I still haven't decided how big of a system I want to do in my car, but in the event I go with 1000+ watts to something like a 12" Fi-Q or DCON, which of these two amps would perform better.

I know they're relatively similar but I've heard some people say AQ1200d will show it's cheapness in the quality, but it seems like a much better price than the sundown. Is the difference in quality that noticeable?

 

also, Eggy, I haven't decided against that dual DCON setup you suggested. Just looking into everything before I decide.

 

sax

 

sundown all the way

I only suggested the mb quart amp to try to stay within budget.

 

u can get sundown amps on the cheapz here

http://www.db-r.com/sell/store2/

 

Here is what sundown amps can help do. \
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RWu0gZDnbUk

 

Videos prove nothing

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T-d1Z...layer_embedded

see

 

Hey thanks a lot for that link. I just wonder why they don't sell 1200D since it replaced 1000D. Only one they have is refurbished

 

Nothing wrong with refurbs

 

If you say so. I still would feel like I'd blame it on the refurb if it ever broke on me.

 

But Jacob at Sundown takes care of his customers, period.

 

Yep

Unlike mainstream brands, you deal directly with the owner if something goes wrong.

 

How do they prove nothing. I showed a acura cl with 2 crappy subs in a nice box with a nice amp. Jeeps r easy to get flex in as they r trash especially the older ones. No support at all. N my car has 2 layers of deadner in it. But enough with the off topic ranting.

 

If you buy from DB-r, you don't deal with Jacob, you deal with the owner of Jacob's repair shop, DB-r... DB-r is the major repair shop for several big amplifier companies in the competition game, including Sundown, Stetsom, etc. If you buy new from Jacob, then you deal with him.

Now, that being said, I'd take the Sundown amp. I've used both AQ and Sundown amps, and the Sundowns run a lot cooler than the AQ's. I could pound on my 1500D for 3+ hours at .5 ohms and get bored after putting my hand on it because it was still ice cold. After ~1 hour of play time at very low volume, the AQ would get much hotter than I like, while running at 1 ohm. Then again, maybe I was just used to my Sundown running as cold as it was, so that's why the AQ seemed hot.

 

I'll have to agree with eggyhustles on that.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0jBgCSS4TdY

 

I was speaking in reference to the crunch amp

 

Looks like the GP3000D, which is a legit 3kw amp. Not really sure what you're getting at there Eggy...

 

goes back to my original post

nothing wrong with the mb quarts just like there's nothing wrong with crunch

 

Thanks for the tips guys. I do like the fact that from a smaller amp manufacturer there's more assurance of quality and better customer service.

Might be a while before I actually pull the trigger and get one of these but I definitely have some ideas going.

 

I doubt DB-r will have that amp long. They run sales to clear inventory pretty often. But the SAZ-1500D is being redesigned and the new one will be smaller in size but still have the same power output. Just an idea, since you said it'll be awhile...

 

I think 1500 watts might be overkill with only one Fi Q or DCON quality sub? Not one of the BTL's as I'd prefer to go more towards SQ.

Or would I need the headroom?

 

Headroom is nice with amps, because when you keep the gain down, you get a nice clean signal. If you're pushing an amp for all it's worth, then you're going to get clipping and that's not a good thing. Hell, before I sold it, I was going to run my Sundown 1500D at 1 ohm on my SA-8. It would've been very clean power, so it should've been alright with ~800w or so. My enclosure's not the best for higher power, but I have faith in Sundown products enough that I would've done it...

 

oh and kind of off topic but how do those AA subs youre selling compare to the other ones I've been looking at? I know they're pretty similar (made almost exactly the same by the same people right? or some guys from Fi branched off?) to Fi but I don't know much about them.

 

yea I understand the dangers of clipping and in general how gain works (I have a $2000 tube amp I use for electric guitar, can't stand clipping distortion of solid state distortion, tubes all the way).

It's just for example an Fi Q has an RMS of 1000W, so wouldn't a 1200W sundown (I know they're underrated too) have enough headroom?

 

FI= AA.

They are at the same (local to me) address.

 

Yea I thought so. I think they have it so one of the companies has dealers (AA) while the other is online only (Fi).

 

Fourthmeal is right. My AA Chaos' are the same as the older Fi SSD's. They've since changed the motor design a bit, to be more like the new BTL's.

Yes, Sundown amps in general are underrated. Here's the thing. The 1200w Sundown amp is of the SAE and now SAX line. These are the lower line of Sundown amps, compared to the SAZ which are their top of the line amps. The SAE and now SAX are not meant to run under 1 ohm and will protect on higher voltage. The SAZ line will run well under 1 ohm (guys are burping them at .25 ohms) and on much higher voltage (up to 18.x V, IIRC). Personally, I'll never buy a Sundown mono amp that's not the SAZ line. Yes, they're more expensive, but they have higher quality parts in them, and they are much more durable.

 

dude is on a smallish budget, sundown should be out of the question

There are other good amps out there.

 

That's really good info on those amps. I too would rather pay a bit more for higher quality parts. I like to get things right the first time around.

