vsizzle

Ok so I have 43700 on my 05TL. Looking for new tires, any suggestions?
It is a lease and it goes back 07 of December.
I will do a total of 20k miles between now and December 07
06 7K APPROX
07 13K APPROX
Thinking of just buying the same EL42'S I will not be doing much driving but not sure, any imput.

Thanks in advance

Lore

Here's the November 2004 Service News bulletin about the A-spec suspension alignment specs. I read through all of the 2005 bulletins and found nothing about it, so I'm assuming it hasn't changed:

ttliang

^ yeah that's exactly what i posted earlier. same sheet too acura faxed to me.

Randbosacura

Have an update here. Am quoting the reply submitted by caha14 because it has a link to an Acura Service Bulletin generated Christmas Eve a couple of weeks ago. It covered some parts such as 2 rear bump stops, replacement of all four tires with improved Bridgestones, balancing and alignment all under warranty. Upon receiving this I immediately e-mailed the service manager at Niello Acura in Sacramento and informed him of of the new info. He called early the next day and told me that neither he or the service rep was aware of this bulletin previously, but he would certainly take care of us.
Because we had chosen to upgrade to Michelin ZR rated Pilots he gave us a 50% discount on those. Alignment, spin balance and any labor associated with this problem was covered. So all in all we paid a lot less than the $1200+ we were quoted to begin with by the service rep (included a B service which was due).
Even though we were in the long run taken care of by our dealer, I find it hard to believe that they were unaware of the Bulletin or the prior defects. I am grateful for their cooperation, however, I will be monitoring the tire wear very closely from now on. The ride? Smooth as silk, straight as an arrow!
Thanks for all the input here which led me to this fix and to bluenoser for getting this thread started. I hope this info helps others there who experience this problem.

Lore

Wow, well done Niello Acura of Sacramento! I've seen their dealership before when I was up there for business and almost took my car in for a service job once. I can't remember for what, but it was probably some rattle or something

Do you have stock suspension? Looks like you have a 2005 TL too, based on your mileage and time of ownership.

jginnane

Some quick questions ...

"B" service, less the new tire mounting, balancing, and full 4-wheel alignment, is (I think) just an oil change and an air filter change. (Anything to do with tires ought to be covered under that service bulletin.) Half price on 4 Michelin Pilots means you paid about $380 there .... so, how much did they charge you?

Also, with a 50% tire proration I assume you were in the 15-20K mileage band, right?

Did you request the adjusted rear toe-in from the service bulletin spec -- 2mm +/- 2mm -- be set at the 0 (zero) mm end of the band, to improve mileage?

Final question -- did you consider getting the next wider tire (245/45-17) to put on your stock rims to improve your footprint?

TIA!

Randbosacura

JGINNANE,
Everything to do with the tires was covered. My TL has over 16k miles. Tire size is 235/45/17. I suppose I could always get something better but I am very pleased with them so far. Yes they adjusted the toe-in acording to the specs in the bulletin. You're in the ballpark on the tire price with the 50% tire proration.

jginnane

Thanks for the feedback.

I was talking with a neighbor who also owns an '05 TL today ... his company works with Princeton [NJ] Acura, so he got a deal on his car.

He was _given_ an Michelin Pilot A/S set instead of the Bridgestone EL42s when he acquired the car -- despite it being an automatic! So, each dealership apparently has some discretion when they set you up and you drive out the door. I didn't know that before today.

Also, I see that Honda Accords come with the better (Michelin Pilot A/S) rubber, at least for the EX trim level. Though from reading tirerack's reviews, I'm still more comfortable with oversized Pirelli Nero P-Zero M+S tires (245/45-17).

The more I discover about the suspension problem and Bridgestones for the 3rd gen TL, and how Acura has "handled" this, the madder I'm getting.

There is no reason on earth why I should be confronting my local dealership tomorrow morning on an 8-month old car, except that the entire organization has screwed the pooch with respect to customer service. They have at least come right up to the line regarding the lemon law -- if not over it.

The toe-in problem's been noted on this website since AT LEAST November 2004. Acura quietly puts out a Christmas Eve bulletin finally admitting to the problem (just a couple weeks ago), and offering proration -- not replacement -- and only towards the inflated price for another set of headaches, that is, the same EL42 tire.

