Why does the 2009 Honda Accord have 271hp in the v6? That is only 30hp away from the RL and on par with the estimately projections for the TL. The TLS will have a little over 300hp.

I'm still wondering, what Honda is thinking putting a better motor in their Accord? It runs in 87 too!

http://automobiles.honda.com/accord-...fications.aspx

Thoughts?

 

Ummm, the base 09 TL is rated at 280HP and the SH-AWD TL (there is no Type S for 09) is rated at 305.

Those aren't projections either.

And the Accord did not receive a power bump. They simply revised the figures for 09.

Some might remember that before the 08 was released it was rated at 271 then dropped to 268 right before launch.

And who cares, its only 3 HP.

 

*looks at dead horse*

*looks at queue forming*

*looks back at dead horse*

*grabs popcorn*

 

I've only see the projections, I haven't seen an official release from Acura yet. My mistake.

Seems like they are far to close. Are the only major differences going to be interior/exterior finish/features?

 

The new Maxima has 290hp and the G has 306, Camry has 268HP while the ES350 has 272HP

 

IMO, Accord is their cash cow. It's the vehicle that competes against the mighty Camry, Altima, and etc. In order to compete within that highly intensified segment, 271hp seems like more than reasonable considering the current gen. Camry puts out 26X hp which generates excellent straight line numbers.

As for the brand new RL and TL, I think they are receiving the same J-series engines from the previous model.. It'd been great if Acura opted to change TL's FWD system to RWD since FWD vehicles should not have too much hp to not get caught up with the "torque steer" phenomenon.

With the SH-AWD, I'm pretty sure the vehicles will be able to handle much more horsepower, but I frankly don't know why they still are not coming out with the new motor other than the current J-series for TL and RL. My guess is that always being a little cheaper than the direct competitors is their main pricing strategy which kinda let them to stick with the conservative hp numbers.

I wouldn't say Honda is putting a better motor in their Accord though. It's just that Honda and Acura have different priorities and strategies.

 

Power isnt the problem with the new TL. Its looking at it.

 

 

 

who cares.... Show me the MPG numbers

The horsepower wars are soon going to be over
Most consumers would be happier to gain 5mpg than to have extra horsepower

 

 

It would appear otherwise. I suspect we'll start seeing more cyl shut down before they start launching cars with less power.

The latest honda lineup has more hp then my 2000 TL.

 

It's been 8 years...what did you expect?

 

That's rather my point, fuel prices have only been rising over the last 8 years, yet we don't see a reversal of HP trends.

 

Buy a fit

 

I see the point. If "Acura" is supposed to be something special, then make it special all around. The Accord is better to look at than the TL, and has almost the same power. Say what you want, but I feel if Honda is going to have a luxury brand, it should be something "better" than things they already have.

But does the competition do the same thing?

Look at Toyota/Lexus: Is a Camry truly a unmodified ES? (I guess this is the closest comparison). Well, I know that the running gear is the same, and 268HP in the Camry vs. 272 HP in the ES is not a big difference. Exterior wise, the ES is much nicer to look at over the Camry, and the interior is no competition. The ES wins, hands down. Pricing is about $26K for the Camry XLE, and $34 for the Lexus ES.

In the Nissan/Infiniti stable: The G37 Coupe vs. the Altima Coupe 3.5SE? (the closest family relationship) The G car is RWD, and has 330 HP, while the Altima is FWD and has 270HP. Nice difference. The interior is also no competition. The Altima looks more like a Pointiac, where the Infiniti's looks classy, like an expensive car. Price is about $9G's in favor of the Altima ($25K vs. $34K), but luxury has its price. And the exterior, although similar, shows the difference. The front clip on the G car is much better than the stubby looking Altima.


Who does this better in the end? I think Infiniti/Nissan has the right answer. The car may look a bit similar, but it is just a much better vehicle.

Honda: Walk over to Nissan and take notes. That's how it should be done.

 

You have to understand that yes, fuel prices were rising, but they didn't hit a consumer breaking point until this year....when prices rose above $4/gal the consumer went to look for mpg options.

