Pete2010

Hey everyone - Had the opportunity to drive a 2012 TL as I dropped my car off at the dealer to get some stuff checked out.

Had a failed TPMS sensor they replaced under warranty - but also had another issue I've experienced a little after I first got the car. When in cold weather - shifting into 3rd and then re-engaging the clutch - the shifter would pop out and back into neutral.

So first - my thoughts on the 2012 TL (Non Tech FWD) after having my 2010 for 2 years.

1) The 6AT is very smooth - very responsive - seems almost as responsive as my 6MT
2) Steering seems much improved from my 2010 - they obviously did more tweaks since the 2010 TL 6MT (which was already tweaked and optimized from the 09 & 10 models). Feels much more engaging and no strange dead-zone in the middle while on the highway (at least not as pronounced on my 2010).
3) FWD sucks - Had a bit of rain today, accelerating from a stop making a turn, wheelspin. In my 2 years of ownership of my 2010 i don't think i have ever had wheelspin (unless in epic snow) - god i love SHAWD
4) Fit and finish - Obviously this is the entry level TL - so I didn't expect much. Leather seats are much lower quality than my 2010 - i'm guessing it's because it's non-tech. Really odd that they have wood trim on the cup holder cover and cubby behind the shifter - but aluminum on the dash... strange - I don't like wood trim anyway - but still looked odd. Other than that - doors close more solidly than my 2010 and the ride is quiet and smooth (obv quiet because of my exhaust)

All in all the 2012 seems like a nice improvement - would be interested in taking the 6MT version for a ride to see how it compares - but I don't trust myself to do that, as I may want to upgrade.

On to the second part - My 3rd gear issue.

Acura had a well known defect in their 3rd gear on the 3G TL. I was worried that this could be related. I was also worried about dealing with back & forth of the dealership trying to get them to replicate the issue - as it only happens to me once or twice a week when it's cold.

The issue is like i described above - gear pops out of 3rd when engaging the clutch - In addition, the 3rd gear shifts often feel mushy or hard. When the issue happen, I can usually feel it when I shift before i engage the clutch - feels like hitting a wall sometimes - others feel like shifting into mud.

So I dropped it off at the dealer - expecting them to call me back saying they can't replicate it... but they DID replicate the issue, and ordered some parts to fix it. They said they ordered a new 3rd gear "kit" or something like that - don't remember exactly - but will obviously get more details when i go back next week.

I'll update here when I get my car back - and maybe help out any other 6MT owners having this issue.

justnspace

iTrader: (1)

they're going to replace the gear set.

Hopefully they return your car in perfect working order.
as some 3G TL'ers came back with NO REVERSE gear! lol
(the techs fixed that as well)

Honda has been having this 3rd gear grind/pop out for YEARS! not only in the 3rd gen TL. but in the civic SI, s2ks, and some other models.

Most every one has used GM syncromesh friction modified in place of the Honda MTF.

I do have to say, the GM magic juice cured my 3rd gear pop out/grind.

Ant$

I've been having that issue ever since I bought my 2010. Because I've read that the GM synchromesh is the only solution and the dealership will not put it in for you, I dropped the issue and just dealt with it...

I may have to pursue this issue with the dealership again...

Pete2010

Yea - I read those threads also about gm sychromesh - it's a fix in a bottle. And the issue wasn't too bad - more of an annoyance than anything. I honestly thought that i would have to battle the dealership to replicate - but they found it right away (or maybe they have had other people report the same issue?) Anyway - I've always done my work at Acura of Boston - they always do a great job. We'll see how they do on the repair - not too worried.

I'll post back when I pick up the car.

justnspace

iTrader: (1)

Looking forward for your updates!
enjoy the '12!

potmilkz

i see your one of those lucky ones.. most of us dont have that kind of luck with the dealership replicating the problem.

glad its working out for you.

and im sure you know this.. once you get it, just dont do 100% inspection, do a 150% inspection before you sign those papers.

really test the transmission, put some pressure on it and see if it will have the same issue again. most of the time a dealer will just do several random tests and call it "good to go" but sometimes you just really have to push it to its limits as it should be.

justnspace

iTrader: (1)

^if they are changing the gear set, it will be brand new.
but like earlier stated, sometimes the tech can mess things up.
interiors can get slashed, reverse gear no work, etc.

Pete2010

Yea - great points but no worries there. I'll take it for a quick spin before i sign anything and make sure nothing crazy is up. I'm really not too worried. If you go back to some old post - AofB is the same dealership that did a full tranny swap for another member here who had some more significant problems.

