I love my old beat up Yukon with its pushrods
09-08-2011, 01:38 PM
#81
I can't honestly answer that...i had one on hold for my rental when I back east for 2 weeks...but I upgraded when I saw they had the new durango...which I LOVED.
It also had the new 3.6...decently potent engine with really decent gas mileage.
If the suspension is anything like they've done with rest of their cars..its a winner in my book...especially because of the cost by comparison.
The only thing you lose out on is the resale values if thats important to you.
It also had the new 3.6...decently potent engine with really decent gas mileage.
If the suspension is anything like they've done with rest of their cars..its a winner in my book...especially because of the cost by comparison.
The only thing you lose out on is the resale values if thats important to you.
An acquaintance rented on recently, and I forgot to ask how he liked it.
09-08-2011, 01:49 PM
#82
Funny, isn't it? Now he's searching around the internet, looking for information that only supports his biases, to "prove" to us about the inferiority of all the Dodges and Fords. And what really makes it interesting, is that he doesn't even actually own the vehicle he's attempting to say triumphs all. He's never owned one. Or the vehicles he likes to belittle. I wonder who actually owns the Yukon. Mom? Dad?
Hey, my mother owns a Honda Accord Hybrid and a Nissan 350Z roadster. If anyone likes I can give detailed factual information in regards to their performance and how they are the best in their respective classes.
And for God's sake, stop being so dramatic! Please!
Again, with the drama. This is so unnecessary. First of all, it doesn't matter if I, my great great grandfather, or a fucking bum off the street holds the title to said truck. I've driven it since 2003, had lots of experience with it, and I am saying It's got a less complicated-yet-faster/freer-revving motor than a comparable Ford. That's not belittling. That's an attempt at a healthy debate. Hell it's not even a debate, as I've clearly (about a million times) addressed the truck's several shortcomings. Say what you will about my "research", whatever, but hey, I'll take Car and Driver's word over yours. Sure I'm partial to GM, but it doesn't change that every F-150/Expedition I've ever driven felt pretty underpowered by comparison. You people are acting like I need to be burned at the stake for stating this.
09-08-2011, 01:56 PM
#83
On the contrary, I think they look pretty decent. However, I actually really like the new Odyssey, and would probably choose it were I in the market for a minivan....it's apparently very nice to drive, dynamically. InsideLine said that out of ALL their long term test cars, said Honda has the best throttle tip-in. That raised my eyebrows. I personally like the lightning bolt door design thingy also.
09-08-2011, 02:02 PM
#84
Again, there are others who will say they like their Expedition w/ the Triton just fine, and wouldn't dare pay 45k for a work truck interior on a Yukon, and that's fine! More power to them.
I am NOT one of those people, however.
Now was all this bullshit really necessary?
09-08-2011, 02:11 PM
#85
Lol, wow buddy. This isn't the first time you've CLEARLY mistaken the meaning of my words. You were offended once when I stated my opinion that a Ford SHO had a great engine--but the rest was garbage. A similar situation ensued. Read post 16, where all this bullshit started. I admit I had a slight sarcastic tone, but this has now turned into an unpleasant thread to where we are name calling (which I certainly did not initiate nor perpetuate).
And for God's sake, stop being so dramatic! Please!
I was simply doing what was asked of me. I don't know how to illustrate any my point any clearer. And I don't understand this hostility--I'll spend an equal amount of time criticizing GM's shortcomings. I realize because I'm not a business owner, and haven't personally written checks for every year, make, and model pickup, that (according to every "expert" on AZ) I can't have a halfway valid opinion. So I go to the experts. But you know even more than them, so I lose again. The facts I presented do not suggest that other vehicles are inferior, and it's actually surprising that even a guy as apparently smart and respected as you are can't see the big picture and instead chooses to turn this into a 3rd grade playground fight. Said facts, from experts, back up my claims that GM trucks have good motors. Again, I'm sorry if that angers or offends you, but facts don't lie.
Again, with the drama. This is so unnecessary. First of all, it doesn't matter if I, my great great grandfather, or a fucking bum off the street holds the title to said truck. I've driven it since 2003, had lots of experience with it, and I am saying It's got a less complicated-yet-faster/freer-revving motor than a comparable Ford. That's not belittling. That's an attempt at a healthy debate. Hell it's not even a debate, as I've clearly (about a million times) addressed the truck's several shortcomings. Say what you will about my "research", whatever, but hey, I'll take Car and Driver's word over yours. Sure I'm partial to GM, but it doesn't change that every F-150/Expedition I've ever driven felt pretty underpowered by comparison. You people are acting like I need to be burned at the stake for stating this.
