9AT Hard Shift 1-2 and 2-3
AcurAdmirer
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 3,004
Likes: 352
From: Dallas/Ft. Worth, TX
But this is just what I'm arguing. Why does having to take responsibility only come in extreme cases? Does someone have to die before it's Honda/Acura's fault? Is that the only scenario where someone has to pay? All Volkswagen did was fib a little, right? This isn't like no one at Acura knew this tranny was a dud when it left the factory. At least if it was something that happens years down the road, I could forgive them.
And all I said in response is that we aren't naïve. We understand that. I understand Acura doesn't want to pay for their own screw-up and are looking for ways to minimize their losses. It's understandable. I'm just saying ... it's wrong.
On at least 3 occasions, the car failed to accelerate from a dead stop when I pressed the gas. I lifted my foot off the pedal and pushed down again and it accelerated normally. On one of those occasions I was trying to cross a busy street and could've gotten t-boned because of the delayed response. On another of those occasions I nearly accelerated into my fence because I pushed the accelerator down further thinking I hadn't pushed it enough. That's not what I call "working". I can put up with the clunky transmission -- apparently I have to, but I would not call every situation an example of how the transmission "does work". Not to mention, I've driven a TLX in which the transmission DOES work as intended, at least as far as that day I had it, anyway.
Hell, no. That's exactly what Acura wants. I think I've convinced 2 people not to buy a TLX. I'll keep singing Acura's "praises" while I own this car. I don't buy cars every 3 or 4 years. I pay cash for them and drive them until the proverbial wheels fall off. This will probably be the first car I get rid of "far too early", but it won't be for another few years until the warranty is up.
After being a fan of this company and waiting years for this car to be released (through delays -- wonder what that big delay was about? hmmm...), only to get stiff-armed and being provided every stupid nonsensical excuse as to why the transmission is "normal"? Then to have idiot dealerships act like beggars asking me to choose all the options "on the right side of the survey" because they want to get good grades? lol.
If people here "just go buy another car", this forum is no different than many of the Caddy forums I used to frequent. Wheels flying off the car, dragging mufflers, seats flying out the window (ok, I'm exaggerating) and people acting like "eh, whatever... I'll be out of this lease in another couple of years". Honda/Acura was supposed to be about reliability or at least backing up their cars. Obviously they're not doing that for everybody and that's what got me pissed. For some of us, all we get is Precision Crafted BS from dealerships and corporate with each pointing the finger at the other saying "it's their fault".
In all fairness, the transmission post-a-myriad-of-software-updates shifts better now, but no, it doesn't shift like a properly functioning TLX transmission. It's gone from "weird shifting" to "unbearable shifting" to "well, it's improved" status. Go Acura.
Anywho, didn't mean to get on anybody's nerves with the post. I'll let everyone get back to discussing the hard shifting normal transmissions.
And all I said in response is that we aren't naïve. We understand that. I understand Acura doesn't want to pay for their own screw-up and are looking for ways to minimize their losses. It's understandable. I'm just saying ... it's wrong.
On at least 3 occasions, the car failed to accelerate from a dead stop when I pressed the gas. I lifted my foot off the pedal and pushed down again and it accelerated normally. On one of those occasions I was trying to cross a busy street and could've gotten t-boned because of the delayed response. On another of those occasions I nearly accelerated into my fence because I pushed the accelerator down further thinking I hadn't pushed it enough. That's not what I call "working". I can put up with the clunky transmission -- apparently I have to, but I would not call every situation an example of how the transmission "does work". Not to mention, I've driven a TLX in which the transmission DOES work as intended, at least as far as that day I had it, anyway.
Hell, no. That's exactly what Acura wants. I think I've convinced 2 people not to buy a TLX. I'll keep singing Acura's "praises" while I own this car. I don't buy cars every 3 or 4 years. I pay cash for them and drive them until the proverbial wheels fall off. This will probably be the first car I get rid of "far too early", but it won't be for another few years until the warranty is up.
After being a fan of this company and waiting years for this car to be released (through delays -- wonder what that big delay was about? hmmm...), only to get stiff-armed and being provided every stupid nonsensical excuse as to why the transmission is "normal"? Then to have idiot dealerships act like beggars asking me to choose all the options "on the right side of the survey" because they want to get good grades? lol.
If people here "just go buy another car", this forum is no different than many of the Caddy forums I used to frequent. Wheels flying off the car, dragging mufflers, seats flying out the window (ok, I'm exaggerating) and people acting like "eh, whatever... I'll be out of this lease in another couple of years". Honda/Acura was supposed to be about reliability or at least backing up their cars. Obviously they're not doing that for everybody and that's what got me pissed. For some of us, all we get is Precision Crafted BS from dealerships and corporate with each pointing the finger at the other saying "it's their fault".
