Stew4HD

I was just picking a little. The '12 SH-AWG was an awesome car to me. I have regrets for trading it in on the GS350 actually. Live and learn.

SSFTSX

It is good for 4 cylinder car below mid 30 price.

weather

Delighted to see you have finally gotten around to see what everyone seems to say about the TLX *LMAO*

(end of sarcasm)

hddnav

Sarcasm aside, the key is that most owners see a very unique combination of strengths in the 4G TL SHAWD that is not present in the TLX V6 (the 4-cylinder TLX appeals more to the Integra crowd than the TL crowd, unfortunately). No other car on the market provides ALL of the following in one package:

Strong value statement (upper $30k pricing selling price)
Taut sport-sedan handling
BMW 5-series body size
Honda reliability
Refinement for times when you need to haul a family or go on vacation
Unique styling if you like it (I love the post 2012 MMC flavor)
Over 300-hp
AWD tuned for sport, but is fully functional in inclement weather, as well.

The TLX drops 3 of these attributes (body size, 300-hp, handling). Of course, it will be a "better" car, just for being a new generation. That's not to say that the 4G is any less of a car than it was, though. The point is that the TLX is no replacement for the 4G SHAWD.

H_CAR

Maybe you should drive the TLX ACTUALLY comparable to your 4G TL SH-AWD.

When you drive a TLX SH-AWD, then come back and say it's worse, not the FWD. Thought that would be common sense.

Stew4HD

Thank you! it's good to see another like minded person on here. We are few, it seems.

George Knighton

This is going to take some getting used to because Acura has only now begun to use a throttle push back to improve fuel economy.

When you get used to how the throttle pedal works in the DI motors, you know that you have to use more throttle action to get the kind of response you are wanting when not in one of the sports modes.

I average 25 mpg in my 2014 RLX, in mixed driving, and I do not baby the car. So, there are rewards for dealing with this kind of technology.

Once you get used to it, you'll be confident pulling out to pass, knowing that you just have to treat the throttle pedal differently so that the car knows you mean business.

Otherwise, when you push the throttle the way you did in your 4G TL, the car will ask "Are you sure?" before it gives you the power.

:-)

George Knighton

With what the original poster said about the rear leg room, I have to agree.

I used to think that I'd be looking at an SH-AWD TLX around December, but having been in some of the TLX now, I know that it's not going to suit me. I frequently have to carry three or four people around, and it just won't do.

So it's the RLX for me for a little longer than I anticipated. :-)

SeismicGuy

That's an interesting observation and maybe spot-on. The TL kept growing in size, specs, and features to the point of it being almost indistinguishable to what you got from an RL--the price differential of the RL was clearly not worth it.

So now the TL is knocked down a peg clearly more into TSX territory which makes the RL separate itself more.

kurtatx

I understand where the TL drivers are coming from. They want to defend what they bought, which is fine, but the fact is the TLX is a better overall car and it's not just because it's a new generation.

The TL was a great car in its day, but the TLX is just better in almost every way than any TL model.

hddnav

Point taken. However, please show me (based on reviews, admittedly) which TLX has sport-tuned handling and the same size as a TL. I'm willing to concede that perhaps the lighter weight will make up for the loss in HP (but not torque due to displacement, though).

kurtatx

This is true, but it is almost exclusively based on size. The TLX SH-AWD is not some TSX replacement by a long shot.

hddnav

I understand where the TSX drivers are coming from. They want to defend the fact that the TLX (the replacement TSX) is a step up from not just the TSX, but also every TL model, which is fine, but the fact is the TLX is a better overall car, except in areas where it's not designed to compete (such as with certain TL models).

Face it, TSX owners want to claim that their cars (or their replacements) are better than their big brother TL models, which is no different than TL owners wanting justification that the TLX truly is an improvement in the key areas that particular TL models distinguish themselves.

How's that ?

Stew4HD

I expect that to be the case. From the reviews I've read and videos reviews, I am anxious to test drive one.

Some people just seem to look for the negative and ignore anything positive. I try to look for positives but keep the negatives in mind

kurtatx

Completely wrong. I bought the TSX because it was what I could afford and I wanted it to last. I don't love the way the TL looks, but I understand that it is a better car than the TSX. I have no interest in buying a TLX, but I want it to do well to point Acura in the right direction. So far, mission accomplished. Make no mistake, though, the TLX is a TL replacement and is as good or better than the last TL in every way except size (if you assume larger=better, which is a stretch).

schalliol

It was a mistake to have this forum branded as fifth generation TL (can we get that changed)? The TLX is its own car and it will never be just a newer improved version of a TL or TSX. I'm not a vegetarian, but I know if you give someone a food with something that is billed to be vegetarian chicken, people won't like it because it won't be the experience you're expecting as chicken. You need to say this is something new/different or people will not be happy even if they would've liked the taste.

