Undying Dreams

iTrader: (3)

Hello photo section, this is my first thread here and I have some questions for the folks that have these cameras. I hope this lineup hasn't been discussed before

Little bit of what I do with my camera:

I currently have a Canon XS, which Canon has taken off it's linup. I've had it for about 3 years and it's been pretty good to me. However since it's outdated and I'm looking into getting better results, an upgrade is in order during the coming months.

I'm a student and amateur photographer so I use the camera for many different things. I don't shoot video, so it's not really a concern for me as to which has better quality. I am looking into expanding my skills and possibly trying to sell my photography in the future.

Besides the obvious specs of each camera, (18MP, 5 frames per sec., ISO, sensor), which should I be considering more?

Being that I'm young, I'm leaning towards the T4i because of all the new goodies, touchscreen, vari-angle, the new DIGIC 5, ect. However, the 7D has a 100% viewing angle, compared to the 60D and T4i's 96%, is that something I should fret over? The 60D and 7D also have the electronic level sensor, is that something you use on a regular basis or not?

Basically, which one will suit my needs better and above all, last me the longest?

If I missed anything I'll either edit my post or just add another post.

Thanks in advance for anyone who replies.

jupitersolo

Outdated is not a reason to change cameras. Your XS will take great pictures for many years to come.

What are the better results you are looking? You haven't said anything about what you shoot, as to what make the XS a body that you can't use.

I could see if you are in sports and the fps can't keep up with what you're trying to capture. Or you're into long exposure photography now and need a camera with better noise control, IQ and more camera control.

To me it sounds like you just want another camera body. I can't blame you for that, they are my crack!

Now my main question, what lenses do you use? It all always BEST to buy better glass than a new camera body. It can add to your current body in performance, more than a camera body. Plus it will be with you longer than any camera body.

Undying Dreams

iTrader: (3)

I would like better noise control and overall quality. I don't usually shoot any high speed subjects, but I have done long exposures, luckily the XS has Bulb

And yes, I would like a newer camera body, the new sensor, vari-angle and touchscreen is really eating at me.

My current lineup of lenses are the kit 18-55, wide angle 10-22, tele 55-250 and 60mm macro, all Canon lenses. When I get the new body I'll be getting the 50mm.

jupitersolo

Then I would remove the 7D from your list and get the other two in yours hands. The T4i will be about the same as your XS in size. The 60D is bigger, you'll want to make sure which feels better.

Me, I never like the Rebel series cameras, for me too small and controls in menus, not on body as the 60D is.

Get into a store and play with them if you can.

Undying Dreams

iTrader: (3)

Yeah I was going to try sometime soon, I want to use the touchscreen on the T4i before I buy it, if it's slow and clunky I'll be passing and getting the 60D.

Undying Dreams

iTrader: (3)

If anyone has additional comments/suggestions, feel free to comment

asianspec

iTrader: (1)

I agree with jup. I learned the hard way of things. I shouldve build my lens library first before upgrading my camera body. Now I am starting to do my lenses. With that being said I love my 7D and don't regret getting it. Even though the 7d is older than the 60d and the T4i, I still prefer the 7d over the others. But all in all it does depend on what type of photography that you are taking. Anything sport-like you have to really look into the 7D with its 8fps. The 60d really doesn't make sense to me just because the 7d is still the top of the line crop sensored. As for the T4i, it's in very par with the 60d, with just the difference of better noise control. Hope this helps.

asianspec

iTrader: (1)

I dunno if you are close to south fla, but if you are I don't mind you looking at my 7d.

Undying Dreams

iTrader: (3)

Nah, I'm father north, thanks for the offer though, and yes, that does help.

is300eater

why do you need the touch screen?

Mizouse

only thing i would like the touchscreen for is reviewing images.

anyways yes like everyone has said, lens first then body.

if you must go with a new body, figure out exactly what is limiting you with your current body in terms of images and then compare that to what the newer body will give you.


and you think your body is outdated? im shooting with 1D mark IIN. those are from 2005!

and i love it in every way except high ISO.. ohh and battery life.

Mizouse

but yes, after using a X0D sized body and 1D body, i cant go back to a rebel. they're just too small in size and the ergonomics are the worst. also the viewfinder is tiny! but those things while they dont really make a difference in your images, make for a more enjoyable experience of taking photos.

MWalsh9152

I agree with Miz, the Rebels felt like a kids toy in my hands. However, unless there is a limiting factor that is making you upgrade the body, I too would recommend upgrading your glass first.