In all fairness, the transmission post-a-myriad-of-software-updates shifts better now, but no, it doesn't shift like a properly functioning TLX transmission. It's gone from "weird shifting" to "unbearable shifting" to "well, it's improved" status. Go Acura.
Anywho, didn't mean to get on anybody's nerves with the post. I'll let everyone get back to discussing the hard shifting normal transmissions.
By the way, the "slow down, then accelerate dead spot" and the "dead spot from a stop" issues have been around for awhile. My '06 TL, '12 TL, and '13 RDX all had it. There were lots of times - like yours - where I would step on it to get out of the way, or across an intersection or whatever, and it was like the car just died for a second, or the accelerator wasn't connected to the engine. Then it would spurt forward.
We were told that it was the traction control trying to keep the wheels from spinning. And sure enough, if you turned off the TC, the dead spot went away. Personally, I'd rather spin the tires momentarily than to be creamed by a truck.
I hope you get things worked out.
Racer
Joined: Dec 2015
Posts: 315
Likes: 39
These transmission issues are more than just a glitch. This transmission was not ready for prime time and so far software "workarounds" have not made the affected transmissions comparable with the swapped-out transmission or the 2016 transmission.
The transmission has gone from just plain bad in affected 2015 models to acceptable (but certainly not good) in the 2016. The 2016 is still plagued with "glitches" and just poor design.
The "rolling stop" glitch persists in the 2016 model. And sloppy, slow downshifts persist. The second is a by product of the transmission having to sequential downshift and going from 9-4 or 8-4 just takes way too long. The latest update for the MDX apparently made a change to let the transmission skip a gear or two in downshifts, but I can find nothing that states this change has been made for the TLX.
Acura has been pretty moronic dealing with the problem. Denials, half-truths, etc. I tild my ACR I was plenty willing to work with them. I told them I was even willing to beta-test software versions. No response.
I figure I ate about 5-6k to get from a bad transmission to an acceptable transmission.
And Honda/Acura continues to deny issue. Complete tone deafness.
- A ten time Honda/Acura buyer, now a former Honda/Acura buyer
The transmission has gone from just plain bad in affected 2015 models to acceptable (but certainly not good) in the 2016. The 2016 is still plagued with "glitches" and just poor design.
The "rolling stop" glitch persists in the 2016 model. And sloppy, slow downshifts persist. The second is a by product of the transmission having to sequential downshift and going from 9-4 or 8-4 just takes way too long. The latest update for the MDX apparently made a change to let the transmission skip a gear or two in downshifts, but I can find nothing that states this change has been made for the TLX.
Acura has been pretty moronic dealing with the problem. Denials, half-truths, etc. I tild my ACR I was plenty willing to work with them. I told them I was even willing to beta-test software versions. No response.
I figure I ate about 5-6k to get from a bad transmission to an acceptable transmission.
And Honda/Acura continues to deny issue. Complete tone deafness.
- A ten time Honda/Acura buyer, now a former Honda/Acura buyer
I'm meeting with the dealer again on Wed next week as requested by ACR, but not really assuming much will get done.
I'm 50 years old and have owned cars going back to late 1970s models, and have owned a Lexus, Mazda, Ford, VW, Honda, and while the rough shifts from 2-3 can be annoying, most times I don't even notice them now. Maybe my outlook is just different than some of the younger buyers.
My vehicle was a 9/14 early build, so not sure if it's subjective and different people have different expectations, but it's not something I want to waste a huge amount of my time on. If they won't replace it now, then I have 6 years or 70K miles and if it gets worse or breaks completely, they'll have to replace it.
Suzuka Master
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 5,172
Likes: 740
From: Atlanta, GA
I'm not arguing, but I've never had a car that DIDN'T have some kind of glitch. And I've had some nice cars - 2 different Lexus LS400's, a Lexus LS460, a Lexus RX300 and an IS350, a BMW 740i and 3 different 540i's, 2 different Cadillac STS's, an Infiniti M56, 2 different Acura RL's, an MDX and an RDX, and on and on.
Every single one of them had something about it that wasn't "right". I guess maybe I'm too much of a perfectionist, but over the years I've learned to accept some things because I'm an old guy now and I don't think the perfect car is going to ever be made.
And all in all, the TLX has a lot going for it, so I'm going to run with it until I'm ready to try something else. Maybe an Audi next time.
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Every single one of them had something about it that wasn't "right". I guess maybe I'm too much of a perfectionist, but over the years I've learned to accept some things because I'm an old guy now and I don't think the perfect car is going to ever be made.
And all in all, the TLX has a lot going for it, so I'm going to run with it until I'm ready to try something else. Maybe an Audi next time.
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Racer
Joined: Dec 2015
Posts: 315
Likes: 39
Maybe it depends on the vehicle and there may be variances based on VIN, but mine has never, ever come close to what I would list as a "safety issue" or anything like it. To me it's maybe an annoyance and really just a quirk.