I had a TSX in summer of 03 (pre-ordered), and I loved it. It seemed like new when we sold it 8 years later at 75k miles. I drove it until I swapped with my wife and bought an Audi. I liked the Audi as our primary car with its spaciousness and features, and now that we have 3 kids and a van, I'm thinking of going smaller to the TLX. I'm leaning toward the Advance SH-AWD given the nice features and advantage for winter driving, but I'm torn as the TSX was really fun to drive. I think I prefer the A6 even though it's bigger, but I also think the loaded TLX could split the difference and handle like the lighter and smaller car it is but have the power and features of the Audi.

Colin

It's funny, through 5 generations, the TL nameplate has had 5 different sizes.

TLX = 190
4G TL = 194
3G TL = 189
2G TL = 193
3.2 TL = 191

Each change was greeted with cheers and jeers. "it's too small' " its too big" I'm sorry Goldielox, it's only "just right" the year before it changes again.

SSFTSX

Each generation of TL was improvement over previous interms of interior space and quality. This one is not. city mpg for V6 FWD did not much improved at all.
Start with cheaper tires, large turning radius on narrow tires. infact at $35k with no leather in V6. now DWB suspension.

schalliol

FWIW, I created a poll on whether this car is not simply a rebadged TL and is a different car worthy of its own top level forum: https://acurazine.com/forums/5g-tlx-2015-2020-415/petition-make-forum-top-level-1st-gen-tlx-915828/ This thread sure makes it seem to me the TL and TSX are dead, and the TLX is now something new.

Stew4HD

It's okay to vent.. keep doing so until you feel better I am going to say that I think the TLX is an improvement over the 4G.

winstrolvtec

There is no getting around the size and if that is a deal breaker. In that sense, I share in your sentiment, as it could be an issue for myself, personal preference in a car, and also driving a 4G TL (6MT) as well.

Being objectively smaller is not the question but rather how that impacts you. Can't say for myself as I have not checked one out yet, although I'm sure it is a fear and/or concern for some (maybe many) former TL buyers both 3G and 4G alike.

As for the handling, we will kind of just have to wait and see, same goes for braking and acceleration. I'm sure they have softened some things up but the vehicle is also lighter and lower and in the case of the SH, has enhanced vectoring by way of added rear axle overdrive ratio. Same kind of things for the other categories, some things could imply downgrades and some could imply upgrades. Without the results and some side by side comparisons, it's hard to conclude anything factual.

The torque to weight would actually works in the same respect as the hp to weight, for the most part. Again, it is lighter as we know and the amount of savings is typically enough to at least wash out or compensate for the power it has lost. It's only down 7 lb-ft "peak" vs the 3.7L and peak tq is available 500 rpms sooner and is broader throughout the rev range plus it has 3 more gears in case of the V6's. Trust me, I share in many of the same questions regarding the comparisons between the models but we do really need to wait for a few official tests to be conducted.

SSFTSX

Improvements are not in quality and design.
we have to see what kind of performance comes with identical set of tires.

Same 8 inch navigation screen. No wide screen 10 inch setup.
TLX interior is more fit for Accord. There is no curves.

kurtatx

Honestly, dude. Who cares? It's not a rebadged TL any more than a F30 is a rebadged E90. Can we all just move on?

It's a better car than either of its predecessors based on what we know so far. This is all despite what the twelve happy TL owners say. [/thread]

schalliol

Just sayin' that if the TLX is considered as just a TL upgrade, that defines the purpose of the car differently, and frankly it makes it seem not as good.

Rocket_man

I just got back from test driving the V6 Tech at John Eagle Acura in Houston. They are the only Houston dealer with TLX's and they just made them available at 1pm today. They had 4; 1 Advanced which sold right off the truck, and 3 V6 Techs. One on the showroom, one for test driving. Not sure where the other one was. They said they will get some I4's next week. So here is my review from a brief test drive. There is only so much you can learn from a short test drive, so my advice to you is to drive the car yourself.

