FiveLiterCheater

Alright, I guess i'm making a list of things to take my car in for before my warranty goes out. This one just started recently. I remember the awful sound of failing CV joints on my 91' Legend (with 200k miles) but its a little odd that i'm getting the same sound out of my 05' TL with 45k. However, i am not completely blaming Acura because the problem is still iffy. I noticed it ONLY making hard left turns. It doesn't do it under normal turning conditions. If I make a sharp U-turn, i'll hear a faint clicking sound. VERY faint, but its there. I haven't fully tested it, but i've only noticed it before the car fully warms up. After about 10 miles the sound is gone. I'm going to take it in, but i'm sure they'll blame it on my suspension (Tein SS....pretty low)

Any ideas? If it was the CV joints wouldn't the sound be constant?

ssmtl2nv

iTrader: (2)

sounds like the boot is going, but they will definitely blame it on the ss's, good luck and hopefully everything works out for you...

djbonsu

iTrader: (3)

in the uber cold here in chicago, i get a nasty sound when turning and accelerating BUT only when its cold....and my boots have no rips or anything of the sort

PeterUbers

iTrader: (1)

I had the same problem -- cost me $600 (rounded up) for replacedment of one axle .. oh, and you can't just replace the CV joint/boot -- it's integrated into the axle so you have to pay for both!! Don't you love it!!

tabularasa

That's odd. I have an apt Monday at my Acura dealer who is going to replace just 1 side for $350.

Are you sure that's correct information?

ILLustriousUA6

iTrader: (2)

have u checked under the car to make sure it's the boot? is there a tear/rip?

Majofo

Take some pics of the inner & outer boots on your driveshafts. If it is the CV joint it shouldn't be too bad to replace. How about your lower arm bushings? how do they look?

01tl4tl

here is what happens-
you lower the car and the angle of the dangleage to the relation of the cv bearings/axle shaft to spline shafts, and where they were originally designed to operate at has been exceeded... and you get click click click on full lock turns at low speed= cv bearing/joint failure

This is one where acura CAN prove a direct link between lowered car and excess wear on the cv--so its not going to be a warranty item

You can buy new complete units from napa and other major parts stores for a much better price and have a private shop install it for you. It does require special tools and knowledge, more than an oil change~

The boot issue is when it gets torn on road debris, all the grease leaks out and invites road grime and dirt into a rotating bearing= cv bearing failure

Majofo

Word.. Check out GSP (Guangsheng Auto Parts) sold by Advance Auto / Parts America. I bought new shafts for the X and they run great. They are 69.99 each and they have a lifetime replacement warranty.

Don't forget to buy new spindle nuts.. flange nuts.. castle nuts.. cotter pins and sway bushings.. check those lower arm bushings too if you do replace driveshafts. Might as well get those stamped out if you can and put new ones in if they are cracked.

Trew

iTrader: (1)

I've never heard of this before. Is this the case on the TL? That would mean if you tear your CV boot then you'd have to replace the entire axle. I don't think Acura can be that dumb to design such a thing, can they?

Jjaber, turn the wheel lock left and put it in reverse. Then accelerate hard from a stop and see if the noise is there. This exaggerates the condition that makes you hear the noise.

Also, I'm really interested in knowing if they cover it with the altered suspension. Can you let us know please?

01tl4tl

cv bearing boots are installed from the open end of the shafts when its off the car
If a boot tears, it leaks out the grease-ruining the bearing

They make funky replacement boots that you wrap around and glue on itself- pretty bogus~
if boot is open- the remaining grease is sucking in grit from the road- kills bearing

torn boot= new axle assembly

01tl4tl

its been discussed here many times that lowered cars do not get warranty coverage on CV, thats one of the few items they can prove a direct link in `change to failure`

Majofo

Not to be deceptive.. but what if the OP put the stock suspension on? How difficult is it for Acura to determine that it is abnormal wear & tear.. I wonder how many here have gone through a driveshaft already?

01tl4tl

if the stock suspension were on its hard to prove--
BUT
for the time and expense of swapping out 4 struts, especially if you didnt get new tophats and have to do a full parts change-over,,,then swap it all back

versus going to a parts store and a private shop, get it fixed and keep driving

factory warranty on that stuff only goes to 40-50k miles?? anyone know?

Majofo

Yeah you're right.. Maybe the OP should chance it with Acura and see if they may cover it and then shop around. I think it would be under 50k miles.

