opened it up or gone on a long drive yet. The tech is awesome, although the head unit could use a tad more processing power. The rear view camera resolution sucks compared to my 09 TL. The ride is awesome, but the biggest problem with this car is the power steering. Audi has no clue how to implement electric power steering. You can adjust it between comfort and dynamic and even in dynamic mode the boost is weak and overly artificial with zero feedback a totally disconnected feel, such a shame. Seems Audi made a software change on the 14 A6 to fix some issues and made it feel worse than the 12 and 13 models.
I can't praise the Audi's MMI enough, far better than anything Acura or Infiniti have ever done, intuitive, logical and just works.
In the end I love the car, but the EPS is a huge turn off and might actually prevent me from being a repeat Audi customer. Time will tell.
I can't praise the Audi's MMI enough, far better than anything Acura or Infiniti have ever done, intuitive, logical and just works.
In the end I love the car, but the EPS is a huge turn off and might actually prevent me from being a repeat Audi customer. Time will tell.
06-01-2014, 02:08 PM
#34
Suzuka Master
Thread Starter
Well I figured I would post an update. I have had my A6 just over 8 months now and have about 7200 miles on it. The car has been flawless other than a minor rear deck that vibrated under bass that the dealer padded it. I had electronic gremlins that flashed a failure on the blind spot system twice within 2 days, but that was over 6 months ago and has never happened again.
What I love:
The power train still impresses me every day when I accelerate regardless if it is slow of fast as it is the silkiest smoothest power-train I have ever driven. The 8AT smooth smooth and quick never once hunting for a gear like my 7AT Infiniti did on occasion. I love the Quattro how it deliver even power 40/60 to all the wheels so you never feel like you are being pulled or pushed, the car just moves as a whole. The Audi MMI is better than anything I have seen in Acura, Infiniti and also a tad better than Lexus. I love the natural language Nav input. Google earth overlays are more a gimmick to me, but Google search is killer especially by voice.
What I do not like:
The damn steering is numb and lifeless. Audi had a EPS issue that they fixed at the end of the MY13 runs and all 14's have the new firmware, but it makes even the sport setting for the steering way to light and numb. The gf's 14 RDX Tech AWD has better steering feedback! The other thing I dislike are the seats.These seats are probably the most uncomfortable seats I have ever had in a car. They are firm, tight, lack adequate thigh support for long legs, and while are OK for average drives I could never see myself doing 4-8 long trips in this seat without feeling less than comfortable by the end.
What else:
The Bose sound system is OK, nothing compared to ELS, or Lexus ML but better than the Infiniti Bose.
Would I buy another or buy it again?
That is a tough question. There are many thing I enjoy about this car, but I know this is not a long term keeper just because the German costs of regular maintenance are much higher. And all costs are higher, example, my auto insurance went up $300 a year. Had I gotten a comparable cost M37S in 14 the A6 still would have been over $300 a year more to insure. And everything is just more expensive, and example is I got a scratch in the passenger door, and it cost $1350 to repair because of all the trim that has to be replaced when their take the door apart. Similar door repaint on my 09 TL AWD was $700. Based on the landscape at the time I would buy it again, but based on the current/coming landscape (15 Q70S, TLX, 15 Genesis HTAC, CTS) I tend to think I would not get another one. If they offered the Audi comfort seats and tightened up the steering I might, but I enjoyed my old TLs and M37S enough to know that the Audi premium is hard for me to justify. Now form a sex appeal perspective I love the car, the wheels I added make the car to me and based on comments I get it transformed the car.
I truly want to check out the TLX because I am an Acura fan, but there are too many doubts I have to think I will get a TLX until there is a Type-S version. The new Genesis looks appealing to me and honestly I enjoyed my M37 enough to see me in a Q70S. The A6 is an awesome car and I will not regret owning it and will enjoy it every moment I do, but I really think I will be back to the Asians soon enough.
What I love:
The power train still impresses me every day when I accelerate regardless if it is slow of fast as it is the silkiest smoothest power-train I have ever driven. The 8AT smooth smooth and quick never once hunting for a gear like my 7AT Infiniti did on occasion. I love the Quattro how it deliver even power 40/60 to all the wheels so you never feel like you are being pulled or pushed, the car just moves as a whole. The Audi MMI is better than anything I have seen in Acura, Infiniti and also a tad better than Lexus. I love the natural language Nav input. Google earth overlays are more a gimmick to me, but Google search is killer especially by voice.
What I do not like:
The damn steering is numb and lifeless. Audi had a EPS issue that they fixed at the end of the MY13 runs and all 14's have the new firmware, but it makes even the sport setting for the steering way to light and numb. The gf's 14 RDX Tech AWD has better steering feedback! The other thing I dislike are the seats.These seats are probably the most uncomfortable seats I have ever had in a car. They are firm, tight, lack adequate thigh support for long legs, and while are OK for average drives I could never see myself doing 4-8 long trips in this seat without feeling less than comfortable by the end.
What else:
The Bose sound system is OK, nothing compared to ELS, or Lexus ML but better than the Infiniti Bose.
Would I buy another or buy it again?
That is a tough question. There are many thing I enjoy about this car, but I know this is not a long term keeper just because the German costs of regular maintenance are much higher. And all costs are higher, example, my auto insurance went up $300 a year. Had I gotten a comparable cost M37S in 14 the A6 still would have been over $300 a year more to insure. And everything is just more expensive, and example is I got a scratch in the passenger door, and it cost $1350 to repair because of all the trim that has to be replaced when their take the door apart. Similar door repaint on my 09 TL AWD was $700. Based on the landscape at the time I would buy it again, but based on the current/coming landscape (15 Q70S, TLX, 15 Genesis HTAC, CTS) I tend to think I would not get another one. If they offered the Audi comfort seats and tightened up the steering I might, but I enjoyed my old TLs and M37S enough to know that the Audi premium is hard for me to justify. Now form a sex appeal perspective I love the car, the wheels I added make the car to me and based on comments I get it transformed the car.
I truly want to check out the TLX because I am an Acura fan, but there are too many doubts I have to think I will get a TLX until there is a Type-S version. The new Genesis looks appealing to me and honestly I enjoyed my M37 enough to see me in a Q70S. The A6 is an awesome car and I will not regret owning it and will enjoy it every moment I do, but I really think I will be back to the Asians soon enough.
06-01-2014, 06:54 PM
#35
Much appreciated the feedback.....when I read this post, it made me realize that we are on teh same page. Acura provides a pretty darn good package for the price and why its so hard to justify buying the German brands....I still need to see that darn TLX!
06-01-2014, 08:49 PM
#37
Suzuka Master
Thread Starter
I am really eager to see the Genesis, they are stealing the Audi playbook. Their HTRAC is full time 40/60 like Audi, their new 2.0 Blue Link looks impressive rivaling Audi's MMI and for $52K you get a loaded AWD V6 with HUD and all the goodies. It will likely lack some of the refinement of Acura or Lexus, as well as the interior materials will be a slight step behind, but the materials and features will exceed what I have in my A6 for $14K+ less MSRP and a better warranty. Yeah it lacks the cache of the Germans, but the only person I need to impress is myself.
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