davo-cls

Someone break it down for me. If the rest of the world is fine with calling the same car a Honda, Toyota, and Nissan then why not us? Is America so shallow that it needs these names to feel better? What's your opinion?

KCPreki11

So have to much money to spend and the foreign carmakers see us as suckers with big names. SO they got us n we fall 4 it

Rod

Yes, in general, I think Americans care too much about what other people think and are always out trying to prove something. So that's why a simple badge sells cars here, shit, Americans even buy just the badges to put on other lesser cars.

Infamuz

Very good point Rod.

Handruin

You know what's sad too, I'd be happier if my car did say Honda on it...I didn't buy my CL-S because it was an Acura, I bought it because it was a Honda. I could care less if my car was prestigious too. I'd rather not draw attention to my car if possible. I was considering a BMW when looking for a new car (being a long time Honda fan I did recon with the idea of crossig over to the dark side), and one of my main reasons for not buying a BMW, was because of the name and sterotype that carries with it.

HellaWhat

Why does America need Lincoln-Mercury, Chrysler and Cadillac? It's called name differentiation

Zapata

hellawhat,
Thank you!

Achance

Lot of people on this board get pissed off when people think they are driving an Accord coupe. That guy who recently sold his CL-s to get a mustang even said that he was upset because people couldn't tell it was an Acura. On most days I could careless, but then other days I feel special to be driving an Acura. It just all depends on my mood I guess.

HellaWhat

Your welcome! Tell you the truth, I could care less about what ppl think my car is. I bought the damn thing so I could drive it, not so someone else could tell what it was.

minla007

its cuz we are brand name/label whores..

HellaWhat

It's not just that. Especially in our case, though the CL looks and shares features with the Accord, it's NOT the same car! The CL has a better engine, better looking interior and is overall more luxurious. If both cars were really the same, I'd save money and buy the accord.

KavexTrax

marketing makes the world go round.
sad but true.

Kwick-CL-ver-S

Well, the reason for the need for Acura, Infinity, and Lexus was not originally ment for differention of badge and prestige as much as it was a way for Japan to push more cars into the US market. There use to be,I don't know about now, but there were quotas for imports coming into the US with certain badges or makers. The way to get around that, Honda made Acura, Toyota made Lexus...etc. For the most, the reason was to get around the quota and introduce more cars to the US market.

All the prestige and badge stuff came with the price premiem, that consumers paymore and then the maker fueled that as well.

As far as ford having Lincoln and Mercury and stuff was because they used to all be independent car makers until they were bought up, but still kept there names ...


and shitty build, IMO

Rod

But the question here is, why isn't it the Honda CL-S instead of an Acura CL-S? The Acura, Lexus, and Infinity brands just give people an extra sense of exclusivity. "Instead of having a regular Toyota, I have "high-class" Lexus." The brands are marketed to portray different images for their drivers and many people in America buy things just because of this image.

moomaster_99

In a recent issue of BusinessWeek, Toyota has been seriously considering the idea of bringing the Lexus marque name to Japan. This is to combat a flight of Japanese yuppies who prefer BMWs and Mercedes to Toyotas. In Japan, as the US, BMW is viewed as a more luxurious brand; a Toyota is still a Toyota...something that your grandpa drives.

Branding is a very important concept...for those that have taken marketing classes, you should know this. BMW and Mercedes have always been viewed as a luxury brand here in the U.S....that was their marketing strategy, since they could only send over so many cars...they sent the best ones. In Germany, Mercedes makes a crappy little A-series...BMW makes a shit 2-series....neither of them would make you want to throw 5~10K over sticker for them. In order for VW to compete, they created Audi...otherwise, if you were buying a car...would you buy a stretched Passat with a 2.7T v6? Or a BMW 5-series? Simple.

SC TL

It's easy to make the statement in 2001, but back in the late '80s, when Honda, Toyota and Nissan/Datsun were thought of as economy cars, it would have been a lot tougher to convince people it was worth it to pay as much for a Honda as they would for a BMW or Mercedes. The new brand names were ways to convince the buyer they were getting something more than just a Honda or Toyota. It worked too. Mazda was going to do the same with the Millenia, but fell on hard times and scrapped the idea. I think the Millenia is perceived more as an expensive Mazda more on par with a top-end Accord than as a near-luxury car with TL's, ES300s, 3-series, etc.

mrdeeno

i remember about 2 years back before the s2000 came out i was thinking about getting it for graduation. people asked me, "who would pay over $30k for a honda?" granted these were people who bought volkswagens 'cuz their friends have them and like bmws 'cuz they're "nice" cars, but this was only 2 years ago.

look at the people who buy certain cars...it IS all brand awareness...i bet over 80% of people who have lexuses, bmw's or benzes bought them for the badge. how else do you explain a 58 year old lady driving around in a brand new 330i? or even worse, her 45 year old sister in an is300?! i'm sure it's not the spirited driving she does!

