Lincoln: MKS news **2011 Revealed (page 5)**
#121
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I like it, a lot. I just wonder if its enough to bring Lincoln back to profitability and pry buyers away from BMW, MB, Infiniti and Lexus. IMO, No. I think it will still mostly appeal to seniors.
#122
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Originally Posted by Beltfed
I like it, classy looking (but not ground breaking).....wouldn't be surprised to see a Sport version at some point with less chrome.
Maybe 2010 when that Turbo 6 shows up, hopefully making nice HP.
Maybe 2010 when that Turbo 6 shows up, hopefully making nice HP.
#123
The sizzle in the Steak
Originally Posted by revitupwriteitoff
me? why?
#124
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Originally Posted by Loseit
I was thinking something similar....except i would expect (hope) that they have a more powerful version of the V8 in the S80. I think the V8 will make the car more appealing to the american public. Whether they buy it or not is a different story but I think most people like to know it is there.
Indeed, the RL uses a V6, AWD, 290hp....but the styling is kind of bland.
Also remember that Turbo 6 in the concept MKR made 415hp/400lb torque.
I wouldn't mind seeing that over a V8.....but 415 might be a bit optimistic. Guessing it will be around 370-380 give or take.
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Originally Posted by Loseit
I was thinking something similar....except i would expect (hope) that they have a more powerful version of the V8 in the S80. I think the V8 will make the car more appealing to the american public. Whether they buy it or not is a different story but I think most people like to know it is there.
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Originally Posted by unlemming
Overall I like it, but the lincoln emblem is just...wrong. It doesn't fit anything but big boxy continentals.
#129
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Originally Posted by Beltfed
Yeah, but fuel isn't getting any cheaper and I think buyer's in this $ category do take gas mileage into consideration.
Indeed, the RL uses a V6, AWD, 290hp....but the styling is kind of bland.
Also remember that Turbo 6 in the concept MKR made 415hp/400lb torque.
I wouldn't mind seeing that over a V8.....but 415 might be a bit optimistic. Guessing it will be around 370-380 give or take.
Indeed, the RL uses a V6, AWD, 290hp....but the styling is kind of bland.
Also remember that Turbo 6 in the concept MKR made 415hp/400lb torque.
I wouldn't mind seeing that over a V8.....but 415 might be a bit optimistic. Guessing it will be around 370-380 give or take.
#135
What Would Don Draper Do?
Originally Posted by titan
Are you serious? I'm personally impressed that they've maintained such a historic emblem without much change. It looks great in between this new, semi-retro grill.
even though the emblem does look old, they've done a good job of incorporating it into the new design.
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I've given it thought, seen the real-world pictures, & I still think it's ugly.
the back end is too high off the ground, the tail lights are fugly, the front facia looks like the bastard child of an old Saturn & a BMW, everything on the interior is blocky & flat (very 2-D), and one small this is the "S" after "MK" isn't the same size, font (not even the same font italicized), or alignment (it looks a little off vertical center to me)
the back end is too high off the ground, the tail lights are fugly, the front facia looks like the bastard child of an old Saturn & a BMW, everything on the interior is blocky & flat (very 2-D), and one small this is the "S" after "MK" isn't the same size, font (not even the same font italicized), or alignment (it looks a little off vertical center to me)
#137
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Originally Posted by deandorsey
i dont like it, and lincoln interiors are retro ugly to me...
#139
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At $38,000 it makes me wonder. That's not much for a very sexy car.
Consider that BMWs are getting very expensive with the $8000 bump they had earlier this year. People have already spent their home equity lines to buy their German lux cars and they aren't getting any cheaper.
Also consider the weakening dollar and how the German cars continue to get relatively more expensive to everything else.
Add in the fact that Lincoln actually has better build quality than the Germans. (If I recall correctly.)
So ... let's put some numbers to this: $38000 will buy you an average priced bottom-end 3 series. Or you can go full size Lincoln. I'm sure optioned out this will be high 40s, but in BMW terms that still means you're driving a 3-series. A nice 3 series, but no M3 so in my eyes you're still a poser.
