Are you serious, compare the cars based on power alone??

With the amount of $$ to make the Mustang equal in price to an NSX, it would absolutely destroy an NSX in every performance catergory attempted. When comparing a GTO and RX7, it would take significant $$ to makeit run at the strip with a well tuned GTO.

In other words, not valid comparisons as the two Japanese makes are meant for something other than the strip. Whereas the two domestic makes are meant for the strip.

Cars are normally grouped according to market segment which includes cost. Of the one's presented, the Mustang and Celica are very close. Both fall in the mid-$20k's and both are coupes. But one performs much better and the other has nicer switch gear...

 

To take that further, what about VW's built in Mexico. Or a Saab built in Japan. Or an Australian Pontiac.

 

Good point scalbert!!!

 

It's not where they're made that counts, it's how they're made.

 

dude you cant just compare a f***kin celica with a new mustang.....what the hell? do you realize the difference in power there? and im sorry but a nsx would destroy the mustang

 

Are they in near-Market segments?? The answer is yes. There are some people who crossed-shopped these two vehicles before purchasing. No one cross-shopped a Mustang and an NSX, that is ridiculous to even mention...

 

are you kidding me???? the celica has like 160 hp and then the stang has like 300 and^ and your saying they can be compared?

 

Forget HP as that is just a feature of the vehicle. Both have similar pricing and both are coupes. What do you not understand??

Do you not beleive there is cross-shopping with these two vehicles??

 

WOW! these cars do not have similar pricing and so what if there coupes the mustang is a v8 and the celica is a v4 or v6 totally different class. and if they are the same as you say then why buy a v8 when you could have the v6? saves you more money at the gas station am i right?

 

Wow, you want to discuss this matter and have shown glaring lack of information. FYI, don't discuss these matters until you have read up a bit. The Celica is an I4 (Inline 4) as are nearly 99% of current 4 cylinder vehicles on the road. That is excluding the Subaru flat 4 (H4 to be exact).

The Celica GTS base price is $22,335
http://www.toyota.com/celica/models.html

The Mustang GT base price is $25,225
http://www19.forddirect.fordvehicles...ord&partner=fv

And you don't think these are similar in price.

A V8 would cost you more at the pump but also perform better in most cases. There are trade-offs which a consumer must consider...

 

lol ok fine you beat me, good little chat, but i still think that these 2 cars are totally unalike

 

Wow.. This thread is ridiculious..

It's silly and ignorant to hate a car merely for who makes it or where it is made.

The auto industry is so diversified, it's hard to tell what a car is any longer as mentioned above (Honda's made in Ohio, Jaguar made by Ford, Australian Pontiac GTO, etc.). There are great cars of every make.

Reliability for so-called American cars have improved significantly in recent years so that's not really a valid attack any longer.

We are all car enthusiasts. I enjoy cars for what the offer, not who made it or where it's made.

 

It wasn't a good little chat. It was an intelligent person (can you guess who?) proving a point to someone who ignores fact and sees his own opinion as a golden rule by which the entire world must adhere.

Good job scalbert.

 

ok it didnt involve you so shut the hell up

 

I don't need some self-proclaimed "P.I.M.P." sixteen year old to inform me of my need to "shut the hell up". You're a dumbass. It's time you figured that out.

 

nice Minch

 

ummm, maybe the 05 Stang GT but the 04 SVT (of which many dealers have a few left) would obliterate the NSX with little effort. And at some point, SVT will produce a new version based on the 05 Stang that (I'm willing to bet) will be a MUCH better car than they had in 03-04.

 

04 Ford Mustang SVT Cobra
MSRP- 35,370

04 Saleen Mustang S281 SC (supercharged)
MSRP- 42,322

05 Acura NSX
MSRP- 89,000

In this case the american cars outperform the NSX (which is an amazing car, love it but still) and are half the price... invest the money u would to buy a NSX under the hood of the SVT or Saleen...and u would have a extremly high performance car

 

Obliterate the NSX? Stock for stock, yes the SVT would beat the NSX--IN A STRAIGHT LINE, but throw both those cars on a road course and I'll bet your sister's virginity the SVT will see nothing but tail lights. As was previously mentioned, though, if the extra money saved from the purchase of the Mustang over the NSX was applied to the performance of the Mustang, it wouldn't be much of a match. For what the NSX is, it is very overpriced and outdated.

 

Horsepower isn't everything guys!!