And for God's sake, stop being so dramatic! Please!
I was simply doing what was asked of me. I don't know how to illustrate any my point any clearer. And I don't understand this hostility--I'll spend an equal amount of time criticizing GM's shortcomings. I realize because I'm not a business owner, and haven't personally written checks for every year, make, and model pickup, that (according to every "expert" on AZ) I can't have a halfway valid opinion. So I go to the experts. But you know even more than them, so I lose again. The facts I presented do not suggest that other vehicles are inferior, and it's actually surprising that even a guy as apparently smart and respected as you are can't see the big picture and instead chooses to turn this into a 3rd grade playground fight. Said facts, from experts, back up my claims that GM trucks have good motors. Again, I'm sorry if that angers or offends you, but facts don't lie.
Again, with the drama. This is so unnecessary. First of all, it doesn't matter if I, my great great grandfather, or a fucking bum off the street holds the title to said truck. I've driven it since 2003, had lots of experience with it, and I am saying It's got a less complicated-yet-faster/freer-revving motor than a comparable Ford. That's not belittling. That's an attempt at a healthy debate. Hell it's not even a debate, as I've clearly (about a million times) addressed the truck's several shortcomings. Say what you will about my "research", whatever, but hey, I'll take Car and Driver's word over yours. Sure I'm partial to GM, but it doesn't change that every F-150/Expedition I've ever driven felt pretty underpowered by comparison. You people are acting like I need to be burned at the stake for stating this.
We need to stop being so dramatic?
The only one being dramatic here is you. Others have chosen to post their opinions, and they are entirely welcome to do so as they feel fit. If you choose to deflect attention away from yourself by considering our rebuttals as "dramatic" or "defensive", and then voice your displeasure at the, as you call them, "experts on AZ", then that's entirely up to you. Examine and reflect upon your own attitude before criticizing those of others.
BTW:
I don't recall ever having a conversation with you about an SHO. Could you please post a link?
09-08-2011, 02:56 PM
#86
Whatever. This is so beating a dead horse, but I'm not the one name calling and saying and inferring extremely disrespectful things. I would have never started this thread if it was gonna turn into a war like this. I just wanted friendly debate. If someone says that I'm wrong, I'd just like to be shown why, and I still haven't yet.
https://acurazine.com/forums/car-talk-5/did-original-yamaha-v6-sho-motor-have-variable-valve-timing-790357/
https://acurazine.com/forums/car-talk-5/did-original-yamaha-v6-sho-motor-have-variable-valve-timing-790357/
09-08-2011, 03:39 PM
#87
Coal
Join Date: Dec 2009
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Thank you. FOR CHRIST'S SAKE, this is ALL I was trying to say! It's not perfect. But, I'm very pleased with the performance of it. Therefore, I can overlook the shortcomings.
Again, there are others who will say they like their Expedition w/ the Triton just fine, and wouldn't dare pay 45k for a work truck interior on a Yukon, and that's fine! More power to them.
I am NOT one of those people, however.
Now was all this bullshit really necessary?
Again, there are others who will say they like their Expedition w/ the Triton just fine, and wouldn't dare pay 45k for a work truck interior on a Yukon, and that's fine! More power to them.
I am NOT one of those people, however.
Now was all this bullshit really necessary?
but i'm glad you finally figured it out.
09-08-2011, 03:55 PM
#88
Whatever. This is so beating a dead horse, but I'm not the one name calling and saying and inferring extremely disrespectful things. I would have never started this thread if it was gonna turn into a war like this. I just wanted friendly debate. If someone says that I'm wrong, I'd just like to be shown why, and I still haven't yet.
http://<b>https://acurazine.com/foru...p?t=790357</b>
http://<b>https://acurazine.com/foru...p?t=790357</b>
That's it?! You have got to be kidding me! You are comparing the thread above to this thread? That it's similar in nature? It seems to me I AGREED with you in the above thread. A made a total of two posts directed towards you.
You've been shown why you were refuted many times. You are welcome to your opinion, and so are others. No one else seems to have a problem with giving their opinion, and in fact present them as just that, an opinion. Your above example clearly displays you don't like it if anyone disagrees with you or presents his/her thoughts in a manner you consider inappropriate.
