lifetimeofwar

So I was thinking about selling my 2005 TL auto non-navi with 85,000 miles and picking up a diesel 2500 series truck (Duramax/Cummins/Powerstroke). I figure I can get 13-15 thousand for my TL and be able to buy the truck straight up.

I wanted your guys opinion/experiences with the above trucks. I do not want payments so buying the truck outright, is my only option.

My immediate task with the truck is pulling a car trailer with, hopefully my race/project car to different tracks around me. Later in the trucks life, I'm buying a truck camper, the cab over kind, and using the pair for extended off-grid trips.

I was leaning towards the GMC 2500 Duramax extended cab short bed mostly because my dad has a 99 1500 GMC sierra and I love that thing.. but knowing very little about diesel trucks in general I could be missing something from the other manufactures.

I am doing my research on each truck, so far, i've only looked at duramax, and they seem good in most aspects.. More than likely all the trucks will have close to 200,000 miles, if not more.

The thing I do know is, all the trucks are gonna need modifications when the truck camper goes on (air bags, sway bars, etc.), and I plan on keeping it as long as I can

oo7spy

Cummins because of the engine. The truck will be a piece of shit. Everything inside will break, BUT the engine will last forever. My dad has a 2001 2500 will upgraded leaf springs. He used to race horses, pulls a 28 ft boat, and hauls the overhead camper, sometimes at the same time. I think in 275k miles he has replaced the clutch once.

You shouldn't need bags to haul an overhead IMO.

lifetimeofwar

Thanks for the reply, your dad never made modifications to haul both the camper and trailer at the same time? All the search ive done on truck camper forums say to make a bunch of modifications, especially with a 2500 truck.

That's all I hear about Cummins, that they will last forever. Hard to find around here and typically asking higher prices.. but i guess there is a reason.

fsttyms1

My vote, Duramax. Most of the people i know with trucks traded the cummins for the duramax. One is running a everyday tune with about 800 hp and does tractor pulls with it and the only thing he has ever broke in the past 5 years was 1 front axle. The allison trans is still holding strong as well.

Hapa DC5

Powerstroke. My buddy owns a towing company, that's all he buys for his light duty tows. His oldest truck is 14 years old with nearly 500k on it, original motor, turbo, trans. Some electrical issues, but that's it. So you know it gets beat on. He can't kill that 7.3L

lifetimeofwar

Impressive.. I like that GM uses the allison transmission, haven't really found anything online as far as issues with them. Dodge's auto transmission however..

Also very impressive. I heard the older engines, the 5.4 were the ones to get, but I'll look more into the 7.3

Three replies, three different manufactures. I think in the big picture, all the trucks have their respective issues. And the more I read the more it seems like one company isn't hugely better than the next.

Mr Marco

FYI:

New LML Duramax is tuned to tolerate 20% Bio-fuel mixture. Something to consider as I have heard Feds are moving in that direction.

Chevy would probably be my choice, although I would never buy a truck. If I find myself in need of one, my hick father-in-law owns three.
(Two Chevys & one Ford).

Aman

IMO any of your choices will be able to handle hauling a car and trailer with no problem. If you're selling your TL for this, I assume it's going to be your regular driver, and you should focus on which one is more comfortable for you as a DD.

lifetimeofwar

I definitely wont have the money for a new truck I was thinking more like 98-03.. bio fuel sounds good to me.

Definitely important to consider comfort, I haven't driven any of them..

juniorbean

iTrader: (5)

Why a Diesel? You don't need a diesel to tow... and you're going to pay out of your ass for fill-ups. Get an F150 (or if you need to tow more then ~6500lbs... an F250) and be done with it. Much cheaper to buy, maintain, and fill-up.

Then, if you actually go the camper route in the future, you can upgrade. But again, most F150's or 250's (or Silverado's or whatever) can tow most large ones easily as well. Unless you're towing over 10k pounds...

My buddy had a Silverado for his landscaping business, and upgraded to an F350 diesel. He loves the truck, but hates the diesel. Fuel costs are killing him. His Silverado towed just fine... even with the large equipment he hauls for large jobs. So he's thinking of going back.

