DrewQ35

Hey guys, Im getting my first maintenance minder on the TL....I bought her used. The A13 is oil change and Transmission Flush...Im at 60k miles on my car. Im new to this whole reminders on cars. I was always used to going by mileage on cars and not some service reminder every couple of thousand miles. I made my appointment for this Friday and they told me I have two options for the Transmission...the first one is a drain and fill and then the second is a drain and flush/fill where they empty out all 12qts and put fresh oil in while the drain/fill is where they empty out about half that and fill it up. Im confused on why would there be two options and why drain only half. Also its almost a $200 difference. I came from an Infiniti G35 Coupe and I didnt have these reminders. What do you guys suggest the full flush or just the drain and fill? Is there that much a difference and should I pay the $200 more for the flush?

jim_c

Hi there,
You should first decide if your transmission (transaxle in a FWD car) is shifting properly, which it probably is. If the car drives and shifts properly then it is probably wise to simply do a drain and refill which is a very easy job and takes about 15 minutes. I just did it myself the other day on my 2010 FWD TL. I don't know where you got your figures but I think the total ATF volume is only 7.5 L (about 7.9 U.S. qts. check your manual, p.578 in mine) The synthetic fluid is about $10/qt.
The drain and refill replaces the fluid that is in the body of the transmission. (Used to be the pan like an oil pan, but Acura does not have a removable pan) The torque converter holds about half the oil and it will not drain. A "flush" would force the oil from the TC to also be circulated and removed but that is only necessary if the oil is really filthy. To do a flush you can remove the cooling line from the transmission and run the engine briefly. Don't attempt this if you don't fully understand the flow etc. Anyone who can change motor oil and who is careful can change the 3.5 L in the body of the transaxle and if this is done regularly, say every two years or about every 30,000 miles (?) you will maintain clean oil in the trans. I would think that a simple drain and fill should not cost more than $40 for the fluid and $50 max for labour at the dealer and it is a very simple task.

jim_c

The ATF does not get used or burned like motor oil in the engine. If you drove gently and the car did not ever get really hot for an extended period you could probably go for the life of the vehicle on the original ATF. I would not advise this but it is possible. The oil deteriorates due to heat and it gets contaminated by debris internally if there is abnormal wear. The fluid (Acura fluid should be used exclusively) should have a reddish colour. The condition of the trans can be indicated by diagnosing the fluid but this is only a possible indicator. Do not believe anyone who tries to tell you your transmission is bad (or good for that matter) based simply on the condition of the fluid. If the colour is brown like poo, or soft pink like a strawberry milkshake, or gooey like sludge, then you probably have a real problem, but you can never tell for sure what is inside until you take a unit apart.
(I was a licensed transmission mechanic and have rebuilt hundreds of transmissions in the distant past.)

DrewQ35

When I made the appt the service person told me its 12qts. The oil change would be about $140 which includes the tire rotation and the trans drain would be about another $180 or the Trans Flush would be aboout $280. Im just trying to decide is it worth it for the flush or wait till 90k. How often are you supposed to drain or flush the trans? On my G drained and filled but it RWD...Just trying to make sure im not doing anything prematurely and getting ripped by the dealer. I have an extended warranty on the TL also.

jim_c

The flush procedure may require 12 qt if they waste 4 qt as a flushing agent. MHO this is in most cases just an easy money maker for the service dep't. (At $10 a qt, $40 down the drain)

jim_c

I would advise that you should not do the flush and I would also advise that their pricing is outrageous. See my note above. IF IF IF your car is driving and shifting properly there is minimal maintenance required. Tire rotation should be free. On a lift it would take 15 minutes max and is usually done by a trainee or a gopher, not a qualified technician.

Mr Marco

^Honda recommends a 3X4 flush (Drain and fill tranny three times with four quarts of fluid, wasting 8 quarts of fluid). This is also how a LOF shop like "Jiffy" would do it.

OP, If you decide to get a real flush, be sure that the shop has a REAL tranny fluid capture system. Many dealers do, but some don't.
A real tranny fluid exchange uses a high tech filter system to capture the old fluid while injecting pressurized new fluid into the tranny.

A REAL machine can cost anywhere from $3,500-6,000. So some shops are too cheap to buy the real deal.

jim_c

You should talk to the service manager and get his thoughts on this. If he gives you a hard time you should consider changing dealers. The service advisors typically would not even know where to look for your transaxle, they are just following a script and they are paid based on how much they sell, whether it is needed or not.