For those of us who are fiscally conservative its an interesting option versus the RL.
Consider that BMWs are getting very expensive with the $8000 bump they had earlier this year. People have already spent their home equity lines to buy their German lux cars and they aren't getting any cheaper.
Also consider the weakening dollar and how the German cars continue to get relatively more expensive to everything else.
Add in the fact that Lincoln actually has better build quality than the Germans. (If I recall correctly.)
So ... let's put some numbers to this: $38000 will buy you an average priced bottom-end 3 series. Or you can go full size Lincoln. I'm sure optioned out this will be high 40s, but in BMW terms that still means you're driving a 3-series. A nice 3 series, but no M3 so in my eyes you're still a poser.
For those of us who are fiscally conservative its an interesting option versus the RL.
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^ Yeah. It honestly has me considering this car. I think the next gen MKZ will be a hot car too, once it gets this styling treatment. In a apples to apples comparison to the STS, style wise, I like this car a lot better.
#141
The sizzle in the Steak
Those real world pics make it look even better!!!!
Great job Lincoln...this will be a big seller!
The center console of the interior is the only thing that is "wrong" with the car.
It's too bland, and looks a little cheap. Perhaps in person the materials will make it appear better.
Great job Lincoln...this will be a big seller!
The center console of the interior is the only thing that is "wrong" with the car.
It's too bland, and looks a little cheap. Perhaps in person the materials will make it appear better.
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This is definetly a step in the right direction for Lincoln. I am curious how it drives and performs. I think that the side emblem should be removed and there are a few details in the interior that could be improved on. It would be nice if the they offered a Sport version of the TT V6. Lincoln would get some credibility if SVT/FPV added some Brembo brakes up front, summer tires on 19's, and a sport tuned suspension. Test the car at the 'Ring to get the car to perform right!
#143
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http://www.lincoln.com/reachhigher
I rarely ever (read: never) click on banner ads but I was at some site today reading about the developments in the House and saw the MKS ad and clicked it for some reason.. I think I wanted to see what the car looks like, since I had no idea. I was checking out the walk-around - really nice site and presentation btw - and I suddenly felt like the background looked familiar.. the building with the white lobby and "spiral staircase" type of ceiling is where I work! Just thought it was interesting. Fitting, given the car is built in Chicago.
I rarely ever (read: never) click on banner ads but I was at some site today reading about the developments in the House and saw the MKS ad and clicked it for some reason.. I think I wanted to see what the car looks like, since I had no idea. I was checking out the walk-around - really nice site and presentation btw - and I suddenly felt like the background looked familiar.. the building with the white lobby and "spiral staircase" type of ceiling is where I work! Just thought it was interesting. Fitting, given the car is built in Chicago.
#147
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Originally Posted by charliemike
Think I'd rather have a Genesis.
#148
First Drive: 2009 Lincoln MKS
http://www.edmunds.com/insideline/do...hotopanel..1.*
Lincoln's New Flagship Sets Sail for Parts Unknown
By Daniel Pund, Senior Editor, Detroit Email
Date posted: 06-04-2008
The 2009 Lincoln MKS might just represent the future direction of Lincoln. Or maybe it doesn't. We frankly just don't know what to expect out of Lincoln anymore.
After all, Lincoln introduced the rear-wheel-drive LS sport sedan at the end of the last millennium to great fanfare and a fair amount of corporate chest-thumping. And then, well, nothing. When the company quietly euthanized the car recently, nobody shed a tear — or even noticed, really.
Lincoln has spent the last couple of years staring at its own belly button. It dredged up its most iconic design — the 1961-'69 Continental — and used it to inspire a seemingly endless series of retro concept cars. The only current evidence of this age of self-consciously retro design has been the return of dual-cowl dashboards and square gauges in production Lincolns. Also the historic Zephyr name made a one-year reappearance.
And now we're starting over again with the 2009 Lincoln MKS.