If I remember my guy did the driver's side driveshaft in about 2 hrs and the passenger side in 1 hr.. If the OP has a A/T get enough ATF for a 3x3.

01tl4tl

you would have to be in really good with the acura service manager-

the regional warranty rep works for acura corp.- who is paying for the part and labor.
read the exclusions on warranty in your book
They like to ask questions on a failure like cv joint--why did it happen..is it a problem with a certain vin range or just one car driven harder than normal
--ooooh whats these tool marks on all the bolts where you change the suspension- and this rolled fender edge--and this camber kit---hmmmm I wonder if this car was ever lowered....

01tl4tl

I imagine acura dealer will happily charge $100 diagnosis fee and say it needs cv,
especially if you turn around and take it somewhere- they are getting the diagnosis fee out of you for putting the car on the lift and checking it out

Of course we have not had to OP test both sides with the slow speed full lock turns from stopped- do it both directions- to see if its one axle or both..right now
If one side cv wore out how far behind is the other?

01tl4tl

Have a transmission shop with a known name check it out for you- for free
They can install an axle easily, they remove them to get transmissions out all day long

PeterUbers

iTrader: (1)

Was acura that "dumb" or was Acura that "smart" from a financial standpoint to integrate this .. the previous generation had separate parts (axle and cv joint/boot).

My service dept charged $350 for the axle (and joint) and 2.0 hrs to install it.... case closed. If you get a better deal at your service department, you're amazing and are worthy of all our praise.

Majofo

01tl4tl.. You my friend know your stuff!

My guy is a tranny guy.. and charged about the same amount that Acura wanted to just change one CV boot, and he swapped out both driveshafts. unbelievable that people pay some of these prices.

01tl4tl

thanks--please tell my wife I know really DO know much of which I speak...

Changing a torn boot is insane- if the axle is already removed- any good tech KNOWS grit is in there--for the time to wash out the cv and repack it with grease, and there will be score marks you cant see that will cause bearing failure in the near future...

to replace just a boot is a fools game

vinuneuro

iTrader: (1)

Yea, skip replacing the boot. If it's clicking, the joint is already done. Plus, packing grease is a pita.

Just replace the axle yourself. It takes no more than 10-15 minutes. Get one from Autozone or Napa. It'll be cheaper and they come with a lifetime warranty.

01tl4tl

there is a locking clip that holds the axle in- read the diy before tearing into this job

Majofo

10-15 mins??? If you have a pit crew and keep 'em out of the beer fridge / vodka freezer until work is done.. lol..

Remove Wheel
Remove Spindle Nut
Carefully remove Ball Joint (use special brace)
Drain ATF
Hammer
Remove
Install
Fill ATF (3x3 if fluid is dark)

That's at least 1.5hrs.. I rechecked and my transmission guy did the driver side in a little over 1 hr and the passenger in less than an hour.. unbelievably fast but he also has the right tools and does these everyday.

vinuneuro

iTrader: (1)

I've done it in 15min, minus refilling the trans fluid. Disconnecting the arm from the balljoints doesn't take more than a couple minutes. I just use the Autozone tie-rod puller tool. Does it extremely easily without damaging the boots. Removing the spindle nut is the tricky one. If it has never come off before, it can be a total pita. The first time I had to remove the axle in my Prelude, I ended up having to take the knuckle with the driveshaft attached to a shop so that they could use a heavy-duty impact to get it off. Drain the fluid after the wheel is off so you can do all the other stuff while it drains.

Majofo

Q: did you use a new spindle nut? I know Acura says replace once removed but I wonder if this is too conservative. Anyone have thoughts on the topic?

lembowski

iTrader: (1)

I have talked to 3 shops near me as I have a torn cv boot. One of the shops was refered to me by my Acura Dealer as the guy told me they do top notch work. All of them have told me that they suggest replacing the boot if the axle is not making any noises. I'm discussed the items in this thread and others......they have all stated that replacing the axle with an aftermarket part is not as good as them fixing the OEM Acura one. They have all told me that they will replace the whole axle, but it is gonna cost around $75 more.

I don't understand why I hear it so one sided from here and from the shops i spoke to. Even the service rep at the dealer told me that if they can replace the boot everything will be all good to go. I normally really trust this guy. Ugh

vinuneuro

iTrader: (1)

I did. They're cheap enough to not have to think about it.

Majofo

Yeah I wouldn't risk it either especially for a couple bucks. Just wondering from the phrasing.

