DerrickM

Took me about 12 hours, but it was worth it! I was experiencing terrible sound at high volume levels, and couldn't figure out what it was. All my equipment is pretty quality stuff, but it sounded like crap unless the volume was low to medium.

I didn't want to run new wire because I knew it was going to be a royal pain the ass. I had to remove: rear seats, all plastic trim from front to rear including the B piller covers, the front seatbelts, all 4 door covers, rear speakers, etc.

I ran 12-guage in-wall speaker wire ($0.39/foot at Home Depot), with no connectors from amp to speakers.

The rear doors weren't too bad--I was able to get the wire into the boots. The fronts were too much for me, and I pushed the wire through the boots (i.e. I cut holes in something that should never be cut). The rubber seals around the wire, but I'll fill it in with tar or something that'll stick to rubber. (Any ideas out there??)

All wires run under the carpet. The car is very easy to run wires back, because the carpet holders just lift up to give you access to underneath.

The main thing I notice is the incredible bass response from the mains. (I have the crossover at 99Hz from the sub). Before, as the volume went up, the bass response (midbass I should say) got worse and worse until it sounded tinny. I also noticed a significant reduction in sibilance, although I still have some.

So, the factory wire looks to be perhaps 20 gauge, and has various connectors in the circuit. Enough for quality sound at reasonable volumes, but not if you want to run 100 watts to each speaker.

All-in-all I would highly recommend this to anybody. I won't lie: it's a serious amount of work. But, it can be done in one day. The difference in SQ isn't something you have to wonder about: you can tell immediately and incontrovertably.

(2001 TL: Sony CDX-C90, XDP-210EQ, MTX564, JVC 1500 mp3 changer, Diamond Audio M661 seperates, JBL P652 coax, Rockford amp & sub (cheap), 1.5f cap.

ou sig

I cant believe you had that equipment with the stock shitty ass wire!!! I can imagine the better sound you are getting. You stock wire was probably only letting like 70 watts or so to your speakers (if you have 100 at the amp) because it is so small and restrictive.

DerrickM

Yeah, roger that. I already had so much time and effort into the project that I was getting tired of messing with the damn thing. However, every time I'd sit in the garage and try to tune the system in, I'd be amazed at how good it sounded--then I'd drive to work and crank it and say, "This sounds like shit--it sounded so good last night..." The speaker wire was the only remaining thing, and I knew all along that it was going to have to be done--I was just lazy.

The wire was really restricting the lower frequencies. The amp I have is 140 watts per channel peak, 70 RMS (four channels).

This is the absolute last time I ever buy a car with all the speakers in the doors. Nothing in the dash, nothing (except that pos sub) in the rear deck, just the doors.

Anyway, I feel bad that I was saying bad things about the JBL P652's. I still have a set in the rear, and with the good wire they sound pretty darn good. (Not as good as the Diamonds, of course).

So, for the fourth or fith time, I have to tune the system in again. Not an easy thing to do with a 21-band EQ with 9 memory settings. (I usually use 4 for varying degrees of loudness, then the rest for varying degrees of what I think is the right curve for the car and the equipment). I wish I could find some starting points for different curves like "vocals", etc.

The Diamonds are still way too bright for me. I'll continue to turn it down at 7.5k, 11k, and 16k.

I think my next project is going to be what I can do for little money to improve the horsepower situation. It's not a slow car, but not quite as fast as I'd like either. ou_sig, what do you think the biggest bang-for-the-buck would be?

ou sig

what car do you have? By far the biggest bang for your buck in the engine upgrade is new headers. They give nearly 20 hp increase to the wheels on a TLP and nearly 30 on a Type S. Another good mod would be to replace your stock crank pulley with a new, lighter one. The company for that is Unorthodox Racing

http://www.unorthodoxracing.com/index.html

The good thing about a new pulley, is that is gives good power thoughout the RPM band, while headers, a new air intake and exhaust give some at low RPM's but the most above 5000RPM.

dnd2984

iTrader: (6)

would 16 gauge wire make a differ. I have a JL 300/4 on 2 sets on Alpine SPX 177 Components. My mids and highs get really loud and stay clear all the way up. Would it make my sound even better or should I not bother with the hassle. And if I upgrade I would only do the front doors. I had all my stuff professional installed in the TL, and would not make to make a mess of everything either.

ou sig

if you had your stuff professionaly installed, they used wire that is good enough...they didnt use the factory stuff.

vidoprof

i would totally agree with ou sig... ANY PLACE that has ANY common sense in installing audio equip will use a min of 16 gauge wire for speakers. They will USUALLY use the biggest that the speakers and amps can take... just because it's cheap and makes the car sound THAT much better.