You dont even have to do it expensively with used glass. The Canon 17-55is is an awesome lens, but I used a sigma 24-60 that I picked up for $275 as my workhorse lens for several years, and it produced some beautiful images. I only upgraded because I wanted to try the IS. A 70-200 F/4L can be had for >$500 used

Undying Dreams

iTrader: (3)

Mizouse, you hit it on the head, I want to upgrade the body for the sake of enjoyment while taking the pictures but...what's really pulling me in is the new DIGIC 5, higher but more controllable noise control, and more megapixels.

The touchscreen only adds to the fun but from watching videos it seems A LOT faster to make adjustments on the fly. Also I'm looking into a flash and I don't think my XS has a wireless trigger built in.

After looking into the cameras and rumors of upcoming ones, it seems the 70D is set to be released in Sept., and a 7D II after that.

(Looks like the 70D will be better built and possibly a magnesium body, as well as a processor upgrade, maybe touchscreen as well? And the 7D II has a FF rumor being tossed around, maybe a beginner's FF? Wishful thinking but I'm anxious to see.)

I don't plan on upgrading till about Nov. (hopefully Black Friday warrants some awesome deals ) but I like to plan ahead so I know what I want/need when I go to buy it.

mdkxtreme

Don't know how much my opinion is as sound as everyone else on this board, but I'll give it a shot.

I was in the EXACT same position as you looking to upgrade my XTi. My big three was the T4i, 60D, and 7D. It took me about 4 days of constant research and mulling to finally make up my mind.

7D is a hell of a camera. I've borrowed one to shoot my car and I love it. It's fast but it's too expensive for just an avid photographer like me. I don't know crap about photography and I don't take that much pictures so a 7D would be overkill for me.

That leaves the 60D and the T4i. After exhausting comparison and consideration, I ended up buying a T4i. I love the continuous focusing video mode, the in camera HDR mode, better ISO, and it's CHEAPER. For a not so savvy "photographer," I felt like the T4i is more forgiving.

I TOTALLY agree with those that says the Rebel series feel like a toy. This was the main reason why I had to mull it over because holding an xxD series feels sooo much better than the Rebel series.

I mean, I have enough money for a 5D MKII, but what the heck am I going to do with it? I boiled it down to what I was capable of and that guided me into buying a T4i.

Undying Dreams

iTrader: (3)

I appreciate all comments

I myself don't get out too much but I really want to and I think having a more capable camera and new one will get me out more. I know what you mean about the overkill, 5D is a super camera though, just not affordable for me.

As of now I'm waiting to see what Canon has to offer in September, rumor has it the new 70D and/or 7D II is coming out

I'd really like to have the 70D but if 7D II is a FF (rumor) and affordable, I'll go for that.

It wouldn't be overkill for me because I know it would last me a long time and I plan on doing more and more in the photography field.

mdkxtreme

It's great going full frame but you sure you can afford that hobby? L lenses gets really expensive

70D sounds very promising. I would have hold off on buying the T4i if it wasn't for my upcoming honeymoon

asianspec

iTrader: (1)

sorry the irony. I heard it somewhere that if they do go FF for it, now it will be called the 6D. ill see if i can find the link But i expect something like that to be more than 2k

Undying Dreams

iTrader: (3)

Yeah I figured, rumors all are

I'll most likely end up with a 70D, which is fine by me.

Edit: I honestly had no idea FF cameras only seated EF lenses.

Guess I'll have to stick with my cropped cameras.

Undying Dreams

iTrader: (3)

I do have one more question, how "weather/water proof" are the cameras and L lenses? Can you shoot in a hard rain or is it best to just keep it away from water?

jupitersolo

The bodies you are looking at, not that protected, the higher end the model, the more protection. The "L" have better protection than the regular lens. If hard rain, look at Optech rain covers.

Mizouse

Not all Ls are weather sealed either.

If you wan to shoot in the rain w/o a cover.
Only a canon 1D plus a weather sealed lens (such as a 24-70 or 70-200 2.8 IS) can handle it.

Worked out nicely for me in China when I got caught in a rain storm.

Everyone kept asking "you're still using your camera?" "it's not gonna break?"

Undying Dreams

iTrader: (3)

Thanks guys

You've all been a great help!

is300eater

IMO, If you think you'll ever be in situations where you NEED to still take pictures in pouring rain, there are decent point & shoots that are water proof, I believe up to 10 feet. I'd just have one of those handy if the situation arise

asianspec

iTrader: (1)

A 7d is a workhorse and weatherproofed as well. Digitalrev killed theirs and still works

asianspec

iTrader: (1)

7D very durable. Rebels won't stand a chance.

Mizouse

It may be weather proofed but it's not the same as current 1D series cameras.

