Capt_Crunch

With the latest TL updates I am so tempted to pull the trigger on a Graphite Gray 2012 TL Advanced. But after being heartbroken that Acura dropped the deep blue color I looked at the 2011 ES350 in Deep Sea Mica and love the color. The two cars are so close to being the same in equipment that it is making my head hurt from flipping back and forth between the two.

Ronp8

I saw a guy with a '09 TL in the dark blue color and I thought it was awesome. Great looking car. I wonder why Acura stopped using this color.

princelybug

iTrader: (16)

The ES350 is FWD and ugly.

Steven Bell

iTrader: (2)

Captain, I know color is a huge consideration for many. You really need to look at the big picture, besides just color.

Pound for pound, dollar for dollar, the TL is the best car on the road. But, of course, you ARE on an Acura forum......




.

promethus78

same eqp but two totally different cars

Treblig

Here is my take, if you enjoy the "ride" go Lexus, if you enjoy the "drive" TL all the way.

Pete2010

I agree, if you like to drive, get the TL. If you want a nice car to get you from point a to point b - get the ES350.

Ruby

TL is nicer to drive but Lexus is nice overall. Lexus is usually a little bit better than Acura if I am being completely honest. But you pay for it.

compewterbleu

I peeped the Lexus' out 2 years ago, when it came time to make a decision it didn't even make the cut. The safer choice is Lexus, Acura is much more daring and about the drive vs the ride.

Oswald Vater

I compared ES to TL in 08. After driving both I realized that while the ES was nice it had no "personality". I could have been driving a loaded Ford Taurus for all I knew. That being said, I went with the TL and when my lease on it was up I didn't even consider the ES this time around. I am very happy with both the comfort level and "personality" of my 2010 FWD/Tech. But to each his own. Spend time with both vehicles before making your decision.

compewterbleu

That's it, personality Mr. Oswald, personality! It's like finally hooking up with this gorgeous woman you've been admiring from afar and once you've been with her you realize there were no explosion or fireworks, nothing more than the muted sensation that you get from kissing a cold fish.

Treblig

That is the best advice. You're going to be the one who has pay for and live with your decision.

AsianRage

We drove an ES350 a while ago as a loaner. My wife, who is a Lexus-type (as oppose to me, an Acura person) agreed that the ES is very bland. My father in law said that he wouldn't buy it since it look so ordinary inside. Granted, this isn't in comparison to the 4G TL. But these opinions remain.

jasonwdp10

Quietness and refinement = ES350
Sporty and sharper handling = TL

The price is about the same btw guys. TL Base Advanced is $41k, the ES with it's 2nd option is also $41k. Features are about the same, give or take.

lji

I wouldn't venture toward Lexus or Toyota for a few years until I see the cars back to the old Lexus/Toyota standards. The ES350 has had transmission issues that Lexus quietly acknowledged. I had an IS250 (bought new) before I bought my TL and that car had too many issues that I finally got rid of it.

Glashub

The ES looks nice. I mistake it for a GS or Camry all of the time. You don't have to worry about sticking out in the crowd.

BLEXV6

That's right, I tested them both, and if you want a quiet, dead, smooth luxury vehicle, the Lexus is for you. If you want a sporty, drivers car, the TL is for you. I was really fond of the ES until I did the test drive. I love my Honda's ande the way they drive.

TechnoCat

Which makes the 2009-2011 TL what, the buck-toothed oddly-proportioned gal you got drunk and took for a spin, only to discover that you share the same obsessions and she can, with her one tooth, give you the best feelings you've ever had?

The TL is a sports-car in sedan-size. The Lexus is a Japanese Buick. Neither is a bad car, but they aren't the same.

ZCL

I was tossing the idea of a GS 350 AWD before buying the 2012 TL Advance SH-AWD. I really liked the GS but I felt like I was getting in a car that had 8 year old tech vs. the TL.

They both drove well, TL handled better, GS had better steering feel/response.

TL won.

Glashub

Check out the NY Times review of the Audi S5 .... decided the cars are lacking charisma. And this about your vaunted and much touted by you S4 -

"And that leads to my only significant gripe about the new S4 that, along with all the qualitative improvements, Audi may have inadvertently given the car a bravado-ectomy. With the demise of the 3.2 V-6 model, the S4 is now the midrange A4, slotted between the 4-cylinder 2.0T and the inevitable RS4. And it seems Audi is saving the overt aggression for the RS flagship."

