Saw another one of these new MB E classes broken down on the highway last night. That's 6 in 2 months and I don't drive that much either!

What the heck is wrong with these cars?

I was tempted to stop and give the MB's owner a demo of my Acura and tell him: "See... just as luxurious and it won't break down on you when you need to make that tee-off time."

I mean really.... I'd be humiliated to own an expensive car like the E and not even have the reliability of Honda civic.

I think we should get a group of TLs together and whenever an E class breaks down, we all pull over and surround him and just make fun of him. Maybe he'll be so embarassed that he'll trade in the E for a nice TL. LOL! Ok, I'm just kidding in this last paragragh.

 

So what is the point? I did not get it. Are you trying to justify your purchase of TL? You cannot compare TL with E class MB. If you do the same kind of comparison there may be another vehicle equivalent to TL in power but less expensive. Like Kia Amanti or Hundai Sonata. (just an example do not come after me I do not know if these model can be compared to TL in power).

There are two kind of people, one who go and buy a branded stuff, the other go and buy one with better justified value for them within some range of money. So if somebody said I bought MB/BMW for brand and dirving pleassure I think we should appreciate it. But if they said, I bought E320/ES300/530i because I can beat TL in race I'd say they made wrong choice. But everybody have their reasonms to buy car/brand. Bashing other car does not justify one's decission. The guy who bought E class have money to buy it and can justify his $25+ buy. The guy who bought TL have his own reasons.

Just my 2 cents.

 

The current generation e-class or the last gen? My mom has current and its great, but I heard lots of problems with the last generation.

 

What's the point? None. I'm just ranting. It's almost a daily occurence to see these things broken down on the side of the highway that I'm really wondering if these things are expensive lemons?

 

...

 

hahaha...my mother's previous car was a 98 E320...and it only lasted about 2 years before she got rid of it. The climate control fried itself in the first month, the LCD on the nav screen began to leak and the screen ad this black glob in the left side, the seat warmers busted...everytime they got fixed...the lights behind the dash mostly went out...she needed a new starter after only one year...so yeah it was a POS alright. But then again, my aunt has a 2001 E320, and it has yet to give her any problems. So it's kinda hit or miss. Since then my mom's purchased a 2003 S600 and it's another lemon...pretty much the same problems..hahaha...German cars are too hit or miss for me...too funny...my father has a 2002 M5, and that thing has been in perfect condition since day one...but the 99 M3 he had before that was shit too...you can never tell with a german car anymore.

 

everyone has his/her own desire of what car he/she wants to buy and drive. I own a MB before and it did not give me any trouble. However, my TL is only 27xx miles and A/C was repaired twice. The first time is replcaing the entire A/C system, and the 2nd time is fixing the A/C clutch.

 

This muthafucka here.... I petition that we all call Joganjani the "thread killa" from now on... that is his new nickname because when he posts on a thread it is over, his shit is the law... he is like probably the most educated person here... right jogan????

He always come back with a history lesson or philosophy stand or some shit.... your alright, guy......

 

Read what is written under my user name. It has a purpose.

JoganJani
is always right.

PERIOD.

 

i own a e500 and it broke down on me twice. it over heated once and had a brake power problem. Problem fixed and i still love the car. Every brand cars are going to have its problem.

 

Yeah, but its the german cars that always seem to have the most of them.

 

Yeh...german cars are falling below in reliability...what happened? I remember when my mom got her first benz it was only because she heard so many stories of mercedes making such durable cars...WTF HAPPENED???

 

That's what i'd like to know too.

 

What happened to the story where the one German car maker had a Toyota Camry in their test labs so that they could copy its quality? or did the German bean counters realize that their customer had enough money to get their car fixed over and over again?

I think the latter is true because it better for their bottom line…

 

Acura/Lexus all the way...it's going to take a lot for me to be convinced to buy a german ar ever again...

 

Yeh, I heard that too a few years ago. Mercedes had engineers working to replicate the build quality of the camry V6 motor. But I'll have to agree with you...those damn bean counters knew when they started that their clientelle could most likely just keep paying over and over again...

