MADCAT

Hope this isn't a repost.....



"Below describes the job of an automotive supplier to a "T" for supplying
automotive parts to one of the three domestic auto makers. We'll use a
baked potato in place of any component supplied to one of our car makers:"


How a Honda employee bakes a potato:

Preheat new, high-quality oven to 350 F.
Insert a 1.0 lb Idaho potato.
Go do something productive for 45 minutes
Check for doneness, then remove perfectly baked potato from oven and
serve


How a Ford employee bakes a potato:

Conduct market test with suppliers in Mexico, Brazil, and Turkistan to
supply 0.75 lb potatoes, choose lowest cost supplier with best Red Wings
tickets.

Change to incumbent supplier of Idaho potatoes, insist they meet
Turkistan pricing with 3% annual price reductions.

Upgrade to 1.0 lb potato, insist supplier erred by pricing for 0.75 lbs
as instructed even though supplier knows Ford spec is for 1.0 lb
potatoes.

Instruct potato supplier to preheat the oven to 350 F, demand that the
supplier show you how he turned the dial to reach 350 F, and have him
produce documentation from the oven manufacturer proving that it was
calibrated properly.

Review documentation, then have supplier check the temperature using a
sophisticated temperature probe (at supplier cost).

Direct supplier to insert potato and set timer for 45 minutes.

Have supplier open oven to prove potato has been installed correctly,
and request a free study proving that 45 minutes is the ideal time to
bake a potato of this size and variability due to orientation within the
oven.

Request a Six Sigma Study showing variable cook times for various potato
sizes and orientations. Check potato for doneness after 10 minutes.

Check potato for doneness after 11 minutes.

Check potato for doneness after 12 minutes.

Become impatient with supplier (why is this simple potato taking so long
to bake?).

Demand status reports every five minutes.

Conduct Value Engineering session and new market test Change to 0.9 lb
potato because marketing determine that customers will only notice if
potato weight is reduced if reduced to 0.85 lb. Check potato for
doneness after 15 minutes...

After 35 minutes, conclude that potato is nearing completion.

Pass through Gate review reporting all Green status.

Congratulate supplier, then update your boss on all the great work
you've done, despite having to work with such an uncooperative supplier.

Remove potato from oven after 40 minutes of baking, as a cost save
without loss of function or quality versus the original 45 minute baking
time.

Serve potato.

Conclude that end users taste must be deficient when warranty claims
indicate undercooked potatoes of varying consistency.

Dispute potato supplier documentation that explicit instruction was
given to reduce cooking time, and insist the supplier replace the
potatoes from the warranty claims at their cost. Threaten to desource
potato supplier because they had the audacity to imply it was not their
fault.

Repeat procedure.

Wonder aloud what on earth what those Japanese folks are doing over
there to make such good, low-cost baked potatoes that people seem to
like better than Ford potatoes.

Neech

I knew there was a reason I never buy domestic potatoes... I mean cars.

dallison

they shouldnt be in the same title

ccannizz11

meh

55M2G7L

madcat your :ghey:

pgatour1

do the trannies and headlights and struts and rotors all fail on the Honda Potato?

lrutt

OK,

Then someone explain to me why I have 100% confidence in the transmission (as well as the rest of the truck) lasting well beyond 100k miles on my Ford but have zero faith in my POS Acura CLS tranny lasting much beyond the warranty, if that.

My truck has less rattles and squeaks than the Acura, has been recalled less, and has fewer known problems than the Acura.

Makes me want to go out and trade my Ford for one of them Ridgelines,

SiGGy

whatever you need to tell yourself...

Honda sucks just as bad, in many other ways.

M TYPE X

From what my aunt tells me at Ford, as well as their interview processes...

... I'd believe that this is totally accurate.

And funny. Looking to become a Ford supplier, Madcat?
You're gonna need a heck of a lot of Red Wings tix.

SiGGy

your not going to be able to explain this to the japanese lovers... been down this road. Just let them think whatever they want to keep themselfs happy.

Honda=cheap and conservative... they make the same crappy big decisions Ford, GM, Chrysler do...

M TYPE X

Sure, Honda has problems.

But Ford's processes and mentality are laughable.
You even got Six Sigma in there!

pgatour1

a buddy of mine got out cars about the same time (Him F-250) me (Acura CL) his has never been to service, mine has spent about 70-80 days in the dealership in the last 4 years
HMMMM.

M TYPE X

For me, this story itself is not so much about product, but rather internal process and coordination. Blame the suppliers, blame the customers ... never blame the process or flawed thinking.

SiGGy

Exactly, and like my warped brakes, which the dealer has fixed 4 times /w new rotors/pads. I'm past the factory warranty now and I'm on the extended one.

Well guess what, it's my problem now. They said they'll "do a one time good will fix and you pay 1/2 of the cost". I said "you expect me to pay 1/2 for parts we both know are defective?"

Another thing Honda forgot to fix in 4 years

And is now in the hands of the consumer...

MADCAT

Your attempt to :ghey: up this thread has failed.

SiGGy

your high on crack if you think it's really that different from Honda.

wstevens

meh. meh.

