TL motor is toast
11-07-2011, 02:37 PM
#1
05-6MT-TL
Thread Starter
TL motor is toast
After a 2+ year oil consumption battle with my TL, the motor finally died last Friday 
I won't bother to explain what the battle means but if you're interested, search my previous posts and you'll get the story. As I await the shops official diagnosis I have been putting together a list of other parts I'll need to replace that would be much easier done while the motor is being rebuilt:
Alternatively, I was thinking it might be more cost effective to just swap the motor with another used one (i.e. less labor). I can handle the small stuff (like the timing belt and brakes) but an engine rebuild or replacement is out of my league without a lift, chain fall and TOOLS! Looking around I have come across 3 used motors listed between $1300 and $1800. The $1800 one said 36K miles while the other 2 listed no mileage. Seems they won't tell me unless I call them.
During my search I began to wonder if I could fit an RL motor in a TL (with minimal hassle)....I'm talking like swapping motor mounts or something small like that. Of course it would mean I would have to replace the tranny too so that installation needs to be considered as well. Does anyone have any expereince or knowledge on this?
TIA to all that reply.
I won't bother to explain what the battle means but if you're interested, search my previous posts and you'll get the story. As I await the shops official diagnosis I have been putting together a list of other parts I'll need to replace that would be much easier done while the motor is being rebuilt:- oil pump
- power steering pump
- master cylinder (not broke but brakes need replacing so why not)
- crank shaft pulley (not broke but a lightweight upgrade would be nice)
- clutch set and pilot bearing (also not broke but needs to be replaced none the less...maybe a performance upgrade)
Alternatively, I was thinking it might be more cost effective to just swap the motor with another used one (i.e. less labor). I can handle the small stuff (like the timing belt and brakes) but an engine rebuild or replacement is out of my league without a lift, chain fall and TOOLS! Looking around I have come across 3 used motors listed between $1300 and $1800. The $1800 one said 36K miles while the other 2 listed no mileage. Seems they won't tell me unless I call them.
During my search I began to wonder if I could fit an RL motor in a TL (with minimal hassle)....I'm talking like swapping motor mounts or something small like that. Of course it would mean I would have to replace the tranny too so that installation needs to be considered as well. Does anyone have any expereince or knowledge on this?
TIA to all that reply.
11-07-2011, 03:22 PM
#2
No, the RL has the j35 engine...it will not bolt up to your transmission.
How much is just the rebuild going to be?
How much is just the labor to remove & replace the engine?
I doubt you'll come out ahead by rebuilding your current motor as opposed to buying/installing a used engine, unless you can do all of the work yourself (minus the machining). Even then, there would be significant downtime while you did the work.
You can probably find <50K j32s on car-part.com for <$1000 (+shipping). You will probably want to do the 105k service while it's out (except for plugs & valve adjustment).
You will want to look inside the precats from above to see if the honeycomb catalyst has been clogged or damaged once you remove them from the engine. If they aren't in good shape, upgrade to HFPCs or PCDs.
...Good Luck!
How much is just the rebuild going to be?
How much is just the labor to remove & replace the engine?
I doubt you'll come out ahead by rebuilding your current motor as opposed to buying/installing a used engine, unless you can do all of the work yourself (minus the machining). Even then, there would be significant downtime while you did the work.
You can probably find <50K j32s on car-part.com for <$1000 (+shipping). You will probably want to do the 105k service while it's out (except for plugs & valve adjustment).
You will want to look inside the precats from above to see if the honeycomb catalyst has been clogged or damaged once you remove them from the engine. If they aren't in good shape, upgrade to HFPCs or PCDs.
...Good Luck!
Last edited by gwiffer; 11-07-2011 at 03:26 PM.
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duckengine (11-07-2011),
TheDingo (11-09-2011)
11-08-2011, 01:06 PM
#4
05-6MT-TL
Thread Starter
11-08-2011, 01:40 PM
#5
05-6MT-TL
Thread Starter
quote from shop
does this quote seem reasonable to you guys? sure is a lot of cash...wish I had a lift and chain fall. The shop normally works on german cars so its likely they have some fluff in their labor to account for the learning curve but they have a very good reputation none the less.
I know I can get the parts cheaper...already checked acuraautomotiveparts.org.
I know I can get the parts cheaper...already checked acuraautomotiveparts.org.
Last edited by duckengine; 11-08-2011 at 01:43 PM.
11-08-2011, 02:31 PM
#6
Former Sponsor
does this quote seem reasonable to you guys? sure is a lot of cash...wish I had a lift and chain fall. The shop normally works on german cars so its likely they have some fluff in their labor to account for the learning curve but they have a very good reputation none the less.