Again, not minimizing the pain of others, but relaying that mine (built 9/14) isn't even close to the safety edge.
Again, not minimizing the pain of others, but relaying that mine (built 9/14) isn't even close to the safety edge.
Intermediate
Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 48
Likes: 1
I've had my TLX (V6 AWD) for about 2 months and 1,500 miles. I've opened a case with ACR but honestly, since the last software update and TCU reprogram, the issue has been very slight. The hard shifts from 2-3 gear still exist, but they're intermittant and transient.
I can see the dealer pushing back more now than they did when they did the 15-040 TSB. Is the tranny prefect, no, but not sure replacement is warranted, especially if another software update will refine things further.
Not sure I want to give a new car to the dealer to rip apart when I have 6 years and 70K miles to see if the issue gets worse.
I can see the dealer pushing back more now than they did when they did the 15-040 TSB. Is the tranny prefect, no, but not sure replacement is warranted, especially if another software update will refine things further.
Not sure I want to give a new car to the dealer to rip apart when I have 6 years and 70K miles to see if the issue gets worse.
Racer
Joined: Dec 2015
Posts: 315
Likes: 39
Suzuka Master
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 5,172
Likes: 740
From: Atlanta, GA
Maybe it depends on the vehicle and there may be variances based on VIN, but mine has never, ever come close to what I would list as a "safety issue" or anything like it. To me it's maybe an annoyance and really just a quirk.
Again, not minimizing the pain of others, but relaying that mine (built 9/14) isn't even close to the safety edge.
Again, not minimizing the pain of others, but relaying that mine (built 9/14) isn't even close to the safety edge.
Instructor
Joined: Mar 2015
Posts: 139
Likes: 7
From: Toronto, Canada
I wouldn't say mine is a safety issue either but that doesn't mean it's not a problem. I'm able to mimic the problem like 90% of the time in Sports+ and that's how I tend to demo it to the field rep. It's a lot more noticeable in Sports+ that any other mode. I'm just wondering if they'll say something like oh it's normal for Sports+ to have a bit of a jerk.
Registered Abuser of VTEC
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 6,542
Likes: 115
From: Edmonton, Alberta
I wouldn't say mine is a safety issue either but that doesn't mean it's not a problem. I'm able to mimic the problem like 90% of the time in Sports+ and that's how I tend to demo it to the field rep. It's a lot more noticeable in Sports+ that any other mode. I'm just wondering if they'll say something like oh it's normal for Sports+ to have a bit of a jerk.
Racer
Joined: Dec 2015
Posts: 315
Likes: 39
So here is the question...
Since the hard shifts are almost exclusively from 2nd to 3rd gear (and very rarely from 1st to 2nd), but they don't happen all the time, what is the consensus as to the problem?
Everyone says the 2015 tranny is bad and the 2016 is good, so what is the cause of the issue? Why is the rough shifting only present in the lower gears and never above 3rd gear (that I've ever experienced)?
I'm have no vested interest here beyond not wanting my new $36K vehicle to have a catastrophic failure. I own it outright, but will probably not keep it beyond the 6yr/70K miles power train warranty, unless something is resolved before then. I am really curious though WHAT the issue is, if what people believe is correct, that it's hardware.
I also am curious why software seems to at least make a large difference in behavior, both after updates and the relearn process, and also between IDS settings. Anyone have an engineering background who can explain why they feel the shifts between 2nd and 3rd are the way they are?
Since the hard shifts are almost exclusively from 2nd to 3rd gear (and very rarely from 1st to 2nd), but they don't happen all the time, what is the consensus as to the problem?
Everyone says the 2015 tranny is bad and the 2016 is good, so what is the cause of the issue? Why is the rough shifting only present in the lower gears and never above 3rd gear (that I've ever experienced)?
I'm have no vested interest here beyond not wanting my new $36K vehicle to have a catastrophic failure. I own it outright, but will probably not keep it beyond the 6yr/70K miles power train warranty, unless something is resolved before then. I am really curious though WHAT the issue is, if what people believe is correct, that it's hardware.
I also am curious why software seems to at least make a large difference in behavior, both after updates and the relearn process, and also between IDS settings. Anyone have an engineering background who can explain why they feel the shifts between 2nd and 3rd are the way they are?
Registered Abuser of VTEC
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 6,542
Likes: 115
From: Edmonton, Alberta
So here is the question...
Since the hard shifts are almost exclusively from 2nd to 3rd gear (and very rarely from 1st to 2nd), but they don't happen all the time, what is the consensus as to the problem?
Everyone says the 2015 tranny is bad and the 2016 is good, so what is the cause of the issue? Why is the rough shifting only present in the lower gears and never above 3rd gear (that I've ever experienced)?