Mr Marco

^I'll agree with that. They are always trying to shove some BS service down my throat. If it wasn't for the "free oil changes for life" I wouldn't even pull into that parking lot.

jim_c

I guess Drew is paying for your free oil changes, if he takes their offer, lol.
Sorry Drew, jk. This sort of thing really bugs me and is a perfect example of why people have a legitimate basis to hate car dealers.

DrewQ35

The Dealer Im going to is Radley Acura in Falls Church, VA. They are supposed to be a good repuatble dealer. It was just odd to hear about two options for a Tranny Oil service. If the car wasnt under warranty I wouldnt bring it somewhere else for less.

Mr Marco

You can bring it to any mechanic. You are not required to service your vehicle at the dealer.

You could do it yourself if you wished. A fluid change is a simple procedure (with the right tools).

Tonyware

First, I wouldn't trust these flushing machines since metal fragments can go flying around the gears and valves and God knows were else with pressure and cause transmission damage. Second, an easier, yet more know-how driven approach is to disconnect the transmission cooler line out and feed 12-14 bottles the transmission oil fill plug while the engine runs. Same result yet more for the pro than the amateure that can ruin a $6,000 transmission in seconds while attempting that. Just some thoughts...

Mr Marco

I think HMCo's official opinion of the tranny "flush" machines is a "No."
However this might be because a $500 machine and a REAL $4,000 machine (which captures the old fluid and it's contaminants such as "metal fragments" and feeds the equivalent amount of tranny fluid back in) look very similar:



^ $500




^ $4,000


Unless the consumer does a little research (looks up the model on-line), how would they know the difference?

DrewQ35

This is funny...I go to their website in which you can schedule your maintence service and you check off which service you need...The A13 with just Trans oil drain and fill is $255, but with the Flush its $360. And thats with a regular oil change. Add $80 more for synthentic oil change. But over the phone the guy says its about 460 for the flush and 300 for the drain and fill.

http://radleyacura.com/Xtime-Schedule-Service/

Check it out, just plug in the model and year of your car and shows the prices.

TLtrigirl

iTrader: (1)

It's all about how you ask for the services. Radley does this whole switch aroo thing sometimes, depending on how you've asked for pricing.

I bet if you ask for an oil chnage ($40), tire rotation($30) and trans drain and fill (~$140)...it gets a little lower.

not sure if the "no flush" for the tranny still applies to the 4G TL. i know for the 3G it's drain and fill only (3x3). the flush as someone else mentioned can stir up metal fragments that have settled and then do bad things to the tranny.

DrewQ35

Do you have Radley service your vehicles or do you go to another shop?

Mr Marco

You're in DC? Good god man, there must be a half dozen Acura dealers within 100 miles of your location.

TAKE YOUR CAR SOMEPLACE LESS EXPENSIVE!

There are only 2 Acura dealers in the Portland area. One is more expensive than the other. If I absolutely had to take my car to the stealership...guess which one I would choose.

DrewQ35

Yeah but some are a ways away and not looking to drive an hour to get to it. Radley is on my way to work. Annapolis is close to where I live but when I called they said they might charge for a loaner so I said screw that. Rockville and Silver Spring are out of the way. I have local shops I trust that I can bring my car to but since its under warranty I rather get the dealer to service it in case something comes up and they try to hit me with some BS about maint. records.

Chrisdg19006

I really like the upfront pricing aspect of this, but the prices are outrageous. The one that jumped out at me is the cabin air filter at $139 that takes less than 10 minutes with a $15 filter and no tools. Heck, it might take less than 5 minutes if your glovebox isnt filled up. The timing belt services looks to be about 2x what an independent shop would charge.

TLtrigirl

iTrader: (1)

in a word...NO. Radley lost my business a long time ago. I go to Pohanka in Chantilly. It's out of the way for me, but when it comes getting treated well and knowing that the techs that work on my car know the car and it's owner....I trust few with my cars. Don't get me wrong...I still get nervous anytime the car is out of my care. I always go to the same service advisor.

Slithr

I assume these cars have a transmission filter that should also be changed. Every car I've owned with an automatic, you had to drop the pan to change the filter.

jim_c

Instead of assuming, why don't you get under your car and look?
No, they don't have a pan or a filter.

Mr Marco

You are not changing ALL the fluid in the tranny.