I know I can get the parts cheaper...already checked acuraautomotiveparts.org.
I know I can get the parts cheaper...already checked acuraautomotiveparts.org.
11-08-2011, 05:00 PM
#7
Suzuka Master
iTrader: (2)
does this quote seem reasonable to you guys? sure is a lot of cash...wish I had a lift and chain fall. The shop normally works on german cars so its likely they have some fluff in their labor to account for the learning curve but they have a very good reputation none the less.
I know I can get the parts cheaper...already checked acuraautomotiveparts.org.
I know I can get the parts cheaper...already checked acuraautomotiveparts.org.
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duckengine (11-10-2011)
Trending Topics
11-08-2011, 06:01 PM
#8
WOW...that's a lot of coin for a well used engine & labor.
I would think an independent shop could do:
~$1000 used J32
~$1000 labor
~$1000 misc (TB/WP kit, seals, fluids, etc.)
--------
~$3000
I don't know how realistic this is though.
I would think an independent shop could do:
~$1000 used J32
~$1000 labor
~$1000 misc (TB/WP kit, seals, fluids, etc.)
--------
~$3000
I don't know how realistic this is though.
Last edited by gwiffer; 11-08-2011 at 06:07 PM.
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duckengine (11-10-2011)
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duckengine (11-10-2011)
11-09-2011, 05:25 PM
#10
thats ridiculous.
The J32 is fairly common, and should be had for between $1000-1500.
I've replaced engines on a bunch of different cars. I've never been charged more than 1000 bucks for labor.
That being said, even 3000$ is too high for just R&R+parts.
I would advise you to buy a used engine from a reputable junkyard WITH A WARRANTY so you're covered. I know you ran into problems with your factory installed engine, but I doubt very many mechanics can replicate the original factory's "craftsmanship." Simply put, i don't think very many mechanics can really rebuild an engine and without creating more problems.
The J32 is fairly common, and should be had for between $1000-1500.
I've replaced engines on a bunch of different cars. I've never been charged more than 1000 bucks for labor.
That being said, even 3000$ is too high for just R&R+parts.
I would advise you to buy a used engine from a reputable junkyard WITH A WARRANTY so you're covered. I know you ran into problems with your factory installed engine, but I doubt very many mechanics can replicate the original factory's "craftsmanship." Simply put, i don't think very many mechanics can really rebuild an engine and without creating more problems.
Last edited by quanaman; 11-09-2011 at 05:31 PM.
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duckengine (11-10-2011)
11-09-2011, 09:59 PM
#11
Burning Brakes
That's very realistic. Motors these days are literally plug and play. Any shop should be be able to swap a motor within 10 to 12 hours.
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duckengine (11-10-2011)
11-10-2011, 03:20 PM
#12
05-6MT-TL
Thread Starter
my car is on its way back to "my garage". I already ordered me a used motor for $1100 and am going to dust off the tools and do this myself. The last motor i swapped was from a plymouth duster about 25 years ago. Can't be that much harder, right...wish me luck guys and thanks for all the feed back.
i'll search after this post but if anyone has a link to a motor swap DIY, please send along.
thanks
i'll search after this post but if anyone has a link to a motor swap DIY, please send along.
thanks
Last edited by duckengine; 11-10-2011 at 03:26 PM.
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justnspace (11-10-2011)
11-10-2011, 03:43 PM
#14
Goodluck with the work!
Also, You can probably get an engine hoist for 100-200 from Harbor Freight Tools.
They dont have the BEST quality tools but I usually buy stuff that I don't use all that often from them. And its likely you'll only need the hoist once (fingers crossed lol) so it's probably your best bet....or you can probably rent one...lol
Anywho, check the 3G garage for install tips. I doubt there's a whole engine swap DIY but theres others that would probably help you get close.
Also, You can probably get an engine hoist for 100-200 from Harbor Freight Tools.
They dont have the BEST quality tools but I usually buy stuff that I don't use all that often from them. And its likely you'll only need the hoist once (fingers crossed lol) so it's probably your best bet....or you can probably rent one...lol
Anywho, check the 3G garage for install tips. I doubt there's a whole engine swap DIY but theres others that would probably help you get close.
11-10-2011, 07:47 PM
#16
I would rent a engine hoist. There are some tools you just don't buy from a super cheap place like Harbor Frieght. Floor jacks, jack stands and any other item you need to trust your life with. It would probably be cheaper to rent anyway. Good luck with the install.
11-11-2011, 04:58 PM
#17
I used the Harbor Freight (Central Hydraulics) 2 Ton Capacity Foldable Shop Crane to R&R the D16/tranny in my EF Civic. I know the J32 is substantially heavier, but I had good results using it.
