bazoulay

Hey All,

I know this might sound overkill with many threads out there around sound system upgrade but I went through all the threads around that subjects and couldn't find the answers to the following questions...Please don't rub the ELS sound system as I owned a 2010 TL NAV also and know it was way better but the 2014 A-spec doesn't have the option of NAV available and couldn't opt for that option. :-(

1- If I would want to start with a first upgrade, should I consider a sub with Amp or change the speakers first?

2- If I change my speakers, do I absoluetly need to go with components in the front which means tweeter also or can I go 2 way speakers leaving the tweeters alone? Thinking to go with Infinity Kappa.

3- Would the 2 way speaker affect the balance of audio in the car having a tweeter also built in the speaker on top of the A-pillar ones?

4-If opting for a sub woofer/amp upgrade only, will the OEM speaker keep up with the sound or will it too much to handle? Here I am debating with a infinity basslink or traditional Box+Amp 12" Alpine or infinity is on my list...Also, is the install of a sub/amp require the installer to tare down the car that much?

Some help would be awesome as I am planning to move this week on upgrading my audio system.

KarKraze

Many have experienced issues with the original speakers. That said, any upgrade will not increase the audio volume level but will enhance the clarity.


It all depends on what you are looking to achieve since what is just right for me may be too much or not enough for you.


I felt that the non ELS system lacks depth to make it sound the way it should and all I did was to add a single 10" sub with a mono amp. I also disconnected the original sub.


When creating an audio system, the most important and perhaps difficult thing is to create a front stage, where the music appears to be in front of you as opposed to completely behind you.


For me, this upgrade was simple, effective and not too costly as I built the box and did the installation myself.

bazoulay

Thanks, yes I think.you said it well. Needs a little depth to the sound. How was the install of sub? Did you have to send wires all the way to the front of car and remove many panels?? That's what I'm a little worried about as I will need an installer to do this and wouldn't want him to mess up my brand new car.

As for speakers, the infinity kappa component set I was thinking comes with 3/4 tweeters...I know the oem are 1inch. Wonder if they can still be fitted in the original spot.

KarKraze

You are welcome. I understand your concern about your car, I am pretty much the same way with mine. There are many very good installers and the key would be to do some research and find a competent one.

A professional would go into your car and you would not have any damages. You will have to run a power wire directly from the battery and feed it through the engine compartment, I found a spot just under the steering column. The side trim panels by both doors as well as the bottom half of the rear seat will have to be removed.
The ground wire should be as close to the amp as possible and your sub feed will come off the original sub wires. If you purchase an amp with a line or speaker level inputs you can connect directly. If you purchase an amp with RCA inputs only them you will need to purchase a line level adaptor or LOC. There are some amps that have both type of inputs.

With regards to your speaker choice, adaptor plates can be fabricated to accommodate them, it all depends on the level of customization you want to get in to.

xerjyo

hi, i have a non els 2012 tl, first y plan un just adding a sub, i choose a image dinamic idq10 v4 for sound quality, but at the end de proyect is turning into a big audio system, wich came into active 2 way audisson avk 6 speakers, audisson 6 coaxials in the back, two hdp4 hertz amps, audison bit one processor, just to keep all audio functions and phone too, using glen audio sound dampening on doors, mabye roof, and trunk, to achive very very good sq, without being in competitions.
now answering your questions.
1.- first sub, weakest part in the tl audio system for me
2 and 3.- you can use 2 way components in front stage changing tweet an woofer using an xover, or just the woofer leaving original tweets, but not adding two more tweets with coaxial speakers.
4.- you can use a small not to powerfull, sub like a 10 or even 8 sub in a sealed box, and taking out the original sub, using the hole as bass port to the car interior.
thats my opinion

bazoulay

Thats great info xerjyo!! I will start with a sub and going for the infinity Basslink installed on Friday. Went to a local futureshop and told me those are really impressive. karkraZe, since you are very detailed with install, will this be an easier install with the basslink vs what you described? The sub and amp are combined in one unit and 200rms!

Finally, Xerjyo...if I understand what you said, I should not install 2 way speakers to replace oem component while keeping oem tweeter...I read many acurazine member saying they replaced for 2 way speakers.

If I want to go next step, should I just change the 2 front and 2 backs for components?

KarKraze

Generally I would not use products such as the Basslink, Bazooka Tube etc. However, it all depends on your budget and what you are looking to achieve. Those products offer an easy, convenient and space saving way to add bass to your system albeit at the sacrifice of a proper system. If you are looking to slowly build a high end audio system I would suggest you start with a good sub and an enclosure built to the spec of that speaker and a good amp, then take it from there.


Truth is, you can build a very elaborate system with multiple amps/crossover, sound processors, vehicle sound deadening, stiffening capacitors, component speakers in the front, center, rear and multiple subs etc. It really depends on how far you want to go with it.


My advise is to start slowly and then build upon it, speak to a professional at an established audio shop who will listen and understand what you want to achieve and not someone who is looking to sell you products.


