masterstone

I think I broke it guys. Turns out there is such thing as too much vtec yo!

Pics below, it's the middle rear cylinder, the photo inside is a screen cap from the video i took while on the side of the highway. Anyways, my concern or question is the fact I could not physically see the spark plug head, is this cause for concern or just my 1130pm fatigue setting in? It is just 1, and I will purchase a new one and pop it in. Is it recommended to simply replace all 6? Worth an upgrade?

Also, much thanks to you guys, I used google and sure enough was directed here to find out the service light was misfire related, and I took my engine cover off to see the coil sitting there.

nfnsquared

You blew a plug. J32s are somewhat notorious for blowing plugs. Most of the time it's #5 or #4. Yours is only the 2nd #2 that I recall.

What year & miles? Original factory plugs? If not, when were they last changed and who did the change?

Did you notice a loud "ticking" sound right before the plug blew?

You might be totally lucky if there was no piston/cylinder damage and if the threads stayed totally intact. Some folks have been able to just screw a new plug in and pop on a new coil. Others have had to have the head pulled and heli-coiled.

Good luck!

the_tl_man09

gross

thisaznboi88

iTrader: (7)

Helicoil or new cylinder head.

I have a built tls in the fs and a few spare coils packs I'd u need it

masterstone

@nfnsquared

It's a 2007 base no nav - 64,000 mi or 104,000 km, no ticking, then again I was merging onto the highway and shifted into 3rd and gave it some pedal and POP, misfire misfire misfire, pull over asap.

I purchased at 77,000km and plugs were new at the time or so I was told. I took their word since they did brakes, rotors, all fluids, new tires, etc It very well could have been original.

I do have a 5 year / 100,000km warranty on it that started at purchase. (unheard of for a used car from dealership) I will investigate the threads before I go drop $60 on a new coil.

If not, to warranty it goes.

thisaznboi88

iTrader: (7)

Good luck. If you have warranty your getting everything covered hopefully . If not I have spare coils packs

masterstone

Much appreciated, will post in 4-5 hours when I have had a look.

masterstone

So I checked things out, found a little something hiding on the frame below. I didn't like the looks of the plug of course, who knows where the contact is.... most likely the cylinder. I tried turning a new plug in just out of curiosity - of course that didn't happen. Calling warranty as we speak, thought i'd show my progress.

thisaznboi88

iTrader: (7)

Yup it needs a helicoil

nfnsquared

OP, were any of the other plugs loose?

masterstone

nfnsquared, I did not check, I am new to the warranty game and I don't want to touch too much in case they're anal about that kind of thing. What are you leading on about? Think maybe whoever installed them at the dealer did a bad job?

thisaznboi88

iTrader: (7)

It was probably like that from factory. Your not the o my one with a blown spark

nfnsquared

Maybe... If they installed new plugs without anti-seize and only torqued them to factory spec (13 ft-lbs), they were way under torqued (18-21 ft-lbs)...

masterstone

I wouldn't be surprised in the least. All in all an update for future members with issues as well as all your curiosity:

Fired an email off to warranty claims friday, they called this morning and directed me to a local shop they work with. Surprisingly the claims manager seemed very keen and helpful - I did not see this coming. As well the local shop, if the correct one, I had a family friend work there for 15 or so years. Taking it up today at 330 PST, will follow up with a rundown on the fix. Hopefully be VTEC'n later this week, if not most likely a courtesy toyota corolla lol

masterstone

Update: checked by the shop, threads completely stripped out, not covered under warranty due to "possible bad spark plug install"
I'm currently finding the paperwork from original sale, if it shows the dealership installed the plugs I'm going to them for repair costs.

nfnsquared

That doesn't surprise me, I'd do the same thing if I were them. But you know what the dealer will say....

On the other hand, if the dealer did not install the plugs and they were OEM from the factory, then I'd go back and fight the insurance company.

masterstone

Any way to prove without a doubt they were factory plugs? Any way to tip the odds in my favor?

nfnsquared

Not AFAIK. An NGK 6911 is an NGK 6911...

If the dealer did install the plugs, then they should have that in their records. I'd approach the dealer in this way: Don't mention anything about the problem. Just tell them that you are trying to fill holes in your maintenance records and ask if they can print you receipts of all the services you've had done at the dealer.

masterstone

Slightly ahead of you on that one I called and asked, but she didn't seem too able to read them properly. I'm dropping by there in a few hours after work.

That is what I figured about the plugs, worth a check though. The guy at the shop is telling me the head is an acura only part (of course) and is getting a quote together for me. On the flip side, my brother in law and long time mechanic, is saying to heli-coil it for a temp fix until I can find a used head on here. Any info on reliability of a heli-coil?