The Middle Road
If the 2009 MKS indicates anything about Lincoln, it could be that the middle road might be the place to begin a return to relevance. What Lincoln has produced is a very well-equipped, visually interesting Ford Taurus. Let our former mortal enemy, Cadillac, spend a boatload of cash developing new rear-wheel drive-platforms, Lincoln seems to be saying. Let them chase the customers who know what the Nürburgring is.
If it helps you draw a bead on the MKS, think of it as more Lexus ES than IS. Like the ES, the MKS is based on a populist sedan, then endowed with every possible option at the company's disposal.
What this means in the world of Ford is that the MKS is the newest product based on the big and primarily front-drive D3 platform. The D3 was initially designed by Volvo for its big sedan and has since sprouted various Ford Motor Company products including the Taurus, Taurus X, Mercury Sable and, most recently the big-box-on-wheels, the Ford Flex.
From the Taurus/Sable comes the 112.9-inch wheelbase. From the Flex comes a reconfigured rear suspension that allows the vehicle to comfortably accommodate the huge-diameter wheels that designers and marketers insist upon. The MKS shares its transverse, 24-valve Duratec V6, six-speed automatic and optional all-wheel drive with a whole pack of FoMoCo vehicles.
Bored
Befitting the luxury version of the platform, the MKS is motivated by a more powerful version of the Duratec motor. The basic architecture and technologies remain the same as the now-ubiquitous 3.5-liter V6, but it's been bored slightly to increase displacement to 3.7 liters. This pushes output to a maximum 275 horsepower at 6,250 rpm and 276 pound-feet of torque at 4,500 rpm. That's 12 hp more and 27 lb-ft more than the output of the 3.5-liter V6 in the Taurus. Of course, it achieves those numbers using premium fuel. If you use 87 octane in the MKS, the peak power drops to 273 hp and torque totals 270 lb-ft.
It's a good thing that the motor gets a little bump because until the twin-turbocharged 3.5-liter V6 arrives next year with about 340 hp, the 3.7-liter is the only available engine for the MKS. And it's got a substantial 4,276 pounds of Lincoln to pull around. That's the kind of weight you get with an all-wheel-drive car that's as long as a minivan and loaded to the roof with various gadgets and doodads.
In addition to the power bump, Ford has also tightened up the six-speed automatic's torque converter to try to give this big boy some punchy throttle response. Of course, the MKS still feels a little flat-footed in passing maneuvers until the smooth-shifting six-speed drops a couple of gears and forces the V6 into the fat part of its power band. The transmission also allows for manual shifting with automatic rev-matching on downshifts. In SST mode, the tranny drops a gear automatically when you dip into the brakes and will hold gears longer under acceleration.
The EPA figures the standard front-drive MKS will return 17 mpg in the city and travel 24 miles on a gallon in highway driving. The all-wheel-drive version is estimated to return 16 mpg city/23 mpg highway. That's just a smidge better than the 16 mpg city/22 mpg highway that the Acura RL's 3.7-liter V6 delivers.
Nürburgring Lap Time Not Available
The suspension is closely related to that of the Flex, and it has been tuned for a middle-of-the-road compromise between ride and handling. It's a nice mix if you're not into scrubbing your tires bald on canyon roads. According to Vehicle Development Chief Engineer Jim Baumbick, the reconfigured multilink rear suspension allows for more accurate tuning than other D3 vehicles and allows the car to carry big, flashy (and optional) 20-inch polished wheels while maintaining a compliant ride.
And indeed, even with the 20s and low-profile tires, the ride quality remains quiet and smooth without the harshness sometimes associated with such a setup. The handling? Well, it's what you make of it. We drove some of Virginia's swaying rural two-lanes and found the MKS very easy to drive smoothly and accurately. The steering is nicely weighted at speed. The first few degrees of body roll are snubbed efficiently. So if you drive with some sensitivity, the big sedan flows along competently. Abrupt steering inputs and tighter corners aren't going to be all that much fun, though.