1StGenCL

7.3 power stroke is the way to go. We have always had fords to pull the horse trailers but the newer diesel engines are terrible on mileage and I know our newer ford and many other people we know had major issues with the engines. The 7.3 is right in your year range and my moms is getting 20 plus mpg in crew cab form.

oo7spy

Nope. Pop the camper on, hook up the trailer, and head up to NE, no problems. Like I mentioned, the factory upgraded the leaf springs to be more in line with a 1-ton capability, but he also did the same things with his old late 80s F-250 diesel.

This is the route I have been tending to since I posted with exception to reliability for comfort. Although, the type of reliability I am talking about, features like A/C and heaters, probably equates to comfort.
Diesel costs more at fill up, but it gets better mileage. It also gets MUCH better mileage towing from what I've heard. Throw in the durability of the engine, and I would rather have the diesel. The 2001 Cummins 2500 can get 20-22 hwy, and towing barely affects that.

juniorbean

iTrader: (5)

^ It's true that you will be getting better mileage while towing... but from reading the OP... towing will be a very small percentage of the time.

Using my friend mentioned above as an example... the MPG difference between the vehicles was very close (Silverado vs. F350) when not towing heavy loads (towing a mower and some accessories did not hurt the Silverado's fuel mileage all that much). Running a cost analysis showed he would have to keep the truck something like 10 years longer to make up the difference in fuel savings on the diesel. The 1-3 MPG advantage takes a lot of time to offset the fairly significant price difference from regular to diesel.

So if the OP is towing most of the time, then I agree, makes sense... but if it's a DD that will tow once in a while... not sure it's the way to go...

1StGenCL

I completely agree JB but the new diesels get terrible mileage do to the new regs, his will not be subjected to that so he should get significantly better mileage. Does it make it worthwhile, I don't know.

Costco

I don't know nearly enough about these regulations... mainly to clean up emissions? I already know about urea injection, but what else is causing MPG to sink in diesels?

Makes me kind of sad how diesel pretty much gets shitted on, at least here in the states. I for one am considering a diesel powerplant for my next vehicle, partially depending on how Mazda's Skyactiv-D does.

Sarlacc

Just worked with a dude who had a F-150 CNG truck...he loved it. But you are limited where you can fill up.

lifetimeofwar

Seems like depending on your area, the cost of diesel is no more than $.40 over gas. Most diesels can manage 15mpg in city and upwards of 20mpg highway, if not more respectively. My roommate's 05 Titan can manage about 10mpg city and maybe 12-13mpg highway (no load). I was thinking of buying a small <500cc motorcycle as a dd, and use the truck only when needed (all of winter, when towing camper and/or car trailer, etc.). I'm not saying a 1500 series truck can't tow my trailer (which will probably weigh < 4000lbs) but, I believe the GVWR (gross vehicle weight rating) would be seriously jeopardized without heavy modification to the suspension, rims, and tires with the camper loaded up. Although all research points that I'll be doing some kind of modification to the chassis anyway.. And then there is the mpg argument, I feel like while towing with or without my camper the diesel will just handle the load better. I do plan on getting my camper within 3-4 years, and I should have my car and trailer within 1-2 years.

Good to know, I'm definitely checking out the 7.3L, there are soo many more used options for the Ford.

Your dad's a pioneer I'm probably still gonna do the modifications most truck camper guys do: 19.5 inch wheels, air bags, sway bars, etc. Also diesel trucks do need slightly more maintenance, but im just not convinced its gonna cost me that much more in fuel; especially if I have a motorcycle as my dd half the time.

You're right, I wont be towing most of the time early on, but I am thinking of buying a <500cc motorcycle as a dd to help with the fuel costs.. and fun. If diesel costs $3.90/ gallon in the mid west region http://www.eia.gov/petroleum/gasdiesel/ and gas costs $3.70/ gallon then filling a 25gallon fuel tank will cost $97.50 for the diesel, while the gas equivalent will cost $92.50.. So does that mean having a gas truck, in that example, saved me $5 bucks? And not to mention, my mpg rating is upwards of 5-10mpg better than gas..

juniorbean

iTrader: (5)

^ May be regional. My friend is paying upwards of 50% more for his diesel (larger tank plus increased cost). I just paid $3.25 for regular on Sunday... and saw diesel as high as $4.05 .

fsttyms1

^ Diesels gain a lot of power from a tune, they can also see great improvements in mpg as well with a good econ tune. My buddies are getting 25 or so hwy. Around here right now diesel is only 10 cents or so more than regular, and 50 less than premium

oo7spy

$3.32 for regular, $3.58 for diesel in central TX right now. 8% more. Agreed on the tune too. There are a lot of options out there for that kind of thing.

lifetimeofwar

I'm paying for premium anyway with my TL which happened to be 20 cents more than diesel at the gas station by my house.