Also I appreciate your responses/help. AcuraZine for the win, as usual.

thisaznboi88

iTrader: (7)

buy my build head . Comes with extra goodies

https://acurazine.com/forums/car-parts-sale-361/fully-built-tl-s-heads-new-seals-new-gasket-09-mdx-camshaft-907439/

nfnsquared

Yeah, a few folks have done the heli-coil and it works fine (do a search for the other blown spark plug threads). I'm assuming there is no way to heli-coil that head without it coming off though. I'm pretty sure the #5 hole (front head) has been heli-coiled while still on...

justnspace

iTrader: (1)

helicoils are used on aircraft with TONS of more force than your TL.

TLer trash

If you can find someone who uses time-sert brand thread inserts, they are installed with the head on, and are a better, permanent repair compared to heli coil brand thread inserts. Honda/acura specifies them for some repairs. The kits are expensive at $150 or so plus maybe $5 an insert, but anyone with modest mechanical skills can do a professional repair.

masterstone

Thanks for your thoughts again. A few things to note before I dive into heli coil vs inserts or purchasing Azn's parts.

At this point in time, there is no indication on the paperwork from dealer A [I realized up until now I haven't specified that the place I purchased from wasn't an Acura dealership, will edit the original post so as not to down talk their brand] that the plugs were swapped at any time with them. I had all paperwork printed out for me, even though I have the originals.

Next step, back to the shop. Quote #1 - Just under $2900 CAD. This includes dealer only complete head, gaskets, etc plus 7 hours of labour. The heads were ~$1800 on their own, gasket set a few hundred, labour just under $700.

Quote #2 is $1350 which includes my head, removed sent to their machine shop + threaded insert (which like heli-coil should have no issue with durability and longevity) This includes the same labour, plus a few hundred for the machining, then parts. He forgot to include the new coil pack and new spark plugs all around.

We discussed things before proceeding. I have told him that I have an email in to the claims department of the warranty company asking what exactly does "ENGINE ALL - engine block cylinder heads intake manifolds & plenums exhaust manifolds timing belt cover oil pan.... etc etc etc"
Apparently the issue at hand that is their leverage against me is the spark plug install. I am leaning on the fact that the plug's threads are completely intact, no sign of wear/non-wear showing it wasn't completely secure. It is also an NGK, which shouldn't mean much, but looks aged to say the least (original for sure). With that being unable to be proven, I want to have in writing that these people will not fix my issue, even with a $4000 4 star 4 yr / 80,000km ULTIMATE DRIVE warranty.

Next step, if they still do not cover it. Family friend, regional manager of dealer A responsible for bringing western canada it's vehicles will be contacted. Considering he has some weight, he may be able to help out in the convincing of these folks. Also I would get a refund on my warranty (they offer refunds that are prorated) and then proceed to next step.

Step after that if still no go - I do commercial renovations for a living as a site superintendent. If you are from the vancouver area, or canada for that matter, we have done work for CBC-vancouver, cityTV of vancouver, and (humorously JackFM) as well I have an acquaintance who works for the local paper and may have some other contacts to help. I will try my best to get the media behind it, and pray that this will do the trick.

As for your guys responses, JustnSpace I understand that, but do Jets even VTEC yo?

Aznboi88, if not covered, I would go for the $1400 option, and if not I'd go for the stock replacement as "aftermarket parts" aren't covered in my warranty.

TLer Trash - The biggest kick in the teeth price wise would be having to take the entire thing off, and may as well go for the machined insert by that point.

As before, I'll continue to update even though I feel this is veering off into more warranty/political/larger issue than a simple coil pack replacement.

Cheers guys, I need to go have a brew, or two....

thisaznboi88

iTrader: (7)

They are not going to know if the parts are after market or not. Its stamped honda all over the place, better head and a nice boost in hp

But I hope you do get a cheaper fix. If not you know where to find me

masterstone

@nfnsquared

Well I have come to an end result, which I'm more than happy with for what it's worth. I went to Manager of 'Car Brand A' Canada (not sure I can disclose) who then went to the salesman at Dealer A who sold me the car + warranty. He tried to convince the warranty company himself with no luck. I guess I have horse shoes up my arse because the owner of Dealership A gave them a call, mentioned something about tearing up the contract with Warranty Owner, to which they replied that they would cover half of the cost of the time-cert option ($1500). The owner at Dealer A I guess didn't feel right about leaving me with ~$750 and volunteered to cover the other half. I'm currently researching how to make a good wine gift basket to send his way. (I'm not a wine drinker don't laugh) The only downfall right now is the warranty company will not cover fluids, gaskets, etc on the broken parts. I'm hoping these costs will fall into the "other half" being covered. Either way I am now having a great day even with the vancouver rain.

Thanks for all the responses and help again. Happy Easter Gentlemen.

nfnsquared

Great news! At least someone stepped up to the plate to help.

FYI, I would still file a case with Acura Corporate. The more people that file with them, the more likely there might be an official recall. So far, Acura has just buried their head in the sand even though this issue is widespread over the J-series engines.

Happy Easter!!