Are any lawyers reading this thread? I think NJ is okay to start a class action, but if someone's already working towards a filing there's no point in duplicating their work. Think of the hundreds of TL owners who have posted in these forums, who've had extra expense either related to the Bridgestones, or because they went into their pockets to avoid the Bridgestones. Then -- think of the tens of thousands of people who _haven't_ posted, but are in the same predicament.

jginnane

I am happy to report a completely successful experience with my Acura dealer, Open Road of New Brunswick (NJ) in respect to our Bridgestone Turanza EL-42 OEM tire issue.

Our TL was picked up May 2 '05, and fell outside the VIN range for the service bulletin. That is, our car was newer. According to the service rep, improved bump stops were installed on our car. However, with 17,006 miles on the odometer in just 8 months of driving, the wear on the Bridgestones was quite visible (and had been commented on at a Bridgestone shop as early as 12,000 miles).

Perhaps an overriding aspect was the safety issue, when, 3 weeks ago, driving on a clear night at the speed limit with cruise control on, the back of the car was suddenly scooting sideways as we crossed a bridge that had light frost on it. This was, I believe, a combination of the rear toe-in geometry and the wear on the tires, and was an unnerving experience.

Our dealership called me yesterday afternoon after their diagnosis, and installed a new set of Michelin Pilot A/S tires, including balancing and alignment, as a full warranty issue. I am very pleased with this decision. The car feels very different in our first 50 miles driving, and I am almost looking forward to tomorrow's rain forecast to see how the car handles there.

So, it looks like I'll have to wait a couple years before I get to try out the Pirellis. Or maybe, since they've locked me in as a permanent customer now, we'll get them on our RL.

ttliang

it's who you work with makes all the differences doesn't it?

jginnane

Yup... and I think of the literally hundreds of people who've posted here over the past couple years, didn't want to risk an adverse confrontation with the dealership, and wound up paying outside because of it. If I'd had to pay much toward a proration, I would have pushed for the Pirellis. But I don't really know that it would make a difference on our car. I'd call Michelin and Pirelli analogous to Coke and Pepsi, with the Bridgestone analogy then being some Sam's Club 3-liter soda with a loose cap.

The issue has been closed for me now, but I'm still trying to figure out what combination of things caused the back to break free like that. Several times on the same drive, BTW. The front tires continued tracking fine -- my foot was off the gas, at least on the first couple bridges, and it felt like the back had suddenly moved some 6-9" to the right.

I did not factor in the evenness of the road surface because it was "smooth", i.e., highway/parkway driving. But conceivably, we were bouncing through short-cycle hill-and-valley terrain (because of the bridge designs). The toe-in of the car under compression would increase. Because of the frost, perhaps only 1 tire got bite during the compression phase -- though it seems odd it would be the left one in each occurrence. Then, the next moment, as we passed over the valley part, the suspension unloaded so the side angular momentum caused by the toe-in didn't have anything to check it.

At 60MPH (100KM/H) you're covering 88 feet per second, so the hill-valley-hill-valley cycle would almost never be noticed in normal (dry) driving by any car with proper shock absorbers. But the live independent suspension on a TL could be just active enough to do this weird thing. (The previous two cars for my wife, a Mercedes ML-320 and a TSX, also had independent suspensions. But neither car had the Bridgestones... so that almost leads the story back to the beginning.)

ttliang

like we mentioned many times here, you want to check your alignment. only few guys' cars around here did that sliding thing you mentioned. it's almost always alignment. u'll be surprised. my car never did that but a re-alignment revealed what a few pot holes here in jersey can do to your alignment.

TheDutch

I have may missed it, but would someone please send me a link to Acura's official response to this excessive rear tire wear problem. Thank you everyone. Great thread.

jginnane

https://acurazine.com/forums/showthread.php?t=129086

TheDutch

Thank you.

subinf

i'm glad to see that niello is actually doing something right for once. when i was going to college in davis i went to them for some warranty work. they were less than helpful. this isnt the right forum to rattle off my problem with them, but i'm glad to see there are some positives to that dealership.

