Cracked oil pan + taking off the heads!
12-21-2011, 01:02 PM
#1
Cracked oil pan + taking off the heads!
With his permission of course, my buddie is doing work to his TL.
Here is the progress so far.
Here is the progress so far.
3 Acuras,Justin your photo skills suck cuz this & the rest you took were off focus/blurry
Cracked oil pan
Damn
Engravings all scratched up
Motor time
hmm
Heads off together with precats
Head gasket & valves..head gasket is still in great shape but i got new ones anyway
While wedging the head around to get it off coolant was pouring & this is what i saw after i took the head off,pistons doesnt look too good but no damage from valves on 'em. I soaked up the coolant with paper towels
Every head (from the intake runners into the cylinder head) had this grease,im guessing its fuel spray pattern from the injectors & maybe oil?
No cracks
Sitting & waiting on his twin so they can go to the shop together :gheylaugh:
Cracked oil pan
Damn
Engravings all scratched up
Motor time
hmm
Heads off together with precats
Head gasket & valves..head gasket is still in great shape but i got new ones anyway
While wedging the head around to get it off coolant was pouring & this is what i saw after i took the head off,pistons doesnt look too good but no damage from valves on 'em. I soaked up the coolant with paper towels
Every head (from the intake runners into the cylinder head) had this grease,im guessing its fuel spray pattern from the injectors & maybe oil?
No cracks
Sitting & waiting on his twin so they can go to the shop together :gheylaugh:
12-21-2011, 02:15 PM
#4
takin care of Business in
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Thanks for sharing justin....the J series stripped apart does look sexy.....
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Bada$$VTEC (12-22-2011)
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Bada$$VTEC (12-22-2011)
12-21-2011, 03:32 PM
#6
I've used JB Weld to fix a cracked Passat V6 oil pan that looked similar to that. There is absolutely nothing protecting them on that car; the TLs/Accords atleast have a subrame surrounding the pan. It's held up for almost 2 years now.
Thanks for the pics.
Thanks for the pics.
12-21-2011, 04:01 PM
#7
Team Owner
The top end looks great. Pistons, valves, intake ports, all good. The buildup in the intake ports is from where the fuel spray doesn't hit. It's from the EGR and PCV. Now imagine direct injection engines with no fuel going through the intake system. They get a crazy amount of carbon buildup in the intake tract in a short period of time.
Piston carbon buildup is not bad at all, neither is the combustion chamber side of the heads. Why was this one pulled apart?
Piston carbon buildup is not bad at all, neither is the combustion chamber side of the heads. Why was this one pulled apart?
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Bada$$VTEC (12-22-2011)
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12-21-2011, 04:18 PM
#10
takin care of Business in
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12-21-2011, 05:15 PM
#11
The top end looks great. Pistons, valves, intake ports, all good. The buildup in the intake ports is from where the fuel spray doesn't hit. It's from the EGR and PCV. Now imagine direct injection engines with no fuel going through the intake system. They get a crazy amount of carbon buildup in the intake tract in a short period of time.
Piston carbon buildup is not bad at all, neither is the combustion chamber side of the heads. Why was this one pulled apart?
Piston carbon buildup is not bad at all, neither is the combustion chamber side of the heads. Why was this one pulled apart?
car was bought wrecked.
Dont know if previous owner or Current(bada$$vtec heheh) over-reved.
Misfiring!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
engine codes were all over the map, saying it was a specific cylinder, then the next day a different cylinder.
I believe he did a compression and a leak down test to determine which cylinder it was.
I believe cylinder 4!!
the day he pulled everything apart, I didnt help much......i was busy errr jacking off. LOL he was super mad at me, that day.
Hope we're still friends badassvtec!!!
Since i was twiddling my thumbs, I didnt really pay attention to anything else he said.
Hope he chimes in with more correct info
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Bada$$VTEC (12-22-2011)
12-21-2011, 05:27 PM
#12
Don't the valves on cylinder 4 look fine?
Any closeups of the cylinder walls?
I remember reading on v.6.p that a failing crank position sensor (CPS) could cause random misfire codes. Also, tight exhaust valves could lead to misfire codes. However, they wouldn't be random.
Any closeups of the cylinder walls?
I remember reading on v.6.p that a failing crank position sensor (CPS) could cause random misfire codes. Also, tight exhaust valves could lead to misfire codes. However, they wouldn't be random.
Last edited by gwiffer; 12-21-2011 at 05:30 PM.