[ 08-02-2001: Message edited by: mrdeeno ]

SchwartzSM

You've all pretty much nailed it in acknowledging that it's all marketing, breaking away from their low-mid line car image in a (successful) attempt to increase sales. But it also lets the company differentiate for themselves, too. When I went to look at a Lexus, they offered me a sandwich in the showroom. Not just a soda, a sandwich. They give you a free car wash every time you drive by a lexus dealer, and in general, they treat customers well. If Toyota didn't create the Lexus line, they'd get Echo buyers expecting the same treatment, which many may argue they should get, but face it, when selling bargian cars, you cut costs everywhere, not just with the car, so the customer saves money. The upscale lines allow differentiated customer service levels (loaner vs. no loaner, etc) within the brands, without the appearance of discriminating against low priced car owners.

N-Gin

This is exactly the reason why they started with those names. Because of the US automakers' insecurities, the government only allowed each Japanese company to have 3 models imported (iirc). Now that many of the cars are assembled in the US or Canada, it doesn't really apply. However, Acura, Lexus, and Infiniti have all evolved into "premier" automakers.

My sister's boyfriend has a very early model Lexus. It looks no more prestegious than the corolla of the same time period.

Rod

Same thing with the first Infinity cars.

avengerjr

Correct me if I am wrong, but the only "Acura's" in Japan are the following:

Honda NSX
Honda RSX
Honda Inspire (TL)

Correct?

So in essence there isn't a Honda CL or a Honda MDX in Japan.

mrdeeno

technically, the cl and mdx are purely acuras...so when someone tells you it's just a honda...THEY'RE WRONG!

avengerjr

that's what i was saying.

moomaster_99

True true...but I still know I drive a VERY NICE HONDA ACCORD..with the BIG MOTOR...

mrdeeno

that's what i say too!! but there are all those damn haters out there that go "oh, well that's only a honda!"

especially them lexus people that forget their cars are altezzas!

jdl75

For the same reason we have Cadillac, Buick and Lincoln (is there an upscale Chrysler product?). It's all designed and built by the same people, just a few subtle differences. Where are the marketing guys when you need them!?!?

Rod

It is only a Honda, but I'm happy with my Honda.

gavriil

Rod, Lexus is available in Europe and other parts of the world. There is no Infiniti or Acura though.

The Honda NSX in Europe has as much of an image as it does here. Why? It was competing with the Supra mainly and that car is still part of the Toyota brand. The Supra is still sold in Europe and Japan. Same case with the RX7. Mazda brand.

Now why are things different in America?

Well, most buyers of luxury cars here in America can recognize a luxo brand from its name. No one knows an SLK 320 AMG, or a C55, the know Mercedes though. You cannot ask from a consumer to remember 320 letters to recongnize a brand.

The other reason is that if there is a brand out there that makes luxo cars ONLY, then it is easier to be recognized by it.

And finally, the Mercedes/BMW/Jaguar syndrome. All these companies made upper class cars since their existance and they are doing better in the US than anywhere in the world. Why? It is simple. The US is where most of the money is floating. More than any other country for the last 70 years. So if you are Honda and want to go against Mercedes here, you have got to create a seperate brand, cos no matter how good the RL is, it will not be able to sell for $50K as a Honda. Not here in the US.

CL Sabre

Honda America Motors came out with Acura so that they could open up more dealerships. Foreign companies were limited to a certain number of dealerships in a given area. When they differentiated there "luxury" and "standard" cars they came up with the Acura name and opened dealerships that only sold these versions of the car.

Rod

Exactly, gavriil. These brands just set a different image for the cars they offer as compared to their counterparts (Honda, Nissan, etc.). They make the cars stand out more in people's minds, like you said, it's easier for most consumers to remember and associate specific brand names with luxury than it is to remember several different models.

VTECnology

because we'll pay for it. end of story.

Type S

to sell u more expensive..that is all...

DtEW

Yup, yup.

Squishy

Without Honda's brilliance, we wouldn't have these funky German like designation for our cars... I mean... when I drive Acura, its now a RL, NSX, RSX, 3.2 CL. Quite different I believe several years ago when we can say we drove a Legend, Integra, Accord, Civic...

Ah forget the names... I might as well say I drive a Acura.

I also don't like how they are putting a trademark inverted pentagon nose on all the Acura cars. It brings questions on how the US redesign for the NSX will turn out.

Scorpius

Could it also be to have more models without comfusing the comsumner? If Acura didn't exist, what would the CL be called? The Honda Accord 3.2 type S? Along with the Honda Accord, 3.0 is there a 2.5? Too many Accords confuse people. I have trouble keeping track of the BMW names. I always thought a 325i meant Three series, 2.6L, Inline. Apparently I'm wrong. I don't know how to decipher the BMW names. Mercedes isn't much better.
Don't forget GM has Buick, Chevy, GMC, Olds, Saturn for just the North American Market.
Ford was tpying with killing the Mercury line. That would turn away alot of customers. The Grand marquis is a much better car with more luxury/sport options than a standard Crown Vic. Think about it. Once you know the model is an Acura branded vehicle, you know its going to have more options and be more pricey than a Honda. So right away you know whether or not to consider one.
Does that make sense?