Bearcat94

Sounds like the same 3rd gear issues that Honda has had for years (just like Justin said).

GM Synchromesh.

If the problem comes back Pete, don't play around with the dealer. Acura/Honda either don't know how to fix it or can't fix it. No point in beating your head against the wall when you change fluid and never look back.

azndriveacura

WOW!! lucky u, my dealer is such a bitch, says dat they cant let me drive the new car, and i ended up driving a 08 cadillac srx....gas hog

MyT6MT

I had all of the same issues you do with my 2010 6MT. I just got a 2012 6MT and the inconsistent shifting is still there. 2nd gear and reverse are still hard to shift into sometimes. 3rd is still as you described but it has not popped out of gear yet. Keeping fingers crossed.

Pete2010

Yea - for sure - I had two routes I was going to take - if it was a battle for them to replicate and fix - was going to buy the better fluid and replace it. Or - if they were able to find and fix (we'll see) - then see how it goes - but it's nice to have that solution in my back pocket just in case.

Yea - sometimes I do notice reverse is harder to get into - something with the synchros i think, I normally now shift into 2nd, then into reverse as a force of habit - when I do that it slips in smooth.

justnspace

iTrader: (1)

^good job on shifting to 2nd then reverse!

Pete2010

I feel like i read someone on here that it was good to do that (higher gear before going into reverse). Something about less stress on the syncros? I bet it was a southern boy post.

Edward'TLS

How comes the interiors get slashed ? They are only changing the outside tranny.

91NSX

Pete

Just wondering if your 20" tires may be a factor in the steering feel. Anyone else noticed a difference in steering with a 2012 vs earlier years?

I think the only problem I've had with 3rd gear is sometimes not paying attention when shifting, and it doesn't go completely into gear. Good advise on poster above about shifting into 2nd first, then reverse. Reverse can sometimes be difficult.

Pete2010

Naw - i noticed it after I got the car - with the factory 18's. I'm much more used to it now - was an odd feeling coming from the 07 TLS to the 10 with the electronic steering.

Yea - I bet even though they say the tranny is all new for the 4G - you just know they likely reused plans/parts for it. Hopefully should hear back on monday when the car is going to be ready.

Missed this before - yea, I don't know why/how an interior would get slashed - Although I'm not entirely sure the specific parts they are changing yet. Needless to say, If i don't get my car back the same I dropped it off, we'll have some problems. I'm not too worried, they're a good dealer - I remember another poster with tranny issues (much worse than anything I've seen posted) - He had his whole tranny replaced (and they did it at the same dealer).

justnspace

iTrader: (1)

lol, just a scare tactic.
Hopefully, Pete's ride comes back better than new.

Pete2010

I did find that other thread with the much worst 3rd gear issue.

https://acurazine.com/forums/4g-tl-problems-fixes-297/006-manual-trans-pops-out-gear-1st-3rd-758607/

dethred

I see Honda still hasn't remembered how to make a decent transmission.

My 2008 Civic Si had a similar problem (those cars got a TSB though). I had the dealer perform the TSB and it was no better. I switched to Redline Syncromesh and it was fine from about 30k miles up to its current 55k miles.... and its starting to screw up and get notchy as well. I plan on changing the fluid again in a few weeks to get it to behave again.

Maybe raise hell, get a warranty extension, then have an independent Acura Specialist shop change the trans fluid (unless you know how) to Syncromesh.

I guarantee your transmission will feel BETTER than new if you switch to Syncromesh. (warning, Acura may try to pull some BS such as voiding your transmission's warranty if they find out... so don't tell them).

Ant$

damn. i'm at the dealership and they didn't find anything during the test drive. of course my trans hasn't given me any problems for about three days. oh well. prior to that, it was a frequent occurence...

justnspace

iTrader: (1)

^gm syncromesh

LawnPro

I just changed my tranny fluid last week, i put in the ac delco synchromesh, friction modified, semi-synthetic. part # 88900399. GM dealers are selling ac delco now because "gm" has changed over to the ac delco brand fluid. It is the exact same fluid as the gm brand.

I drove my tl this weekend and it felt fine. I have 17k miles on it, and dont think it had been changed yet. The owners manual has advise on shifting into reverse:

First have the stick in nuetral, then push it to the 1st gear side of the gear box - while remaing in nuetral, then go back to the 5th gear side of the gear box - still remaining in nuetral, and now go down into reverse gear. I tried this on saturday and it went in smoothly. I was not having the issues like some - Pete2010 was having, but i have heard so many good things with doing the tranny fluid change w/synchromesh. Time will tell.
Hope acura of Boston worked out your tranny issue for you Pete.

