Ken1997TL

Maybe it's just me but the Accord platform is a great starting point for many cars, I don't think it's much of a 'slam'

Oh well.

I hate cars

I don't know why everyone gets so butthurt. The tl and accord share something like 90% of the parts. I'll try and find the actual figure. The tl no doubt drives feels and looks like a different car but facts are facts it is a glorified accord and it's worth every additional penny.

teranfon

I find most people, car enthusiasts or not, are aware that Acura is manufactured by Honda. Honda, in the eighties, was actually the first of the Japanese manufacturers to develop and promote an upscale brand with it's automotive roots closely associated with the more mundane offerings of the parent company. This has actually been going on with some manufacturers for decades. Mainly the domestics. I'm currently restoring a car at the moment that shares it's underpinnings with a more "affordable" offering from the parent company. Even then, this particular car had more luxurious offerings to separate it from it's sibling. It also had a whopping one inch increase in wheelbase as well to justify it's higher standing. How? The axle was moved back one inch on the leaf springs. Other manufacturers share floorplans between entire brands.

In the case of the Honda Accord and Acura TL, there are some differences that allow the Acura to command a higher price. More luxury features, chassis tuning, exterior and interior styling, and image branding all work to differentiate the two. In late 2004, I asked myself the same questions when deciding between the TSX, TL, and Accord 6MT. In the end I chose the 6MT although it was only a couple thousand less than the TL as I found the driving dynamics and tuning more favourable. I realized the TL was more luxurious, but felt I wouldn't use all it's features. Even some models within brands have a pronounced difference. One could even argue that a 2011 F150 XL is not the same vehicle as a 2011 F150 King Ranch. Although sharing much of the same architecture and driveline, both target a specific demographic and have numerous features to differentiate the two. The Accord and Acura may share the same floorplan, but overall are designed and marketed separate of each other.

In the end, buy what you like and enjoy it. As Ken mentioned it's a stellar platform, and the way it can be used by two brands for different purposes is a testament to it's strength and durability.








Terry

madcaps

iTrader: (1)

Who cares! This is Bimmerzine!!

I hate cars

We're talking a little more than just sharing a floor pan. Same trans. Same engine family. Same suspension, only tuned differently. Same rack. Same fuel system. Same wiring. Same brakes minus the rear rotors and of course Brembo equipped TLs. Same AC, heater, power steering. Same radiator. Every major system is the same.

It's kind of like the difference between a base TL and a TL-S. It's the same car with some tweaks. Take away the cosmetic differences and you're left with different suspension tuning and NVH enhancements. Nothing wrong with that, the Accord platform is a great start. They took a reliable Honda product, made it look better, handle better, a little faster (in some years), and more luxurious. But that doesn't change the fact that it shares most of it's parts with the Accord.

One neat thing I learned in this search is the TL's aluminum front subframe is 58lbs lighter than the Accord's steel subframe.

Osamu

I wish more people knew scion is a Toyota Ive run into a lot of people that think its some Korean or chinese car company.

Legend2TL

I agree, the 3G TL feels quite different and looks dramatically different from it's 7G Accord roots. I've driven both back to back at a GM driving event, both 5AT and the distinction is alot in terms of performance. Far greater than the 2G TL and 6G Accord.

Legend2TL

I agree it's a glorified Accord but I've never any any issues with that.

In terms of % of commonality, my guess is somewhere in the ~40-50% commonality of total component count between the Accord and TL. Alot of the stuff you see is different. Glass, all exterior sheet metal, all exterior plastic including lighting, all interior plastic, carpeting, interior instrumentation, radio, switches, interior lighting.

Alot of that stuff adds up in component count but the design/development cost is nowhere near as high as the major system/components. The key thing in platform sharing is keeping the large NRE components and systems the same. The engine, transmission, floorplan, suspension...

I'm doing some parts bin engineering on a project at work, and I'm trying to keep the NRE and production costs as low as possible by not re-inventing the wheel.

