Huns

One of the things that drew me to the TL was that it's a really nice car - luxury, or "entry level" luxury - but it doesn't go out of its way to let the world know about it. Am I off base here? When I see a Merc, or an Audi, or a BMW, I instantly think "status symbol." On the other hand, when I see a Lexus or an Acura, even if it is $40K+, I DON'T think that, even with the RL. In other words, as I see it: These are cars you buy for YOURSELF, and not because you want to seem a certain way to others.

Is there something to this line of reasoning? I know that not everyone who buys a German luxury car is trying to make a statement, but I think the "status symbol" motivation might be stronger in that group.

carlos9827

iTrader: (2)

I would agree. Although I think a lot of people might buy Acura rather than Honda, or Infiniti rather than Nissan or Lexus rather than Toyota for the status symbol also. I don't consider myself a show off, but I love that fact that I drive an Acura TL. (Don't love the $600 payment but love my TL) When I had my 05 Nissan Altima 3.5SE. That was also around the same price range as my TL cause I paid $33k for it, I had the Navigation Leather Sport Package, and it did not feel the same when I would say I drove a Nissan....you know what I mean?

vas25tl

I don't think that people buy German cars just to make a statement. It's a matter of preference. I personally love Acura because they are fun to drive and the reliability, but once I get done with school and get a job and everything I will most likely move on to BMW; not to make a statement but because I love the way a BMW drives, smells, sounds, and looks..I drove an 03 M3 from Phoenix to Milwaukee and I was sold...Not just on an M3 but on any 3 or 5 series in general.

vas25tl

And on Audi: We live in Wisconsin and there is a lot of snow; the car handles amazingly in any weather condition. I drove an '03 A6 2.7T through all of last Winter and I never got stuck or felt threatened. The car drove in snow like on dry pavement (with the right tires of coarse)

Depending on where you live, an Audi is a great choice! Plus they depreciate so fast, you can get a really nice car pre-owned for a relatively low price

JediMindTricks

i understand and agree that there are people that buy BMWs, MBs, bentleys, etc as status symbols.

but there are just as many people that buy for their own personal preferences and not for the badge.

yes, i do think the german cars have more of the "luxury, high class" appeal than the japanese. but in the US, i think lexus is in that group now. for example, there are many execs at the bank i work at that don't know a whole lot about cars and are wanting to trade in their 7series or S class for the LS.

i'd imagine it being different in europe, though, where lexus doesn't have the history as it does here.

but yea, i think infiniti and acura are behind in that order.

Costco

It definitely has an impact though I'd be inclined to think someone's a tool if they're buying a BMW mainly because its a BMW, or a Honda because its a Honda. It need not be a German luxury car, it could also be a Prius, some people buy it because they think they're doing the planet a huge favor or something.

I usually don't group cars with regards to "status", at least I try not to.... but from the impressions that I get, a BMW/MB is usually a bit higher in status than say an Audi/Lexus, which in turn is higher class than Infiniti/Acura.

charliemike

I don't see Audi as a status symbol car. They just don't sell enough of them to justify that conclusion. And since about 65-70% of BMWs are leases, I'd say that's as good a reason as any to call them badge whores

Regardless, Lexus is absolutely a status marque. Acura much less so. But when people aspire to own a brand there's status in it.

This is why Hyundai is spending billions to improve its status with the Genesis sedan and coupe. When people aspire to own something, they're willing to pay more for it.

myron

iTrader: (4)

^ audi is such a status symbol. At least for me. I grew up in europe and even there when you see and audi you know its "someone" driving it.

Black Tire

Acura should go back to their roots. Remember that great VIGOR commercial way back where the Germans were talking about how great that car was? It’s all about great cars at affordable prices. Like the Legend. And amazing looking and performing car for a great price. Acura’s motivation back then was not to compete with the Germans.

taitando

That Acura TL you're talking about may be a status symbol to the Honda fanboy in the riced out Civic. Ever thought of that? If you're buying a luxury item, whatever it may be, in essence you're buying into that idea of "status". If a vehicle is a means solely to get you from Point A to Point B, then why not a Kia, Honda, Toyota, Ford, etc.? They're all nicely appointed too and do the same job, why the differentiation? As long as you're gracing the term "luxury", there's always a modicum of status to be tossed around. The Germans just happen to have more of it, at least in public perception, and there's nothing wrong with that. Plus, they have the history to back it up.