I'm have no vested interest here beyond not wanting my new $36K vehicle to have a catastrophic failure. I own it outright, but will probably not keep it beyond the 6yr/70K miles power train warranty, unless something is resolved before then. I am really curious though WHAT the issue is, if what people believe is correct, that it's hardware.
I also am curious why software seems to at least make a large difference in behavior, both after updates and the relearn process, and also between IDS settings. Anyone have an engineering background who can explain why they feel the shifts between 2nd and 3rd are the way they are?
Since the hard shifts are almost exclusively from 2nd to 3rd gear (and very rarely from 1st to 2nd), but they don't happen all the time, what is the consensus as to the problem?
Everyone says the 2015 tranny is bad and the 2016 is good, so what is the cause of the issue? Why is the rough shifting only present in the lower gears and never above 3rd gear (that I've ever experienced)?
I'm have no vested interest here beyond not wanting my new $36K vehicle to have a catastrophic failure. I own it outright, but will probably not keep it beyond the 6yr/70K miles power train warranty, unless something is resolved before then. I am really curious though WHAT the issue is, if what people believe is correct, that it's hardware.
I also am curious why software seems to at least make a large difference in behavior, both after updates and the relearn process, and also between IDS settings. Anyone have an engineering background who can explain why they feel the shifts between 2nd and 3rd are the way they are?
The only thing the transmission is doing from 2 to 3 is releasing the C-brake and engaging the B-clutch. It's supposed to do those 2 things at the same time, as far as I know. Something may be intermittently getting stuck in the valve body (unlikely), or the timing is off, or any number of issues.
The reason it has to be something hardware is because if it was simply a software fix, Acura would have just mandated that all 2015's receive the same software as the 2016's. That would be super cheap to implement. Obviously they haven't done that, so that rules that out (companies will almost always take the cheapest path out if it solves it). Why replace a transmission entirely for a software update?
Hell, even if it was just the TCU, that's on the outside of the transmission. There must be some internal part that's different in some way, even if it's minor, and may have to do with a component in the C-brake or B-clutch. I'm only guessing at this point though.
Racer
Joined: Dec 2015
Posts: 315
Likes: 39
The only thing the transmission is doing from 2 to 3 is releasing the C-brake and engaging the B-clutch. It's supposed to do those 2 things at the same time, as far as I know. Something may be intermittently getting stuck in the valve body (unlikely), or the timing is off, or any number of issues.
The reason it has to be something hardware is because if it was simply a software fix, Acura would have just mandated that all 2015's receive the same software as the 2016's. That would be super cheap to implement. Obviously they haven't done that, so that rules that out (companies will almost always take the cheapest path out if it solves it). Why replace a transmission entirely for a software update?
Hell, even if it was just the TCU, that's on the outside of the transmission. There must be some internal part that's different in some way, even if it's minor, and may have to do with a component in the C-brake or B-clutch. I'm only guessing at this point though.
The reason it has to be something hardware is because if it was simply a software fix, Acura would have just mandated that all 2015's receive the same software as the 2016's. That would be super cheap to implement. Obviously they haven't done that, so that rules that out (companies will almost always take the cheapest path out if it solves it). Why replace a transmission entirely for a software update?
Hell, even if it was just the TCU, that's on the outside of the transmission. There must be some internal part that's different in some way, even if it's minor, and may have to do with a component in the C-brake or B-clutch. I'm only guessing at this point though.
If this just a quirky annoyance or is damage occurring slowly (or not so slowly)?
Instructor
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 169
Likes: 11
From: Phoenix
Just saw the NSX 0001 car at Barrett Jackson. It's one of the in a charity auction cars Has a nine speed double clutch trans. I wonder if they have the same issues. Doubt it. Don't care stunning car. $157000.
Three Wheelin'
Joined: Aug 2014
Posts: 1,321
Likes: 400
From: Thornhill, Ontario
Maybe it depends on the vehicle and there may be variances based on VIN, but mine has never, ever come close to what I would list as a "safety issue" or anything like it. To me it's maybe an annoyance and really just a quirk.
Again, not minimizing the pain of others, but relaying that mine (built 9/14) isn't even close to the safety edge.
Again, not minimizing the pain of others, but relaying that mine (built 9/14) isn't even close to the safety edge.
Advanced
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 82
Likes: 13
The only thing the transmission is doing from 2 to 3 is releasing the C-brake and engaging the B-clutch. It's supposed to do those 2 things at the same time, as far as I know. Something may be intermittently getting stuck in the valve body (unlikely), or the timing is off, or any number of issues.
The reason it has to be something hardware is because if it was simply a software fix, Acura would have just mandated that all 2015's receive the same software as the 2016's. That would be super cheap to implement. Obviously they haven't done that, so that rules that out (companies will almost always take the cheapest path out if it solves it). Why replace a transmission entirely for a software update?