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Bada$$VTEC (12-22-2011)
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justnspace (12-21-2011)
12-21-2011, 08:55 PM
#16
Head Bolt Design Changed for V6 Engines
NOTE: This article applies only to ’05 Acura
V6-equipped models built in North America.
In July ’05, our Ohio engine plant and Alabama
factory changed the type of cylinder head bolts
used to assemble V6 engines.
The original head bolts were 6-point, elasticity
range bolts. You tighten these bolts using a threestep
torque method. The new head bolts are
12-point plasticity range bolts. You tighten
these bolts using a torque angle method.
As a rule, you should never mix these two
different bolt types. Mixing the bolts, or switching
between their bolt tightening methods, could
cause bolt failure or cylinder distortion. Always
order the same type of head bolts that originally
came with the engine. If, for instance, the engine
came from the factory with 6-point bolts, don’t
order 12-point bolts, even if you’re replacing all
the bolts. The parts catalog lists both types of bolts
for ’05 vehicles. You can take the guesswork out
of ordering if you’ve got the vehicle’s engine
number handy.
Before reusing 12-point bolts, you need to
measure the bolt diameter in two places. If either
diameter is less than 11.3 mm (0.44 in.), you
must replace that bolt. If you’re using 6-point
bolts, you can keep using the same ones again
and again, unless, of course, they’re damaged.
If you’re using 6-point bolts, follow the three-step
torque method in the appropriate S/M. If you’re
using 12-point bolts, follow the torque angle
method in these steps:
1. Apply fresh engine oil to the threads and
under each bolt head.
2. Use a beam-type torque wrench to torque the
bolts in sequence to 29 N•m (22 lb-ft). If
you’re using a preset torque wrench, make
sure you torque them slowly to prevent
overtightening. If a bolt makes a noise while
you’re torquing it, loosen that bolt and torque
it again from the first step.
3. When you’re done torquing all the bolts,
tighten them further in two steps (90 degrees
per step) in sequence. If you’re using a new
bolt, tighten that bolt an extra 90 degrees. If
you tighten a bolt beyond the specified angle,
remove that bolt and remeasure its diameter.
Replace the bolt if needed. Don’t loosen it
back to the specified angle.
IMPORTANT: Make yourself a copy of this article,
and keep it at your workstation. Not all S/Ms
include this 12-point head bolt info yet. Those
S/Ms will be revised at a later time.
12-POINT 6-POINT
B 50 mm (2.0 in.)
A 45 mm (1.8 in.)
FIRST STEP
SECOND STEP
THIRD STEP
(New bolt)
NOTE: This article applies only to ’05 Acura
V6-equipped models built in North America.
In July ’05, our Ohio engine plant and Alabama
factory changed the type of cylinder head bolts
used to assemble V6 engines.
The original head bolts were 6-point, elasticity
range bolts. You tighten these bolts using a threestep
torque method. The new head bolts are
12-point plasticity range bolts. You tighten
these bolts using a torque angle method.
As a rule, you should never mix these two
different bolt types. Mixing the bolts, or switching
between their bolt tightening methods, could
cause bolt failure or cylinder distortion. Always
order the same type of head bolts that originally
came with the engine. If, for instance, the engine
came from the factory with 6-point bolts, don’t
order 12-point bolts, even if you’re replacing all
the bolts. The parts catalog lists both types of bolts
for ’05 vehicles. You can take the guesswork out
of ordering if you’ve got the vehicle’s engine
number handy.
Before reusing 12-point bolts, you need to
measure the bolt diameter in two places. If either
diameter is less than 11.3 mm (0.44 in.), you
must replace that bolt. If you’re using 6-point
bolts, you can keep using the same ones again
and again, unless, of course, they’re damaged.
If you’re using 6-point bolts, follow the three-step
torque method in the appropriate S/M. If you’re
using 12-point bolts, follow the torque angle
method in these steps:
1. Apply fresh engine oil to the threads and
under each bolt head.
2. Use a beam-type torque wrench to torque the
bolts in sequence to 29 N•m (22 lb-ft). If
you’re using a preset torque wrench, make
sure you torque them slowly to prevent
overtightening. If a bolt makes a noise while
you’re torquing it, loosen that bolt and torque
it again from the first step.
3. When you’re done torquing all the bolts,
tighten them further in two steps (90 degrees
per step) in sequence. If you’re using a new
bolt, tighten that bolt an extra 90 degrees. If
you tighten a bolt beyond the specified angle,
remove that bolt and remeasure its diameter.
Replace the bolt if needed. Don’t loosen it
back to the specified angle.