11-12-2011, 08:41 PM
#19
3rd Gear
Join Date: Sep 2007
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Plymouth Duster from 25 years ago, hey this guy is a Mopar fan! Glad to see you are swapping the engine yourself. I wish I were closer, I would be glad to help. Need a garage up there for a job that big. Hope you have a heater. More electrical connectors and metric tools, but you'll be just fine.
Cheers,
Burt 1971 Roadrunner back in the 1980's, 2007 Acura TL now.
Cheers,
Burt 1971 Roadrunner back in the 1980's, 2007 Acura TL now.
11-14-2011, 03:39 PM
#20
Goodluck with the work!
Also, You can probably get an engine hoist for 100-200 from Harbor Freight Tools.
They dont have the BEST quality tools but I usually buy stuff that I don't use all that often from them. And its likely you'll only need the hoist once (fingers crossed lol) so it's probably your best bet....or you can probably rent one...lol
Anywho, check the 3G garage for install tips. I doubt there's a whole engine swap DIY but theres others that would probably help you get close.
Also, You can probably get an engine hoist for 100-200 from Harbor Freight Tools.
They dont have the BEST quality tools but I usually buy stuff that I don't use all that often from them. And its likely you'll only need the hoist once (fingers crossed lol) so it's probably your best bet....or you can probably rent one...lol
Anywho, check the 3G garage for install tips. I doubt there's a whole engine swap DIY but theres others that would probably help you get close.
Question
Where is the link to view the 3G garage???
Can someone tell me if it's in any sublinks?
Can't seem to find it on acurazine.
11-20-2011, 09:09 AM
#21
05-6MT-TL
Thread Starter
Quick Progress update
Thought i would jump in and give you guys a quick update.
Old motor is out and on the hoist and I'm swapping parts over to the new motor. New motor arrived in 6-7 days nicely wrapped in plastic and wire tied to a pallet. Motor was exceptionally clean and almost looked new (rebuilt). Upon closer inspection I realized they had done some superficial painting to the block and timing belt covers which made it look shiny and new. Not sure why and admittedly it makes me a little nervous but the motor does "look" pretty good - very clean. They did a good job taking the time sealing all the orifices with fitted caps and duct tape; just not sure why the paint - makes me wonder if they're trying to cover something up. Anyway, had to pull off the intake manifold to remove what was left over from their hack job of the previous engine wiring harness and to swap over my old wiring harness - that requires new gaskets so I'm partially on hold until those arrive.
Thinking of cleaning the intake but not sure what the best approach is or just leave it. Advice?
I discovered the front catalytic converter was toast as it sounded like a tin can with a bunch of rocks in it. Looking up the exhaust port on the motor I could clearly see the valves were badly corroded - obviously the oil burning was quite bad on this side. The rear converter and valves looked ok. Need to order new cats.
As previously mentioned, I'm looking at replacing these with the PCD's. I thought i saw some previous postings on PCD's with a resonator to cut down on the rasp, droning?? I don't mind a little extra noise but I don't want it annoying as i do a lot of highway driving. I'll trade a little noise for increased performance though. Advice?
Thanks!
Here are a few pix:
Old motor is out and on the hoist and I'm swapping parts over to the new motor. New motor arrived in 6-7 days nicely wrapped in plastic and wire tied to a pallet. Motor was exceptionally clean and almost looked new (rebuilt). Upon closer inspection I realized they had done some superficial painting to the block and timing belt covers which made it look shiny and new. Not sure why and admittedly it makes me a little nervous but the motor does "look" pretty good - very clean. They did a good job taking the time sealing all the orifices with fitted caps and duct tape; just not sure why the paint - makes me wonder if they're trying to cover something up. Anyway, had to pull off the intake manifold to remove what was left over from their hack job of the previous engine wiring harness and to swap over my old wiring harness - that requires new gaskets so I'm partially on hold until those arrive.
Thinking of cleaning the intake but not sure what the best approach is or just leave it. Advice?
I discovered the front catalytic converter was toast as it sounded like a tin can with a bunch of rocks in it. Looking up the exhaust port on the motor I could clearly see the valves were badly corroded - obviously the oil burning was quite bad on this side. The rear converter and valves looked ok. Need to order new cats.
As previously mentioned, I'm looking at replacing these with the PCD's. I thought i saw some previous postings on PCD's with a resonator to cut down on the rasp, droning?? I don't mind a little extra noise but I don't want it annoying as i do a lot of highway driving. I'll trade a little noise for increased performance though. Advice?
Thanks!
Here are a few pix:
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P1zzaman (06-22-2016)
11-20-2011, 09:23 AM
#22
Instructor
This reminds me.....