MADCAT

There's alot more happy Honda owners out there then in this forum. Most owners won't look at FORD after owning a Japenese car. Including me.

MADCAT, former FORD owner.

M TYPE X

Yeah, but it's not like all of Honda's ills are published everyday in the Detroit News to groan over!

The Detroit nameplate I'd most likely drive is some kind of Ford ... then again, I have family connections. But the design and engineering on Chryslers is and GM is just so yeah.

SiGGy

ya, no doubt

SiGGy

Just as there are ford... and plenty of people who believe in buying domestic.

I've owned 14+ cars. Most of which were domestic. I'd still buy domestic. While I'll agree Honda makes *some* good cars, most of them are cheap junk. Same can be said /w the domestics.

wstevens

I'd buy domestic.



























If I lived in Japan.

MADCAT

I have two neighbours. Born and raised in North America, white as you can get. They drive Honda’s. One has an unbreakable CRX, and the other changed from a Buick to a CIVIC. The one with the Civic is going to get rid of the Chrysler Minivan for a Nissan.

If these are a small sample of what’s happening, just imagine what’s happening nation wide. And don’t forget the Korean cars.

BTW..I think this thread will be moved to Car talk.

SiGGy

ya, I was going to move it once it had some good traffic.

wow, one example in which you believe applies to everyone.

My neighbor traded both their domestics and japanese in for a saab and a volo. EVERYONE IS GOING SWEEDISH!! QUICK, SELL THE JAPANESE STOCKS!

MADCAT

Whatever. From my observation at every street light I hit. I see the Japanese cars outnumber everybody else.

SiGGy

Probably true in certain parts of the US. However don't forget the opposite applies in areas too. My job has taken me all around the US. I've been in parts where compacts are popular, parts where pickups are popular, SUV's popular, 4wd popular... demographics change drastically as you move around.

F23A4

It's ironic you mention that. While waiting in my car for my wife @ a suburban NJ mall, I was pretty bored. So I counted all the domestics and foreign makes within range of my eyesight. My tally at that moment does support your statement Madcat. It seemed like imports outnumbered domestics about 1.5:1. If I execluded the Euro makes it'd be more like 1.25:1. (If I didnt count the domestic SUVs/minivans, the import:domestic ratio would be more like 2:1.)

Caveat: I live/shop in an upscale middle class area where foreign dealers easily outnumber domestics within the immediate 5 mile radius.

Now, someone please pass the french fries.

dallison

now i actaully read it, thats funny

dom

I hate to bring facts into the argument but The Camry and Accord are the best selling cars in North America and the Civic and Corolla the best selling small cars. So there's a reason you see more Japanese cars on the road, because they are more.

The Big three have been consistantly losing market share year after year for several years now so yes, people are moving away from them. GM's market share is the smallest its ever been.

Having said that, my confidence in Honda has been severly shaken since I bought the TSX. Its nowhere near lived up to the high standards I expected after owning a 98 Integra and 2000 Civic. So my my second car, I bought domestic. which would have never happened 2 years ago.

Signed Former Honda Fanboy.

matelot

It's like that in ANY upscale area

matelot

American processes/Management: too much MBA bullshit

MADCAT

....cut costs and you get praised

MADCAT

Go to our upscale areas in TO and you'd be lucky to see a American models. Maybe only the upscale American SUV's.

Fibonacci

X3


Oooh you're a blackbelt, six-sigma my ass!

F23A4

....I just heard that JPM Chase (former employer) is dumping their Six Sigma program altogether.

Exactly.

Maybe I missed the thread (or just dont recall it) but, what happened with the TSX domn?? Outside of it being underpowered, the impression I got was that it is a great car.

dom

It is a great car and a big smile appears on my face everytinme I get in. The interior fit and finish and materials used are IMO better than cars costing several thousands more and the handling is as good as it gets for FWD. But I've had more than a few problems than I wasn't expecting.

-I'm on my 3rd set of front rotors in 39,000 miles.
-Replaced driver side headlight due to condenstation
-Replaced VSA sensor
-Replaced armrest hinge twice
-Seat heater light gone out
-Driver's seat grinds when moving so they replaced the track twice.

Most are minor and are probly atrributed to it beng a first year model but considering the Honda's I've had before it had 0 problems between them its a disappointment.

I'd still buy another Honda in a heartbeat now only I'll look elsewhere more closely before doing so.

Fibonacci

On 5AT's, it's usually better to rest your left foot on the dead pedal, not the brake.



But seriously, those rotors are whacked. Honda has never been known for building strong brakes.

My main complaint besides the minor rattles which I can live with, is my engine knocking/pinging intermittently in the higher rev ranges when I use the sportshifter.

F23A4

teranfon

As much as I love the Honda products, I have to agree with you. Being a farmer I have to depend on my Ford trucks. Mostly for running around, but called upon at times for severe duty. It's not uncommon for me to have 4000 lbs sitting in the Superdutys and over 2000 pounds in the 150's. Problems? Next to nothing.

Terry

matelot

hey what's a farmer doing on Jpn import car forum ???