IMPORTANT: Make yourself a copy of this article,
and keep it at your workstation. Not all S/Ms
include this 12-point head bolt info yet. Those
S/Ms will be revised at a later time.
12-POINT 6-POINT
B 50 mm (2.0 in.)
A 45 mm (1.8 in.)
FIRST STEP
SECOND STEP
THIRD STEP
(New bolt)
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justnspace (12-21-2011)
12-21-2011, 09:00 PM
#18
Team Owner
With a blown headgasket, the cylinder getting water contamination (if there is one) will be nice and clean.
That tiny little bit of carbon you see on the pistons and combustion chambers is what Seafoam through the intake is supposed to clean off. Proof that it's pointless. How many miles are on this one?
One more off topic post, the guys with meth/water injection will have spotless pistons when pulled apart. I couldn't get over my 50,000 mile engine that looked like it had never been run.
Any chance of getting a close up of the crosshatching in the worst cylinder, preferably on the thrust side?
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Bada$$VTEC (12-22-2011)
12-21-2011, 09:04 PM
#20
Team Owner
Head Bolt Design Changed for V6 Engines
NOTE: This article applies only to ’05 Acura
V6-equipped models built in North America.
In July ’05, our Ohio engine plant and Alabama
factory changed the type of cylinder head bolts
used to assemble V6 engines.
The original head bolts were 6-point, elasticity
range bolts. You tighten these bolts using a threestep
torque method. The new head bolts are
12-point plasticity range bolts. You tighten
these bolts using a torque angle method.
As a rule, you should never mix these two
different bolt types. Mixing the bolts, or switching
between their bolt tightening methods, could
cause bolt failure or cylinder distortion. Always
order the same type of head bolts that originally
came with the engine. If, for instance, the engine
came from the factory with 6-point bolts, don’t
order 12-point bolts, even if you’re replacing all
the bolts. The parts catalog lists both types of bolts
for ’05 vehicles. You can take the guesswork out
of ordering if you’ve got the vehicle’s engine
number handy.
Before reusing 12-point bolts, you need to
measure the bolt diameter in two places. If either
diameter is less than 11.3 mm (0.44 in.), you
must replace that bolt. If you’re using 6-point
bolts, you can keep using the same ones again
and again, unless, of course, they’re damaged.
If you’re using 6-point bolts, follow the three-step
torque method in the appropriate S/M. If you’re
using 12-point bolts, follow the torque angle
method in these steps:
1. Apply fresh engine oil to the threads and
under each bolt head.
2. Use a beam-type torque wrench to torque the
bolts in sequence to 29 N•m (22 lb-ft). If
you’re using a preset torque wrench, make
sure you torque them slowly to prevent
overtightening. If a bolt makes a noise while
you’re torquing it, loosen that bolt and torque
it again from the first step.
3. When you’re done torquing all the bolts,
tighten them further in two steps (90 degrees
per step) in sequence. If you’re using a new
bolt, tighten that bolt an extra 90 degrees. If
you tighten a bolt beyond the specified angle,
remove that bolt and remeasure its diameter.
Replace the bolt if needed. Don’t loosen it
back to the specified angle.
IMPORTANT: Make yourself a copy of this article,
and keep it at your workstation. Not all S/Ms
include this 12-point head bolt info yet. Those
S/Ms will be revised at a later time.
12-POINT 6-POINT
B 50 mm (2.0 in.)
A 45 mm (1.8 in.)
FIRST STEP
SECOND STEP
THIRD STEP
(New bolt)
NOTE: This article applies only to ’05 Acura
V6-equipped models built in North America.
In July ’05, our Ohio engine plant and Alabama
factory changed the type of cylinder head bolts
used to assemble V6 engines.
The original head bolts were 6-point, elasticity
range bolts. You tighten these bolts using a threestep
torque method. The new head bolts are
12-point plasticity range bolts. You tighten
these bolts using a torque angle method.
As a rule, you should never mix these two
different bolt types. Mixing the bolts, or switching
between their bolt tightening methods, could
cause bolt failure or cylinder distortion. Always
order the same type of head bolts that originally
came with the engine. If, for instance, the engine
came from the factory with 6-point bolts, don’t
order 12-point bolts, even if you’re replacing all
the bolts. The parts catalog lists both types of bolts
for ’05 vehicles. You can take the guesswork out
of ordering if you’ve got the vehicle’s engine
number handy.
Before reusing 12-point bolts, you need to
measure the bolt diameter in two places. If either
diameter is less than 11.3 mm (0.44 in.), you
must replace that bolt. If you’re using 6-point
bolts, you can keep using the same ones again
and again, unless, of course, they’re damaged.