25mpg highway is amazing.. I wasn't aware of econ tunes, thanks.

Costco

it's hearsay but I heard someone with an F-250 diesel towed another 1/2 ton truck on a long trip, and in doing so still got 27 mpg.

lifetimeofwar

That sounds a little too good to be true.. If I can tow my car and trailer with a truck camper and manage even 13mpg, I'll be happy.

juniorbean

iTrader: (5)

Does the TL require premium? It's been over a decade since I had one... so can't remember.

Either way, comparing the TL to a truck is not really relevent. You should be comparing a truck (most require regular) to a diesel.

That said, I neglected to factor in tunes. Diesel's respond really well... so that may be an option.

1StGenCL

I pulled a two horse with the 7.3 a lot and would get around 16 unloaded and 17-18 loaded. Now this is an aluminum gooseneck and as weird as it sounds to get better mileage with two horses weighing around 2,500, many said it was because the trailer didn't bounce around as much and rode lower.

Jakes_tl

Dodge - Cummins is an awesome motor but everything isn't all that good.
GMC / Chevy have the Allison transmission which is the best tranny out off all the diesel trucks.
Ford - if you get a Ford get one with a 7.3, stay away from 6.0.

oo7spy

Is the search for a manual or automatic?

lifetimeofwar

Yeah the TL requires premium.. I was just saying in the sense that diesel is cheaper at this particular location by my house.

Still impressive mpg.

Thats a good general guide

auto, although dodge's manual trans is supposed to be unbreakable..

2000UA5

cummins!!! rather be cummin than strokin.

oo7spy

Not sure about the Allison or Ford, but you will be losing power in an AT Dodge.

08FLrdxSH-AWD

Personally I would stay away from a Cummins. I absolutley love the engine, but what good is it if the vehicle is bolted to is only an orange stain on your driveway here in a few years? Duramax is a good all rounder just because they require minimal work and produce impressive power with not much work (tuner, dpf delete, egr delete, exhaust). However in your price range it will be next to impossible to find a decent one with the Allison trans in it. Still the trans that they come with is still solid and should last you a good long while. Bu that brings me to the last of the three, the Powerstroke. I love Ford's and i especially love the Super Duty lineup. While it is true that the 7.3 is probably the most bullet proof without any added money or work, it is also weak in comparison to the 5.9 Cummins, the 6.7 Duramax, and the 6.0 Powerstroke. I would say look for a 6.0 Powerstroke with reasonable miles (under 175k) and that has been studded and deleted (head studs and egr delete). The head studs and the egr on these trucks are notoriously terrible and cause serious longevity issues and it all has to do with Ford's relationship to International when the engine was designed and built, tight deadlines and cheap parts resulted in a not so good reputation for the 6.0. I know from personal experience with the 6.0 that when these issues have been fixed, these engines can make astronomical power. 2 guys that I work with both have 2005 Harley F-250s that produce well over 600 hp and one produces over 1000 lb-ft of torque. So while I might not be an expert on any of these motors, I feel pretty well versed in them and I just feel you could be happier with a Ford.

08FLrdxSH-AWD

Oh and I forgot to mention, the 2 F250s both get in the upper 20's in mpg

lifetimeofwar

Thanks for the heads up.. I think, probably the only way im getting a cummins, besides further research, is if I can get one with MT.

Im not sure what GM's other transmission is, but if I choose duramax, which is my favorite atm, I would pretty much only consider the Allison trans. I've heard a lot of different opinions on the powerstrokes.. 7.3 vs 6.0.. seems like there is no clear answer, which makes me kinda weary on ford. But the large amount of them used, with lower mileage, is hard to overlook.

Thanks for the info.