Lore

I haven't used them for service before, but I was quoting someone who had, but hopefully they are now as helpful as they seem to be based on that person's experience!

bshean

I've got an early 05, 6spMT, 17k miles. I took my car in last week for the rear bump stop replacement. I the dealer service rep that I wasn't interested in paying a pro-rated amount to replace the Bridgestone tires.

After reading today about the dealer in NJ who replaced an owner's Turanzas with Michelins, I called the service manager at Acura at Oxmoor, in Louisville (I didn't buy the car there, nor will I ever recommend anyone buy a car from them, but that's another story...).

The service manager told me that Honda is not allowing dealers to replace the Turanzas with the Michelins. I then said "Well I guess it's just my bad luck that I got Turanzas instead of Michelins." He then claimed that the Michelins were just summer tires installed on 6pd MT cars. Of course he would know that '05 automatics also come with the Michelins if he took a look at his lot.

Anyway, glad somebody's getting free replacements for their crappy Turanzas.
Evidently most of us just have to accept these crappy tires.

Looks like I'll be paying for a new set of Pirelli's soon. And probably not making another Acura purchase.

Oh, I've also been told to show may extremely faded dash to the regional Acura rep when he visits town next month--since the dealer can't do anything else about it other than apply the ineffective Honda dash protectant-but that's another story, too

baysic tl

i have just notice this porblem of the rear tires and i only have 4600 miles on it...it's lowered with some tein s tech springs but my question is, are most of you guys stock hieght? or do you have some kinda of suspention? and these new spec for the toe-in, are they working to porlong your rear tires?

jerzeygroove

i'm going to have my car serviced and i'm glad i read this. how can i bring this up to acura? can i still mention it after having 31,000 miles in 1.5 years of owning it? all of my tires are worn since they've been rotated a few times. my tires are now threadless and i'm afraid of driving it in the rain.

K-Shawn

Acura is only going to align it to specs, if you want a alignment that is adjusted to your driving habits and prevent early tire wear. Try Muzzio's front end alignment shop in Ridgewood NJ, Jack only takes appt and he adjust your vehicle to your driving style. Phone#201-652-1121.

lookinco

I am planning to get a 3rd gen TL soon. Planning to lower it with the Tein SS. Will this problem be worse on lowered vehicles? Or would it be better since there would be reduced rear suspesnion travel with the Tein SS.

So the main problem now is with too much toe in for the rear. Would it solve the problem if we set some rear toe out?

demellie

The 'bump stop' fix for the uneven tire wear issues does NOT resolve this issue. I have 8600kms on my second set of Yokos and they are wearing out unevenly again. The service technician informed me that Acura is still encountering suspension issues on the 04 TL and that it shows up quicker on TLs running Yokos instead of the Michelin tires. The service manager who I dealt with last time is coming back from holidays next week ...so until then.....we are back in a waiting game.

If you have had the 'bump stop' fix installed on your TL to resolve the uneven tire wear issues....keep a close eye on things........

L8R

demellie

SpecialFX

I realize this is an old thread, but this is stall an ongoing issue. I just called my dealer regarding the EL42 showing excessive wear. The car has 22K of easy driving on it (it's my wife's car). The tires are shot and have been bad for a while. At first I was told that there was nothing they could do. Then I mentioned the bulletin and the person on the phone "remembered" the bulletin. They said it was a recent notice. I mentioned that it came out on Dec. 24 2005. there was not much response. I was told I could take my car in to have it inspected but they've yet to see a single car with wear matching the parameters required for replacement under the bulletin. As you can see, I'm not overly optimistic.

Back in the spring the car was in for an oil change and they told me the front tires (which had previously been rotaded from the rear) were badly worn and should be replaced (which I knew). They suggested rotating them again, which they did. Since the service bulletin was out they should have informed me.

My question is this: Based on their response so far I expect them to tell me that however the tires are worn it will not fit the requirements of the bulletin. So what exactly is the wear pattern they are looking for, so I can respond appropriately. I already expect a battle for the 50% vs. 75% replacement value since the car currently has over 20K, but did not at the time the dealer noticed the wear and rotated the tires. I also want different ires in a larger size to protect the rims from further curbing.

