darksom1

Does anyone have any real info on a strut bar that will work with EDFC on a 3G TL??

And yes, I searched, but only found that abandoned project by Black_05_TL_6spd

I need this for my EDFC please! Thanks!

Bearcat94

darksom1, I recently did an extensive search on the front strut bar.

I thought that Exellerate was working on something? With Comptech or Progress???

Maybe PM him to see if anything ever got off the ground.

darksom1

Thanks Bear!

Bearcat94

Check this:

https://acurazine.com/forums/showthread.php?t=169542 - look at the last post.

darksom1

Yeah, I found out about Marcus and his plans for a strut bar. I'm hanging on to hope. Is this about supply and demand, or this is hard to do? Anybody? Why isn't this done already? Is it that Acura just has a complex design to match up with?

Kennedy

iTrader: (2)

It cost money to develop such a bar... and considering the projected sales is probably < 50 (given the stock bar seems adequete, and the only reason people would want one is to run EDFC, and the last EDFC check in thread showed < 10 people with it... whew, what a sentence). Given that, it's really not worth the investment from any manufacturers perspective, as they'd only sell about 100 unit across the life of the produ My opinion anyways.

I know you guys know this, but if you buy the 03 Accord Top Hats, and drill one hole in the strut tower, you can run the 03 Greddy Bar. You have to dremel the plastic a bit if you plan to keep them. That's working great for me.

... and going back to stock is no big deal either. It's just one hole that NOONE would know didn't belong there.

Just do the Greddy bar and be done with it.

Darksom, where'd you mount the EDFC control box?

darksom1

I think that's a mis-leading number Chris because the issue of the bar deters people from buying it. I don't know about how many people would wind up actually buying it versus the interest they showed initially, but there are a lot of people who want the EDFC unit, but are scared of the strut bar issues (you know that). Everyone of the guys I talked to about it feel that way on here. Now, outside of AZ, that is hard to gauge, but the interest has at least been here from responses in the threads concerning it. Just look at the strut bar thread responses about the same thing.

I saw your post in the other thread on my box and answered it, but short take: In glovebox, easy to reach presets, out of sight so no one wants to steal it.

BLACKURA_NY

iTrader: (6)

yea, i think the accord 03 bar is a good route to go, as i am going to be getting EDFC w/ SS soon.. and i will probably do that


Kennedy, what are you talking about with the dremmel? can you explain? i want to do my setup perfectly

darksom1

Yeah, I got that PM, but where are the pics Big Poppa???

darksom1

So Allon, I guess you are tired of waiting for the miracle bar like me huh? Hahahaha...I don't see it happening anytime soon. I wonder if a shop could custom make one for me. Not the same cost wise as mass produced right just for a prototype. Also, our OEM bar isn't all that!

darksom1

I could've sworn I saw a pic where Kennedy did his Accord mod for the strut bar. Where was that Chris?

BLACKURA_NY

iTrader: (6)

i had just recently PM'ed keepin_it_clean .. he had that setup and said it was sweeet...

i havent seen pics from either him or kennedy though.. wouldnt mind seeing those pics...

autosportstyle.com has the accord bar for $117... ill probably be getting it soon... gonna look for a better cost, but that seems pretty fair

BLACKURA_NY

iTrader: (6)

where would we get the top hats from and price??

BLACKURA_NY

iTrader: (6)

and another question... doesnt the greddy bar ...look.. flimsy.. compared to the OEM acura bar? i believe the OEM acura bar is hollow though... but it looks ALOT thicker

Kennedy

iTrader: (2)

Well that being said, fixing the strut bar issue will not significantly increase the amount of EDFC sales... and you can't deny the fact that this thing hasn't been made because manufacturers dedicate R&D resources based on percieved market... and the perception is there's just no market for this.

My numbers are are not intended to be accurate, but just a quick assessment of the business case, which clearly a manufacturer would consider. The greddy bar is a more than adequete workaround. Not sure why some folks are so afraid to drill one hole.

The TL market is just not that large. If we didn't share parts with the Accord, we would have jack for afetrmarket support.

The plastic engine covers that attach to the strut bar have to have a little dremel work to clear Greddy bar, as it rides a little forward of the OEM. I'll take a pic during the day, but it's very intuitive when the bar is installed.

darksom1

I'm gonna do it. What Allon says is true, then it's a cheap alternative til the real thing comes along. Thanks Chris, but I really feel good about doing this. on that pic I was talking about I saw before, I think you only had one screw attached or something (accord bar). I'll wait for the pics, order it and "get 'er done" Thurs, Fri, or Sat!!

Where did you get your part from Chris? Cheaper than what Allon said?

Kennedy

iTrader: (2)

Blackura, most have your questions are answered in search.