Legend2TL

I love the aluminum front sub-frame, it just looks cool besides saving weight. I highly doubt the wiring is the same, there are significant differences in the Accord and TL electrically and the have different systems as well (VSA on the TL, HID on the TL, separate bulbs on the Accord for high/low beam,....).

The steering rack I've wondered about, the one downside to the 3G TL is it's poor turning radius. The 7G TL doesn't suffer from that but the TL also seems to have a faster ratio so I wonder if the rack has a different ratio as well as different limit stops on the TL.

I hate cars

I have no issues with that either. In fact I think it's a good thing. Look at the TL's reliability record vs most Mercedes or BMWs. They took a solid car and improved it in all areas.

I agree the 90% figure may be too high but all of the major systems are the same.

As for the turning radius, the stops might be different. I'm pretty sure the TL comes with wider tires, maybe that's why they had to limit the turning radius. If that's the case I would look in to swapping the Accord stops to my TL and see what happens. It would suck if you ran out of rack though.

Gabru678

iTrader: (1)

Yea car company's are more closely related than you would think.
Did you know that mighty Ferrari is owned by little Fiat?
or that VW owns: Audi Bently lamborghini and soon porche?

CLtotheTL32

iTrader: (3)

VW also owns Bugatti but that doesn't mean a Beetle and a Veyron are built on the same chassis or have the same engine. The TL and the Accord share the same engine and other vital components.

juniorbean

iTrader: (5)

Same here. Then again I try to make sure that the people I associate with on a day to day basis are not morons

JS + XES

iTrader: (1)

I've never talked to anyone who is not aware that Acura is manufactured by Honda. Even my mom knows that.

tinteduptls

i was about 8 years old when i realized that honda and acura are the same thing.

i think its funny when people ask me what who makes my car because i answer honda lol.

oonowindoo

Why are ppl so buttsore about it? when i had my CL-S, i had no problem telling ppl i drive a fancy accord. It is what it is. a fully loaded Accord V6 is not much cheaper than a base TL. So please do not feel you are somewhat "better" just because u paid $3000 more.

a fully loaded Maxima is the same as a well equiped G37

a fully loaded Camry costs almost the same as ES/IS250

Gen7/8 4 cylinder accord is pretty much the same as TSX. Of course, without all the added luxury/technology. For those of you don't know 2006+ Accord can use TSX factory/aftermarket exhaust to make it a dual with minor or no modification at all.

TL might look/feel different than accord as it should because it is more expensive but if you strip all the sheet medal and interior you will see the similiarities.

F23A4

The Maxima and Infiniti G do not share a platform nor a powertrain.

Aman

Camry vs. IS is stretching it as well.

juniorbean

iTrader: (5)

Kind of brings me back to page 1...

Mr Marco

It was Crown Vic = Marauder.

People who make statements like that usually drive an Accent, Versa, Rio or anything below $13,000 with a 0-60mph time of 10-12 seconds.

NSXNEXT

iTrader: (2)

FWIW,

1999-2003 Acura TL = Honda Inspire/Honda Saber

oonowindoo

I know G shares the same as 350Z and Maxima doesnt. I have had 2 G35 and 1 G37, i would think i know a little bit about those cars.



A lot of people who buy " Semi-luxury" brand think their car is Significantly more expensive than the "non-Luxury" Brand flagships, therefore, they somehow think they are superior than everyone else. ie Maxima vs G37, Camry vs ES/IS, Accord vs TL/TSX, when in fact that a loaded non-luxury brand flagship costs almost just as much and has just as many features as entry level semi luxury brand.

It is like what a lot of BMW owners think about TL/G37/IS350

i would still choose the Entry Level car tho, cuz i am a douchebag/brand whore.

oonowindoo

Correction:

People who make statements like that usually drive BMW and Mercedes Benz or anything that is slightly more expensive than yours, so they can justify the few thousand more they spent.

charliemike

It's because they're better designed and engineered cars. They're not the 10-15% premium that seems to be charged but they're definitely better.