At $3.00/gal people were still buying SUV and V8's.

It's basically been 2008 where things have started to change.

 

vcm on the automatics help out the mpg alot......

 

Different strokes for different folks.

IMHO, automakers are heading in the right direction with ever increasing power levels while simultaneously increasing fuel economy.

 

IMHO:
okay the Acura TL (09) and the V-6 Accord getting really close on power. but it comes down to 3 things.
#1. Looks(which car looks better to you)
#2. Money( if you got the money to drop to go up to the TL)
#3. features( do you need the extra features on the TL or not).
i hope Honda/Acura doesn't get like GM where they got like 5 models overlap.

 

That's due to inflation... Price of stuff just doesn't go down... I remember buying gas for under a buck and buying soda pop for 20 cents a bottle

Gas was $1.45 a gallon back in 2002 when I bought my CL... but it's jumped ahead of inflation in just the past 3 or so years...

It takes years to bring new cars to market (how long has acura been working on the next NSX for example), so you're not going to see a shit load of small fuel efficient cars pop up on the new car market over night...

With the Fit, Yaris, SmartCar, hybrids and others, we have started to see a trend to smaller cars, but it's going to take awhile...

Now if gas prices keep falling and go back to under $3.00 a gallon, then all bets are off...

 

Oh, and the new accord coupes are DAMN SEXY !! I've seen a few up close now, and if they were RWD, I'd be in the dealer buying one this weekend (either in black or blue).

 

This is more in line with my thinking of things.

 

I've always thought it was curious that Acuras are based off the better selling Accord...

2G CL's (2001-2003) for example are based of the 6th gen Accord (1998-2002). So Iv'e got a 2003 CL that is based of a 5 y/o platform... Seems kinda weird that you top of the line luxury car is based off the lower priced vehicle, but when you sell 200K accords an only a couple of tens of thousands CL's, it starts making sense....

That's why Acura need to get it's own platforms and engines, so that everthing doesn't start out as being based on the accord and then trickle up to the luxury division.

Hyundai is doing just that by with the BH/genesis platform. With both the Gen Sedan and Gen Coupe being built off the same RWD platform, and only sharing engines with the other cars in the hyundai lineup...

 

When I picked up my 07 AV6 I weighed #1 and #2 in considering the base TL, with me deciding 'no' to #3. I like the 07 TL's design MUCH better than that of my AV6 but with performance being a wash I could not justify the TL's $5-8k premium over a fully loaded Accord despite neat features like 5.1 Surround and Bluetooth. (Though, I could justify that premium if it were the 07 TL-S.)

 

Ehh..... usually I don't complain since the Accord is a pretty good platform to work off of, but these new Accords are just too big. I mean I have a pretty big coupe myself but it doesn't weigh all that much compared to coupes nowadays. The EX-L V6 coupes weigh in at over 3500 lbs, but thats with a FWD layout and ever growing platforms. Imagine what the next Accord is going to be like with the extra hardware for RWD, it'll be a pig.

They need to start basing it off smaller platforms at least. If its FWD, the TSX/Euro Accord platform should work nicely. After all it handles great as is.

 

Acura/Honda just has bad product planning... With the 09 TL having SH-AWD and just about everything else the RL has, they effectively have killed the RL till the next generation.

They really need to revamp the launch strategy for their model lineup... For a company that making billions of dollars, you'd think they'd have that shit figured out by now...

 

Here's a simple strategy to help Honda/Acura make waves in 09/10:

1. The RL and TL should only be sold with SH-AWD
2. If #1 happens, the TL can be in the base 270 - 290 HP range, and a TL-S in the 330 HP area.
3. The RL should be about 375 - 400 HP area.
4. Styling: boy has Honda been conservative, not wanting to take a risk. I know on another thread someone photoshopped a new front end on the new TL that looks terrific. So I say style the car so that they are with or above their peers (the ES/M car with the TL and the GS/Q ship for the RL)
5. Sell the TSX as a RWD car. Now it can be AWD, but RWD plus take the Accord Euro R and make it a TSX..... Just make sure the luxury content is there.

