A buddy had a 2nd gen TL that I loved. I have a truck, so when he would borrow it I would drive his black TL ("blacura"). I got a new job and I now drive almost 800mi/wk. I looked at TL vs. IS300 vs. BMW 3 series wagon. Based on Edmunds, KBB, and other owner driven sites, it looked like TL owners really loved them as well as the magazine editors. Thus, I narrowed my search to a 3rd gen TL for less than 12k.

While doing my research on 3rd gen TL's, it looks like transmission issues are a common problem; occurring anywhere between 50k and 150k miles. Or are they? I think message boards are the most valued resource on the web but also realize that people don't often sign on just to sing the praises of product _____. (insert anything you wont) More often, consumers sign on to gripe or find answers to problems.

Question: I have found 2004 TL with 152k miles on it for $8,500 that just had the transmission(AT) rebuilt within the last 200 miles. I drove the car and it rides great. The price is spot on with KBB. My thinking is I really like TL's and I'm going to put about 40k/year on the car so why not just buy a car for cheaper price that already has pretty high mileage and a tran that is already rebuilt? If the tran goes out again in 60k miles and I have to get it rebuilt for $1700, at least I didn't pay 13k for a TL that only has 90-100k. I would buy the car for $4,500 less and possibly spend $1,700 for the 3rd tran/rebuild.

Should I be looking at this differently?

 

I'm not going to lie, the TL does have some transmission issues, esp. the 04 and 05 models.

I would say look into the 04TL, but realize that it's going to need work done to it in the future esp. if the previous owner didn't keep up with it. Every 100K you'll need to do a timing belt/waterpump service and spark plugs. Also I'd recommend changing out the fluid to something better like Redline D4 and change it every 30K at a minimum along with the air filters and such as with any car.

I'd have a dealer do a pre-purchase inspection on it if you are seriously contemplating it. If I were in your shoes, I'd buy it but I'd pay 8500 out the door at the MOST.

If you are driving 40K a year, the TL is probably your best bet. Not only does it get GREAT highway MPG, but it's a great highway cruiser. That coupled with low maintenance is going to keep it going for a while.

I love my 04 and will probably end up driving it into the ground before I get rid of it!

 

From what ive seen on these forums mileage can have little to do with when the transmission goes bad, it could be 50k could be 150k, so if when the transmission will fail is your reasoning for how to spend a certain amount than I would go with the rebuild. Just make sure you consider all the wear and tear items, especially if you don't do your own repair work, you will end up spending a lot more money than you think on this car. $800-$1k right off the bat if the timing belt hasn't been done.

 

Thank you for the replies. I do some of my own repair work (oil change, brakes, plugs, wires, etc.) in the past on my vehicles. The TL I have been looking at has a Napa timing belt, so while the owner says he had the timing belt done and he does NOT have a receipt, I can only think that a Napa belt is not the original one. Also, there were some marks on the pully retainer nuts like a wrench had been there. I do not know if the water pump has been done, didn't ask owner yet - doubt he will know.

I understand transmission rebuilds are unpredictable. So my main thought thru this has been, buy one that has had the tran already done so it is one less thing to worry about. After reading a lot of threads around here, I understand that is important to do the following during rebuild:

-change 3 and 4 switches (I don't even know what this means yet, still have some reading to do). How do I confirm this has been done with the recent rebuild by the current owner?

-replace the external filter (I saw this in a thread on here somehwere, apparently there is an external and internal filter. The external filter is not mentioned anywhere in the factory service manual. The internal filter and or torque converter is the root of evil with tran filter - at least from what I have read. Please correct me if I am wrong.)

-Use redline ATF fluid or D4 and change tran fluid every 30k miles going forward. Do not use OEM fluid (Z1 ?)

Thanks again.

 

3rd and 4th gear pressure switches, they are little switches that screws into a port in the transmission where fluid flows to, it's easy to replace and if you turn your wheel to the right, it's on the front driver side behind the plastic cover if your looking straight at it. Their switches that when hit a certain pressure it tells the transmission to shift, they fall out of calibration and needs replacing to prevent wear when shifting gears. They are cheap, less than $100 total for both. They don't make oem z1 fluid anymore. I suggest the new oem fluid DW1, I've been using it for that past few oil changes and have no problems at all. The key is the change the fluid about every 15k, I know someone who did that after his rebuild at 98k on his 2nd gen and now has over 260k and the 2nd gen are known for massive failures. The external filter is replacable on the 04/05 and is easy to do, it doesn't list it in the service manual (I dont' remember) because it's not meant to be replaced but it's wise to do it anyways. I would assume that the rebuild did not include switch replacements and just spend the $100ish to get the switches and filter done. Also do a search on installing a transmission cooler, heat is a top killer in auto's that's what I've done. Good luck.

 

What has the life/mileage been on rebuilt transmission among those that have changed their 3 and 4 switches, new internal and external filters, and changed the fluid every 30k miles?

Now that these things have been discovered as possible reasons for failure of the original transmissions, once they are maintained more intensely are the rebuilds likely good for many more miles than the originals (150k +)? Or, are the transmissions on 3rd gens just doomed to fail over and over?

The bottom line is, I don't mind doing preventive maintenance, but don't want to be paying $1,800 every 60-70k for another rebuild.

 

I have an '05 at 100k and haven't had any tranny problems so far, knock on wood.

 

Keep in mind the Engine mount might have to be replaced. Maybe the strut mounts to.

 

My 04 has over 150K on the original transmission. It has never had Honda fluid in it since I have owned it - either Mobil 1 Synthetic or Redline D4. I change the filter and pressure switches every 50K. You can really tell when the 3rd gear pressure switch starts to go - it will hold in 2nd a bit too long... and once it goes, it goes fast.

My 06 has 120K and is on the original transmission too. Same maintenance as the 04.

I think that the Honda fluid is junk and their recommended maintenance interval is too long for the junk fluid. This causes failures, not so much the transmission it's self. ...speculation, of course.

 

if your commute is 40k mi/yr I would get a 4-cyl beater, like a used accord or a camry, and spend no more than 5-6 grand for it. TL is too nice of a car to drive into the ground...

 

JDA: Thank you for your response, that is specifically the information (even if it is speculation) I was looking for.

Kostyan: thanks, but I am really only considering a TL. My company pays for all of my gas and the drive is not a commute. Its several days on the road; sometimes up to 300 per day. I would prefer to drive it in something comfortable and enjoyable.

 

I have a copy of the recent rebuild receipt on the car I would like to buy. The parts that are listed are:
Honda torque conv $200
Honda Banner Kit $295 -(btw, what is this?)
Honda filter $35 (assuming internal filter?)
Honda cooler filter $13
Honda Z-1 ATF (quantity: 10) $58

What was not done that should have been done on this 2004 TL with automatic transmission, and 150k miles? I'm guessing the 3 and 4 switches? Anything else?