 

why are you guys comparing a car that debuted in 1990 that beat the ferraris and lambos? you guys are comparing apples and oranges. If you want to compare the NSX, compare it with the 1990 mustangs with their 5 liter 150hp engine you dumb fawk mustang lovers because that's when NSX was made. If most models have an average life span or generation span of 4 years, the NSX is almost 4 generations old. So lets make an analogy... human generation is around 75 years on average. The NSX has aged 4 generations, that's 75 x 4 = 300 year old geezer the nsx. While most cars were having kids and producing newer versions of themselves FOUR times over, the NSX stayed the same to be 300 years old in human age. Show the NSX some respect dayam it, it's like a super old grand father of cars who's still alive in the market today.

 

I'm not gonna read the whole thread because I dont think I can take much more blatant brand whoring. Fact is that unless you buy a handbuilt car, the car is designed to fall apart. Granted the Japanese appear to have the upper hand as far as reliability goes, but the gap is closing. The Big 3 are getting much better reliability rankings and the interior/exterior quality is tons better than what it was even 10 years ago.

BTW My brother's SHO had 210k HARD DRIVEN miles on it, and it still ran very well. Well enough to out-pace a brand new TL-S as a matter of fact. My dad has a 91 GMC Safari (like the Astro) and it has 200k+ on it. It cranks over faster than any car I've ever owned, and is 100% reliable. The trans fluid has NEVER been flushed, and it shifts as good as new. The only issues have been wear items such as shocks, alternator, and water pump.

I cant understand how people who own the Honda 5AT can criticize other car makers for reliability. My sisters 01 Buick Regal has NEVER seen a dealership service dept, and it has 80k on it. Can anyone on here claim that?

And I'd like to see any import car put up the abuse that I inflict on my Mustang w/o falling apart.

 

Those old Astro/Safari vans are tough as nails. I have an '88 Astro cargo van with a 4.3L V6 that I bought new 17 years ago. Now it has over 300K miles (the odo has rolled over three times) and it still has the original engine/tranny and hasn't been rebuilt yet. Sure it looks a little run down (it's been through five accidents, yes five throughout it's 17 year life) but the damn thing still keeps going strong, oh yea and the A/C still works LOL.

 

haha, alive, that's funny

As far as comparing an NSX to a Mustang, I find that silly. Compare an NSX (3.2L, the older 3.0L NSXs aren't much to talk about) to a ZO6. The NSX will be eating the Zs dust on the street and on the track. And you can't say anything about interiors else you've never been in either car. The NSX isn't that great inside. The only thing the NSX has going for it is that it looks like a Ferrari. Of course you could jump on Honda/Acura for simply being wannabes just like the guy that converted his car into a Ferarri look alike.

I think the Japanese/America/whatever is plain silly. Every car has diff concepts. Just as much as the original poster hates American cars, I hate Japanese, etc econoboxes like the Impreza, Corolla, etc. Doesn't mean they are bad cars just not my cup of tea.

 

Hey, don't exclude the 4ATs either.

and On top of that what turns me off is that Honda didn't do much about it and generally denied all of it for the longest. I've had better luck with a Ford dealer. Many on this site are completely in love with Honda, I prob won't buy another after seeing their business practices and lack of guts in car design. Once again, not my cup of tea.

As far as the European vs. American, I don't think they compare in the least bit except maybe vs. some of the American luxury cars.

 

hey you master of the obvious, welcome to ACURAZINE! A website for ACURA/HONDA owners! LOL yes, you are quite intelligent for pointing out the fact that people here tend to like their hondas and acuras. And if honda's not your cup of tea and you dislike honda cars so much, why are you here?

You young fool.... NSX was beating all the ferraris and lambo and porsches and mustangs and corvettes when it first came out while you were playing on your nintendo in 1990. NSX's only flaw is that its aged beautifully for 15 years with the same price tag. If they lowered the price every 4 years they didn't redesign down to around 35k, I would've bought it over my TSX lol.

 

You do have a point-kind of. I don't care when the fucking car was produced. It's the fact that they're still producing and pricing it at a level which should make it competitive with the cars that are currently being produced in that price range. Your analogy with the 75 yr. life span only makes sense if they weren't constantly updating the car and slightly making it over (not to mention increasing the price). Basically what I'm saying is that it's not our fault that we compare it to similar cars of today, because IT IS A CAR OF TODAY, and is still in production to compete with other sports cars with the same characterstics.

 

I also understand your point but TO ME the NSX can't be compared to the cars of today because the bottom line is that the NSX is a 1990 classic honda still chooses to produce after a loooong loooong time. I respect that....