Hell, even if it was just the TCU, that's on the outside of the transmission. There must be some internal part that's different in some way, even if it's minor, and may have to do with a component in the C-brake or B-clutch. I'm only guessing at this point though.
The reason it has to be something hardware is because if it was simply a software fix, Acura would have just mandated that all 2015's receive the same software as the 2016's. That would be super cheap to implement. Obviously they haven't done that, so that rules that out (companies will almost always take the cheapest path out if it solves it). Why replace a transmission entirely for a software update?
Hell, even if it was just the TCU, that's on the outside of the transmission. There must be some internal part that's different in some way, even if it's minor, and may have to do with a component in the C-brake or B-clutch. I'm only guessing at this point though.
Now that doesn't preclude the possibility that the tranny software engineers may find a valid workaround, but they definitely have not found the secret sauce to resolve all 2015 build issues.
Advanced
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 82
Likes: 13
The only thing the transmission is doing from 2 to 3 is releasing the C-brake and engaging the B-clutch. It's supposed to do those 2 things at the same time, as far as I know. Something may be intermittently getting stuck in the valve body (unlikely), or the timing is off, or any number of issues.
The reason it has to be something hardware is because if it was simply a software fix, Acura would have just mandated that all 2015's receive the same software as the 2016's. That would be super cheap to implement. Obviously they haven't done that, so that rules that out (companies will almost always take the cheapest path out if it solves it). Why replace a transmission entirely for a software update?
Hell, even if it was just the TCU, that's on the outside of the transmission. There must be some internal part that's different in some way, even if it's minor, and may have to do with a component in the C-brake or B-clutch. I'm only guessing at this point though.
The reason it has to be something hardware is because if it was simply a software fix, Acura would have just mandated that all 2015's receive the same software as the 2016's. That would be super cheap to implement. Obviously they haven't done that, so that rules that out (companies will almost always take the cheapest path out if it solves it). Why replace a transmission entirely for a software update?
Hell, even if it was just the TCU, that's on the outside of the transmission. There must be some internal part that's different in some way, even if it's minor, and may have to do with a component in the C-brake or B-clutch. I'm only guessing at this point though.
Now that doesn't preclude the possibility that the tranny software engineers may find a valid workaround, but they definitely have not found the secret sauce to resolve all 2015 build issues.
Styl1n
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 998
Likes: 159
From: NYC-Hollis, Queens
Agree that this is not just a software issue or the 6 TSBs (counting the 4 versions of 15-040) would have corrected it by now. I think there is either a design flaw or perhaps a manufacturing build issue (tolerance stack-up problem maybe?). Or maybe a combination of the two. It seems the later 2015 builds either exhibit the problem less frequently or issue is much less severe.
Now that doesn't preclude the possibility that the tranny software engineers may find a valid workaround, but they definitely have not found the secret sauce to resolve all 2015 build issues.
Now that doesn't preclude the possibility that the tranny software engineers may find a valid workaround, but they definitely have not found the secret sauce to resolve all 2015 build issues.
Cruisin'
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 23
Likes: 0
From: knoxville,tn
just finished reading an article in "Automobile Magazine", long term test of Jeep Cherokee. they said the transmission was a deal breaker, poor shifting. Doesn't the Jeep have the same transmission as the 6 cyl. TLX?
We have a very early 2015. my wife loves the car and doesn't even notice the poor shifting. the very few time I drive or ride in the car it drives me crazy.
We have a very early 2015. my wife loves the car and doesn't even notice the poor shifting. the very few time I drive or ride in the car it drives me crazy.
Registered Abuser of VTEC
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 6,542
Likes: 115
From: Edmonton, Alberta
The old automatics totally failed. These 2015 ones are just being annoying (some people are past annoyance, but the thing still WORKS, just not well). On my initial test drive of a 2015, it had the issue, really badly actually, and I decided to wait for 2016 and was glad I did as a result. The test car had a massive R->D clunk, a hard 2-3 shift (VERY hard, like you would drop your water bottle hard), and hesitation issues coming out of parking lots. They don't seem to be breaking like the 1999-2003 ones though. This transmission is probably pretty durable (especially since it's the heavy duty version, there is a lighter duty version ZF sells and no manufacturer bought it, lol).
Racer
Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 371
Likes: 53
The old automatics totally failed. These 2015 ones are just being annoying (some people are past annoyance, but the thing still WORKS, just not well). On my initial test drive of a 2015, it had the issue, really badly actually, and I decided to wait for 2016 and was glad I did as a result. The test car had a massive R->D clunk, a hard 2-3 shift (VERY hard, like you would drop your water bottle hard), and hesitation issues coming out of parking lots. They don't seem to be breaking like the 1999-2003 ones though. This transmission is probably pretty durable (especially since it's the heavy duty version, there is a lighter duty version ZF sells and no manufacturer bought it, lol).