Of course these are my opinions and yours will be different and your logic may be different than mine, so take this for what it is.

Summary... I see three groups of people looking at this car:

- Non-Acura TL/TSX owners or those new to the brand. The car will make a great impression. As an overall package it really works well at a good value point. I was speaking to a couple that just came from looking at CPO A4 and ES300 and they really seemed to like this car. They mentioned there was more room in the back of the TLX than the A4. Apparently I knew way more about this car than the sales staff and they picked my brain. They even came back to me to ask questions..... a sure sign I might have a problem. Later I saw them coming back from a test drive. This car will sell to folks like that like hot cakes. Especially when the prices soften. It is a great overall value.
- TSX Owners. I have a 1G TSX and this car is great upgrade from that. I did not drive the I4, but my guess is even the I4 is a step up and the price points are not that different from the outgoing model. I think this is a great replacement to a TSX and the V6 is certainly a nice upgrade. That is where I'm coming from.
- TL Owners. If you own a late model TL I don't see much reason for you to sell that car and get the TLX. Unless you just want a new car and can afford it, there is nothing compelling to make you buy this. There was a TL SH-AWD Advanced next to the TLX on the showroom floor. I sat in both. If I were approaching both from a new car standpoint I would personally pick the TLX over the TL. No offense to TL owners, it is just a nicer car overall to me. The interior is more modern to me, simplified, and more 'airy.' I could not tell my difference in interior space by sitting in both. I know the numbers say the TL is larger, to me they felt about the same. I think the TLX's dash is a little further front and not so much in your face and that may make the car feel roomier than it is. I ran the TLX seat all the way back and the TL seat was also all the way back. My knees hit the back of the front seat in both and I could not reach the pedals in either. It a normal seating position for me there is plenty of comfort in the rear of the TLX. I'm 5'8"

Specifics:

- V6/9AT. I don't think I need the V6 but is sure is smooth and quiet. You can hear the engine when you are heavy into the gas, but most of the time the car is very very quiet. In Normal and Sport mode there was a little hesitation when you step on the gas. You have to feel it yourself to know what it is like. I'm not sure the car is looking for a gear, it just seems to wait half a second or so to get going. It was a little odd. In Sport + mode there is no hesitation what so ever. Either while driving, or from a stop. We were at a stop light and I switched to Sport + and floored it at the green and the car got up and moved down the road in a serious fashion, no waiting at all. I'll spend most of my time in Normal mode. Is this really an issue? It is not a deal breaker to me and I'm sure I will adapt to it eventually. But I'm at a loss at what the car is doing. Why can't it me more like Sport +? Is it saving on gas somehow? You can also use the paddles to downshift if you want. They work very well.

- Styling: I like the look. I think it looks great in person. Again, IMHO the TLX looks better than the TL sitting next to it. But of course that is subjective. The wheel gap that some complain about is not very evident when you are next to the car. You can't see the exhaust tips unless you get way down low. The lines of the car are nice and add character. I think there are little things that Acura could have done to make the car stand out a bit more, but as it is now, it is a nice looking car and styling is not going to hold me back. Both cars I saw were black and that color looks great on this car. I've never had a black car and would not look forward to maintaining it. But it looks good in black.

- Interior: The car I drove and the showroom car both were Greystone. I like the lighter color, the TL was black. I'm not a fan of black interiors personally. The seats were very comfortable and the driving position felt very natural. The passenger seat has height adjustment (!) and I'm sure my 5' 2" wife will be very happy in them. The rear seats were plenty comfortable for me and I had several inches of leg room to play with. I folded done the rear seats and I'm very happy Acura added this to the car. The opening is a little oddly oval and very much like the Accord. I think they could have done better here but they do get credit for 60/40 split folding seats. The materials are just what you'd expect in an Acura. That is not a bad thing, it just felt like an Acura. The materials were nice and as I expected and I have no complaints. If you buy a more expensive luxury car you'll probably get better materials, but I have no complaints about the TLX. The push button shifter leaves more room in the center console. Personally I think they should have put the nav controller there, but it will take almost no effort to adjust to the push button. The IDS button was a little annoying. You have to push it once just to enable it, then again to change modes and then you have to cycle through. As another poster mentioned, a knob or direct buttons would have been much better. I don't see myself changing modes often, but if you want to, it is a multi-push process. You can clearly see the mode on the info screen in front of you, and the button has little nibs on it, so once you get used to where the button is it will be quicker, but I think they could have implemented something better.