Iirc it has the same sealing as a film body from back in 1994

But I'm sure it's good thou.

Undying Dreams

iTrader: (3)

That durability test is insane

Okay I've thought of another question...

Canon 70-200mm f/2.8 or stick with the f/4?

asianspec

iTrader: (1)

Depends on you. The f/4 is much lighter then the f/2.8. But for bokeh then the f/2.8 is what you want.

mdkxtreme

I've read that some people feel like the heaviness of the 2.8 takes away the fun of photography.

jupitersolo

I at one time owned all of Canon's 70-200mm (minus the newest 2.8 version II). I found it, the sharpest of the bunch was the 70-200mm 4.0. When I put it on the 5D is just shined, with the right light. I think the 4.0 with some of today's body, you don't need the 2.8 for low light.

Mizouse

If you can afford it and can handle te weight then get the 2.8.

It's a 1 stop different in light.

Mizouse

Those people need to goto the gym or something.

I can handle
A 1D2n + 70-200 2.8 just fine..

Mizouse

While that it's true it is the sharpest and the high ISO of today's bodies.... I'd rather have the 2.8 to use the extra sensitivity in the AF sensor with 2.8 or faster lenses

Undying Dreams

iTrader: (3)

Thanks guys, I'll stick with the f/4, if I need it to be faster (doubtful) I'll upgrade in the future.

Undying Dreams

iTrader: (3)

Well, I bump this thread today because I have been watching and reading many reviews between the 60D and T4i. I'm really torn between the two

Reasons I'm leaning towards the 60D:

-Weather sealed
-LCD on top
-Adjustment wheel on the back
-Bigger and more solid body
-Built in level (because I suck at leveling my photos)

Reasons I'm leaning towards the T4i:

-Touch screen
-Filters, HDR & handheld night mode
-Great for video (autofocus)
-Lighter


And here I come to the 60D pros. I have an XS still and I don't have the features I listed. I don't have the LCD screen up top so I've never had the pleasure of using it, nor do I know if I will use it if I had it. I've never taken my camera into rain or the likes, and if I did, I would surely cover it for general fear of electronics vs water.

The adjustment wheel looks like it would be a nice addition I would use because I often find myself adjusting exposure and holding down a button and then using the wheel on top can be a bit cumbersome. The wheel would be great for fast adjustments.

I would enjoy the level very much because after viewing my shots in PS or LR, I realize how skewed they are. I try to line up things as best as I can through the viewfinder but to no avail.

Now for the T4i...touch screen looks to be a huge improvement over traditional scrolling with buttons. All the videos I have seen showcase the speed of the screen, much like that of an phone or tablet. I enjoy my iPhone and the fluid responsiveness but the "buttons" are much larger then the 3" screen on the T4i. I fear I will press things I intend not to and become frustrated with it, thus killing my strongest appeal to the T4. I also listed filters and such as a pro because I think they'd be fun to mess with every once in a while; also after seeing "is300eater"'s handheld night time shots from his Sony, I would like to see the results Canon can offer.

Although I listed the T4i for having great video, I rarely do video, but I listed it because my only other means of video are my iPhone or Contour ROAM. Having a DLSR would be great for when I do want video.

However, I can only see myself using videos while recording something for family, or recording cars. I don't see myself using the autofocus to it's full potential but it's still a plus. During a review video, I saw how slow the autofocus really was, but to be fair, the reviewer had it in a dim room and the objects were close to the camera.

During the next few weeks, I plan on going to a local store to get a feel for both cameras and hopefully come up with a verdict. I will update the thread with which one I buy.

I plan on calling Canon tonight about their Loyalty Program (thanks asianspec!) to see what I can get. I'm not sure if they give you money for your old camera or if they just give you the 20% discount off of what you purchase. I have my Canon XS and my mother's older film camera. Hopefully I get get a cheap new camera directly through Canon!

Thanks for reading! All comments and suggestions welcome as I am still torn between the two!

MattB07TL

I have the Canon 70-200mm f/2.8 it is a little bulky to haul around but weight isn't a huge issue. I would get the 2.8 if you can afford it, the IQ is extremely sharp and the lens is very well constructed. I also have the Canon 60D, as far Crop sensor go its a decent camera. Personally though if I was to do it over I would go with the 7D Since it has faster FPS, Dual processors,Better AF system and metal body. The one huge downfall for me on the 7D is it only takes CF Cards

Undying Dreams

iTrader: (3)

Well...I think I'm dead-set on the 60D. Camera store is out the window. I'll soon be taking advantage of the Canon Loyalty Program

MattB07TL

^ Sweet!!

henrylee

7d if you have the money or just get a 60d.