103 Octane
04-27-2005, 03:03 PM
#1
Suzuka Master
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Pittsburgh, PA
Age: 48
Posts: 9,940
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
103 Octane
Got a SUNOCO around me that sells race fuels.. 100 Octane 101 and 103 all LEADED.
I assume all race fuels are leaded?..no?
I assume all race fuels are leaded?..no?
04-27-2005, 06:18 PM
#5
Drifting
Originally Posted by Smitty
Got a SUNOCO around me that sells race fuels.. 100 Octane 101 and 103 all LEADED.
I assume all race fuels are leaded?..no?
I assume all race fuels are leaded?..no?
If i were you, i'd look for "unleaded" race fuels.
"danmartin" said they run all the way up to 110.
04-28-2005, 12:06 PM
#6
Burning Brakes
Join Date: Feb 2005
Age: 72
Posts: 1,024
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Just stay away from the airports, carl...
A very common fuel for airplanes is 130 octane "low lead".
130 octane LL packs a punch, it's blue in color, and smells one hell of a lot better than autogas. Not much price difference, either, as compared to 93 octane name brands.
But "low lead" is a relative term. Because 99.99999% of our engines are air cooled, they expand and contract a lot, expanding when the power output is high, and contracting when the engine is at idle.
The piston/bore clearance in your CL is probably on the order of .001". Our airplanes are more like .007-.010". We depend upon the rings to take up the clearance, and is the biggest reason why airplane engines are comparatively hard to start as compared to a water cooled engine.
We have special problems, particurlarly in lubricating the valve train, due to the unusual attitudes we can encounter as compared to a car engine, whichhopefully spends it life in only one attitude.
as a likely comparison, you might encounter lubrication problems also, say, if you put your CL on its' roof and leave the engine running.
To combat this, we use a very high amount of lead in the 130 LL which coats the valve train as a film, almost as a "dry" lubricant.
We use the term "low lead" because the amount of lead is about 5 times less than av gas had in 1975. But 130 LL avgas still has about 7-8 times the amount of lead than car gas ever had, even before catalytic converters were even required.
I bring this up because, back when I was able to fly and instruct, hardly a month went by when I didn't notice a Ferrari or the like at the airport, tanking up on 130 low lead.
I talked to some of these exotic owners, and they were basically ambivilent about the possible damages to their expensive machinery. Most replied that they didn't care, saying the extra 37 octane points were worth the extra kick in the pants the fuel delivered. I soon gave up talking to these guys. I could only conclude that just because one is rich, it doesn't necessarily follow that they are also smart.
I wonder, just what would a valve job and four new catalytic converters cost for a V-12 engine?
130 octane LL packs a punch, it's blue in color, and smells one hell of a lot better than autogas. Not much price difference, either, as compared to 93 octane name brands.
But "low lead" is a relative term. Because 99.99999% of our engines are air cooled, they expand and contract a lot, expanding when the power output is high, and contracting when the engine is at idle.
The piston/bore clearance in your CL is probably on the order of .001". Our airplanes are more like .007-.010". We depend upon the rings to take up the clearance, and is the biggest reason why airplane engines are comparatively hard to start as compared to a water cooled engine.
We have special problems, particurlarly in lubricating the valve train, due to the unusual attitudes we can encounter as compared to a car engine, whichhopefully spends it life in only one attitude.
as a likely comparison, you might encounter lubrication problems also, say, if you put your CL on its' roof and leave the engine running.
To combat this, we use a very high amount of lead in the 130 LL which coats the valve train as a film, almost as a "dry" lubricant.
We use the term "low lead" because the amount of lead is about 5 times less than av gas had in 1975. But 130 LL avgas still has about 7-8 times the amount of lead than car gas ever had, even before catalytic converters were even required.
I bring this up because, back when I was able to fly and instruct, hardly a month went by when I didn't notice a Ferrari or the like at the airport, tanking up on 130 low lead.
I talked to some of these exotic owners, and they were basically ambivilent about the possible damages to their expensive machinery. Most replied that they didn't care, saying the extra 37 octane points were worth the extra kick in the pants the fuel delivered. I soon gave up talking to these guys. I could only conclude that just because one is rich, it doesn't necessarily follow that they are also smart.
I wonder, just what would a valve job and four new catalytic converters cost for a V-12 engine?
04-28-2005, 01:58 PM
#7
Comptech Freak
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Toronto, Canada
Age: 40
Posts: 6,555
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by Alin10123
Not sure if the leaded fuel will damage anything htough long term.
If i were you, i'd look for "unleaded" race fuels.
"danmartin" said they run all the way up to 110.
If i were you, i'd look for "unleaded" race fuels.