- Driving: This car is about as quiet as Church on a Monday morning. Even at highway speeds there is no need to raise your voice to talk. I noticed this car has speed sensitive volume control but I don't think it needs it. My TSX could have used it! I honestly could not feel the P-AWS but my test drive was pretty short. For those familiar with TX roads, I took a highway turn-around at a pretty decent speed... the tires complained a little but the car felt just fine. A turn around is a 90 degree left, a short straight and another 90 deg left. Again the slight hesitation in Normal and Sport mode (I didn't test Eco mode) was something noticeable but I'd probably adapt to it. A car came up beside me and the blind spot warning light came on. I noticed it is smart enough to know not to warn me when I pass a car, only when one comes up from behind. The lane keep assist seemed a little sensitive, but was not a problem. It went off when I felt I was not that close to the other lane. But then it never went off again.

- Other: When I stopped the car back at the dealer it ran up slightly on the curb (sorry!). I had removed my seat belt and decided to back up. I put it in reverse but the car would not go backwards. The display said the parking brake was on, but I did not put it on. Later I realized this was the automatic parking function. I had to put my seat belt back on and shift into neutral and then into reverse and it backed up. The back up camera looked good to me. As I backed up a car came from the side and it showed the warning on the screen. Nice.

I didn't have much time to play with the touch screen and nav system. Three people were waiting to drive the car. I did switch radio stations and felt the screen was responsive and easy to read. The resolution of both seemed pretty good to me. Certainly good for a car. The screens were bright, clear, readable, and responsive. What more do I need?

Overall I really liked the car and I'm 99% certain I will buy it. I had never been to John Eagle before (it is a 100 mile round trip from my house) but the dealership is nice and the sales people were very helpful and never pushy. They will let me know when the I4's come in but I can wait til my local dealer (2 miles from me) gets them in. My trim of choice will be the V6 Advanced but only because they don't offer the I4 Advanced. When the prices soften I will buy this car, just not sure what color yet.

I took some pics but there are so many pics out now I probably won't post them.

Rocket_man

Let me expand on this.... as I drove back home in my 1G TSX I paid attention to the throttle response. The TSX had a more immediate response to the throttle than the TLX. But the TLX had better acceleration. Again you have to drive it yourself to understand. Is it a deal breaker? No I don't think so. Like I said it is one of those many things that you adapt to when you buy a new car. Still I can't figure out why except it may give the car a little better FE. My boss is one of those drivers that pulses the gas pedal on-off-on-off-on-off like every sec. Drives me crazy but that is just the way he drives. Maybe this throttle behavior is intended to even out short pedal pulses. It seems to me this could be programmed out since the Sport + doesn't do it.

So can you just drive in Sport + mode all the time? Well I guess, but one thing I forgot to mention is that in Sport + the car seems to use engine braking when decelerating. It felt like driving an MT except I didn't have to downshift. So for me I would not be driving in Sport + mode except on rare occasions. I'd expect only a few buyers will ever try it, and after that they may never use it again. Personally I think Sport mode should have zero delay, not just Sport +.

If I had to pick a complaint about the car this would be it. About the only thing I can think of to complain about.

John Eagle is having a reception for this car on the 21st and I'm told some Acura exec's will be there. If it weren't so far away I might have gone and asked a few questions like.. 'Why no I4 Advanced? and Why the throttle delay on the 9AT?'

Still I'm 99% certain I'll get the V6 Advanced. I'm an engineer and we rarely say 100% about anything so 99% is pretty damn certain.

012TL-GLM

I'm reserving judgment until the SH-AWD reviews come out

Colin

I was going to comment on this. I recently had a test drive with a old "Buick driver". She's currently driving 10-15 year old Regal or something like that. It has a six cylinder. Obviously, a TSX is plenty of power for her, even more than her current vehicle. Unfortunately, she is exactly the type of driver you are referring to and with the TSX she was never able to accelerate smoothly. The slower throttle response on the 4G TL worked much better for her. However, we had essentially sold out of TLs by this time so she is on the list for a TLX. I think the six cylinder is going to suit her best.

Also, does anyone remember the brouhaha when Acura started moving towards Drive By Wire throttles? Wasn't there a lot of grumbling then about throttle response? I find it curious that everybody jumps on the transmission when it's very possible it's only the programming in the DBW system.