I believe Acura has lost a lot of sales and goodwill due to the transmission problems.
Drifting
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 2,607
Likes: 536
By the way, the "slow down, then accelerate dead spot" and the "dead spot from a stop" issues have been around for awhile. My '06 TL, '12 TL, and '13 RDX all had it. There were lots of times - like yours - where I would step on it to get out of the way, or across an intersection or whatever, and it was like the car just died for a second, or the accelerator wasn't connected to the engine. Then it would spurt forward.
I hope you get things worked out.
Summer is Coming
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 2,857
Likes: 647
From: Houston
Do you know that for a fact?
Several manufacturers use that tranny, and every one of them modifyit, either with hardware or software. And in some applications, it works fine.
I could be wrong, but there's no hard evidence the transmission as it comes from ZF is defective. It appears to be a function of what Acura, Jeep and others do with it when they get it.
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Several manufacturers use that tranny, and every one of them modifyit, either with hardware or software. And in some applications, it works fine.
I could be wrong, but there's no hard evidence the transmission as it comes from ZF is defective. It appears to be a function of what Acura, Jeep and others do with it when they get it.
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just finished reading an article in "Automobile Magazine", long term test of Jeep Cherokee. they said the transmission was a deal breaker, poor shifting. Doesn't the Jeep have the same transmission as the 6 cyl. TLX?
We have a very early 2015. my wife loves the car and doesn't even notice the poor shifting. the very few time I drive or ride in the car it drives me crazy.
We have a very early 2015. my wife loves the car and doesn't even notice the poor shifting. the very few time I drive or ride in the car it drives me crazy.
Acura does not manufacture the transmission, ZF builds it like other parts they buy from suppliers. I don't even think Acura does the software for it. I think ZF does. Since this transmission is a stop-gap for them until thier own in-house 10-speed is ready, it does not make sense for Acura to take on the expense of manufacturing or even modifying it in house.
Old Man Yelling at Clouds
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 16,973
Likes: 7,362
From: Seattle, WA
Also I'm sure that's a quote from the Acura PR material they are sending all of them. This is broken -> fixed scenario, not better -> best IMO.
Racer
Joined: Dec 2015
Posts: 315
Likes: 39
I wouldn't say mine is a safety issue either but that doesn't mean it's not a problem. I'm able to mimic the problem like 90% of the time in Sports+ and that's how I tend to demo it to the field rep. It's a lot more noticeable in Sports+ that any other mode. I'm just wondering if they'll say something like oh it's normal for Sports+ to have a bit of a jerk.
Could this be a shift point issue where higher revs and delayed shifts aren't subject to whatever the issue is?
I'm not a mechanic or transmission expert, so I'm just guessing based on my own experiences.
Instructor
Joined: Dec 2014
Posts: 225
Likes: 46
From: Orange County, California
I get smooth shifts if the RPM is either low or high. So it seems the mid-range (1500-2500 RPM) is where the software gets the sync wrong. Unfortunately that is the "normal" RPM for when I am starting up from a stop in traffic. Can't gun it or I will plow into the car in front. Could baby foot it, but maybe the car behind would then plow into me!
Advanced
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 82
Likes: 13
What's interesting is that with mine, I just started testing Sport + mode the other day after driving mostly in Normal and Sport (and testing Econ), and Sport + seems to have the least hard shifting in low gears. In fact, the 2-3 shift is almost flawless in Sports +, but the shift point is around 3,500 rpm.
Could this be a shift point issue where higher revs and delayed shifts aren't subject to whatever the issue is?
I'm not a mechanic or transmission expert, so I'm just guessing based on my own experiences.
Could this be a shift point issue where higher revs and delayed shifts aren't subject to whatever the issue is?
I'm not a mechanic or transmission expert, so I'm just guessing based on my own experiences.
AcurAdmirer
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 3,004
Likes: 352
From: Dallas/Ft. Worth, TX
I get smooth shifts if the RPM is either low or high. So it seems the mid-range (1500-2500 RPM) is where the software gets the sync wrong. Unfortunately that is the "normal" RPM for when I am starting up from a stop in traffic. Can't gun it or I will plow into the car in front. Could baby foot it, but maybe the car behind would then plow into me!
Glad you posted this, since i havent seen it mentioned before.
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Old Man Yelling at Clouds
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 16,973
Likes: 7,362
From: Seattle, WA
I get smooth shifts if the RPM is either low or high. So it seems the mid-range (1500-2500 RPM) is where the software gets the sync wrong. Unfortunately that is the "normal" RPM for when I am starting up from a stop in traffic. Can't gun it or I will plow into the car in front. Could baby foot it, but maybe the car behind would then plow into me!