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mrmako (09-08-2011)
09-08-2011, 04:11 PM
#89
The Third Ball
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Los Angeles, Ca
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09-08-2011, 04:18 PM
#90
Someday, an RS6 Avant+
I like what VW did with the Routan. But it's a Chrysler in disguise. Just some body work and interior bits. Rented one a few years ago (LA to Vegas) and the engine was fine. The transmission on the other hand...
09-08-2011, 04:31 PM
#91
The Third Ball
Join Date: Sep 2002
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Now its a 3.6L with more power and tq and a 6spd tranny.
09-09-2011, 07:52 AM
#92
Someday, an RS6 Avant+
There were some different interior bits (A/C vents, small trim) but the radio and A/C controls were straight up Chrysler parts bin. I wouldn't pay a premium for it, but I thought it was a better exterior look, IMO
09-09-2011, 07:57 PM
#95
the e-drama on AZ is sometimes very enjoyable read on a lonely night
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tmnhs81 (09-09-2011)
09-11-2011, 05:12 AM
#97
Someday, an RS6 Avant+
09-18-2011, 02:57 AM
#99
09-18-2011, 03:27 AM
#100
The Third Ball
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Ladies and gentleman....the tool who just can't let go....
09-18-2011, 06:34 AM
#101
AZ Community Team
instead of 
09-18-2011, 07:19 AM
#102
AZ Community Team
Whatever. This is so beating a dead horse, but I'm not the one name calling and saying and inferring extremely disrespectful things. I would have never started this thread if it was gonna turn into a war like this. I just wanted friendly debate. If someone says that I'm wrong, I'd just like to be shown why, and I still haven't yet.
https://acurazine.com/forums/showthread.php?t=790357
https://acurazine.com/forums/showthread.php?t=790357
09-18-2011, 10:19 AM
#103
Chapter Leader (Southern Region)
09-18-2011, 10:26 AM
#104
My first Avatar....
I love my old beat up thread with its push rods.
Miss Phee, where you been?
09-18-2011, 10:35 PM
#108
Oh please! Isn't it pretty obvious that I'm not serious here? I'm sorry that I inadvertently insulted someone who has "pull" in this online forum, but that wasn't my intention. I wasn't trying to hatefully argue with anyone.
When someone explains to me how/why I'm wrong here, I'll gladly shut up. 3 pages of name calling, when all I wanted was some healthy debate.
I'm still waiting for a legitimate answer. Prove me wrong, and I'll gladly leave it alone. Just because someone has had better experience with work trucks, well, that doesn't answer my question.
When someone explains to me how/why I'm wrong here, I'll gladly shut up. 3 pages of name calling, when all I wanted was some healthy debate.
I'm still waiting for a legitimate answer. Prove me wrong, and I'll gladly leave it alone. Just because someone has had better experience with work trucks, well, that doesn't answer my question.
09-18-2011, 11:10 PM
#110
Team Owner
I pretty much skimmed over most of this thread but as always I have to put in my .02 especially on that last post.
Power does make up for a lot of shortcomings. If it didn't I wouldn't drive a 1984 Buick that handles like a truck (well not that bad really) and an interior that is all about the '80s. It's definitely not going to pick up chicks for me.
If I had to give up one of my cars it would be the TL, no competition. If the GN and TL had the same hp I would get rid of the GN without a second thought. When you get into the higher powered cars you overlook a lot of stuff. Who would put up with the Vette's harsh ride and difficult entry and exit and cramped interior that's mostly plastic if it didn't out handle and out run 99% of the cars on the road.
All of the memories in a car like this with "character", the 800hp single turbo Supra that drove down from LA to race for a few grand, the first Viper I beat, all of the hustling and memories make it worth it even if it had the worst interior on the planet.
I believe that interiors and all of the other little things people base a car's worth on matters less and less as the hp levels go up. The CTS-V is very appealing to me because it has a good mix of both but you're not going to get great styling and a ton of power below $100k.
One of my best friends has a couple of CL65 Mercedes. One is a Brabus and one is an AMG. Both make in the neighborhood of 700hp and 900lbs of torque. This is truly the best of all worlds but the $220,000 price tag keeps it out of most of our hands.
Here's a pic to maybe lighten the mood. This was after she ran it into a parking stopper multiple times.