Rocket_man

I don't think it has anything to do with the new 9AT. I found the 9AT to shift very quickly and smoothly. I had to look at the tach to even tell it was shifting (except in Sport + when I could feel and hear the engine change rpm). The 9AT is a really nice transmission. I think it is all in the programming of how the throttle and transmission work together. And I suspect it has something to do with maximizing that MPG number. I need more seat time in the car to really figure this out. 10 minutes and a few miles is not enough.

Rocket_man

As I said in my review there was a TL SH-AWD next to the TLX. The front seat of the TL was all the way back and the power was not on so I could not move it up. But I took pictures of both the TL and TLX sitting in the rear seat with the front seat all the way back. The perception was that there was about the same room in each but I didn't actually measure it. My knees were brushing the back of both front seats. Sit in them both and decide for yourself, but here are the pics. BTW I'd never put the seat that far back, I literally could not reach the pedals with the seat that far back!

One other observation I forgot to mention. The reflection from the side view mirror looked a little odd. No, not the convex part, I mean the overall look of the reflection just looked odd. Maybe I just need to look at it better.

I noticed on the lip of the bumper that the paint looked like it had multi-color metal flake, but the rest of the car did not. It wasn't protective film. That is the last pic in this post.

Rocket_man

Probably the feature I most wanted in this car. Some may recall I was the 'split folding rear seats damn it' guy. So I had to check them out. They are definitely there and they get credit for them. I think they could have made the opening a little more useful but I can live with it. I meant to bring my tape measure and see how wide the widest part was but I forgot.

Also notice that the back of the front seats does not have that plastic trim piece, that must only be on the V6 Advanced trim.

I didn't take a picture under the trunk floor but there have been ones posted on line. There is a Styrofoam insert that holds the tire pump/fix-it kit, the tow hook and gas funnel and some storage space. The sale guy said the spare tire kit is $360. If I recall from other Acura models you can get them on-line cheaper.

Rocket_man

Okay, one more thing I forgot to mention because I didn't feel it. I got the car on the highway and was cruising at highway speeds in Normal mode and so I'm sure the car would have gone into VCM mode but I did not feel or hear a thing. I turned the radio off during the drive because I didn't need to hear that, I wanted to hear the car. Like I said it was really really quiet. So I don't KNOW that is was in VCM mode but I certainly didn't feel a thing. If there is a display or something I will look for it next time.

4WDrift

That's one thing I don't like so far. The close in angle made it a lot easier to reach the wide open front door for shorter stature people and women. Something the Japanese used to think about in design.

Nexx

a freakin men. i love the "whatever i own is better" syndrome many cars owners have

Rocket_man

To see the exhaust tips? Pretty low. Standing near the car and even just behind the car they are invisible. Like that or not I understand, but to see the exhaust tips or mufflers is not that easy. But if this is still too much I think a little black stove paint will make them disappear even from this angle.

http://www.stovepaint.com/

Sorry, there is no paint to make them APPEAR.

4WDrift

Those Pep Boys chrome extensions should come in handy now.

Rocket_man

I think the extra grab handle like on the TL might have made this easier, but I'm 5' 8" and I did not have a problem closing the door. If the door was fully open (which I really seldom do) then I do need to reach but I could do it from a seated position. If I opened the door that far in a parking lot or in my garage it would probably hit the car next to me.

I think the lack of that extra handle is probably one of the little things that make the car feel a little roomier. With that handle there it makes the space around the steering wheel seem a little more cramped. It works for me though and I didn't notice it as a problem.

Rocketsfan

That's the first thing I noticed when I got into the car today. The door was swung open a bit too much so when I tried closing it, I noticed there was no handle where I usually grab it on my 3G. It's a trivial annoyance to me, but still ...

tsxacura

Rocket man, did you get a chance to try out the navigation? I have a 13 tsx and one of the few things I don't like about the car is that I have to manually punch in addresses separately instead of just pressing the voice button and saying the whole thing, like in an Audi for example.

I'm really hoping they've added this natural language enhancement.

Rocket_man

unfortunately the test drive was pretty short and I didn't get to test that out. I'm in the same boat as you. I notice even on my 1G TSX that I can use the voice recognition to dial phone numbers with near 100% accuracy. The key there is to say the number in one input in a clear voice and it will get it nearly every time. If I try one number at a time it never gets it right. Plus the TLX is very quiet which I think will help the voice recognition.

The TLX is supposed to have this natural language input but I think it is pretty misunderstood. I think Acura needs to do some videos on this to show people how it is used.