JRock

AcuraFan is correct. Some of you need to bone up on your common sense.

1SICKLEX

They are not losers cause the GS and IS were the first JAPANESE sedans to lose/meet/beat the vaunted 5 and 3 series. They lowered Lexus's age target as they wanted. They made Lexus seem as a BMW option as well as a Benz option (whereas they were before). Next thing u know, Infiniti brings over the G35 and M45 cause they see people want BMW alternatives. What failure?

1SICKLEX

They are not losers cause the GS and IS were the first JAPANESE sedans to lose/meet/beat the vaunted 5 and 3 series. They lowered Lexus's age target as they wanted. They made Lexus seem as a BMW option as well as a Benz option (whereas they were before). Next thing u know, Infiniti brings over the G35 and M45 cause they see people want BMW alternatives. What failure? Hell, they have the Honda S2000? Why not the Honda NSX? It's not like the Acura badge has done anything for it. People think "NSX" not "Acura".

Sitting in the TSX, I could not see justification of badging it an Acura. Our American Accord has just a beautiful interior.

soopa

1SICKLEX... LOL

first off... I think all lexus look plenty alike...

the IS/GS look very much alike.

The ES/RX look very much alike... and the profiles of them all look the same.


Second... umm... arent Lexus's Toyota's in many other markets?? I think yes.

1SICKLEX

Your entitled to your opinion. But, IMO, they look nothing alike, none of them. They seem to be trying to share that horizontal grill and the typical large Lexus headlights but that is about it.

Indeed, but I don't think u see my point.

Davediego

lets not forget the TSX is NOT the euro accord exactly, the TSX has an upgraded interior as well as 40hp more than the euro, not sure about torque, and slightly stiffer suspension

7or8

Yep...and that's saying a lot for honda/Acura quality. Cause if interior quality was a must in order to put a premium name tag on a car, than Infinity's G35 would HAVE to be rebadged a Nissan. Or, using the interior quality argument, you could say that because the Accord's interior is so nice it should have been badged an Acura.

<--Begin Rant
Basically us Honda/Acura owners are spoiled. We, in most cases, spend so little time dealing with quality issues or other problems with our cars that we go and find other things to complain about...like.....basically anything. It's only got 200hp?...it should have had 240hp. It's only got 240hp?......It should have had 260hp. It's got 280hp?....well it should also have AWD and a rocket launcher.....Oh and make sure you keep the price the same!! I'm not paying anymore for a Honda/Acura....but I want it to beat the competition at everything....but DONT up the prices!!
--End Rant>

Some things that are different.

(1) It's got stiffer suspension.
(2) DIFFERENT interior. It seems some people think it has the same interior as the Euro Accord.
(3) Vehical Stability Assist
(4) 360 watt stereo system
(5) It's got less HP than the Euro Accord Type-S, but more torque and more aggressive gearing...which ended up making it faster.

It seems silly to me to be saying it should be a Honda here just because it's named a Honda Accord overseas. I think it's just that it's named an ACCORD overseas that people are having a hard time with it. If Honda called it something different over there...like maybe if they called it the Honda TSX...then people wouldn't be so upset. Basically Honda had to make a much more sporty and smaller car for Europe. They would never go for a bloated NA Accord. The NA Accord is a type of car that only NA has an insatiable appetite for, as reflected in the sales numbers.

1SICKLEX

I think the G35 should have been a Nissan, hell with the same name, SKYLINE. I think that would have been awesome. The name Infiniti really does not benefit the car, cause the general public does not know or care what Infiniti is. Nor would the name Nissan have hurt any of the cars wonderul reviews. Whereas the TSX reviews have been average at best, thus hurting the ACURA name.

Take the ES 250 Lexus for example. It was a Camry with basically a L badge and Lexus never made that mistake again.

AcuraFan

What TSX reviews are "average at best"? What was it, Motor Trend (or Road & Track I can't remember) that rated it ahead of Saab and just behind MB? What about the glowing C&D review from this months issue? From where I stand, pretty much all reviews I've read range from above average to great.

I know you have some grudge against this car. And that's fine, to each his/her own. But only select few are going to grab their pitchforks and join you in lynching Acura for introducing this car. For the rest of us, it's a welcome addition to the lineup.

1SICKLEX

Or Forbes, or Money, or the first Car and Driver review, or the EVO review, or the Sports Car International review..