Established audio shops would not include the big box stores such as Future Shop or Best Buy. I mean a custom car audio store in the area you are located.

xerjyo

from my understanding, a two way speakers, are actually two separate speakers, a woofer for "mid range" and a tweeter for "hi range" while a coaxial are woofer and tweeter in the same body, like audison voce avx 6.5, so when they said that they change to a two way speaker y think they change both; every shop that try´s to sell some product will say that it´s wonderful, but then you listen to a better speaker and a whole diferent world, while y like more sq tan spl thats why y choose those components for my car, not 100% about two way speakers but i´m pretty shure.

KarKraze

You are correct , component speakers will reproduce music that is much cleaner than coaxial speakers. Personally, I prefer clarity over bass heavy systems as well.


Op, from several hundred to several thousand, it all comes down to what you are trying to accomplish. Try to imagine what you need from the end product and then purchase accordingly.

kwong819

I have a fairly new basslink from my last car that I want to throw in my 4G TL to give it a little more bump as well for a low cost (for now). Please let us know how the install goes... I assume it should be easy, just run the power to the battery, ground it to the body somewhere, then tap into the existing sub... I just haven't had time to take everything apart and look into it, but I would like to know what you think of it and how it sounds compared to the OG system, plus its a great space save since its fairly small.

bazoulay

Will do for sure. Install is scheduled for this Friday. Do you know in which part of the trunk will you install it or where it should for better sound? Really to many uneven parts in that trunck and not sure where it will fit despite of being small. I think you can install it flat or standing up. Debating if it can fit right where the hatch open is or on one of the lower sides to keep spare wheel space open. If anyone installed the infinity basslink, let us know how it sounds and placement of it.

kwong819

I'm thinking standing up against the back seats if it fits, not sure if its to tall or not.. if it doesn't fit there I'll probably try the driver side corner by the taillight area.

xerjyo

i wil try first left taillight area, the right one has the manual opener for the gas tank, maybe if i got the money a three way speaker in te front with semi active setup, and mids and hi´s in a pilar with hertz mille i know this is not the topic of the thread but just to give any one ideas what can be done in this car

bazoulay

Hey All,

Just got by Subwoofer installed but toke Karkraze's advise and went with an Apline M-500 amp and a 10" Infinity 10" reference subwoofer.....WOW!!! What a difference!!! This was installed by a professional installer at futureshop...which BTW you would be impressed how great he was. Toke him 1:30 and the car looks clean. In my case, didn't need the trunk space so I went with a bassworkx box right in middle with amp mounted in the back. Sound is so complete and powerful with only 1/4 volume from amp and sub set at -4!! I wonder if I really need to change the speakers and if it will make a difference now...

Here are some pictures.

KarKraze

Love both products. As mentioned, I felt that depth is all that is missing from the base system, I take it you agree now after listening to your new set up.


As for replacing the other speakers.............I would not, your car is new and they are all covered by warranty, if one goes out the let the dealer replace it.


The other thing is, now that you have a real sub (lol) you can turn down the bass on the original speakers and turn up the bass on the sub, this will put less stress on the factory speakers and extend its life.


Only thing I don't like is the loss of trunk space but as you mentioned it is not an issue for you.

bazoulay

Ya...still debating on the right settings...I have the base at C or -1 and sub at -4 or -5...When playing with the base setting it seems that the subwoofer increases also not just the speakers base. Karkraze, whats you setting at for Base?

KarKraze

Bass is at +2 and sub bass at +3.


If you feel that the sub bass is drowning out the rest of the system you may want to look at the gain level on the amp. Generally, to set that I will turn it all the way down, then adjust the system volume to around 30 and then turn the gain to the point where there is no clipping or distortion.

bazoulay

The Gain is one level over the min line. Looks like I'm at 1/8th of Amp power and Sub is loud at -4, -2...Left the Base at C and sub at -2 for now. Sound is great so far under ProLogic II which is IMO the better mode vs Off. Do you guys keep it on or off?

lift3d_

thats a nice setup, i subscribed to this thread last week and happy i did

im tackling my sound this winter, and have been peeking around my local futureshop lately. not sure i want to grab my sub there, but they have nice amps and i've heard their installation crew is surprisingly good as well.

hows the vibration coming out of the trunk? do you find your license plate rattles at all? i've thought of laying some dynomat behind all the fabric but that shit isn't cheap

kwong819

so did they just tap into the existing sub wiring? as far as running power to the sub as well, do you know where they went through to get it to the battery? i think i my start taking a look into mine this weekend and how i can run my basslink

bazoulay

No vibration at all on plates or anything else. These cars are well isolated. As for install i'm not sure how he did it as I came 1h30 later and it was all done. Didn't seem complicated for him. This makes a total difference in the sound system as I had the els before and now its way better then that. I wonder if the speakers in els and base are the same. Apparently they ate pioneer.

xerjyo

what do you think about this set up, focal 165 w-rc speakers in the front, audison voce coaxials in the rear, hertz hdp4 amps, and image dinamics idq 10 v3 sub? front stage, semi active, rears passive, original hu and audison bit one?