If you’re using 6-point bolts, follow the three-step
torque method in the appropriate S/M. If you’re
using 12-point bolts, follow the torque angle
method in these steps:
1. Apply fresh engine oil to the threads and
under each bolt head.
2. Use a beam-type torque wrench to torque the
bolts in sequence to 29 N•m (22 lb-ft). If
you’re using a preset torque wrench, make
sure you torque them slowly to prevent
overtightening. If a bolt makes a noise while
you’re torquing it, loosen that bolt and torque
it again from the first step.
3. When you’re done torquing all the bolts,
tighten them further in two steps (90 degrees
per step) in sequence. If you’re using a new
bolt, tighten that bolt an extra 90 degrees. If
you tighten a bolt beyond the specified angle,
remove that bolt and remeasure its diameter.
Replace the bolt if needed. Don’t loosen it
back to the specified angle.
IMPORTANT: Make yourself a copy of this article,
and keep it at your workstation. Not all S/Ms
include this 12-point head bolt info yet. Those
S/Ms will be revised at a later time.
12-POINT 6-POINT
B 50 mm (2.0 in.)
A 45 mm (1.8 in.)
FIRST STEP
SECOND STEP
THIRD STEP
(New bolt)
12-22-2011, 01:41 AM
#21
Sorry this is a long post.
Thanks Justin for helping me create this thread but unfortunately im not off tomorrow (xmas week schedule changed it). When i first got the car back in March i did over rev to 8k @ 80+mph trying to shift to 4th but shifted to 2nd for at least 5secs til i caught it back with the clutch (was still learning the car). Car ran fine all those while til back in August it threw a code for cyl2 misfire (it threw cyl1 misfire when i first got the car but when i let it run for a while it immediately stopped).
So fast forward to August it started misfiring on cyl2,bought new coil pack but no luck.Then it said cyl2 & 3 misfire,swapped coils but nothing changed,used chevron fuel cleaner then it stopped misfiring for like 2 days (I average ~150 miles a day). I even dynoed 229 at the wheels with it misfiring,i then later changed the spark plugs (@ 82kmiles) & it looked bad but didnt stop the misfire. Ran against Justin multiple times & we were always even.
So then in october went to a Honda delearship to get a leakdown test cuz my buddy knew a friend who's a Honda tech,so they checked it,did a leakdown test,vacum test & adjusted the valves on cyl4,5 & 6 then when i cranked it on it threw a random misfire code for all cylinders except cyl 1 or 6 (cant remember which). They did all possible test besides compression test,so they told me since i overrevved & have been driving like that for a while i must have bent some valves on the rear head. They told me i was runing really lean on cyl4 thats why it looks clean on the intake runners compared to the other cyls.
Most times it drove like nothing was wrong with the motor but sometimes it acts like my old 02 CIVIC LX (slow pos) but i always felt heat soak was also the problem. Most times from a stop,it feels like i have 10trqs to the wheels but top end power seemed decent cuz i could still pass cars easily.
I broke my oil pan 3rd of this month cuz i ran over a rock driving too close to a donked Charger (it was too late to make any lane switching). Car has almost 91k miles now,bought at 74k in March & ive always used 93 octane Shell,Chevron,Texaco,Valero & few times Exxon.
I already took out the rear head apart today before work except this one clip for a sensor attached to the head near the passenger strut tower is being a b***h to get off so cant totally take the head off,ill get back to it on friday before work again. I'll update more on this when im off work again And oh after i took off the front heads i noticed one wire was loose on the rear head area near the green plug switch from the power steering hose like it has a plug or something,have to check Justins car to see where the wire is from.
THANKS EVERYBODY FOR YOUR INPUT & IF YOU HAVE ANY OTHER ADVICE FEEL FREE TO TELL ME. TIA! Sorry for my long post.
So fast forward to August it started misfiring on cyl2,bought new coil pack but no luck.Then it said cyl2 & 3 misfire,swapped coils but nothing changed,used chevron fuel cleaner then it stopped misfiring for like 2 days (I average ~150 miles a day). I even dynoed 229 at the wheels with it misfiring,i then later changed the spark plugs (@ 82kmiles) & it looked bad but didnt stop the misfire. Ran against Justin multiple times & we were always even.