Uploaded with ImageShack.us
Uploaded with ImageShack.us
Everything is pretty much straight forward, it tooke me about 3 weeks cause i ordered some parts but you shouldnt have any issues. Just make sure you put each plug back in its bracket
Uploaded with ImageShack.us
Uploaded with ImageShack.us
Everything is pretty much straight forward, it tooke me about 3 weeks cause i ordered some parts but you shouldnt have any issues. Just make sure you put each plug back in its bracket
11-20-2011, 06:59 PM
#27
05-6MT-TL
Thread Starter
11-20-2011, 08:17 PM
#30
Former Sponsor
11-21-2011, 11:44 AM
#33
05-6MT-TL
Thread Starter
HELP! I need tools for the clutch replacement. I just called the stealership…they said they won’t loan me a tool but I could buy them….the pressure plate thingy is $370…the cutch line up tool is $70.
Does anyone know where else I can get these. I could fabricate the line up tool but do I really need the pressure plate tool? Never used one before on my other cars (Toyota).
Does anyone know where else I can get these. I could fabricate the line up tool but do I really need the pressure plate tool? Never used one before on my other cars (Toyota).
11-21-2011, 03:00 PM
#34
Former Sponsor
HELP! I need tools for the clutch replacement. I just called the stealership…they said they won’t loan me a tool but I could buy them….the pressure plate thingy is $370…the cutch line up tool is $70.
Does anyone know where else I can get these. I could fabricate the line up tool but do I really need the pressure plate tool? Never used one before on my other cars (Toyota).
Does anyone know where else I can get these. I could fabricate the line up tool but do I really need the pressure plate tool? Never used one before on my other cars (Toyota).
11-21-2011, 05:24 PM
#36
Here's all of the special tools listed in the manual:
07AAE-P8EA000 Pressure plate compressor
07AAF-P8EA000 Clutch alignment shaft
07AAK-P8EA000 Pressure plate compressor adapter
07LAB-PV00100 or 07924-PD20003 Ring gear holder
07746-0010200 Attachment, 37 x 40mm
07749-0010000 Driver
I saw the pressure plate compressor on Majestic Honda parts for ~$250 and I've heard that it is very necessary to properly install the clutch/pressure plate. You could buy it and I'm sure someone would pick it up from you in the blackmarket later on.
07AAE-P8EA000 Pressure plate compressor
07AAF-P8EA000 Clutch alignment shaft
07AAK-P8EA000 Pressure plate compressor adapter
07LAB-PV00100 or 07924-PD20003 Ring gear holder
07746-0010200 Attachment, 37 x 40mm
07749-0010000 Driver
I saw the pressure plate compressor on Majestic Honda parts for ~$250 and I've heard that it is very necessary to properly install the clutch/pressure plate. You could buy it and I'm sure someone would pick it up from you in the blackmarket later on.
11-21-2011, 07:50 PM
#37
Former Sponsor
Here's all of the special tools listed in the manual:
07AAE-P8EA000 Pressure plate compressor
07AAF-P8EA000 Clutch alignment shaft
07AAK-P8EA000 Pressure plate compressor adapter
07LAB-PV00100 or 07924-PD20003 Ring gear holder
07746-0010200 Attachment, 37 x 40mm
07749-0010000 Driver
I saw the pressure plate compressor on Majestic Honda parts for ~$250 and I've heard that it is very necessary to properly install the clutch/pressure plate. You could buy it and I'm sure someone would pick it up from you in the blackmarket later on.
07AAE-P8EA000 Pressure plate compressor
07AAF-P8EA000 Clutch alignment shaft
07AAK-P8EA000 Pressure plate compressor adapter
07LAB-PV00100 or 07924-PD20003 Ring gear holder
07746-0010200 Attachment, 37 x 40mm
07749-0010000 Driver
I saw the pressure plate compressor on Majestic Honda parts for ~$250 and I've heard that it is very necessary to properly install the clutch/pressure plate. You could buy it and I'm sure someone would pick it up from you in the blackmarket later on.
I've done 6 of these clutches without one. Just carefully tighten the pressure plate down a little on each side with the alignment tool. You want to be able to slide the alignment tool in and out with barely any resistance.
If you haven't purchased your clutch yet this guy is selling the OEM clutch made by LUK with all the alignment tool, and bearings.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/LUK-CLUTCH-K...item255fb27e03
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duckengine (12-02-2011)
11-26-2011, 10:54 AM
#40
05-6MT-TL
Thread Starter
That's a great question. It looks ok...in fact the clutch disk looked really good too. However, the plate mounted to the flywheel is loose. I don't means the mounting bolts are loose; I mean the plate itself. Is that supposed to be that way?