Power does make up for a lot of shortcomings. If it didn't I wouldn't drive a 1984 Buick that handles like a truck (well not that bad really) and an interior that is all about the '80s. It's definitely not going to pick up chicks for me.
If I had to give up one of my cars it would be the TL, no competition. If the GN and TL had the same hp I would get rid of the GN without a second thought. When you get into the higher powered cars you overlook a lot of stuff. Who would put up with the Vette's harsh ride and difficult entry and exit and cramped interior that's mostly plastic if it didn't out handle and out run 99% of the cars on the road.
All of the memories in a car like this with "character", the 800hp single turbo Supra that drove down from LA to race for a few grand, the first Viper I beat, all of the hustling and memories make it worth it even if it had the worst interior on the planet.
I believe that interiors and all of the other little things people base a car's worth on matters less and less as the hp levels go up. The CTS-V is very appealing to me because it has a good mix of both but you're not going to get great styling and a ton of power below $100k.
One of my best friends has a couple of CL65 Mercedes. One is a Brabus and one is an AMG. Both make in the neighborhood of 700hp and 900lbs of torque. This is truly the best of all worlds but the $220,000 price tag keeps it out of most of our hands.
Here's a pic to maybe lighten the mood. This was after she ran it into a parking stopper multiple times.
09-21-2011, 06:49 AM
#111
Someday, an RS6 Avant+
Your question answered
Oh please! Isn't it pretty obvious that I'm not serious here? I'm sorry that I inadvertently insulted someone who has "pull" in this online forum, but that wasn't my intention. I wasn't trying to hatefully argue with anyone.
When someone explains to me how/why I'm wrong here, I'll gladly shut up. 3 pages of name calling, when all I wanted was some healthy debate.
I'm still waiting for a legitimate answer. Prove me wrong, and I'll gladly leave it alone. Just because someone has had better experience with work trucks, well, that doesn't answer my question.
When someone explains to me how/why I'm wrong here, I'll gladly shut up. 3 pages of name calling, when all I wanted was some healthy debate.
I'm still waiting for a legitimate answer. Prove me wrong, and I'll gladly leave it alone. Just because someone has had better experience with work trucks, well, that doesn't answer my question.
Ok, this will be long but read below. This will answer your question, which is in bold above.
-----------------------------------------------------
Coast around for a sec at 30 and floor it. You may not think it's special, but it will at least make you say, "Damn, not bad for a 6000lb vehicle." This truck has towed a boat for years and years, been ragged out like CRAZY its whole life, beaten up off road paths, and still the powertrain is ROCK-SOLID. I don't give a shit if the interior is chintzy (it still works and the leather looks good), I just love the way it drives in general, and how it will snap your neck back when power is summoned. To me, those are attributes of a good and well-designed truck. I've driven many comparable Fords; sure the interiors are nicer, and the Triton does have some oomph and gets the truck up to speed okay, but it has ABSOLUTELY NOTHING (doesn't rev fast, no high rpm HP rush, nothing..for an OHC motor???) on a GM truck engine. That's what matters to me in a truck.
Wow. Sorry you had a bad experience with a brand new one. The ones I've seen seemed to have pretty good fit and finish; better than mine. But then again, (even though it's a $60k vehicle), I'm not expecting LS460 quality in there. The money went to it being a truck, first and foremost. Tow a 2 ton boat for 6 years and the tranny still shifting like new is what I'm concerned about, and they deliver that with flying colors.
Not gonna debate who is superior now, but back then in 2003 these were near--if not at--the top.
Not gonna debate who is superior now, but back then in 2003 these were near--if not at--the top.
What matters to me in a truck is durability and long term performance. You speak as if no other truck has done as much as your Yukon. Throughout the years, my trucks have been used to haul and pull extensively. Three thousand pounds of feed in the box and eight thousand pounds behind them. Started in -40 weather and used immediately. Some have gone over 300 000 on the clock and haven't had a valve cover removed. My business uses trucks as commercial vehicles and they are expected to be workhorses. And by far the best have been the Fords.
I recently purchased another, a 2011 F150 5.0 that is a marvel of smoothness and performance. A 4V DOHC, all aluminum design, the coyote is an example of evolving technology. The GM products I drove for comparison seemed lethargic and crude by comparison. The Dodge Ram, equipped with a 5.7 "Hemi" (quotation because the new hemi shares little with wonderful elephants of yesteryear and is more of a marketing approach) felt much livelier and more refined than any of the GM offerings as well.