So then in october went to a Honda delearship to get a leakdown test cuz my buddy knew a friend who's a Honda tech,so they checked it,did a leakdown test,vacum test & adjusted the valves on cyl4,5 & 6 then when i cranked it on it threw a random misfire code for all cylinders except cyl 1 or 6 (cant remember which). They did all possible test besides compression test,so they told me since i overrevved & have been driving like that for a while i must have bent some valves on the rear head. They told me i was runing really lean on cyl4 thats why it looks clean on the intake runners compared to the other cyls.
Most times it drove like nothing was wrong with the motor but sometimes it acts like my old 02 CIVIC LX (slow pos) but i always felt heat soak was also the problem. Most times from a stop,it feels like i have 10trqs to the wheels but top end power seemed decent cuz i could still pass cars easily.
I broke my oil pan 3rd of this month cuz i ran over a rock driving too close to a donked Charger (it was too late to make any lane switching). Car has almost 91k miles now,bought at 74k in March & ive always used 93 octane Shell,Chevron,Texaco,Valero & few times Exxon.
I already took out the rear head apart today before work except this one clip for a sensor attached to the head near the passenger strut tower is being a b***h to get off so cant totally take the head off,ill get back to it on friday before work again. I'll update more on this when im off work again And oh after i took off the front heads i noticed one wire was loose on the rear head area near the green plug switch from the power steering hose like it has a plug or something,have to check Justins car to see where the wire is from.
THANKS EVERYBODY FOR YOUR INPUT & IF YOU HAVE ANY OTHER ADVICE FEEL FREE TO TELL ME. TIA! Sorry for my long post.
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justnspace (12-22-2011)
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justnspace (12-22-2011)
12-22-2011, 09:08 AM
#23
Team Owner
Thanks Justin for helping me create this thread but unfortunately im not off tomorrow (xmas week schedule changed it). When i first got the car back in March i did over rev to 8k @ 80+mph trying to shift to 4th but shifted to 2nd for at least 5secs til i caught it back with the clutch (was still learning the car). Car ran fine all those while til back in August it threw a code for cyl2 misfire (it threw cyl1 misfire when i first got the car but when i let it run for a while it immediately stopped).
So fast forward to August it started misfiring on cyl2,bought new coil pack but no luck.Then it said cyl2 & 3 misfire,swapped coils but nothing changed,used chevron fuel cleaner then it stopped misfiring for like 2 days (I average ~150 miles a day). I even dynoed 229 at the wheels with it misfiring,i then later changed the spark plugs (@ 82kmiles) & it looked bad but didnt stop the misfire. Ran against Justin multiple times & we were always even.
So then in october went to a Honda delearship to get a leakdown test cuz my buddy knew a friend who's a Honda tech,so they checked it,did a leakdown test,vacum test & adjusted the valves on cyl4,5 & 6 then when i cranked it on it threw a random misfire code for all cylinders except cyl 1 or 6 (cant remember which). They did all possible test besides compression test,so they told me since i overrevved & have been driving like that for a while i must have bent some valves on the rear head. They told me i was runing really lean on cyl4 thats why it looks clean on the intake runners compared to the other cyls.
Most times it drove like nothing was wrong with the motor but sometimes it acts like my old 02 CIVIC LX (slow pos) but i always felt heat soak was also the problem. Most times from a stop,it feels like i have 10trqs to the wheels but top end power seemed decent cuz i could still pass cars easily.
I broke my oil pan 3rd of this month cuz i ran over a rock driving too close to a donked Charger (it was too late to make any lane switching). Car has almost 91k miles now,bought at 74k in March & ive always used 93 octane Shell,Chevron,Texaco,Valero & few times Exxon.
I already took out the rear head apart today before work except this one clip for a sensor attached to the head near the passenger strut tower is being a b***h to get off so cant totally take the head off,ill get back to it on friday before work again. I'll update more on this when im off work again And oh after i took off the front heads i noticed one wire was loose on the rear head area near the green plug switch from the power steering hose like it has a plug or something,have to check Justins car to see where the wire is from.
THANKS EVERYBODY FOR YOUR INPUT & IF YOU HAVE ANY OTHER ADVICE FEEL FREE TO TELL ME. TIA! Sorry for my long post.
So fast forward to August it started misfiring on cyl2,bought new coil pack but no luck.Then it said cyl2 & 3 misfire,swapped coils but nothing changed,used chevron fuel cleaner then it stopped misfiring for like 2 days (I average ~150 miles a day). I even dynoed 229 at the wheels with it misfiring,i then later changed the spark plugs (@ 82kmiles) & it looked bad but didnt stop the misfire. Ran against Justin multiple times & we were always even.