TRIUMPHT

iTrader: (1)

Not to be taken personally & no hostility towards anybody

I am well aware of the fact i drive a glorified honda accord. Really don't care . But on the same note just because someone spent more for their car doesn't make it better as said between the difference of the fully loaded accord and TL not being to far apart in price range.

If some one has a bmw 3 series and it's not an M they could STFU if they have a 5 series and it's not a 550 or M5 they could STFU. If they drive a Benz and it's a C class well you get the point .

The C class benz the 3 series bmw Audi A4 regardless if they cost more or not are ENTRY LEVEL LUXURY/SPORT cars .

Mr Marco

Costco

This thread was just an abortion from the model-specific forums.

Better designed and engineered?

The rear shock tower mount on my friend's dad's E36 M3 separated from the frame. German engineering at work maybe he hit a pothole or two, but he drives like an old man and the car only has ~90,000 miles.

Nevermind the multiple sensors that tell you when the brake pads are worn or when a light bulb is out. They seem like some of the most ingenious innovations ever until when it comes time to pony up the cash to replace them.

TRIUMPHT

iTrader: (1)

I will go out spend more money on a car that is slower ,has less room and is not as reliable just to say i spent more money my v-6 requires turbo to still have a couple horses less than your's but it costs more. but wait FWD TL has 280 HP that's not more HP's than a 335 or a 535 . Your right but it has a whole lot of a hell more horses than a 528 or a 328 which still costs more .

cjTL

iTrader: (2)

I didn't understand this post at all. Will try to read again.

TRIUMPHT

iTrader: (1)

i could understand how it can be a bit confusing. It was more of a rant. i am a TL owner . was mimicking the so called bmw, benz owners .

i should have broke it down a little more

Jalex3.5RL

The only thing that bothers me is when people switch the emblems. Honda might make acuras but when you see the honda emblem it just doesnt look right. Bump that

TRIUMPHT

iTrader: (1)

I def second that i never understood why people did that. If i pay for a Acura by god my symbols will say acura. I am also not a fan of people putting symbols on their car if the car isn't what it is like people putting type s on the car when it's just a base model. I have even seen a guy with a civic with acura logo's on it.

TRIUMPHT

iTrader: (1)

now as far as my rant yesterday that some might of looked at like the hell is he talking about.

I was saying i really don't think that anybody has the right to talk crap about anybodies car especially if it's in the same segment regardless of how much more or less the other car costs.

A bmw 335/535 has a turbo V-6 that puts out 300HP acura has a engine with out turbo that put out 280&305 and infiniti has a V-6 that puts out 330 Hp without the use of turbo.

The 328/528 has about 240Hp.

The TL has more room , more power , is more reliable & costs less no matter if it's the base model or the fully loaded model.

If you like the car you like the car. I got a TL because i personally wanted a TL if you got a BMW then more power to you because that's what you wanted. But to constantly s*@# on somebody elses car is ridiculous.

I hate cars

I think you're getting a little off track here comparing power and turbo vs non turbo. The turbo BMW's powerband is very fat with tons of power and torque from 1,200rpm to redline. The Infinity and Acuras have to rev to the sky to make power. The BMW has a big block V8 feeling and the Acura and Infinity do nothing until you're past 4,500rpm to 5,500rpm, typical of a small NA engine. The BMW drives with an effortless feeling, passing rarely requires a downshift. The turbos are not always about absolute power, they fill in the first 2/3 of the powerband the Acura and Infinity are missing. Then you get into mods, there's no comparison, the BMW opens up such a large gap with $1,500 that nothing short of the turbo kit (supercharger won't cut it) will give the TL a chance.

This argument is retarded, talking about turbo vs non turbo. Both the Acura and G have lots more displacement than the BMW, it makes about the same power, more torque, and a MUCH better power band with a smaller engine.