"danmartin" said they run all the way up to 110.
even one tank of LEADED gas will blow up the Cat converter right away
back in the early 90s my dad's BMW 525i and MB 230E were using leaded gas, then unleaded gas came out and you can switch over to the unleaded with a slightly mod at the dealer
but that really sucks a lot of power since changing to the unleaded and esp for the 230E....even thou you can use unleaded but you still have to use leaded once every 3 tanks of unleaded to keep the performance
to put leaded fuel into ur car needs modi with the engine so they can be comprimosed
Trending Topics
05-03-2005, 09:28 AM
#12
Team Owner
iTrader: (1)
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Leesburg, Virginia
Age: 41
Posts: 36,474
Received 249 Likes
on
175 Posts
Smitty do NOT PUT THAT LEADED SHIT IN YOUR CAR. If Racing fuel is cheap shit (not saying Sunoco is) it will destroy your injectors 
You can order VP high octane unleaded fuel online. Stick with VP Streetblaze 103 or VP Motorsport 103.
You can order VP high octane unleaded fuel online. Stick with VP Streetblaze 103 or VP Motorsport 103.
05-03-2005, 10:10 AM
#13
Suzuka Master
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Pittsburgh, PA
Age: 48
Posts: 9,940
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by mrsteve
You can order VP high octane unleaded fuel online. Stick with VP Streetblaze 103 or VP Motorsport 103.
05-03-2005, 01:04 PM
#15
Suzuka Master
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Pittsburgh, PA
Age: 48
Posts: 9,940
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
321 Mars-Valencia Road
Mars PA 16046
103 unleaded Motorsport
5 Gallon $45.00 + tax (.48 per gallon)
15 Gallon $122.55
30 Gallon $211.20
54 Gallon $339.66
THe diff. between Motorsport and Streetblaze is that Streetblaze has MTBE (chemical in it for street use).
www.VPracingfuels.com
This Puruis Brothers is 25 miles North of me.... they will not ship to me.
Mars PA 16046
103 unleaded Motorsport
5 Gallon $45.00 + tax (.48 per gallon)
15 Gallon $122.55
30 Gallon $211.20
54 Gallon $339.66
THe diff. between Motorsport and Streetblaze is that Streetblaze has MTBE (chemical in it for street use).
www.VPracingfuels.com
This Puruis Brothers is 25 miles North of me.... they will not ship to me.
05-03-2005, 01:32 PM
#16
Team Owner
iTrader: (1)
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Leesburg, Virginia
Age: 41
Posts: 36,474
Received 249 Likes
on
175 Posts
wtf do u need race fuel for anyways? You'll start messing with the e-manage settings end up backing out too much timing and detonate like a mofo @ 9psi.
:ibsmitty's"iblewitup"post:
:ibsmitty's"iblewitup"post:
05-03-2005, 02:20 PM
#17
Suzuka Master
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Pittsburgh, PA
Age: 48
Posts: 9,940
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by mrsteve
wtf do u need race fuel for anyways?
see initial post (POST #1)
it was a question... for discussion.. ya know.
05-03-2005, 02:40 PM
#18
05-03-2005, 04:04 PM
#19
Suzuka Master
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Pittsburgh, PA
Age: 48
Posts: 9,940
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
red color is off road
blue color is road use..
the red contains sulfur I do believe.. the blue does not.. I could have that backwards..
blue color is road use..
the red contains sulfur I do believe.. the blue does not.. I could have that backwards..
05-03-2005, 05:40 PM
#22
///M POWER
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: West Bloomfield, MI
Age: 39
Posts: 15,299
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like
on
1 Post
Originally Posted by mrsteve
Well on that note... I've put 110 unleaded in my car at the track. Didn't make a single damn difference in my times. The shit smells funny though... and it's blue 
should help ya since ya got a blower
05-03-2005, 09:58 PM
#23
Team Owner
iTrader: (1)
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Leesburg, Virginia
Age: 41
Posts: 36,474
Received 249 Likes
on
175 Posts
Originally Posted by darrinb
should help ya since ya got a blower
It didn't. Without something to tune the ECU with to allow for less timing retard the higher octane won't help much if any.
05-04-2005, 07:19 AM
#24
Suzuka Master
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Pittsburgh, PA
Age: 48
Posts: 9,940
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by mrsteve
It didn't. Without something to tune the ECU with to allow for less timing retard the higher octane won't help much if any.
e-manage will do... but like we discussed you would have to load a different map after you ran that expensive tank of gas out of the car.
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
gavriil
Automotive News
11
02-04-2005 11:51 AM
103, 110, buy, dealers, fuel, ga, gas, octane, pa, pennsylvania, pittsburgh, racing, streetblaze, sunoco, vp