Karanx7

iTrader: (2)

I own an 08 ES350, and I can say with confidence that it is an Old Man car. It is not fun to drive AT ALL. Even when you punch it, it just lacks any real feeling.

But if the quiet boring drive is what your looking for, look no further.

Don1

When I bought my 2010 TL Tech I test drove both the TL and ES350 for about an hour each. The TL was fun to drive and had lots of features that the ES lacked unless you bought a costly option package. Canadian pricing was different than U.S. for comparable car. Driving the ES was very boring and I almost fell asleep during the drive. Really, I kid you not. Before the tests I had considered the two cars to have more or less equal merit. After the drives it was the TL hands down. I have never regretted the choice.

TechnoCat

That was a bit off-topic; I was saying the TL is better than the E350; I didn't mention Audi. The NYT is the yellowest journal we have, but I did say after getting my S4 that the TL is more sportscar than it (and said it here.)

compewterbleu

Dang Techno-Kitty, you got got cat scratch fever or sumthin'? LOL One man's trash another man's treasure....

I can't help it if I knew what i wanted when I bought my TL ....

...oh by the way, "Chick dig the car."

compewterbleu

If it's not an Audi that kitty won't purr...

TRIUMPHT

iTrader: (1)

well i would have to say test drive both ...i have the 2011 TL & my wife has the 2011 ES350.....so naturally i've gotten to do more than test drive both cars....i do know the 2012 TL & ES350 is a closer comparison that both have the 6 speed auto transmission .........but with my comparison...if you are more into sport driving the TL is a better car & if you want more luxury & smoothness the ES350 is better....i like the fact that i can switch up but honestly i find myself more in my TL...........i find myself up to high in the ES no matter how far i drop the seat as to where i feel nice and low in my TL ...not as low as my 3rd gen TL but still a hell of a lot lower than the ES............the ES is also behind in horses about 15/20 HP's if i am not mistaken .....but the cars are definitely close in comparison. ..my wife was originally looking at the Infiniti G sedan ...drove it and said she felt it was to sporty ..and went with the ES350 and loves it .........she wasn't a big fan of the exterior but that went right out the window when she drove the ES................................................ ...........won't tell you that that is an easy decision to make ...but good luck on the decision and also just think of what yo want out of the car ...more sport or more luxury comfort ........

TRIUMPHT

iTrader: (1)

but then again i think i just have an ACURA bias because back in 2000 i ad a 96 TL and my girlfriend at the time had a 08 E 320 and as much as she used to try and get me to drive her benz i would always say no and jump in my TL ......lol

Glashub

Yeah, you're right, TC. I was getting compewterbleau's back in a gentle way. I like his posts. In fact, I like some of the things you post as well. You seem to try to be fair most of the time but on the other hand you never miss an opportunity to dump on the TL overtly or in what you consider a sly and subtle manner.

ggesq

iTrader: (1)

Do not turn this thread into an Audi thread. Thanks.

LessisBestmakingendsmeet

85% of Tl's sold are FWD models with buyers much like the ES 350 with pretty much the same demographics. The TL is slightly sportier while the ES is more luxurious and both have basically the same acceleration. Both are based off another platform (Accord/Camry) and both are about the same price and size and both are entry level luxury sedans. The ES is built in Japan though. The TL-SHAWD offers a sportier option. The ES 350 was a huge hit for Lexus while the current TL has been a huge miss for Acura. Another thing to consider is the TL is newer while the next ES is probably coming soon.

Flipster23

iTrader: (15)

The ES350 is ugly IMO

jasonwdp10

I won't reply to any of your posts after this, in order to "not make this an audi thread" but I have something to add, in terms of the Audi A5 vs the Acura TL.

I regularly drive the A5, and it's much more engaging than the TL. Did you even read that review?

"The 2-liter engine is rated at 268 pound-feet of torque from 1,500 to 4,200 r.p.m. and it has excellent part-throttle response, but it is devoid of personality — or even a discernible exhaust note. "
The 2 liter is already known to "lack personality" in VWs other models. It's actually a pretty generic sounding motor.