I wonder if someone like me who has limited experience in car audio would be able to notice the difference between a Q and an SSD (or chaos). I wish I could try out all of them in my car before buying one haha

 

While its true I'd like to keep my budget small, I wouldn't mind paying more for quality. My real issue is value, I don't want to pay for something that isn't worth it. If it's worth it and something I'd want, I'm totally fine saving for it.

 

You probably wouldn't notice much of a difference between those 2.

And IMO, Sundown SAZ series amps are some of the best values in Car Audio today. I ran my 1500D at .5 ohms daily and could pound on the thing for 3+ hours and it would still be ice cold. They are well worth the money that Jacob charges for them. That along with the customer support that Jacob offers should anything go wrong is unbeatable, imo.

 

Yeah sundown is the way to go if you have the money for it.

in this case i'd look into, rockford prime, mb quart dsc/onx(new line), soundstream ref/stealth, cadence, planet audio big bang, crescendo.

 

Within the next couple weeks I'm going to try and find time to go talk in person to an installer I've heard good things about. See what exactly can be done for my specific car. I'm not totally sure yet how much space I'm working with yet.

I'm going to do 1/0 and maybe a better battery if I need to. I'd like to not have to touch the alternator though.

The hardest part for me is getting a good enclosure made. I have no idea about that part and definitely won't do it myself since I know 0 about woodworking haha. I assume the installer I talk to knows how to make quality enclosures for every setup and can do it for me for a price. If it turns out I can get a a dual enclosure made that works with my trunk, maybe I could buy those Chaos's off of you.

Or would you be willing to sell just one even? I have no problem buying used if theyve been taken care of (and it seems like you do).

You might have sold them by the time I figure this stuff out though, which is totally fine too.

 

From what i've experienced, never ever get an enclosure done by folks @ shops

for one, they'll charge u an arm and a leg and 2 they usually don't build the boxes you want.

I've seen many cases of dudes coming to the shop with ported boxes tuned real high(40+) when they've asked for 30-34hz tuned boxes.

As far as electrical goes, i'd try to stay around 900-1100 watts total..that includes your front stage.

 

Well that might be true but I really don't know anyone who has experience designing and building boxes. I was hoping since this guy has so many positive testimonials and has been doing car audio for so long (he's famous in the porsche 911 audio scene. Flys across the country doing his special install for folks) and has experience on all sorts of cars, from porsche's to acuras to ferraris, that he would be able to design a decent enclosure.

I think if I provided him the specs of the sub I want in it he'd be able to make a quality enclosure. I obviously wouldn't get one from some fly by night company or best buy or something haha.

And about the total wattage. If, for now, I intend to try and keep my stock amp for the front/doors, would putting in a ~1200 watt amp for the sub require a complete electrical overhaul... hmmm.

 

As long as you use good 1/0 and do the Big 3, you can pretty well get away with the stock alt, so long as you watch the voltage. I know I ran my 1500D at .5 ohms on 1 battery (XS Power D5100R, then a D2400) and my stock alt and the voltage was fine, so long as I didn't push too hard. Push the system hard, and you'll find the weak link... For me, the weak link was the alt, but I hardly ever pushed beyond what I knew it could handle.

The enclosure isn't really that hard. As long as you take your time, do your research, and care about what you're doing, it shouldn't be that hard to figure out. It shouldn't be hard to fit a box for 2 10's in your trunk, but you may not have a ton of room left to spare. If you did 1 10 or even 1 12, you would have a lot more room (more with a 10 than 12, but still). As for selling 1, yeah, I'll sell individually or together. Selling them before you can get to them, maybe. I'm taking them to a swap meet this weekend, hoping to get some cash out of them, some Kicker tweeters I've had sitting around along with an older RF amp. I dunno what'll happen, but we'll see. I'll update the FS thread if they do sell.

Where are you located that you're willing to farm the work out to this expert guy? I'm about 90% sure there's a reputable box builder in your area that could take care of you for much less than that guy...

As for the total power, I ran my 1500D at .5 ohms and an RF 450.2 bridged to my Bravox EXS6 mids and could get pretty good voltage drop, if I wanted (which is not the case) but that was on a stock 80A alt. Or, if I babied it, I could stay 14+ without much problem. Oh, and yes, the subs have been babied for probably 90% of their life...

 

ok that sounds good. I would definitely do the wiring upgrades.

Oh and about your subs, it was just an idea. I'm 90% sure you'll have sold them by the time I get around to it

And the guy I'm planning on going to see isn't like... ONLY an expensive expert type. At least I don't think so. It just seems (from his website and testimonials) that he does quality work and cares about how well he does it. Here is the website: http://www.caraudioinnovations.com/

I live in Davis, California. Which is pretty much right next to Sacramento so I'm sure there's a lot of options for me around here. I just don't know anyone who is into car audio or building enclosures haha.

I just figured I would get everything done at the same place. Have them build the box and install it all at once. If it's quality work I wouldn't mind paying more for it than some fly by night place.

 

You live in CA which means you live near Bing. That's only guy I'd go to.

 

I mean there is a big difference between this:



And this:

 

lol it does look nice (and expensive ) but I have no idea who Bing is. haha