3 piece design is not as rigid as a single piece, but the Greddy Bar is MUCH beefier than the OEM one. The stock bar is solid, but made from super thin steel.

I haven't driven hard enough to determine the Greddy is an "upgrade" or a "downgrade", but it seems to be working fine.

Here's pics of Accurateins install:
https://acurazine.com/forums/showthr...ghlight=greddy

Accord tophats come from... you guessed it: Honda dealer. can't find the PN right now, but it's on bernardiparts.com

Good luck guys.

darksom1

Thanks man....wtf???...I think Allon's ass fell asleep on me or something!!

BLACKURA_NY

iTrader: (6)

sorry guys. ran to go eat some dinner...

im 100% with you on this mod... i dont plan on track racing my car, but i wouldnt want this greddy bar to be 'weaker' then our OEM bar.... i guess we ACCURATEin's input on this one

darksom1

I was gonna PM him...

BLACKURA_NY

iTrader: (6)

thanks for the thread kennedy.. some good info in there on how to do this right..

what do ya think Ray ? Greddy Accord bar w/ accord top hats? but then you are still only using 2 bolts, from what originally looks like 4 or 5?

i dont want to comprimise the car's handling for the EDFC... if it becomes that big of a project or risk of the car increasing understeer.. i may stay away from the EDFC

Kennedy

iTrader: (2)

No... Go look at your bar.

Only 3 mounting points for the OE bar. Accord OE bar uses 2.

Switching to the Accord takes you from 3 to 2... but the Greddy mounts are about 2X as thick as the OE, so I think it's fine.

Just put it on.

MWalsh9152

heres a link to keepin_it_cleens auction ths strut bar is shown there off the car, someone got that before I had the chance when I bought the rest of his suspension

darksom1

I emailed Marcus of Mr Heeltoe, and this was his response today in regards to my question about if the strut bar was needed for safety's sake while I wait for a reliable replacement:

Yes, the strut brace is there to enhance the structure of the car but the (car) will function fine without it. We are in the process of producing a bar that will fit in its place!

Marcus

IMO (meaning just the way I feel or think about this - so don't attack me, it's just my opinion. If yours is different then simply state yours, but it's NOT yours versus mine. I am not telling ANYONE to follow me or do like me. Do your own research and follow who you listen to and respect.):

I've always felt, and I was told by mechanics, body shop people and such, that the strut bar was "not a necessity, but an enhancement" as far as performance and structure. That as long as I don't take hard turns at 80mph on the regular, I will definitely be ok. (Leedogg & Chris - D. said that last statement, FYI) That ALL cars don't come with them, so they are not a necessity.

Now, IMO, the reason why our's does come with one, is because of the way they assume people may attempt to drive this car, and to complement other performance enhancements on the vehicle as well. Or maybe even just a feeble attempt at selling us on their attention to high performance. The flimsy, hollow design furthers my belief on that. Therefore, as of now, my bar is not on. I have it off and the reason I was thinking of adding one, is because since I have had the TEINs on, I enjoy the ride better and desire to throw it around some. Now, I don't have to drive like that, and I won't until I do get a bar. But the bar will not make me feel the structure is anymore invincible than it is, but just give me more of a sense of security and better feel performance-wise, when I do make those wow turns, which quite frankly, I don't see me doing a lot of bar or no bar. Add to the fact that I have lowered it and have heard on this forum that a lot of real hard, fast, hairpin cornering is not good on the suspension, so it will more than likely be few instances when I do "wilin' out" type shit with my car.

Basically, I wanted to drop it and be able to have some fun every now and then, so a bar for right now is something I can roll without until someone makes one that fits more solidly that I can bolt on and roll without worrying about it. I don't do crazy shit, so I feel I will be ok either way. Do what YOU feel is best. Experts and non-experts may weigh-in. And I don't care if you think or say "IT" is stupid to do it, but there is no need for you to say "I" am stupid for doing it. You feel me? Cool...

Peace!

MrHeeltoe

iTrader: (1)

Hmmm, well, you might have linked me to this thread so I could have participated here . Luckily I found it myself.

You are looking way too far into this.

Does the stock brace help the chassis feel more rigid? Yes.

Is it a critical part of the car? No

Will you notice a difference if you take it off? Can't say, depends on driver. Most likely you would feel the chassis flex more.

Will driving the car hard (80mph turns...yowee...) make the car break or feel unsafe? Highly doubtful (read: no)

Hard fast turns are not good for the suspension....this is a new one to me. Sounds a little absurd actually.




You are entirely too concerned about what other people are going to think here. Overally the internet is a populous of over-thinkers and under-doers. Your thinking is sound to me. Actually, in a way you are giving the strut bar a little more importance than it needs. It is for chassis rigidity and has an indirect impact on handling. It is not going to make the car unstable or anything to remove it. It won't impact the ride to remove it either.