Name ALL the reviews. Not just the ones you want.I dunno, maybe it's the huge dual exhuasts, a pet-peeve of mine. They are dang near bigger than the 350Zs. Kinda like the silly 4 exhausts on a PONTIAC Grand Am or the new Maxima. M3s and M5s have quad exhaust....

oh well, I'll shutup.

Sarlacc

HEY HEY HEY cmon now, you cant be dissin on those quad exhausts on the bimmers, 1) they are sweet as hell 2) they do serve a purpose

I think seeing dual exhausts on a neon (srt4) is more retarded then the TSX.

But i personally like the look of dual exhausts, lets the rear of a car look more balanced from an aesthetic PoV. But yeah some cars do just look ridiculous with them, specially the the super huge ricey duals.

AcuraFan

...then there's the early Automobile Magazine review that said "what took so long?"

I'm just naming the reviews that contradicted your statement. If you make a blanket statement like that, you're going to get someone trying to prove you wrong. What I'm saying is, you can focus on the articles that support your side of an arguement...that doesn't mean there isn't just as many articles supporting the other side. For every article you site that give the TSX an "average at best" review, there is an article that says things like "Engine to copy, transmission to envy, craftsmanship to benchmark."

And if I remember right, that first C&D article liked the car...just not as a 3series fighter. I would definitely have not called it negative.

AcuraFan

I think that was his point. The M3 and M5 have them because they serve a purpose. The TSX looks silly because it doesn't need them. I guess that's why he's carrying on about the TSX as if Acura should be strung up because of this car.

I kinda like it. As you said, it gives some symmetry.

Zoot

I think the first C&D article was just a preview....no test drive. Now most people here thought the TSX looked wimpy on paper....but it's the opposite when driven, which explains C&D's 2nd article on the TSX.

1SICKLEX

You got my point, THEY SERVE a purpose on M cars, thus they belong. Hell the Hyandai Tiburon has huge duals, its factory rice.
If I saw dual exhausts on a ES 300, I'd laugh my arse off. It doesn't belong. Even the A4s have these huge pipes.

Vettes have quads too.

Aegean_Blue6

I'll trade my CL right now for ANY car with a rocket launcher! Damn, that would be sweet for when I'm stuck in traffic! And AWD would be great for crawling over the smoking carcass of the car in front of me. Good call, that should be the next CL!

7or8

ROFL!

SilverBullet_RENAMED

Audi Bland Interior?! I couldn't believe I read that in the same sentence. Bland... Look at Honda's Interior. Very plain.

Audi is known to be the benchmark of interiors.

For power. I would say stock for stock the TSX and 1.8t A4 are about as quick. The CVT in the A4 might make it faster though due to the way it works. Once you chip it though, its much faster.

I think you should still drive it to compare. It handles very good with teh sport package. At least drive it with the sport package.

dacura

iTrader: (1)

I think Audis use great material in their interiors but I do not like their ergonomics, confusing controls and I think I've said it before, the red lit interior (it screams at you I think.)

I drove an A6 for 3 weeks in Germany and I just didn't like the way it looks and it's kind of hard to use the controls. It almost is a little bland despite great materials used.

But that's my opinion and I respectfully disagree with magazines that say the Audi interiors are benchmarks, maybe material used but that's it.

AcuraFan

I agree. The interior materials are top notch...but the layout just rubs me the wrong way. It's German-practical but it just doesn't flow. Interior design can be an artform. But Audi has made it as bland as a high school mathbook (dry and boring and a little too busy). IMHO

SilverBullet_RENAMED

This is why you both drive Acuras not Audis. My controls are very easy and simple in my A4.

Zoot

now we are back on the Audi interior discussion? Look what you did SilverBullet....

AcuraFan

It's not that the controls are too hard to use...it's that they look like they were put where they are by a business guy and not a designer.

Here's an example: I work in the webdevelopment team of a large corporation. On occasion, the corporate execs mandate that a page look a certain way but don't run it by the web designers. Those pages always look terrible. They may be functional but they look like crap. That's how I see Audi's interiors. The interior has nice materials, it's functional, but it has no asthetic design qualities.

Again, IMHO.

AcuraFan

Ha ha...ok, let's bring this full circle.

That's why I like the TSX interior layout. The materials are high quality and the presentation is very pleasing to the eye.

SilverBullet_RENAMED

I didn't start it! :P

1SICKLEX

I hate little buttons in cars and German cars always have tons of them.