Instructor
Joined: Apr 2015
Posts: 166
Likes: 52
I am in a loaner 2015 V6 Tech for the next few days. I haven't looked at the build date yet, but the transmission definitely has the 2-3 bump. It does not feel as pronounced as my previous transmission, but it certainly still makes me appreciate the replacement. I will be happy to have my car back next week.
I am driving this one in granny ECO mode. As said above, it you are soft on the accelerator, the bump is minimized.
I am driving this one in granny ECO mode. As said above, it you are soft on the accelerator, the bump is minimized.
Drifting
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 2,607
Likes: 536
I get smooth shifts if the RPM is either low or high. So it seems the mid-range (1500-2500 RPM) is where the software gets the sync wrong. Unfortunately that is the "normal" RPM for when I am starting up from a stop in traffic. Can't gun it or I will plow into the car in front. Could baby foot it, but maybe the car behind would then plow into me!
AcurAdmirer
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 3,004
Likes: 352
From: Dallas/Ft. Worth, TX
This is exactly what I reported to the dealership. As a matter of fact, I said it happens around 2000 RPM in stop and go rush hour traffic. With the latest updates it's much better. As a matter of fact over the past week or two for some odd reason it's gotten a lot better. It's not nearly as good as the 2016 as I drove, but it's bearable to drive in rush-hour traffic again. If I only had to worry about a short trip, I wouldn't have been so ticked, but I have a 60 mile round-trip in stop and go traffic that felt like somebody was clubbing my seat with a bat when the tranny was at its worst. As a matter of fact, in driving it today, I felt the lag in the morning, but didn't feel the 2000'ish RPM bump as hard or frequently. Like I said, it's bearable now. Or it was today, anyway. No telling what tomorrow will bring. I've noticed this in Sport and Normal driving now (the smoother shifts) whereas a week or two ago the bumps were coming back after the latest software updates. I swear this tranny's possessed sometimes.
My situation isn't as stop and go as yours and many others, and I therefore don't experience the 2-3 shift as often in a given day. That makes me a little more tolerant of it than you guys who get bumped a hundred times a day.
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Drifting
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 2,607
Likes: 536
You make an excellent point - people who drive or worse yet commute in a lot of traffic and therefore go through a lot of cycles of stop and go will get more frustrated with the shift bump. It's just a matter of how many times you have to experience it in a given time frame.
My situation isn't as stop and go as yours and many others, and I therefore don't experience the 2-3 shift as often in a given day. That makes me a little more tolerant of it than you guys who get bumped a hundred times a day.
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My situation isn't as stop and go as yours and many others, and I therefore don't experience the 2-3 shift as often in a given day. That makes me a little more tolerant of it than you guys who get bumped a hundred times a day.
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On the other hand, when I'm cruising or accelerating above 40 mph or so, the car is an awesome drive.
Old Man Yelling at Clouds
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 16,973
Likes: 7,362
From: Seattle, WA
So frustrated with Customer Care.
So I send them some new information about my case and a question about why some are getting transmissions replaced and others not. They say "please call and reference your case number". I think to myself, well good maybe they are reconsidering their answer. So I call - after the obligatory phone tag I get the rep. I say I got a message from Acura to call them. He asks what about?
I say Acura asked me to call them. So I go over my question. He basically says nothing has changed about my case and they are not fixing anything. So I ask why did you ask me to call you? He says because if I had a concern they want to hear from me.
Really.
Cliffs:
Me: Hi Acura Customer Care I have a problem.
ACR: We're not fixing your broken transmission.
Me: Hi Acura Customer Care, I have new information.
ACR: Please call us!
Me: OK I've called, what's the news?
ACR: We're still not fixing your broken transmission.
So done with Acura.
So I send them some new information about my case and a question about why some are getting transmissions replaced and others not. They say "please call and reference your case number". I think to myself, well good maybe they are reconsidering their answer. So I call - after the obligatory phone tag I get the rep. I say I got a message from Acura to call them. He asks what about?
I say Acura asked me to call them. So I go over my question. He basically says nothing has changed about my case and they are not fixing anything. So I ask why did you ask me to call you? He says because if I had a concern they want to hear from me. Really.
Cliffs:
Me: Hi Acura Customer Care I have a problem.
ACR: We're not fixing your broken transmission.
Me: Hi Acura Customer Care, I have new information.
ACR: Please call us!
Me: OK I've called, what's the news?
ACR: We're still not fixing your broken transmission.
So done with Acura.
Racer
Joined: Dec 2015
Posts: 315
Likes: 39
So frustrated with Customer Care.
So I send them some new information about my case and a question about why some are getting transmissions replaced and others not. They say "please call and reference your case number". I think to myself, well good maybe they are reconsidering their answer. So I call - after the obligatory phone tag I get the rep. I say I got a message from Acura to call them. He asks what about? I say Acura asked me to call them. So I go over my question. He basically says nothing has changed about my case and they are not fixing anything. So I ask why did you ask me to call you? He says because if I had a concern they want to hear from me.