Lincoln-ness
After so many fits and starts in Lincoln styling, we haven't a clue what a Lincoln is supposed to look like. Head Ford design man for these United States, Peter Horbury, reckons he does, and he's created a sort of salad bar approach to future Lincoln designs. Horbury has defined seven design cues inspired by vintage Lincolns, including the split or "bow-wave" grille that is supposed to call to mind the 1941 Continental. Others include clean, uncluttered flanks and horizontal, full-width taillamps.
The MKS is the first production Lincoln to be produced under this new design regime — or at least partly produced. The car was already well into development by the time Horbury defined the cues.
We're not wholly convinced that the MKS has real beauty, but it at least presents itself convincingly as a luxury car. It's a good sign that the first obvious evidence of the MKS's origins is that annoying bulge in the floor pan immediately in front of the front seats that all D3-based cars have. (It covers a structural crossmember.) When you're driving into the mid-$40,000 price range, the less customers see of this car's Taurus origins, the better.
Now With a Delicious Nougat Center
It's too bad Lincoln can't turn the MKS inside-out. The interior is the car's greatest strength. In contrast to the dual-pod retro-ism and cheap-looking nickel-color plastic of recent years, the MKS goes a thoroughly modern route that is, dare we say, elegant. The center stack that smoothly flows into a high center console is particularly nice, in a coupelike way. The interior team worked to reduce the number of obvious cut lines on the dash and console. The top edge of the glovebox, for example, nestles under the overhanging piece of chrome and wood veneer that stretches across the instrument panel. The leather upholstery is impressively supple.
As with the Flex, Ford/Lincoln has managed to block out most offensive noise from the cabin. The MKS gets acoustic laminated glass for the windshield and the front side windows. In steady-state cruising, the MKS rides around making a gentle hushing sound.
There's a ton of space inside the cabin. A 6-foot-2 rear-seat passenger can comfortably sit behind a person of the same height without ever brushing his knees on the seatback. Lincoln also claims a class-leading trunk volume. And even though we're not really sure what else directly competes with the MKS, we don't doubt that's true. Unfortunately, the trunk opening is absurdly small. So if you carry many, many small things but no really large things, then this is the setup for you.
Doodads
The MKS comes standard with electronic stability control, HID headlamps, power-adjustable heated and cooled front seats, heated rear seats, leather upholstery and an eight-speaker audio system with Sync control.
The test car we drove added the all-wheel-drive system (a $1,870 increase in base price over the front-driver) and the grandly named Ultimate Package. As its name implies, it is the king of options packages, enveloping all the other packages into its ultimate-ness. With this $5,995 compendium you get (take a deep breath here): voice-activated navigation system, rearview camera, THX surround-sound audio system with a 10-gig hard drive, adaptive headlamps with automatic high-beams, rain-sensing wipers, front parking assist sensors, power rear-window sunshade, keyless ignition, dual-panel moonroof, 19-inch wheels and upgraded leather. The 20-inch wheels will cost you another $685 on top of the Ultimate Package price.
The Price of Greatness?
When we looked at the information sheet supplied with our 2009 Lincoln MKS test car, we inadvertently blurted, "Holy *&@%! This is a more-than-$46,000 car." The engineer riding in the backseat said flatly, "Yes. It is."
Be a little more judicious with the options sheet and you could get into an MKS in the low $40Ks. (The all-wheel-drive model starts at $40,355 including the $800 destination charge.)
The trouble is, there are a lot of fine vehicles on the market for $46,000 from premium makers that don't carry the baggage Lincoln has saddled itself with. Of course, they're not likely to be as large or carry as many gadgets.
By Daniel Pund, Senior Editor, Detroit Email
Date posted: 06-04-2008
The 2009 Lincoln MKS might just represent the future direction of Lincoln. Or maybe it doesn't. We frankly just don't know what to expect out of Lincoln anymore.
After all, Lincoln introduced the rear-wheel-drive LS sport sedan at the end of the last millennium to great fanfare and a fair amount of corporate chest-thumping. And then, well, nothing. When the company quietly euthanized the car recently, nobody shed a tear — or even noticed, really.