Glad to hear that the speaker wire upgrade helped out. That (speaker wire and ground wire), besides the voltage the HU puts out are the two biggest factors IMO that make or break a system. All things equal of course.

Ou Sig finally go the install done... I should be able to post pics tomorrow. of everything..

Ryan

DerrickM

dnd2984: if your system is clear and the midbass response stays true all the way up, I wouldn't mess with it. (Wouldn't hurt to open the passenger door and verify the installers work, though).

Oh, forgot to mention the body shop that fixed my car managed to cross-thread one of the bolts holding the seats in. I have to out there today and drill it out and re-tap it. I'm not very happy about it, and somebody's gonna get a phone call on Monday...

DerrickM

ou sig: wow, those are expensive pulleys. Can a lightweight pulley really make that much difference?

How much do headers typically cost to have installed?

I have the 2001 TL (not type-s, which started in 02 I think).

dnd2984

iTrader: (6)

Yea Idont think I am gonna mess with the TLs system. But what I am gonna do today is upgrade my RSX system. I have a whole day off and gonna make a new box and install new speakers.

ou sig

There is a member on this site that is selling the pullies for cheeper than MSRP.
here is a link to that Thread.

https://acurazine.com/forums/sponsored-sales-group-buys-10/unorthodox-racing-pulleys-special-pricing-event-155330/

You only need the crank pulley to get any power increase. The others (alternator and power steering) are only for looks. Yes they do give a good bit of power increase. Look at the dyno's on that site, everyone who gets the crank pulley seems to like it alot.

To get headers installed, shouldnt take more than 2 hours of shop time. So depending on how much the shop charges/hour. I paid $150, which is pretty close to what most people pay.

ou sig

sweet take some pictures if you can. Tell me how it goes because my friend has a RSX and we might tackle that over the Christmas break.

dnd2984

iTrader: (6)

It was hell alot easier than the TL. Put some old school type S speakers in the front door and a kicker comp vr with a 300 watt amp. Nothing big but it was easy to do.

ou sig

nice nice...its amazing how shitty most factory systems are, you can tell so quick when you get some decent aftermarket stuff in. Interesting how you pay $30k for a TL and get a stereo worth a couple hundred bucks...and they try to justify it by saying its "Bose". "Blowse" sucks ass

DerrickM

This is my second Bose system, and at least it's 4 ohm--at any rate it was more expandable than the other one. (My last one was a 92 maxima). I understand the HU is actually made by Pioneer or Matsushita or somebody; and I think it's pretty decent for an OEM HU.

BUT, it's not all Bose's fault. Honda chose those terrible speaker grilles, small speaker openings, small wires, no speakers in dash or rear deck, etc. All Bose did was provide the EQ and the speakers (and their brand name, of course).

ou sig

correct but their EQ and speakers are POS. I mean look at the door speakers...my clock radio has the same size of magnet, and the cheep thin paper cone...makes me when I think about it. And their EQ has to boost the highs like 20db just so the door speakers sound like they can produce some treble.

Ok I am done

DerrickM

I totally agree with you.

I had a 2002 Camry, and I have to say the stock system (JBL branded) was pretty nice. Of course I ripped it out and sold it the first week, but at least it had spots for 6 speakers, including the dash and rear deck.

Personally, I think if they just provided good speaker locations, thick wire, and standard size dash openings consumers would be better off. I mean you can get a decent head unit for like $100 all the time.

The other thing that kills me is the price of replacing any of those non-standard Bose pieces when they break! A replacement speaker (one) for my 92 Maxima was almost $500 ten years ago!

That reminds me, I need to get over to the Black Market section and try to sell those OEM speakers...

ou sig

haha ya I know...oh well. Its also funny on some cars that the "premium" sound system (which still sucks, just not as much) is like a $2000 option!!! when you could spend 1/3 of that and get a better one. you really should just keep your stock stuff, because you arent going to get much for it, and it will be handy if you want to sell the car.

DerrickM

Holy shit--I never did sell that system from my '02 Camry--I wonder if there's a market for it on eBay...

DerrickM

I already sold the HU, so the speakers are never going to do me any good. When I sell the car I"ll put in some after-market stuff of reasonable quality.

So, I've been looking at headers and the pulley. I think the whole thing is going to have to wait. After spending nearly two grand on a stereo, my wife would kill me if I spent another grand on performance upgrades.

ou sig

I feel your pain, Im about to be in your situation...hell I may as well be already! At least I got some mods out of the way before I got married.