The 335 weighs 3306lbs. The TL weighs 3600-3962lbs depending on the trim.

We could do this forever.
The 330 has more hp.
I bought my TL new in Dec of '05 because it was better than the non M BMWs in just about every category but number one was reliability. I love German cars but they seem to have rather large failures when they have failures. I knew going into it that I could easily have afforded a 5 series or E class and that Acura does not carry the prestige that BMW and Mercedes does but I bought the car for me, no one else.

Rick_TL-S

I think your argument is leaving out the fact that the BMW as whole cars vs. the TL are usually better than the TL.

Using the performance or statistics of roominess doesn't mean much if you forget that you're also paying more a better Navi, better quality materials, & a much more refined finish. And so forth. Of course, yes, you are also paying a bit for the name sake, but you do the same with Acura as well.

I love my TL, but against our fully loaded 3 Coupe, the BMW is a much more complete, & luxurious car for the money. A little bit more involving to drive as well & all around fun car to just drive. Just my .

TRIUMPHT

iTrader: (1)

To sum up what i was saying I (me myself ) think that bmw's are over priced i think the same of infiniti. Or maybe it's just the fact i've been spoiled with the fact that TL's are just cheaper.

Either way i am not a BMW hater i like BMW's and will prob own one 1 day. I live with the you only live once attitude. I am on my third TL and def do want to try something more luxurous and i will. But everybodies idea of luxury and fun is different. When i think of a car that's luxurious i think of MB S550's , Jaguars etc etc . when i think of fun i think BMW 6series M3, M5 G37 coupes etc etc . Just my opinion as said.

In my rants i have actually went in a total different direction than the OP started the thread for. Everybody is entitled to thier own opinion. And i have to remember this is a open forum. And def can't take anything personal.

TRIUMPHT

iTrader: (1)

so my question to that is then are they really worth the extra money?

Nothing lasts forever and i've actually mentioned i purchased a CPO TL that started to fall apart at 50K so no car is breakdown proof in my book. But my idea of a step up from the TL is a lot more than a 328/335 or a 528/535.

I hate cars

This is just my opinion but back when I bought the TL I felt it was the better car regardless of the price. I can honestly say that if both cars cost the same I would still own the TL. The FWD was a big turn off but that's a different discussion. Plus the TL was unique back then. You just didn't see a whole lot of 3gs on the road and when you did it got noticed. I got compliments daily on it back then. Now, no one notices it even though it looks better than it did new.

If I had to buy one or the other today, it would be the 335 or 535. I hate heavy cars and I love torque. If I were in the 60+ age range it would be the 4g TL. I don't mean that as a slam toward the TL but BMW has improved the interiors, it's RWD, better performance as a whole, and the overall package is just better/sportier. However, reliability would still be a worry.

As for being worth the extra money, I can get a 335 with sport suspension for the same price as a 4g TL. BMW will bargain with you, the local Acura dealership won't.

I have a friend that has owned various Porsches, Mercedes, and BMWs since high school. He's been on the Mercedes CL kick for about 6 years now. He currently owns a Brabus CL65 and I love that car and for once he's kept a car more than a year so he must like it too. I was given the choice to buy his AMG CL65 at the time I purchased my TL for the same price. I passed only because I saw what he went through with maintenance, mostly unscheduled breakdowns with those cars and at relatively low mileage. It would've been about $700 a month which I paid for the TL plus at least $500 a month put away for repairs which I didn't need for the TL.

F23A4

The "is it worth the extra money" question is terribly subjective. But, I think we've digressed too much in this thread.

oonowindoo

You gotta admit, the badge is worth at least 10%.

and as far as "better" that is subjective.

Better Value? Styling? MPG? Interior? RELIABILITY? Cost of Ownership? Status?

same thing as all name brands, is a LV purse really worth $2000? Yes i know the "Quality" is supposed to be better but is it $1500 better than a $500 Michael Kors?