Pete2010

Thanks - still waiting to hear back from them - They said they had to order parts, would come in today. So guessing that they'll call me later today or tomorrow and let me know when I can get it.

I can't wait - having a non-tech FWD car sucks... Not having a backup camera is one thing I think I miss the most. That, and the FWD wheelspin. But at least no AWD lag - the FWD definitely seems a bit snappier - which I do expect.

docboy

^Pete, I took a hiatus from AZ as I've been extremely busy with work and my practice... I had the day off today and some free time, and thought I would drop by AZ again. I happen to read your post re: your 3rd gear issue and am glad your dealership found your problem.

As you probably know, I've had (and am still having) the same issues with my 3rd gear: 3rd gear popping out, mushy/soft feeling during shifting from 2-3 and recently even from N-3 and 4-3, and the occasional 3rd gear grinding... Not to mention R not engaging fully, though the R gear issue has been "solved" by me shifting to 1st before shifting to R.

Any suggestions on how I can get my 3rd gear issue resolved? Did you speak to Acura corporate HQ? I took my TL to the dealership I bought it from for 3 times and they have been unable to replicate the issue, citing driver error of course.

lji

^Hey docboy, welcome back...

docboy

Thanks! Good to see some familiar "old" members (and some new ones as well).

Not to mention that Pete2010 is now a mod

gibjer

Well hey, if you ever want to take out a '12 MT and are out in the Shrewsbury area let me know I can let you take mine out for a bit.

Ant$

looking on amazon.com...GM synchromesh and Pennzoil synchromesh are 2 different things, right?

LawnPro

GM and AC DELCO synchromesh are the same, but other companies make it as well including amsoil. But from all the talk of GM/AC DELCO i didnt want to even bother with the other brands of synchromesh.

Pete2010

Yup - been putting in the hours here you know... Welcome back BTW.

Yea - so I got extremely lucky I think - the dealership was able to recreate it the first day they had it. But I was prepared for a battle with them. I had planned on having them keep the car for a week or so until they were able to recreate it. On mine - the problem was really only with 3rd gear - mostly when it was cold outside. They tried to recreate in the summer and had no luck - but in the cold, it worked for them.

Only thing I can say, is to try and get a loaner, get the dealer to keep it for a week to try and recreate it. Hopefully you get lucky. Or - just forget them, and put in the GM Synchromesh.

Pete2010

Thanks for the offer - where did you buy yours at? The MT's are hard to find.

gibjer

Acura of Auburn, they got it in their first allotment in March, which I test drove immediately, finally got around to buying it in July. Still had less then 100 miles on it.

Pete2010

Ok - got the word back from the dealer.

All the work is done and they should have my car ready for tomorrow.

During the part of the job where they had to remove the transmission, they had to remove my exhaust. When they did the gaskets pretty much fell apart on removal. I tried to see if I could get some replacements, but after talking with XLR8 - they said that you can use high temp silicone in it's place (which I guess is what most people do).

So the dealer (who is awesome by the way), had some high temp silicone and was able to get everything sealed back up. They're keeping it the night to let the silicone do it's thing and I should have my car back tomorrow.

docboy

Keep us posted Pete, and let us know if the repairs have resolved your 3rd gear issue. I would especially eager to know if your dealership (Acura of Boston?) has made any contact with corporate Acura. It seems that your dealership is rock solid in terms of customer service. Mine supposedly won some "award for dealership of distinction" but I don't see it

I'm leaning towards to contacting Acura HQ and see if they can start a case for me, but IMHO it would carry more weight if there is precedence.

Pete2010

Will definitely let you know. So far when asking what the issue is, they just say "Fixing the 3rd gear set". Hoping with the work order I'll see the part they changed and can look it up. Their service department is really quite good. They said they were able to replicate it right away, so I was impressed by that. I'll probably drive it for a week or two when we get some cold weather to make sure its really gone - below 30f and it seems to happen more often.

justnspace

iTrader: (1)

^thats a fluids job. to keep things well lubricated under harsh conditions. (-30 degrees)

Pete, when you get it back, of course its going to feel new.
new 3rd gear set and new fluid.

what happens when that fluid starts to wear?

Pete2010

That is the ultimate question... I do have 20k on the odo, not sure when a normal tranny fluid swap would happen.

justnspace

iTrader: (1)

^I put GM juice about 10k miles ago.
I will change it out at the 30k mark.

LawnPro

I think the first scheduled tranny fluid change is at about when the car hits 15k miles.
And then every 30k miles after the first change. Cant wait to hear how your repair turned out for you Pete!