Lincoln has spent the last couple of years staring at its own belly button. It dredged up its most iconic design — the 1961-'69 Continental — and used it to inspire a seemingly endless series of retro concept cars. The only current evidence of this age of self-consciously retro design has been the return of dual-cowl dashboards and square gauges in production Lincolns. Also the historic Zephyr name made a one-year reappearance.
And now we're starting over again with the 2009 Lincoln MKS.
The Middle Road
If the 2009 MKS indicates anything about Lincoln, it could be that the middle road might be the place to begin a return to relevance. What Lincoln has produced is a very well-equipped, visually interesting Ford Taurus. Let our former mortal enemy, Cadillac, spend a boatload of cash developing new rear-wheel drive-platforms, Lincoln seems to be saying. Let them chase the customers who know what the Nürburgring is.
If it helps you draw a bead on the MKS, think of it as more Lexus ES than IS. Like the ES, the MKS is based on a populist sedan, then endowed with every possible option at the company's disposal.
What this means in the world of Ford is that the MKS is the newest product based on the big and primarily front-drive D3 platform. The D3 was initially designed by Volvo for its big sedan and has since sprouted various Ford Motor Company products including the Taurus, Taurus X, Mercury Sable and, most recently the big-box-on-wheels, the Ford Flex.
From the Taurus/Sable comes the 112.9-inch wheelbase. From the Flex comes a reconfigured rear suspension that allows the vehicle to comfortably accommodate the huge-diameter wheels that designers and marketers insist upon. The MKS shares its transverse, 24-valve Duratec V6, six-speed automatic and optional all-wheel drive with a whole pack of FoMoCo vehicles.
Bored
Befitting the luxury version of the platform, the MKS is motivated by a more powerful version of the Duratec motor. The basic architecture and technologies remain the same as the now-ubiquitous 3.5-liter V6, but it's been bored slightly to increase displacement to 3.7 liters. This pushes output to a maximum 275 horsepower at 6,250 rpm and 276 pound-feet of torque at 4,500 rpm. That's 12 hp more and 27 lb-ft more than the output of the 3.5-liter V6 in the Taurus. Of course, it achieves those numbers using premium fuel. If you use 87 octane in the MKS, the peak power drops to 273 hp and torque totals 270 lb-ft.
It's a good thing that the motor gets a little bump because until the twin-turbocharged 3.5-liter V6 arrives next year with about 340 hp, the 3.7-liter is the only available engine for the MKS. And it's got a substantial 4,276 pounds of Lincoln to pull around. That's the kind of weight you get with an all-wheel-drive car that's as long as a minivan and loaded to the roof with various gadgets and doodads.
In addition to the power bump, Ford has also tightened up the six-speed automatic's torque converter to try to give this big boy some punchy throttle response. Of course, the MKS still feels a little flat-footed in passing maneuvers until the smooth-shifting six-speed drops a couple of gears and forces the V6 into the fat part of its power band. The transmission also allows for manual shifting with automatic rev-matching on downshifts. In SST mode, the tranny drops a gear automatically when you dip into the brakes and will hold gears longer under acceleration.
The EPA figures the standard front-drive MKS will return 17 mpg in the city and travel 24 miles on a gallon in highway driving. The all-wheel-drive version is estimated to return 16 mpg city/23 mpg highway. That's just a smidge better than the 16 mpg city/22 mpg highway that the Acura RL's 3.7-liter V6 delivers.
Nürburgring Lap Time Not Available
The suspension is closely related to that of the Flex, and it has been tuned for a middle-of-the-road compromise between ride and handling. It's a nice mix if you're not into scrubbing your tires bald on canyon roads. According to Vehicle Development Chief Engineer Jim Baumbick, the reconfigured multilink rear suspension allows for more accurate tuning than other D3 vehicles and allows the car to carry big, flashy (and optional) 20-inch polished wheels while maintaining a compliant ride.