 

So much for upgrading to a better car after owning an acura. I can't see myself taking the financial risk of owning a benz or bimmer after reading all the problems those cars are having.

Looks like it'll have to be acura/lexus.

 

Yeh, Its the Japanese culture that has kept the quality of the Japanese far superior to the German and American makes. It’s the culture of “money” that’s keeping the quality of the others so poor.

The “fools” buying the German cars don’t really think about that.

 

My roommate works for a consulting company that has accounts with just about every M.B. dealership in the country... (product knowledge) and she said that they have lots of problems with the E500 but not the E320... I asked her about the AMG E55 and she said that there hasn't been any problems that she know of...

 

AS much as I love the E-class, electric gremlins to persist. But it sure is gorgous.

 

German cars are POS when it comes to electronics...I've owned quite a few Germans in the last 4 years and I think every single one of them had some sort of electronic issue, whether it's the nav, stereo, or something...but they sure make GREAT motors

 

I'd love MB so much if they fixed their stupid electronic junk.

There is NO excuse as the Germans make some of the BEST electronics out there.

 

my aunt down in florida owns an 03 e320. it's broken down quite a few times on her... nav system troubles, auto tranny hesitating, wouldn't start up... that kind of stuff.

she said it was in the shop all the time. so why don't you get a new one auntie?? because the repair shop is only a mile from where i work!!

these are the people who buy the vast majority of german cars...

 

I love how a lot of you guys bash MB, and then you have to think about all the problems you guys have had with your car? If I remember correctly about 1/3 of us have had transmission problems more then once. I think thats riduclous. I would rather have my radio go out on me then my transmission. I have a 2002 TLS that I love, a 2001 SLK320 and a C320, I love all of them. All of them have had their problems. A car is a machine, all machines will break down/have flaws eventually. If I had to pick MB or Acura, I for sure would still pick a benz. A benz drives completely different then an Acura. But its all personal choice in the end. I like the heavy feeling of a benz, but I like the speed of my Acura. In the end, you shouldn't bash any other company out there, becuase in the end...Acura is the one who has F*cked its consumers several times by stranding them on the side of the road with transmission failures.

 

Gadd:

I bash MB and I've never had a tranny problem

Oh wait, I have a 1st generation TL, among the most reliable cars ever made

 

MB does have its share of reliability problems, especially electrical.

But regardless, if I could get my hands on an S500/S55 or E500/E55, my oh so beloved TL would have to move back in line!

 

S500/S55????...aren't those the grandpa looking cars???

:killer: :killer: :killer: :killer: :killer: :killer:

 

You can bash. 1st gen TL built like a tank. The USA made ones built like a wet diaper. So no lemon calling (shit search lemon here).

 

stop hating, and look at the section of OUR (I own a TL) forum dedicated to transmission failure---a much more serious problem than non functional heated seats. Acura claims only 2% of the vehicles are affected---BUT its probably more like 30-40%, as most people post in the thread stating that their tranny took a shit today. Another issue is stolen headlights...I wonder how many people joined this website simply becuase of either stolen headlights, or a tranny failure. I am willing to bet that if you put an E500 with no options next to any of your cars, you wouldnt look twice at the TL.

 

Werd. I think the E is a fabulous car. The E 500 is wonderful, I was so very impressed in driving it. Worth the money. The E55=speechless!

 

I own a E55, and so far no problems. Honestly I could care less about electrical problems because of the fun factor the car will give me that NO Jap car will ever give me. We also own a Lexus, it is ROCK solid and I would not have my wife drive any other brands while she's driving my son around. My 2000 TL was a "cool" car for me at that time (I didnt make too much money then) but let's face it, it is not and my car certaintly was not rock solid like a Lexus (I've owned 3 and just bought my mother one). TL had tranny problems twice (didnt want to stick around for 3rd time), sunroof sqeaks over and over (notorious in that model) CHEAP ASS PAINT on the entire car, but I will admit that my radio, heated seats, or power windows/seats never went out. It is all relevant no matter what brand you look at or compare. My 2004 E500, did have the brake system recall and it got taken care of.