I am going to follow up on my bar again tomorrow. I have not heard anything recently. The one we are making is a significant improvement on the stock piece, and will accommodate all of the stock engine covers as well. We are trying to incorporate a master cylinder stopper as well to enhance the brake feel.

Marcus

MrHeeltoe

iTrader: (1)

The OE bar had a larger mounting area on the shock tower than the Greddy bar. I can't say for sure, but I would bet money the stock brace is stronger than the greddy bar since those mounts on the greddy bar actually seem kinda poorly designed to me. They fit well, but they just seem a little spindly in design. I supoosed we can blame the accord shock tower design for this though, not really greddy.

darksom1

Thanks Marcus!

Actually, I was just trying to cover all bases for the scared people out there who have told me they think it is unsafe to drive without the strut bar or to modify the OEM one. Yeah, I got kinda verbose with this assessment of the situation, but I just wanted people to feel at ease if they took into consideration what I said. Thanks for cleaning up some of the finer points of this debate though, as I am sure judging by the strut thread, there were many concerns and opposers to riding without.

Well, that and...they can yell at you now! Hahahahaha! (j/k) Thanks again bro!

- Ray

BLACKURA_NY

iTrader: (6)

hmm... making this a tough decision for me....

why cant we just get a good bar made by a company like comptech, progress or greddy to meet or exceed OE standards and accomadate an EDFC ?

it doesnt seem like an possible task to accomplish... i mean, we've had vendors make greddy exhaust, stromoung exhaust, progress bars..

i understand you Kennedy in the fact that market is very small for this car and these mods, but progress didnt think it was THAT small if they decided to make a rear sway bar.. not alot of R&D has to go into making a solid metal pole that aligns to pre-existing holes...

i really think with support from either Marcus or Josh, we could get some of these made, atleast a group buy of like 50 of them...

darksom1

^

ACCURATEin

Greddy for the win. No hassle, no wait, easy fitment, looks nice. Search my username you'll find all the info.

ACCURATEin

And in terms of track cars, both the HART Racing Honda Accord and the THR TL are using the OEM supplied strut bars, so with that being said the OEM one is sufficient.

EDFC motor compliance = greddy accord strut bar.

darksom1

One thing I have to admit about that ACCURATEin, is that if you just want a strut bar on, don't want to drill, and it really isn't a factor as far as safety is concerned, then why not Greddy even if it is just one bolt - until someone makes an exact fit one, like what Marcus is making.

ACCURATEin

darksom1 has an idea and he might follow through with it! Watch closey to what he might do.

MrHeeltoe

iTrader: (1)

It is a matter of resources allocation. We all know it is a needed product in the marketplace, but not a high priority one.

I recently finished up my Medieval Pro / Tein damper kit private label for 84-87 CRXs, so now I am moving on to this project.

Oh, and the company I am working with on this bar will be able to make us a really nice one. I promise none will be disappointed when (or if) we get finished with it.

About Progress, I was working with them for a about a month on this, and they basically told me they did not have time for it. 50-100 bars is not that many in the grand scheme of things. Progress makes everything in-house. Nothing overseas. So you can understand that labor and time a valuable commodities to them! Also why would they want to produce a bar that will enable people to run one of their suspension competitor's damper system?

Marcus

drdamian

are you looking for pics like these???




I have had the greddy bar on now for over a year, no problems to report and the car handles great.

darksom1

Marcus man, why did you have to say that? LOL...I'll just wait and see...

darksom1

Looks good Doc!

BLACKURA_NY

iTrader: (6)

yea. is that picture with the accord top hats? because i do see two bolts holding it in place.

Ive spoken with lots of other members, who are without the bar, and claim the car is fine, which im sure it is.. However, having that bar MUST have some type of imporvement to chasis flex and handling.

ray, if you can come through with a perfect bar.. that would be the shit. keep us all posted on this and any other members with input please ... add to the convo!

MrHeeltoe

iTrader: (1)

Yea that is with the accord hats in place and a hole drilled in the shock tower.

The greddy accord bar will definitely help get back some rigidity lost by removing or modifying the stock bar, no doubt! But being a band aid fix I am not sure it is "being all it can be." This if only purely based on the fact that the bar is not made for a TL and uses 2 bolts next to eachother on one side of the mount rather than 3 all the way around. The bar fits differently on an accord than on the TL. On the Accord it is probably more effective.

Lets say, 1-10, 10 being the best.... Stock is maybe a 7, cut stock is maybe a 4. None is obviously a 0, I put the accord bar at around 6.5, or a 7 if you have more faith in it than I do. This is based only on what I know about chassis dynamics and physics (which, is above average at best ).

Marcus

THTL

iTrader: (2)

Any update? Will your bar fit the accord or the TL top hat?