 

And proaudio, you're only 4 years older than the NSX LOOOOOOOOOL hahaha i find that funny

 

I didn't say like, I said LOVE. I don't want to offend anyone by using harsher terms, but some people here are so into Honda as a company, that everything else sucks. I didn't mean they just liked their car. :retard: I'm still here b/c I still have my Acura, and b/c this board is the best for anything, regardless of what car brand you own. Honestly it's becoming one of the best 350z/G35c boards. I don't dislike Honda cars, I dislike Honda's "theme".

The only fool here is you. Yea, the NSX was great when I was playing my Nintendo but I wasn't talking about 15 years ago. I'm talking about NOW, where the NSX isn't so pretty anymore, isn't that fast, and is WAAAY overpriced. Period. Yea, so what if it beat a Mustang in 1990, they have come a LONG way and the NSX really hasn't.

I sort of agree tho, if it would have slowly moved down to ~$40K it would be MUCH better now. At $90K tho now, it's pricing itself into history. If it was lower in price, it would compete with a diff set of cars and all of the sudden it does preform pretty well.

 

OOOOOOOOOOOOOO you are only 8 years older, big fucking whup. I think you are one of those Honda guys I was talking about.


bradb1us has it right.

 

You know, you talk a lot of shit for someone who isn't very involved in this board. You seem like another "holier-than-thou" asshole that seems to have populated this topic. The bottom line is the NSX may have competed in yesterday's market, but in today's, where 30k can buy you 300 horsepower from almost any manufacture you can think of, with handling characteristics to match, the NSX is an outdated relic.

 

Exactly. I'm not trying to say the NSX is a POS that should be trashed - but every fucking time somone starts to mention some car that is a great performer besides a fucking Honda the NSX comes up as the holy grail, car to end all cars, everyone else should just fucking stop and bow.

Would I take an NSX? Hell yea I would, but I'm not gonna stand around talking about how it beat a 1989 Ferrari Testarossa.

 

hmm Interesting, Im also 4 years older then the NSX, and it seems like ProAudio and I act a lot older then someone whos 9 years older then it...well aside..you claim that because the NSX debuted in 1990 its 10 years older then the 03 Mustang SVT... well lets look at ur standards...the Car by the name Mustang Debuted in 1964 1/2 which makes it 40 years old... although it would be complete bullshit to say that w/ out being sarcastic...

now if u wanna talk parts lets give it a go...The 2005 NSX and the 1990 NSX are two totally different animals, new suspension, body has had some slight renovations, totally Different Engines...the NSX has infact evolved w/ time...Im not an Expert on the NSX...but if it does in fact have the same Chassy then okay ill go w/ ur 15 year old car theroy

However by the same thinking, the Chassy on the 2003 Ford Mustang, GT, SVT Cobra, and Saleen, is 25 years old.. So sorry to take the air out of ur balloon but yeah, the Mustang that beats the NSX for half the price, is 25 years old....so whipe that shit-eating-grin off ur face

 

This is my take on American Cars.
They aren't built as well as imports.
I do agree German cars are very high tech(BMW,and Benz) but sometimes they put it out before it's perfected.
The German styling is almost untouchable(The Benz E-Class is a timeless classic even though it's been around for 3-4 years it's one of those cars you see and say DANG THAT CAR HOT) also look at the BMW 6 series
American cars sometimes have better styling I think the Japanese their Quality is under par. for example (I know I'll get flamed for this) Even though it's a P.O.S. I like the styling of the new Grand Prix. Would I own one no way.
I got a 94 Accord with 270 k on orginal tranny and motor.it's been in 5 accidents and been through hell. I drive almost every day.
The other thing I don't like about American cars is resale value. Their resale value is trash.
It's like this in my opinion
If you want a High tech car that has awesome styling and don't mind dropping some serious paper go German(BMW,Benz)
If your main thing is reliablity and want the car to last a good while and good resale: Go with a Japan car(honda,Toyota,Nissan)
If you don't care about reliablity and want a cheap ride due to rebates and other incentives: Go with Domestic(Ford,Dodge,GM)