bazoulay

Thats sounds great, especially if changing the Amp!!! Im really thinking hard after adding a Sub 10" reference infinity and Alpine amp to change my speakers but keeping the OEM AMP. Seems to be way too many of taking apart the car if I changed the AMP and the car is brand new. I was debating on doing either of those 2 scenarios: Changing the 2 front and 2 rear for 2way infinity Kappa's 62.9i, (those are 2-way and don't know if that will change the sound that much and what the extra tweeter will do to the audio balance) or changing 2 front Component infinity Kappa 60.9CS (with tweeter) and rear 2-way Kappas 62.9i. I wonder how harder it would be to change the AMP on top of that...was looking at the alpine AM-300 4ch but man oh man thats work. Also, not sure if I want to go in that A pillar to change the tweeters...seems to be a pain to do if I go that route, I should change the central while Im there to have all 8 speaker changed!!! How hard is it to install the central speaker? do we need to remove the dash???

Lets get some advise on Acurazine member who did those changes? Which is the best option? Component +tweeters or 2 way speakers front and rear??

xerjyo

You can conect the external amps after or before the oem one, un my set up one amp for the front stage and another fore the rear and sub, while the processor will be before the oem amp

Brew0360

You cannot connect external amps before the OEM amp. Give it a try and you will see that you won't be able to control any of the sound settings of the OEM HU including volume.

Brew0360

Dump the Audison bit one and get a Mosconi 6to8 (with controller if you like). You will thank me later.

Brew0360

I missed that this thread was for a Non-Nav Base TL. My responses are based on experience and what currently installed in my SH-AWD Tech.

workTL

Agreed. Masconi is the better choice DSP for the stock HU.

xerjyo

My mistake, yes it shoulf be after the oem amp, how you conect the mosconi 6 channel input to the non navigation tl? I think im 2 missing channels for the semiactive front stage, im still talking of a non tech package audio set up.

Brew0360

What do you mean by semi-active front stage?

gramzee

Hi guys, quick question, i've searched and am not sure i've seen a definitive answer. Plus this thread seems active.

In the 3G TL, (i've recently traded up to a '12 SHAWD Tech here in Canada) the head unit was tested for signal output pre-amp, and showed a usable signal. Many guys take the signal out of the radio before the amp as it was the cleanest, and did not exhibit noise faults of the factory amp. Has anyone tested the 4G deck to see similar results? I've reviewed the wiring diagram in the FSM and it shows all the right wires and what they do, on the 28P connector B page 23-35. I'm just confused, I see a lot of people grabbing everything after the factory amp here with the 4G. What i'm hoping to get at is find a 28P connector that will plug into the factory harness that goes into the amp, and have RCA's soldered into a custom harness. Here is a picture of the connector (one on the right) that would be required. Note that this picture is take from a vendors website that makes a different product for the TL. in the 3G, guys would grab a harness that I think came from iSimple and chop off the connector and build out the harness.



ihatecars might be able to chime in on what was done with the 3G, i've seen him post about it before, and believe he is doing the same thing. I've seen another guy diamondjoequimby ask in this forum as well, he did it first on his 3G I believe (could be wrong) and didn't get a response. Maybe this get's it's own thread to keep from muddying up this one.

xerjyo

in my case, front woofers directly to amps, while tweeter using an xover, thats what we call front semiactive stage

Brew0360

I don't know why you would want to do that when you can just buy a Mosconi 6to8 and go all active with dedicated amp channels for the tweeter, fronts, rear and sub; and dump the front passive xovers. The "8" in 6to8 means you have 8 outputs that you can assign.

I quess if it sounds good to you, "go for it". Good luck.

xerjyo

I dont know if i can use the mosconi without summing al channels, while in Mexico is really expensive, using the xover is in first place to protect the beryllium tweet while i learn to use the processor so i cant blow it and the second point the tweeter is at 6 or 8 omhs wile the amp is stable at 4 or 2, thats why, while sq will not be afected

Brew0360

Why would you spend 2K for a set of WRCs and have the cheap OEM amp power any part of it.

Get your system installled and then we can discuss. I have 165 WRC in the front / KRX-2 in the rear and a 10W7 sub. My processor is the 6to8 and my amp are currently JL HD 750/1 (sub) and JL HD 600/4 (front and rear). I moving to Focal FPS amps so that I can run the WRCs active which Focal highly recommends.

I've gone through most of the processors out (cleansweeps, MS-8, Alpine PXA-H800), so I'm very familiar with the Acura OEM system and it's many limitation. My thread below but have not updated since changing to 6to8:

https://acurazine.com/forums/showthr...light=brew0360

xerjyo

I will be using a dhp4 just for the utopias not the original amp,

Brew0360

When will your system build be complete? Send pics to share with the rest of the forum.

xerjyo

Still planning it, will be done in dicember, the installer lives 400km away frome me so it will be done in vacations, will make a thread about it, the installer is the same guy that build a white tl with alpine stuff.

workTL

Brew, why did you swap out the H800 for the 6to8?

I absolutely love the Alpine DSP.

Brew0360

The Acura SH-AWD Tech front or rear OEM output signal is not full range and the Alpine products H701 or H800 don't sum.

That why I changed to Mosconi.