So then in october went to a Honda delearship to get a leakdown test cuz my buddy knew a friend who's a Honda tech,so they checked it,did a leakdown test,vacum test & adjusted the valves on cyl4,5 & 6 then when i cranked it on it threw a random misfire code for all cylinders except cyl 1 or 6 (cant remember which). They did all possible test besides compression test,so they told me since i overrevved & have been driving like that for a while i must have bent some valves on the rear head. They told me i was runing really lean on cyl4 thats why it looks clean on the intake runners compared to the other cyls.
Most times it drove like nothing was wrong with the motor but sometimes it acts like my old 02 CIVIC LX (slow pos) but i always felt heat soak was also the problem. Most times from a stop,it feels like i have 10trqs to the wheels but top end power seemed decent cuz i could still pass cars easily.
I broke my oil pan 3rd of this month cuz i ran over a rock driving too close to a donked Charger (it was too late to make any lane switching). Car has almost 91k miles now,bought at 74k in March & ive always used 93 octane Shell,Chevron,Texaco,Valero & few times Exxon.
I already took out the rear head apart today before work except this one clip for a sensor attached to the head near the passenger strut tower is being a b***h to get off so cant totally take the head off,ill get back to it on friday before work again. I'll update more on this when im off work again And oh after i took off the front heads i noticed one wire was loose on the rear head area near the green plug switch from the power steering hose like it has a plug or something,have to check Justins car to see where the wire is from.
THANKS EVERYBODY FOR YOUR INPUT & IF YOU HAVE ANY OTHER ADVICE FEEL FREE TO TELL ME. TIA! Sorry for my long post.
Intake runner cleanliness has nothing to do with how rich or lean the engine is running. Fuel only hits the very, very end of the runner if at all and even if it was a wet flow intake which it is not, rich or lean would have no effect on it.
How did the leakdown results turn out? A leakdown will pick up a bent valve very easily. It's more useful than a compression test except for detecting a bent rod.
Did it ever have a misfire at idle?
From what little I can see in the pictures, no cylinder was running lean for any length of time.
Bent valves won't make it run lean but they will lower compression and make it look like it's running richer.
I hope this fixes your problem but unless the leakdown results were bad (assuming they did it right), they may have jumped the gun pulling the heads off.
12-22-2011, 01:23 PM
#24
Confused Maxima Owner
Did you ever do anything about the sensors? The J Series has the same non sense going on like a VQ... So did you check the CPS Ref/Pos sensors or Camshaft POS sensors? If you guys have that....
12-22-2011, 08:04 PM
#25
There are a couple things wrong with what they told you.
Intake runner cleanliness has nothing to do with how rich or lean the engine is running. Fuel only hits the very, very end of the runner if at all and even if it was a wet flow intake which it is not, rich or lean would have no effect on it.
How did the leakdown results turn out? A leakdown will pick up a bent valve very easily. It's more useful than a compression test except for detecting a bent rod.
Did it ever have a misfire at idle?
From what little I can see in the pictures, no cylinder was running lean for any length of time.
Bent valves won't make it run lean but they will lower compression and make it look like it's running richer.
I hope this fixes your problem but unless the leakdown results were bad (assuming they did it right), they may have jumped the gun pulling the heads off.
Intake runner cleanliness has nothing to do with how rich or lean the engine is running. Fuel only hits the very, very end of the runner if at all and even if it was a wet flow intake which it is not, rich or lean would have no effect on it.
How did the leakdown results turn out? A leakdown will pick up a bent valve very easily. It's more useful than a compression test except for detecting a bent rod.
Did it ever have a misfire at idle?
From what little I can see in the pictures, no cylinder was running lean for any length of time.
Bent valves won't make it run lean but they will lower compression and make it look like it's running richer.
I hope this fixes your problem but unless the leakdown results were bad (assuming they did it right), they may have jumped the gun pulling the heads off.
At idle,i do feel it misfiring & i can hear the valve noise change to a different tone. The misfiring at idle worsened when i turn on the AC or when the weather became colder over here. My exhaust note at idle even sounded like i had a cammed Ford 302 under the hood,which it didnt when i first had the car.
I wasnt at the working area when they started the leakdown test but i went there when they were checking the valves on all cylinders with a lil microscopic camera & doing the vacuum test. I remembered they said the vacuum pressure or something like that was suppose to hit 20 when revved but nothing happened. They even sprayed carb cleaner on the IM,then the engine choked & stalled out.
EDIT: here's a vid of the idle i did a while back,vid is still processing so might take a while.