Simple fixes. But I might be repeating what all Acura owners/loyalists would want.

 

The RL's styling is already suicide to the model itself but, such a TL would be another nail in this RL generations coffin.

 

I really thought with the 05 RL they would have gone 350-400hp, but they didn't. We really like our 05 RL but it SHOULD have more power. THE SHAWD is nice but not required for California driving, a simple rwd option would be better all round. Including gas.

I'm starting to think they difference between honda/acura is going to largely come down to the trimmings.

 

That's always been the case for most part but even then that is begining to change since all entry level cars are getting features previously reserved for luxury cars.

Honestly I just bought an 08 accord coupe loaded. Has all the same features of the current gen TL and then a few extras. I was set on a TL but at the end of the day I couldn't justify the big price difference for no real added benefit.

That's the scary thing because that alone puts Acura in a weaker position add in the fact that the styling on the 09 TL is um well lets just say it probably could of been done better and I'm starting to believe that Acura is going to be hurting the next few years.

Time will tell though.

 

Great choice! Did you get the V6? Just wondering what your final price was before tax title etc..

Acura will always have customers because there is a certain clientele who always shops for the badge, not necessarily the content of the car. There are members here who cannot, for example, bring themselves to buy a Hyundai, or a Pontiac. Even though they admit that they like some of the products those companies offer. So, there will be an awful lot of ugly TLs on the road come October.

 

RWD Accord? Never going to happen. Nor should it.

 

i wish the coupe was a bit smaller, but it was inevitable that the sedan was gonna get bigger because that's the trend now...cars are getting bigger and bigger. and i, too, am scared as to how big the next accord, camry, etc will be.

i'm surprised the TSX didn't get any larger than it did...i was worried because i thought the 1g was a great size for the car.

as for the OP's questions, they've pretty much been answered. the answers and problems are all over the place. and we can only hope that honda goes through with what they've been saying about the next RL.

and congrats, Mike00, on the new accord coupe. it's one of my most favorite cars on the road today.

 

I agree, I think Honda had it right before, like when the 3G TL came out in 2003 as a 2004 model, if you went and looked at a fully loaded Accord EX-V6, you could still tell the difference if compared with the much nicer styling of the TL. But now, something is happening where Honda made their Accord way too luxurious to compete with the 09TL, even though we haven't really seen the 09TL so we really shouldn't be talking right now but it does seem like its gonna be right in there with the Accord. The way I think of it is, if I am gonna spend 5k-10k more on a luxury brand it needs to be very unique in comparison to its parent company entry level option.

I definately agree that Nissan/Infiniti and Toyota/Lexus are doing a better job of watching out for this although, a new fully loaded 2009 Maxima SV is getting right up in there with Infiniti and I think Toyota's fully loaded Avalon XLE/Limited could definately be taken for a Lexus....

 

I also think that the ES is basically a Camry with more options on it. Those cars have almost everything in common.

 

Honda has been very careful to not place the Accord in a position to overtake the TL and I really do not think the 8G Accord vs 4G TL will be much different.

 

Was the V6. Honestly I know dealer and they cut me a deal you won't find anywhere. So suffice to say I paid a lot a less then anybody else is.

Beautiful car though I just couldn't justify the TL especially with redesign next month. Buying brand new I'd get killed on resale down the road. Not that I buy a car for that but well 5 years into the next gen product line with the following gen almost out is going to be worse then I would normally see.

 

Well aside from the top end features of SHAWD (which I wouldnt be interested in) the lack of considerablly more power then the accord makes it very close.

I realize the lower end of the market is more competitive but I wouldnt be surprised if the accord gets closer to 300 in the coming years. Then where does that put the TL and RL with their v6s?

Seems to mee, if they keep pushing the accord v6 up they are either going to have to get some F1 equal v6 in the TL/RL with 100+hp/l or go with a v8. Then maybe with the v8 they could do some cyl shut down.