"The V-6 is actually too quiet"
I don't see how this is a bad thing. The TL's V6's are some of the quietest I've driven for awhile.

"The A5 coupe’s chassis feels understressed. The quattro system makes it all but impossible to overwhelm the tires with horsepower"
It almost sounds like they're talking about the SHAWD TL here. Again, no problem here.

"Audi says the S5 Coupe will hustle to 60 m.p.h. in 4.9-seconds — nearly quick enough to make one overlook its 3,858 pounds."
Nearly quick enough? 4.9 seconds to 60 is not fast anymore?

"While the A5 and S5 are gorgeous cars, they come up short in mechanical character — tantalizingly close to living up to their tailored exteriors, but not quite there."
What it sounds like to me, is that the NYT reviewers were unhappy with the idea that the Audis look better than they perform. Which to an extent I agree. However, almost all other reviews are gushing about them btw in terms of looks and performance, including most of this review.. though mostly about the A5/S5's looks.

If the A5/S5 are "lacking in charisma" then the TL has "no charisma" and the ES350 has negative charisma since it is quieter, smoother, and rides better than the TL.

Btw, what I'm seeing here is that you are trying to create a problem in this thread by taking it off topic and directly attacking TC.

jasonwdp10

Exactly! Most TL drivers I see are older men or women (especially older women) and are FWD. There's a huge disparity here since there are so many male SHAWD drivers on this forum.

We're comparing a relatively new Acura to a soon-to-be-replaced lexus. Heck if anything, the Base TL is still trying to catch up to where the ES is now. When the new ES comes out, it'll probably blow the current TL out of the water. Then acura will try really hard to catch up by softening and quieting the TL down (again).

Litt

Yeah my dad has an ES 350. It def has a softer ride and is much quieter. Everything is high quality. But I would have more fun driving my car.

Lexus seats don't have too much side support.

New ES 350 takes regular unleaded!

The ES will never blow the TL out of the water even when the ES is refreshed. It will not have a awesome AWD system. The next gen ES will only be quieter and more refined then it is now.
Lexus doesn't try to make it sporty. They have inferior (cheaper) machperson struts, and FWD only, much softer. It's what they're going for.

jasonwdp10

Eh I meant the Base (FWD) TL, not SHAWD.

Glashub

Are you the guy that bought a FWD and regrets it or are you the one that bought more car than you can afford? I can't remember.

It's insulting to ask if I read the article. Here's the title which perfectly sums up the article, "Perfectly Tailored Two-Doors Coming Up Short on Charisma" Incredible that you would support TC after all of the pain he's caused on this forum with his disparaging comments about the TL and TL owners. You are the one trying to cause problems because you overlooked my post where I go out my way to laud him for some of his posts even though I haven't a clue why he or you hang around here.

winstrolvtec

Acura will probably never try to get the TL FWD to match the exact quietness or soft ride of the ES. I think Acura will try to improve those areas but never at the expense of what makes it what it is. Which is the sporty alternative to a large(r) FWD entry luxury sedan. Likewise the ES will probably never be a FWD TL but may try to infuse a bit of sportier appeal.

In the small group of large FWD luxury or premium sedans, the ES is at one end the TL FWD at the other. They are the same type of vehicle for that specific market but still have and will continue to have contrasting characters.

jjsC5

Exactly.

There are no right or wrong answers - you have to decide what you are looking for. I've driven an ES and you could not give me one. And I have a Lexus GS350. But the ES is quite a bit "softer" than my GS, and it's a little on the soft side itself.

But I am a believer in the right tool for the job. My daily driver is the GS and my weekend car is a Z06 Corvette. I love them both but would not want the Corvette to be my daily driver and would not want the GS to be my weekend car.

jspagna1

We also looked at the ES350 when shopping for cars. The ES350 is just a glorified Camry IMO and Lexus cars as a whole have no road feel. Mother-inlaw had one and it was just so numb.Yes it is an old persons car for sure.
TL is much sportier and gives me the road feel that I enjoy from a car. It's really your decision to make as to what you want.
Also as someone mentioned before, Toyota needs to get there act together. Build a Toyota like my 97 4Runner and I'll consider them once again as well.

Costco

Ask Acurazine = TL by a landslide

Ask ClubLexus = ES350 by a landslide



Lessisbestmkaskdjk summed it up best.