Is the wear even across the tire, just excessive, or is it concentrated toward the inner or outer edge of the tire? I've not heard whether the problem is toe-in or toe-out.

Thanks for any help.

~Lefty~

iTrader: (1)

I know this a 5+ year old thread, but I'm bumping this for good cause.

My '08 TL-S is being such a pain in the a** with this rear toe issue. I've gone through 2 sets of tires already with the same symptoms people have been describing here. I've done an alignment twice, and checked the specs on 2 different machines. Alignment is in spec, however I'm still burning through tires. This is getting a bit ridiculous and I'm not sure where else to turn.

I know there was a TSB for the 04/05 in regards to bump stops. I believe it was #B05-076.

Has any TL-S owners had the same issue or similar? I love this car to death, but if I need to replace the tires once more, the car will be gone. I refuse to keep replacing tires every 4-5 months.

rvb1427

Lefty,
Great to hear somebody else with an 08 is concerned. I wondered if it was only a 04/05 issue. My wife's 08 is driven like a baby, has only 42K on it and during a rotation, one of the rears was worn bald on the inside edge. As I had been watching the fronts for wear, I never even noticed the rears wearing unevenly. The one rear wheel was out of tolerance and it was aligned. Haven't driven it enough since to know if it rectified the problem completely. Contacted our selling dealer and they assured me the suspension specs have been modified or adjusted to prevent the 04/05 problem. I also learned that 42K is the mileage rating for the factory Michelin's still on the car. Even on a US made vehicle I have been able to squeeze 70K out of factory tires with proper alignment and rotation. Hang in there and good luck. This is my first week in this site and I cannot believe the volumes of helpful info.

94eg!

About a year ago I installed a pair of new tires on the rear of my 05 6MT and promptly followed that up with an alignment. I have been aware of the rear wear problem for a long time now. I even made sure the shop used the updated toe specs and pretty much made all 4 wheels a perfect 0.00 toe.

Well I had been keeping any eye for any feathering on the inner edge and noticed I wasn't having any trouble. Then I loaded up the car and moved from Las Vegas to reno. The back seat and trunk were stuffed to the max with whatever I could fit. Now that I'm here I notice the inner edge of the tires is now feathered. Not so visible, but you can definitely feel it when reaching into the fender and running my hand around the tire.

For those that don't know, feathering is when the tread blocks are worn more on one edge. In my case, the leading edges are worn more than the trailing edge. Not the typical left to right pattern shown in most illustrations. Here is a pic I found:



This is more obvious when running your hand over the tread rather than visually inspecting.

Well I have a kinda retarded solution, but I'm going to give it to everyone:

- String alignments. This is a diy toe-alignment and it should fix the problem. If you plan on traveling a long distance with a loaded vehicle, do this the night before. The only issue is, you will need to do it again once you take everything out of the car...

I have done 2 string alignments so far, and both were very successful. I will be doing a write-up in the comming weeks when I finally get around to doing my TL. In the mean time, you can search up the process on google if your interested.

Info you need:
- front & rear track width (front = 1577mm & rear = 1576mm)
- Toe specs in millimeters (front & rear = 0mm +/- 2mm)

Tools:
- 14mm wrench
- 19mm wrench
- jack stands (2 or 4)
- thin 4lb .2mm fishing line (I got bright orange)
- Metric scale with millimeters or even half-millimeters
- A small level (like for hanging pictures)
- Homeade slip plates for the front (plastic bag with spray lube or grease inside)
- A tool to hold the steering wheel steady (I bought S&G 66400 from Amazon for $29)



BTW: I got a pair of mini levels on ebay for $3 shipped like this one but without the keychain. This can be placed atop the air-bag to center the steering wheel and is used to level your scale when taking measurements (makes it much more accurate):

~Lefty~

iTrader: (1)

Yup, I know how to do a string alignment. It's how ya the old school guys used to align the Indy cars.

ez12a

I'm curious to those with the rear tire wear issues, how often do you rotate your tires?

I'm about 10k in on some Hankook V12 Evos on my rear. Kind of hard to judge in % how much is worn. Definitely noticeable though since I just replaced my fronts with the same brand/type.