Really.
Cliffs:
Me: Hi Acura Customer Care I have a problem.
ACR: We're not fixing your broken transmission.
Me: Hi Acura Customer Care, I have new information.
ACR: Please call us!
Me: OK I've called, what's the news?
ACR: We're still not fixing your broken transmission.
So done with Acura.
So I send them some new information about my case and a question about why some are getting transmissions replaced and others not. They say "please call and reference your case number". I think to myself, well good maybe they are reconsidering their answer. So I call - after the obligatory phone tag I get the rep. I say I got a message from Acura to call them. He asks what about?
I say Acura asked me to call them. So I go over my question. He basically says nothing has changed about my case and they are not fixing anything. So I ask why did you ask me to call you? He says because if I had a concern they want to hear from me. Really.
Cliffs:
Me: Hi Acura Customer Care I have a problem.
ACR: We're not fixing your broken transmission.
Me: Hi Acura Customer Care, I have new information.
ACR: Please call us!
Me: OK I've called, what's the news?
ACR: We're still not fixing your broken transmission.
So done with Acura.
Yeah, this is essentially my experience as well. Going to the dealer tomorrow as asked by ACR, but I'm at the point of just driving the car and seeing if anything gets worse. Then if they don't replace the tranny I'll take them to court or see about lemon law proceedings through arbitration.
What's still very curious to me are the differences in performance based on temperature, IDS setting, build of software, and shift points. What's also interesting is that drivers of Jeeps, Chryslers, and Land Rovers with this same transmission report issues 100% solved via software updates or in some cases no change and only replacement helped. The difference seems to be that those other manufacturers aren't fluffing off the issue or trying to say it's "normal" the way Acura has.
I would love for someone at ZF to post anonymously what the hell is the deal with this transmission.
Old Man Yelling at Clouds
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 16,973
Likes: 7,362
From: Seattle, WA
^ Yeah I think I'm done with the fight. I've spent too much energy on it as it is. I will continue to make good on my promise to make sure people know how Acura is treating it's loyal customers. For now, I'm just going to explore options to get out of the car and move on. Might take me another year until I can get out from under it on the lease. The depreciation on this car seems abnormal. All the more reason I'm glad I leased it.
Instructor
Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 205
Likes: 32
From: Miami FL
So frustrated with Customer Care.
So I send them some new information about my case and a question about why some are getting transmissions replaced and others not. They say "please call and reference your case number". I think to myself, well good maybe they are reconsidering their answer. So I call - after the obligatory phone tag I get the rep. I say I got a message from Acura to call them. He asks what about? I say Acura asked me to call them. So I go over my question. He basically says nothing has changed about my case and they are not fixing anything. So I ask why did you ask me to call you? He says because if I had a concern they want to hear from me.
Really.
Cliffs:
Me: Hi Acura Customer Care I have a problem.
ACR: We're not fixing your broken transmission.
Me: Hi Acura Customer Care, I have new information.
ACR: Please call us!
Me: OK I've called, what's the news?
ACR: We're still not fixing your broken transmission.
So done with Acura.
So I send them some new information about my case and a question about why some are getting transmissions replaced and others not. They say "please call and reference your case number". I think to myself, well good maybe they are reconsidering their answer. So I call - after the obligatory phone tag I get the rep. I say I got a message from Acura to call them. He asks what about?
I say Acura asked me to call them. So I go over my question. He basically says nothing has changed about my case and they are not fixing anything. So I ask why did you ask me to call you? He says because if I had a concern they want to hear from me. Really.
Cliffs:
Me: Hi Acura Customer Care I have a problem.
ACR: We're not fixing your broken transmission.
Me: Hi Acura Customer Care, I have new information.
ACR: Please call us!
Me: OK I've called, what's the news?
ACR: We're still not fixing your broken transmission.
So done with Acura.
Suzuka Master
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 5,204
Likes: 1,267
1Louder...I wish you luck. It is unfortunate that they had to piss people off that badly and turn many people away from the brand but their loss. I had purchased several Acuras and when our ILX lease is over, that will be it for us too.
CTSV,TL, Audi Q7 & A5SB
Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 2,082
Likes: 600
From: NYC / LI
^ Yeah I think I'm done with the fight. I've spent too much energy on it as it is. I will continue to make good on my promise to make sure people know how Acura is treating it's loyal customers. For now, I'm just going to explore options to get out of the car and move on. Might take me another year until I can get out from under it on the lease. The depreciation on this car seems abnormal. All the more reason I'm glad I leased it.
But someone I know sold his leased GM vehicle to them right around a year into his 36 month lease and walked away relatively unscathed. When all was said and done I think he took a $500 hit which was worth it to him so he could walk away.