I never touched the sensors and if i did have a crank/cam sensor go bad or have a problem,it should have come up on my OBII scanner.. All wires seemed normal except for just one loose wire i saw behind the rear head next to the strut tower,but it seemed kinda corroded like its been like that for a long while.I need to check on Justins car to confrim where that wire is from.
Last edited by Bada$$VTEC; 12-22-2011 at 08:10 PM.
12-25-2011, 05:13 PM
#27
I was able to unclip the damn sensor holding me back from pulling the rear heads off...well i broke the tab of the clip. I noticed couple of things.
1. The exhaust valves on cyl1 was more redish than cyl2 & 3.
2. The pistons on cyl2 & 3 have markings on the exhaust side from the valves hitting the pistons,cyl1 has the same thing markings except its just a tiny markings (im gonna take pics of what i mean when i find my DSLR).
I'll be sending the heads off to the shop on tuesday. Need to start installing my new water pump + timing belt & motor mount pending the 3-4 days it takes to have the heads rebuilt.
1. The exhaust valves on cyl1 was more redish than cyl2 & 3.
2. The pistons on cyl2 & 3 have markings on the exhaust side from the valves hitting the pistons,cyl1 has the same thing markings except its just a tiny markings (im gonna take pics of what i mean when i find my DSLR).
I'll be sending the heads off to the shop on tuesday. Need to start installing my new water pump + timing belt & motor mount pending the 3-4 days it takes to have the heads rebuilt.
01-05-2012, 09:58 PM
#29
Team Owner
I was able to unclip the damn sensor holding me back from pulling the rear heads off...well i broke the tab of the clip. I noticed couple of things.
1. The exhaust valves on cyl1 was more redish than cyl2 & 3.
2. The pistons on cyl2 & 3 have markings on the exhaust side from the valves hitting the pistons,cyl1 has the same thing markings except its just a tiny markings (im gonna take pics of what i mean when i find my DSLR).
I'll be sending the heads off to the shop on tuesday. Need to start installing my new water pump + timing belt & motor mount pending the 3-4 days it takes to have the heads rebuilt.
1. The exhaust valves on cyl1 was more redish than cyl2 & 3.
2. The pistons on cyl2 & 3 have markings on the exhaust side from the valves hitting the pistons,cyl1 has the same thing markings except its just a tiny markings (im gonna take pics of what i mean when i find my DSLR).
I'll be sending the heads off to the shop on tuesday. Need to start installing my new water pump + timing belt & motor mount pending the 3-4 days it takes to have the heads rebuilt.
01-06-2012, 12:18 AM
#30
Honda doesnt sell a gasket for it,neither does any auto parts store... You gotta use RTV gasket maker/sealer. Its gonna be a bitch to take off the oil pan bolts near the crank pulley (well it was for me cuz my hands are big & the subframe was in the way too),also you can loosen the oil return feed line half way (not sure of exactly what they call it but you'll see what im talking about) after you loosen all the bolts around the pan to get it down or else you're gonna be on that forever.
I got the heads back from the shop within 3 days (on NYE) of taking it to the them,they told me i had 12 BENT VALVES (6 intake,6 exhaust) but i forgot to ask 'em what particular cylinders it was. It was all done for $320,they didnt charge me for replacing all the bent valves cuz i had no idea it wasnt part of the $320 quote i got from the owner 2 months before.
I had a fight trying to take off the damn Crank bolt,took me 2 or 3 days & so many attempts breaking tools but i finally got it off using the starter trick (i tried the honda crank pulley tool called intertia tool but that didnt work). So the WP,Auto tensioner,TB,head gasket,rear head is in place (not torqued down yet) & installing the rear cam pulley ATM .
I'll be doing the fronts Tomorrow & Saturday & hopefully i get it all done by Saturday. Im waiting for my side motor mount to come in next week cuz i found out it was broken (got it on ebay for $50 shipped compared to Oreilly wanting $139.99). Doing all this myself & i'm so proud.
This is the video i used for the starter trick
Last edited by Bada$$VTEC; 01-06-2012 at 12:21 AM.
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Bada$$VTEC (01-07-2012)
01-07-2012, 02:47 AM
#32
Thanks for the support,yeah i thought the starter method wont work on my TL too cuz it has the one crank start but it worked. I'm almost done putting everything back together;just have to torque the crank bolt,already torqued the heads down,need to re-install my IM,CAI tomorrow. All ill have left to do is get the motor mount but i have no idea when its coming cuz its shipped thru USPS.