Some people are just bored with Japanese cars. I count myself as one, since I've grown up with them, bought them, and have had them all my life. It's simply human nature and desire to satiate curiosity and get what you've never had or experienced. That's the appealing factor of the German cars for me. It's merely a plus that they happen to be viewed as a "status symbol".

wackura

The people that are truely unconcerned with status buy the Camry XLEs and Accord V6's. Having said that everybody knows Acura isn't quite there yet (not by design) so it's somewhere in the middle, for people who want the Accord V6 with a little status for flavor.

As for lots of people buying Audis or BMWs because they are automotive sophisticates, no, absolutely not. All those people are on these forums so there's an illusion of there being many of them. Most people, woman in particular where cars like clothes. They drive a nice car for the same reason they shop for nice clothes. They do it the second they can afford it.

Trackruner228

iTrader: (1)

I consider Lexus to be a symbol or at least more than Acura is anyway.

FiveLiterCheater

I don't see acura,lexus, or infiniti as status symbols... If I wanted a sports car, i'd get a bimmer...if i wanted a luxury car i'd get a benz

wackura

Well they are whether you think so or not. That's why Acura exists in the first place, to tell people "this car is inheretly better than those cars."

vas25tl

If I wanted to "show off", I wouldn't be buying an Acura...I personally don't believe it's a status symbol of any sort. They are just good cars.

Mansa24

Some brands have more status than others. For me MB has the highest (ultra-luxury excluded), followed by Lexus and BMW. Acura, Audi, and Infiniti are about the same, give or take.

Further more, some models have more status. Entry-level luxury like the 3, C, A4, etc don’t have any status in my opinion. It’s funny when people think their the sh!t because they own a 3 or a C. IMO, status starts at the luxury level, E350, 535, RL, etc.

Status, among other things, is why I don’t see the Hyundai Genesis selling well no matter how much hype the auto media gives it. People who can afford an E350, 535, or even a 09 TL SH-AWD will probably buy those before the Hyundai. Why, because it’s a Hyundai and doesn’t have any status in the luxury market. I have nothing against Hyundai, I just don’t see them breaking into the luxury market.

Will Y.

Well, there are also differences in suspension tuning, engines and aesthetics (as between the 3G TLs and pre-2008 Accords) that make a difference to an enthusiast. Same for the G37 v. 350Z now.
The reason I got a 3G TL in '05 was because it was a quick, good-handling, quiet, semi-lux sedan with an automatic trans- it was a great compromise car, unlike its contemporary Accords, Camrys, Lexus ES330, Sti, Mustang, Audis, BMWs, etc.

vas25tl

I don't think that Audi should be in the same level as Acura and Infinity. You cannot compare a A5 to a TL and you most def cannot compare a RL to a A8...Audi is on the level of Mercedes and BMW. And comparing Acura to Infinity, Infinity passed them a long time ago in styling and performance.

I'm not against Acura here, but I don't think they should be compared to makers such as Audi-completely different level

zeroday

I think I'd prefer to put up with the status symbol issue and drive a better car.

:flamesuit:

zeroday

not buying a car because someone might percieve you one way or another is just as stupid as buying one so that they do.

fsttyms1

I drive my lowered TL like that too. Good set of snow tires and it goes and handles like its drypavement. (i live in WI too)

vas25tl

I agree, with a good set of snow tires you can drive any car...but you still can't compare a front wheel drive car to an all wheel drive car. You don't need snow tires for an Audi, you can run all seasons and not have to mess around with switching tires 2ce a year.

You also can't tell me that a TL drives like a BI-Turbo A6...(if you compare 2nd gen to 00-04 2.7T's

vas25tl

What's up neighbor? Haven't been in Appleton in a while, Snappers still open up there?

mrmako

I'd much rather sink my money into a house as a status symbol, than a car. I mean, I could by an E class, and it definitely shouts "I've arrived". But if you live in a broke-ass 2 bedroom apartment, what's the point?

I agree that the Merc carries a certain status. BMW/Audi/Lexus are the tier just below. Everyone else is just that.

Costco

ps. I am not a redneck

sipark

Now that I have a house of my own, I just can't stop imagining what my garage would like with a Porsche in it.

Black Tire

I know some wealthy people through cousins I have in UK. If you think having a bimmer is showing that you have money is dead wrong. People with alot of money, I mean alot of money don't even consider BMW's. We're talking Rolls, Lambo's and Ferrari's. People with BMW, are just pretending. Best description of the Bimmer is "I almost made it". As with Acura, you can't pretend you have the money.

vas25tl

Are we talking about rich people or about wealthy people? There is a big difference.