I recently purchased another, a 2011 F150 5.0 that is a marvel of smoothness and performance. A 4V DOHC, all aluminum design, the coyote is an example of evolving technology. The GM products I drove for comparison seemed lethargic and crude by comparison. The Dodge Ram, equipped with a 5.7 "Hemi" (quotation because the new hemi shares little with wonderful elephants of yesteryear and is more of a marketing approach) felt much livelier and more refined than any of the GM offerings as well.
Not really; I'm just saying that it's been through quite a bit. I never said noone on AZ can own a truck/SUV that they've abused/worked the shit out of, nor did I say that my Yukon is the end-all, be-all example of a beater. But it's had a helluva lot more of that than 95% of the million others I see on a daily basis, and it has held up quite well. It was worth the cost.
Keep in mind that I'm talking about a 2003 MY vehicle. You name me a Ford truck that had a powertrain that could hold a candle to it's GM counterpart of that year. And keep in mind I"m talking about the standard 5.3L. I'm not even comparing the 6.0 in the Escalade to the (same 5.4 as in F-150) Navigator, which is laughable.
Ford is so ahead of the game, right? Is that why their brand new PowerStroke doesn't even come close to hanging with the Duramax? I mean, now that they've FINALLY gotten a diesel right.
All I meant was that based on my experience with my truck, I wouldn't be thinking, "Oh Gee I should've gotten the Ford DOHC" every time I stepped on the gas if I bought a new one with the 6.2. GM has more than satisfied me with their powertrains. Not to mention they look a 10000000% better in my eyes.
Keep in mind that I'm talking about a 2003 MY vehicle. You name me a Ford truck that had a powertrain that could hold a candle to it's GM counterpart of that year. And keep in mind I"m talking about the standard 5.3L. I'm not even comparing the 6.0 in the Escalade to the (same 5.4 as in F-150) Navigator, which is laughable.
Ford is so ahead of the game, right? Is that why their brand new PowerStroke doesn't even come close to hanging with the Duramax? I mean, now that they've FINALLY gotten a diesel right.
All I meant was that based on my experience with my truck, I wouldn't be thinking, "Oh Gee I should've gotten the Ford DOHC" every time I stepped on the gas if I bought a new one with the 6.2. GM has more than satisfied me with their powertrains. Not to mention they look a 10000000% better in my eyes.
In the bold above, you then attack Teranfon's opinion as if he was telling you what to buy. All he did was voice his experience. This is not debate. If it were, you would argue the merits you see and not denigrate his opinion.
Wow........
It certainly seems to have upset you that I have a varying opinion. And that's what it is, a varying opinion. I have mine, and you are certainly entitled to yours. You claim that particular vehicles are "laughable" and that again is your privilege. I confidently list plenty of what I feel to be better powertrain choices other than the one you obviously adore, but it seems as if you would only belittle it as you have everything else. Obviously, you consider your opinion beyond scrutiny. Most others, fortunately, aren't so blinded by brand loyalty that they can see that all manufacturers offer good products.
All hail the 2003 GMC Yukon. Unequivocally, the best truck ever produced.
It certainly seems to have upset you that I have a varying opinion. And that's what it is, a varying opinion. I have mine, and you are certainly entitled to yours. You claim that particular vehicles are "laughable" and that again is your privilege. I confidently list plenty of what I feel to be better powertrain choices other than the one you obviously adore, but it seems as if you would only belittle it as you have everything else. Obviously, you consider your opinion beyond scrutiny. Most others, fortunately, aren't so blinded by brand loyalty that they can see that all manufacturers offer good products.
All hail the 2003 GMC Yukon. Unequivocally, the best truck ever produced.
Haha. I love how people try to mask their drama queen-ness by attempting to lay it on someone else. Of course you're entitled to your opinion, but it's kind of a fact that (at least in 2003) GM, truck powertrain-wise, beat Ford easily. There's a reason they sold 39490239203290 Escalades, and about 19 Navigators. Comparing the 6.0L to the boat anchor in said Navigator is pretty laughable, my friend. You don't need to turn my affirmation of the truth into something as dramatic as me attempting to belittle you or Ford.
Until now, you couldn't take Ford seriously, truck powertrain-wise. That is also a fact. I'm sorry facts insult you.