10-10-2015, 05:45 PM
#34
Intermediate
Thanks Justin for helping me create this thread but unfortunately im not off tomorrow (xmas week schedule changed it). When i first got the car back in March i did over rev to 8k @ 80+mph trying to shift to 4th but shifted to 2nd for at least 5secs til i caught it back with the clutch (was still learning the car). Car ran fine all those while til back in August it threw a code for cyl2 misfire (it threw cyl1 misfire when i first got the car but when i let it run for a while it immediately stopped).
So fast forward to August it started misfiring on cyl2,bought new coil pack but no luck.Then it said cyl2 & 3 misfire,swapped coils but nothing changed,used chevron fuel cleaner then it stopped misfiring for like 2 days (I average ~150 miles a day). I even dynoed 229 at the wheels with it misfiring,i then later changed the spark plugs (@ 82kmiles) & it looked bad but didnt stop the misfire. Ran against Justin multiple times & we were always even.
So then in october went to a Honda delearship to get a leakdown test cuz my buddy knew a friend who's a Honda tech,so they checked it,did a leakdown test,vacum test & adjusted the valves on cyl4,5 & 6 then when i cranked it on it threw a random misfire code for all cylinders except cyl 1 or 6 (cant remember which). They did all possible test besides compression test,so they told me since i overrevved & have been driving like that for a while i must have bent some valves on the rear head. They told me i was runing really lean on cyl4 thats why it looks clean on the intake runners compared to the other cyls.
Most times it drove like nothing was wrong with the motor but sometimes it acts like my old 02 CIVIC LX (slow pos) but i always felt heat soak was also the problem. Most times from a stop,it feels like i have 10trqs to the wheels but top end power seemed decent cuz i could still pass cars easily.
I broke my oil pan 3rd of this month cuz i ran over a rock driving too close to a donked Charger (it was too late to make any lane switching). Car has almost 91k miles now,bought at 74k in March & ive always used 93 octane Shell,Chevron,Texaco,Valero & few times Exxon.
I already took out the rear head apart today before work except this one clip for a sensor attached to the head near the passenger strut tower is being a b***h to get off so cant totally take the head off,ill get back to it on friday before work again. I'll update more on this when im off work again And oh after i took off the front heads i noticed one wire was loose on the rear head area near the green plug switch from the power steering hose like it has a plug or something,have to check Justins car to see where the wire is from.
THANKS EVERYBODY FOR YOUR INPUT & IF YOU HAVE ANY OTHER ADVICE FEEL FREE TO TELL ME. TIA! Sorry for my long post.
So fast forward to August it started misfiring on cyl2,bought new coil pack but no luck.Then it said cyl2 & 3 misfire,swapped coils but nothing changed,used chevron fuel cleaner then it stopped misfiring for like 2 days (I average ~150 miles a day). I even dynoed 229 at the wheels with it misfiring,i then later changed the spark plugs (@ 82kmiles) & it looked bad but didnt stop the misfire. Ran against Justin multiple times & we were always even.
So then in october went to a Honda delearship to get a leakdown test cuz my buddy knew a friend who's a Honda tech,so they checked it,did a leakdown test,vacum test & adjusted the valves on cyl4,5 & 6 then when i cranked it on it threw a random misfire code for all cylinders except cyl 1 or 6 (cant remember which). They did all possible test besides compression test,so they told me since i overrevved & have been driving like that for a while i must have bent some valves on the rear head. They told me i was runing really lean on cyl4 thats why it looks clean on the intake runners compared to the other cyls.
Most times it drove like nothing was wrong with the motor but sometimes it acts like my old 02 CIVIC LX (slow pos) but i always felt heat soak was also the problem. Most times from a stop,it feels like i have 10trqs to the wheels but top end power seemed decent cuz i could still pass cars easily.
I broke my oil pan 3rd of this month cuz i ran over a rock driving too close to a donked Charger (it was too late to make any lane switching). Car has almost 91k miles now,bought at 74k in March & ive always used 93 octane Shell,Chevron,Texaco,Valero & few times Exxon.
I already took out the rear head apart today before work except this one clip for a sensor attached to the head near the passenger strut tower is being a b***h to get off so cant totally take the head off,ill get back to it on friday before work again. I'll update more on this when im off work again And oh after i took off the front heads i noticed one wire was loose on the rear head area near the green plug switch from the power steering hose like it has a plug or something,have to check Justins car to see where the wire is from.
THANKS EVERYBODY FOR YOUR INPUT & IF YOU HAVE ANY OTHER ADVICE FEEL FREE TO TELL ME. TIA! Sorry for my long post.
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