And indeed, even with the 20s and low-profile tires, the ride quality remains quiet and smooth without the harshness sometimes associated with such a setup. The handling? Well, it's what you make of it. We drove some of Virginia's swaying rural two-lanes and found the MKS very easy to drive smoothly and accurately. The steering is nicely weighted at speed. The first few degrees of body roll are snubbed efficiently. So if you drive with some sensitivity, the big sedan flows along competently. Abrupt steering inputs and tighter corners aren't going to be all that much fun, though.
Lincoln-ness
After so many fits and starts in Lincoln styling, we haven't a clue what a Lincoln is supposed to look like. Head Ford design man for these United States, Peter Horbury, reckons he does, and he's created a sort of salad bar approach to future Lincoln designs. Horbury has defined seven design cues inspired by vintage Lincolns, including the split or "bow-wave" grille that is supposed to call to mind the 1941 Continental. Others include clean, uncluttered flanks and horizontal, full-width taillamps.
The MKS is the first production Lincoln to be produced under this new design regime — or at least partly produced. The car was already well into development by the time Horbury defined the cues.
We're not wholly convinced that the MKS has real beauty, but it at least presents itself convincingly as a luxury car. It's a good sign that the first obvious evidence of the MKS's origins is that annoying bulge in the floor pan immediately in front of the front seats that all D3-based cars have. (It covers a structural crossmember.) When you're driving into the mid-$40,000 price range, the less customers see of this car's Taurus origins, the better.
Now With a Delicious Nougat Center
It's too bad Lincoln can't turn the MKS inside-out. The interior is the car's greatest strength. In contrast to the dual-pod retro-ism and cheap-looking nickel-color plastic of recent years, the MKS goes a thoroughly modern route that is, dare we say, elegant. The center stack that smoothly flows into a high center console is particularly nice, in a coupelike way. The interior team worked to reduce the number of obvious cut lines on the dash and console. The top edge of the glovebox, for example, nestles under the overhanging piece of chrome and wood veneer that stretches across the instrument panel. The leather upholstery is impressively supple.
As with the Flex, Ford/Lincoln has managed to block out most offensive noise from the cabin. The MKS gets acoustic laminated glass for the windshield and the front side windows. In steady-state cruising, the MKS rides around making a gentle hushing sound.
There's a ton of space inside the cabin. A 6-foot-2 rear-seat passenger can comfortably sit behind a person of the same height without ever brushing his knees on the seatback. Lincoln also claims a class-leading trunk volume. And even though we're not really sure what else directly competes with the MKS, we don't doubt that's true. Unfortunately, the trunk opening is absurdly small. So if you carry many, many small things but no really large things, then this is the setup for you.
Doodads
The MKS comes standard with electronic stability control, HID headlamps, power-adjustable heated and cooled front seats, heated rear seats, leather upholstery and an eight-speaker audio system with Sync control.
The test car we drove added the all-wheel-drive system (a $1,870 increase in base price over the front-driver) and the grandly named Ultimate Package. As its name implies, it is the king of options packages, enveloping all the other packages into its ultimate-ness. With this $5,995 compendium you get (take a deep breath here): voice-activated navigation system, rearview camera, THX surround-sound audio system with a 10-gig hard drive, adaptive headlamps with automatic high-beams, rain-sensing wipers, front parking assist sensors, power rear-window sunshade, keyless ignition, dual-panel moonroof, 19-inch wheels and upgraded leather. The 20-inch wheels will cost you another $685 on top of the Ultimate Package price.
The Price of Greatness?
When we looked at the information sheet supplied with our 2009 Lincoln MKS test car, we inadvertently blurted, "Holy *&@%! This is a more-than-$46,000 car." The engineer riding in the backseat said flatly, "Yes. It is."
Be a little more judicious with the options sheet and you could get into an MKS in the low $40Ks. (The all-wheel-drive model starts at $40,355 including the $800 destination charge.)
The trouble is, there are a lot of fine vehicles on the market for $46,000 from premium makers that don't carry the baggage Lincoln has saddled itself with. Of course, they're not likely to be as large or carry as many gadgets.
#150
Senior Moderator
Thread edited.
#160
msl82 ftmfw again!!
Sorry, I can't help myself.
Sorry, I can't help myself.