now to the driving part of it.
I've driven a 2002 BMW 330XI, and a 2004 Z4, which were a BLAST to drive everything felt solid but I talked to the owner of the 330 and he had a 328 before this and he said it's typical for BMWs over time to have electrical problems. I rate the Germans #1 in fun to drive but it was still "classy"
#2. In fun to drive but still "classy" I'd say Japan cars. The last few years they've made BIG BIG progress. Before they were viewed as a good family sadan(like the Accords,Camrys,and Altimas) But now you WRX Sti, Evo MR, RX-8, S2K, new RL,TL. The thing I've noticed about Japan cars are either their change is usually too little aggressive.I felt the new RL body didn't do the car justice. for a car that to compete against the E-class benz it doesn't hold a candle.
#3. In fun to drive but yet "classy" sorry to say but Americans come in last. Almost every car the Americans have tried in this catagory has failed.
The new Ford T-bird(it's gonna get discontinued soon)'
Ford SHO(Gone)
Mercury Murader(how ever you spell it)(it's basically a souped up Crown Vic) but it doesn't sound like it's staying around
Pontiac Grand Prix GTP(yeah it looks good but the performance numbers aren't equal to a TL,or G35)
Dodge Magnum(This is just a plain nasty looking car, It must be because i'm fairly young i don't get it. yeah it has a crap load of HP but it looks like crap)
Chrysler 300C(see the Magnum)
Pontiac GTO looks good but the numbers once again don't match the car. the handling and weight of the car blows.(trust me in Autocross i ran even with my prepared CRX Si which only makes 120 wheel hp) and he probably makes 300 wheel hp. I figured he'd kill me.
new Mustang: personally I don't like it. I'm not much for the "throw back" styling on cars. My favorite era of Mustang was 94-97. That was the best looking Mustangs.
the new Pontiac G6:they interview Bob Lutz they said this car is suppose to be as good if not better than an Accord or Camry. HHAHAHAHAHA GIVE ME A BREAK. The Accord has been in Car and Driver top 10 cars like almost every year since they've started doing it.

The biggest problem with american cars is they get an idea from other car makers then they put it into production before making it reliable and or safe.

 

[your old english teacher]It's CHASSIS dammit![/your old english teacher]


OK carry on...

 

LOL the mustang's chassis was made in 1980?!?! I had no idea, no wonder the mustang's had a loooong history of poor handling for all these years... I guess you answered one of my questions, but anyways YES, the NSX is for the most part friggin 15 years old. You are right about minor little revisions down the line, you can see them all here:

http://www.j-garage.com/1110.htm

If you actaully do read that site you will realize that not much did change to the NSX compare to other cars that change much faster (ex: 05 G35 gets an extra 20hp less than 4 years) . For the most part, the NSX is old... old to the point all of you youngins trash it because it's not up to par with the young guns. But damn, it was a dream car for my friends and me to have a nsx when we were younger.

 

also I just wanted to add:
We got a 4 year old ambulance at my station (we bought new in late 2000)(shortly after i signed on as a firefighter)
it's on a Ford F-350 super-duty chasis with the power-stroke diesel motor.
a little over 110 k on it and when we drop it into reverse it makes all kinds of grinding noises with the gears.(NOT GOOD).

If I had to buy an American:
It would be like this #1. GMC/GM/Chevy(we had a 94 K-3500 chassis ambulance we used until last year with 350,000 on it no major problems, just it squeeked here and there but I usually drove this one because it was so reliable)
#2. Ford See comment above about ambulance #3.
#3. Dodge. I was hopeing when Benz bought Dodge they'd improve quality but I haven't seen much improvement. they have a LONG LONG road ahead of them if they want to stay in business because they dumped Mitsubushi, They own Freightliner(which we used to have those chassis on our engines wanna talk about a Piece of crap) we went to Pierce Custom chassis WHICH ROCK. Dodge also owns Western Star, Sterling,and Volvo trucks. I heard they own Cummins Diesel. They own a lot of stuff people don't know about. In my thoughts they've invested to much in off-shoot ventures like the big trucks and things like that when they should focus on quality of what they got.

 

Well hey as long as were talking as Firefighters...heres my imput...at my Station we have 3 buses (ambulance) one of which we just took out of service, the one taken out of service is build on a 8 year old Ford F-350...it runs great, only reason its out of service is because its being replaced w/ a new ford...
both of our buses now are ford E350 vans, which We couldnt be happier about, there both great and beautiful ambulances...

Now the work truck, which is the oldest truck we have in service is a 1971 Ford truck...It used to be the Brush fire truck untill it was replaced w/ a new Ford F-350 a few years ago (which is honestly one of the the coolest trucks ive ever seen: lift kit, huge wheels, alot of really cool stuff done for firefighting).... 15 (the work truck) is still on its original tranny/engine after 33 years of service, and belive me we dont go easy on that truck...meenwhile my 04 Acura TSX, is on its second tranny..I love honda cars, and Im sorry that ur Company had problems w/ ur Bus...but still u cant pull the Imports are More reliable and better built card anymore...because its just not true

 

Refrain from the insults.

If you re-read the thread the Mustang and NSX comparison was incorrectly made by the thread starter since they both make similar power. They are two different class of vehicles and should not be compared.

BTW, weren't you still in a child's seat when the Acura line was launched??