Majofo

It's right there before you but you may not realize it. They are patching the CV joint which has been exposed to dirt and moisture which has caused damage and will continue to wear even once it has been amended.. you'll may not need a new axle for 40k miles.. 30k miles.. 5k miles?.. only time and road conditions will tell..

Simple economics.. Pay about the same now for just the CV Boot and then pay again down the road for the whole driveshaft.. or pay now to change out the driveshaft (lifetime replacement warranty) and never pay again.. just labor. Why pay twice?

01tl4tl

you have to remove the driveshaft and related parts to change a torn boot

Yes, the shop would very much like to have you pay them twice, and you will ...
PLUS once its in the shop, they ~MAY~ discover too much damage to clean, regrease and replace the boot..so now you have to repair a cv (dont) or buy a new axle,,,
at their price~

pay once and do it right,,,, as we - the many people who drive a TL every single day in many varied conditions...and have experienced this type failure--are long time mechanics both new and old school thinking, and have no financial interest in the situation
or the guy who works at a place that works on cars, and work is slow--
like car salesmen, service writers sell service, they are not there to help you save money- but to help themselves stay employed---and they will say anything to get you in the door and the car taken apart.
(from the mind of a retired service writer)

01tl4tl

didnt the OP say they had a noise in a least one turning condition??- thats what started the investigation into the cause?

and the shops are saying IF no noise.. then they can reboot it

So it has noise, it needs to replace the entire assembly

01tl4tl

did any of those shops test drive the car or put it on the lift and check the cv bearings?
or has this all been just talk about what to do- in a speculative way

vinuneuro

iTrader: (1)

Plus, if you're having someone else do the work, they're going to charge you an extra hour of labor for all that's involved in replacing the boot; apart from the hour they'll charge you to remove and install the drive shaft.

Unless you track the car, Autozone and Napa axles work just fine at the fraction of the cost.

lembowski

iTrader: (1)

Any guys out there know what the time frame is for a shop to change out just the axle? One shop is telling me its the same time as doing the cv boot. Even though every post on here says you have to take the axle out to get to work on the cv boot. Doesn't add up to me. So that means they are telling me 1.8hrs of work for the cv boot or the axle, this is based on their hourly rate. ??????

Majofo

My guy did my driver's side in a little over an hour but that was because it was pretty jammed in there because dirt moisture and heat had almost locked it in so it took him some extra hammer time.. (can't touch this ).

Vinn says 15mins but that is pretty fast. I'd say 1 hr is about right and about 30 mins for passenger side. Acura recommends doing transmission drain and fill on the driver side which is no big deal and good as well.

4DGSR

I was wondering how difficult it is to DIY. On the Integra and Civic that I've done, it wasn't that hard. Just time consuming.

01tl4tl

if you have a few specialty tools and have similar experience then its no big deal

As for shops quoting price on the PHONE- see my last post regarding getting you in the door!
If they are reading from a book of labor time, it may not include clean and repack grease- so they are just going to remove the boot and slip a new one on, maybe put some grease in the boot for good show
Have you asked if they have done this boot job on a TL with perfect results?, no failure in 12 months?

As a former industry employee, I would never sell a boot replacement over a new complete axle with 2 fresh cv bearings and 2 new boots
Its just easier and safer to replace all- and be done with it, for about the same price

01tl4tl

the shops may also be thinking of using the old style rubber piece that wraps around the cv and glues onto its own edge, making a full round boot, not pulling the axle and installing a factory boot

Guess how well that works in real life

Again: Once the car is in the shop and apart- you are at their mercy,
and they have none!~

lembowski

iTrader: (1)

Man some shops are ripoffs! I've called around to a dozen shops for quotes. I've gotten everywhere from the lowest for replacing the cv boot for $190 and $210 for replacing the axle with aftermarket parts for $220. And the high end is Acura saying it will take 2 hrs for the axle replace at $105/hr + cost of axle, and 2.5hrs for the CV boot plus + parts.

I just got off the phone with another Acura Tech at a different dealer and he told me that with the # of miles I have on my car he wouldn't suggest replacing the axle with aftermarket parts unless the joint is screwed up. He told me flat out I know your not gonna get the work done here......but if I was in your position and the joint is not bad I would get a good shop to replace the boot and regrease.

At this point after hearing soo many different shops tell me to just replace the boot, thats what I'm gonna do. I don't want to shop this out anymore, and if Acura themselves tell me thats what they would suggest than well whatever. The way I look at it is I don't plan on having this car in another 40K+ miles.