I'm glad you're happy with your new Ford truck; all I was saying (again) is that based on satisfaction with my truck, I'd probably buy GMC again and NOT cry because I'm missing out on a Ford "revolutionary" Coyote. Vortec would suit me just fine.
Until now, you couldn't take Ford seriously, truck powertrain-wise. That is also a fact. I'm sorry facts insult you.
I'm glad you're happy with your new Ford truck; all I was saying (again) is that based on satisfaction with my truck, I'd probably buy GMC again and NOT cry because I'm missing out on a Ford "revolutionary" Coyote. Vortec would suit me just fine.
That sir is not a debate. You expressed a strong opinion, backed up with opinion. Once some posters here tried to give a counter point, you went on the defensive and misunderstood this to be an attack. From here, you were open season. And the folks on here jumped on.
If this does not answer your question posed above, then I don't know what to say.
09-21-2011, 08:47 AM
#112
Chapter Leader (Southern Region)
So in conclusion, OP is a troll from 3G. I didn't see that coming..
Also, Terry's 50 Coyote F150 would smoke OP's 2k3 Yukon.. it would smoke OP's TL as well.
Also, Terry's 50 Coyote F150 would smoke OP's 2k3 Yukon.. it would smoke OP's TL as well.
Last edited by Majofo; 09-21-2011 at 08:52 AM. Reason: Margarine
09-21-2011, 03:11 PM
#113
09-21-2011, 03:14 PM
#114
Chapter Leader (Southern Region)
Terry will beat you to 100 on the speedo guaranteed. 
09-21-2011, 03:15 PM
#115
Ok, this will be long but read below. This will answer your question, which is in bold above.
-----------------------------------------------------
In the bold text, you call out what you think are the best aspects of a truck. Got it.
Here, you state that the GM truck you drove was near the top, but you also discount that a truck that costs $60K plus should have "Lexus like" quality? It better have for $60K, and I don't care about the brand. That price should deserve a certain quality level. And this was an opinion that you attacked the contributor for.
Teranfon is a well respected member here, and he is giving his take on what is important to him with trucks, and what he does with them is far in excess of towing a boat for 70K miles and "ragging it out". But this is his opinion.
In the bold above, you then attack Teranfon's opinion as if he was telling you what to buy. All he did was voice his experience. This is not debate. If it were, you would argue the merits you see and not denigrate his opinion.
No need to bold this, as Teranfon was spot on with his assessment of your statements. And he is being a bit tongue and cheek with the "All hail" comment.
And your above statement I ended because you stated a "kind of fact". What the hell is that? And then you continued your attack, and put out a "fact" that "you couldn't take Ford seriously".
That sir is not a debate. You expressed a strong opinion, backed up with opinion. Once some posters here tried to give a counter point, you went on the defensive and misunderstood this to be an attack. From here, you were open season. And the folks on here jumped on.
If this does not answer your question posed above, then I don't know what to say.
-----------------------------------------------------
In the bold text, you call out what you think are the best aspects of a truck. Got it.
Here, you state that the GM truck you drove was near the top, but you also discount that a truck that costs $60K plus should have "Lexus like" quality? It better have for $60K, and I don't care about the brand. That price should deserve a certain quality level. And this was an opinion that you attacked the contributor for.
Teranfon is a well respected member here, and he is giving his take on what is important to him with trucks, and what he does with them is far in excess of towing a boat for 70K miles and "ragging it out". But this is his opinion.
In the bold above, you then attack Teranfon's opinion as if he was telling you what to buy. All he did was voice his experience. This is not debate. If it were, you would argue the merits you see and not denigrate his opinion.
No need to bold this, as Teranfon was spot on with his assessment of your statements. And he is being a bit tongue and cheek with the "All hail" comment.
And your above statement I ended because you stated a "kind of fact". What the hell is that? And then you continued your attack, and put out a "fact" that "you couldn't take Ford seriously".
That sir is not a debate. You expressed a strong opinion, backed up with opinion. Once some posters here tried to give a counter point, you went on the defensive and misunderstood this to be an attack. From here, you were open season. And the folks on here jumped on.
If this does not answer your question posed above, then I don't know what to say.
09-21-2011, 03:19 PM
#117
Chapter Leader (Southern Region)
09-21-2011, 03:32 PM
#119
Chapter Leader (Southern Region)
Calling Paypal.