As far as "German cars cost more than Japanese cars in terms of maintenance"...TOTALLY WRONG. Shit, the Germans give you free maintenace, BMW even covers brakes. With that in mind, my LX470 set me back $750 for some maitenance that was check, check, check, check, check, and not one replace without you getting billed for that thing replaced. Hell, they charged me to refill my washer fluid (petty fuckers), but since my wife is the one driving it I didn't complain at all.

Looks like some of you have owned German cars and perhaps got tired of visiting the service dept and went with Acura which it totally understandable but FUN factor is certaintly not there when comparing Acura to BMW or even an AMG car. I personally like Torque and unfortanately HONDA motors put out like 2 lbs of TQ in their cars. I would love to have a German Engineered car with a Japanese person designing the electrical systems...but that is life I guess.

 

Actually per liter, Honda/Toyota and Nissan put out the most amount of torque

 

I have yet to see any HONDA motors put out more than 250 or so lbs of TQ. I'm not a big fan of per litre statement because it meaningless when it really comes down to it. Since the S2000 is a monster in the "per litre" sense it should be smoking M3s no? The last sentence was really more a figure of speech but just making an example.

 

Acura Didnt say just the TL's 2%, they counted all the accords and odysseys and all the cars that use the Tranny, so You know they took the sneaky way out

 

Acura RL motor puts down 260 foot pounds of torque. Its only 3.5 liters...


Now sure, Nissan motors can put down more power (not by much though) per liter but they are also much rougher. The VQ is much much smoother when it is about 3 liters.

The J series is smoother, more efficient in return for only a few foot pounds of torque.

Also, keep in mind that Honda is notorious for UNDERRATING its engines power and is extremely conservative with its math.

 

It is a monster in terms of how high it can rev and the number of HORSEPOWER per liter.


The M3 has a lot of torque per liter, mainly because emissions and fuel economy were thrown out of the picture. Also it is an inline 6, so losses are minimal as compared to an equivalent V6.


I'm quite sure Honda could build an Inline 6 with equivalent power per liter, however I doubt they will unless several platforms could share it. Inline 6's require a long hood, something Honda is trying to reduce.

 

I don't know...my TL put down 174HPish to the wheel when rated at 220HP Flywheel so I would say they are pretty dead on. The TypeS engines are putting down about 195 to 200 so about a 20% +/- 5HP is pretty close.

Sure the RL may put out 260HP but it takes off like a damn turtle. I guess, I'm more for performance in the sense of TQ. My LX470 puts out something like 300 something and in terms of power, it is the biggest POS in its class or any for that matter.

Yes I agree that Nissan engines are great! Well Hondas make awesome motors but I just wish they made em more powerful and with more TQ but I don't think I'll ever see a V8 from HONDA thus they reason I would never buy another Honda/Acura til they do...the new RL is something to look forward to. From what I've read, it seems pretty awesome except it looks like a BIG CL.

 

Whoa... my C32 Type II puts down 191 hp with a 4 speed auto...

Now its supposedly 230 at the flywheel but maybe the extra's i've done were actually worth it.



As for those saying Honda's lack torque...


Several people and Hondata is involved on this one are very close to getting nearly 200 foot pounds of torque out of the K20. Thats nearly 100 foot pounds per liter of displacement from a naturally aspirated engine running on street gas.


http://sohc.vtec.net/article_files/2...tovtsx_aem.gif

The above is for the TSX, a 2.4 liter engine. But it has the TORQUE you would associate with a 3+ liter V6!

 

Let me rephrase, I wish Honda motors put out TQ at early RPMs rather than at 50,000RPMs. We all know that Hondas can Rev like crazy. I test drove the RSX and noticed the car is a DOG til it reaches 6K RPM, I'm guess that's where it peaks. I'm accustomed to heavy TQ at around 2500RPM.

 

Well the '96 through '04 RL puts most of its torque down low (around 2800 rpms) so maybe thats your kind of car?


I know in my car after 2000 rpms it really takes off. I love low rpm torque too, don't get me wrong but Honda is well known for its engines that LOVE to rev I think Honda does things for a reason, perhaps to reduce torque steer (think Maxima).