JediMindTricks

yea, it's all relative.

a BMW or MB will be considered a lot of money to some, while an acura and infiniti will be to others.

zeroday

Oh get your head out of your ass. I'm a BMW owner and I didn't purchase the vehicle to pretend to be something I am not. I'm not rich nor do I pretend to be. I purchased it because it is exactly what I wanted features/quality/performance wise and it was within my budget (I don't have kids).

Warren buffet drives a Cadillac and I would guess he has a little more money than those people you mentioned. I know people with money coming out of their ears that drive Toyotas. My dad is very well off and he drives a Volvo s80.

If you really look at the car someone is driving to determine how well off they are, you are bound to make a LOT of mistakes. All rich people aren't attention whores driving Bentleys and Fereraris. That's just MTV fucking with your head.

taitando

It's funny how everyone equates wealth with a certain image or type of car, purse, watch, clothes, or whatever luxury item.

As someone else mentioned, Warren Buffet, the richest person in the world drives a 2006 Cadillac DTS And before that, it was a 2001 Lincoln Towncar. Totally old school, especially from a man who can afford a fleet of jets, versus a domestic luxury car.

The perception we see from the media about the lives of the affluent aren't always the case. People in America these days are too concerned about image and perception, which is part of the reason everyone's either in debt or strapped for cash. A lot of greed and trying to keep up with the Jone's has lead us to our current credit crisis and housing implosion.

Public sentiment back in 2003 - 2007:
"Houses are hot and prices are through the roof! Gotta have that nice big house. Now I'll use the equity from my house to get that nice luxury car. It's no problem though, because my house keeps appreciating and there's no way prices will come down. Even though I make a median income of $50k, my broker tells me I'll have no problems getting that $400k - $500k home."

Public sentiment Now:
"Oh shit. My ARM reset 5 months ago and now I have a notice of default. They repo'd my 7-series yesterday while I was trying to refinance my mortgage. Found out I can't re-fi despite what my realtor originally told me because my house is now worth 30% to 40% less than what I paid. What's that? A foreclosure or short sell stays on my credit report for 7 years!?! Guess that's better than a bankruptcy."

I guess what I'm trying to say is, don't judge a person by the car they drive, or how "status" is reflected, because often it doesn't reflect their true net worth. That dude in the beat up '92 Accord may be the "Millionaire Next Door".

*Which is a great book BTW*

vas25tl

endo022

iTrader: (1)

+1

wackura

It mostly had to do with reckless lending to people who had traditionaly been at risk of defaulting. I don't think you can attach it to vanity to any special degree. I think the key themes were greed and exploitation.

wackura

Are you saying it's a smart idea to drive around a Civic with a three tier spoiler with "Powered By Honda" on the windshield? Is it so wrong to no want people to think you're an asshat?

Costco

Buying a certain car doesn't qualify someone as an asshat, however, completely tasteless mods do. Apples and oranges....

zeroday

^^ what costco said.

wackura

The principle is exactly the same, the difference here is only degree. Not apples and oranges, not by any stretch. A Bentley says Im high class every bit as much as a rice racer says I'm Paul Walker.

Costco

A Bentley could also mean, you're a trust fund baby who only lives off of their parents' money. Or if its a chick driving it, she could be a really popular prostitute.... even those sound silly but anything could happen. Very few cars are rice from the factory.... its mostly the owners who do it. BMWs for instance are far from rice. But a set of altezzas, a fart can, a gutter guard grill with a bunch of gay decals equals German rice.... schnitzel. Going with certain stereotype for certain cars is ridiculous. A Bentley could also easily mean you're a filthy rich douchebag.

I disagree with you mainly because I'm the farthest thing from a stereotypical Camaro owner. If anything it was one reason why I didn't want to get one, to be associated with certain people. I'm not a redneck (I'm not even white), I'm not an asshole, I don't instigate stoplight races, I don't think every Honda is rice, I don't think Mustangs are shitty, except for V6 Mustangs, but even the V6 Mustang owners think their cars are

A "typical" 4th gen Camaro owner would think your TSX is rice. Doesn't matter if its stock or highly modded, no matter how nice it is on the inside, its rice. I don't agree with that kind of thinking at all, do you?