Hi speed

iTrader: (3)

I would just like to know how these guys are pulling an additional 100-130 HP over stock with cams and some bolt-ons. I am also confused about how AT's are pulling supercharged 6 speed 1/4 times with no LSD. I haven't spent a lot of time in this thread because of the lack of explanation. It seems like people got offended by others asking how it was done. I think it would be helpful to the forum to have some explanation of what theses 320-350 WHP Auto guys are doing to take the car from 200 WHP to 320-350. There is no reason to go SC if you can make the power for much cheaper NA.

Sonnick

With regards to the post above, the low 13 @107 was done by a cammed 6 speed, not auto. However, I've been biting my tongue with this for awhile now. I'm not a 'naysayer' or non-believer, but it IS hard to believe that a bolt on/cammed TL, whether 6 speed or auto, is pulling S/C numbers and reflecting them at the track. Why it's even harder to believe, is because there are no dynos or timeslips confirming the aforementioned. Aside from the fact that most full bolt on 6 speed TL's don't trap higher than 102.

I'm not saying it can't be done OR that you guys are liars, not in the least bit. I fully support the J series NA builds and love the fact that they are getting done successfully. But, it would be nice to see some evidence of it as well. I'll tell you one thing, if I did a 13.18 @107 in my Accord all motor, you'd be damn certain I would NEVER lose that timeslip.

No one wants this thread to turn into a "I don't believe you," "Well then go f*** off" thread. But if there is evidence of these power numbers and timeslips, that would benefit the community as a whole. Do you know how many of us would continue modding this platform instead of moving on if we could see S/C #s all motor? I'd bet plenty. It would really help us out if you guys could show some form of dyno or timeslip to back up your claims.

You know what? Even after the evidence is presented, people will STILL doubt it. But at least you shared it with us! No one has seen these numbers without a 6 speed and a full build, so this would prove the J series has a lot more potential than people may have thought.

Inaccurate

^ You forgot to include the disclaimer about being full-weight 5AT. I have *more* equivalent HP (total area under the curve) than the typical max'ed out SC.

Regarding the LSD - I am pretty sure both my front wheels (5AT) lay down power to the ground. I haven't done it, but I can.... turn off my VSA and confirm. I always leave my VSA on so I ain't super positive.

ethenol

ethenol

ethenol

ethenol

And yes the back tire is off the ground............................................ .................................................. .................................................. ....... I am the biggest fibber

Sonnick

That's what I like to see! I wasn't calling you a liar. I've sent you a few friendly PMs back in the day, and was in no way saying you were lying. But someone has to come out and say "show it to me." That someone happened to be me (Hi Speed leaning me towards it lol).

Ethenol: I, as well as others I'm sure, very much appreciate the video/timeslip! Let me be the one to say that I was a little doubtful with those trap speed, but didn't think you were lying at any point. Btw, you posted an even better run than talked about....13.0 @108.6. Damn. Were you tuned on that run?

You sure that wasn't you in the right lane doing the 17.x @48? LOL only teasing man.

r3devi7

iTrader: (2)

Nice slip!

tommypenguin

That's an awesome 0-60ft time, great job in general.

swoosh

iTrader: (5)

dayummmmm

brian6speed

iTrader: (5)

I love how your car sounds.

veggiemonster

iTrader: (1)

ethenol what's your mod list? it sounds awesome and that is a great run....i would do shit to this thing if i could replicate something even close to that!!!!!!

Sonnick

I haven't watched the video yet, but I will when I get a chance. The fact that you trapped 85 in the 1/8th shows your low-midrange isn't suffering at all with the cam, but yet REALLY improved. You must be tuned.

I believe the mods are I/E/PCD/stock Jpipe/ported mani/runners/TB/cams/tune.

swoosh

iTrader: (5)

^^^ I believe he also had some head work done....I could be wrong thow....

phee

iTrader: (5)

i think this is the reason people don't share "proof" with the forum. everytime i posted something about my TL there was some ass-hat who called BS, that's kind of why i stopped posting my tinkering threads/helpful/wacky ideas.

veggiemonster

iTrader: (1)

hence the 'haters gonna hate' jpg's everywhere

Inaccurate

+1

This crosses my mind often before I post something about my car. And, you know that I have some "off of the wall" stuff going on.

There was my Diet thread. In the early years, the haters actually unknowingly encouraged me to find more stuff to remove. What better way to get back at the haters than by rubbing their face in it.

Then the haters started the "It didn't happen unless we see a timeslip" mantra. So, I then did the videos. For some haters, the vids still weren't enough.

"For those that believe, no explanation is needed. For those don't believe, no amount of explaining or proof will suffice."

Sometimes, I have to test the waters before I post something that I suspect will meet a lot of criticism. Like how removing my EGR and PCV improved my performance. I have not worked-up the strength to openly post this too much yet. Everyone will say that those things can't have an impact on performance because they become inactive under heavy throttle. There is no way it can improve performance. I know this. I ain't stupid. But, I also know what my car tells me. So, some things stay just between me and my car, and the forum losses out on the unshared info.

Usually, I find a way to back-up what I post. But in the case of having phenomenal part throttle response and awesome low-end power...... how can I prove that. Even a performance monitor can't capture this sort of info to present as proof. So, I don't post it.

There have been others things that I never openly shared on the forum. Like I never posted pics or discussed removing the steering wheel airbag. I knew that the forum would freak-out at the sight of seeing their precious driver-side airbag being desecrated.

justnspace

iTrader: (1)

^you do know that I live like 5 mins away from you and I would love to learn from you!!!!

AtlM5

fyi i think ethenol uses the aem fic

gerzand

iTrader: (3)

and the speculation begins....and it should end here. I'm glad he is my good friend and therefore I know he will say all that he wants to. Sorry all, but these NA car's arent "cheap" to build, though that might be the common idea around here and I think he has shared as much as anyone is going to get out of him. Just congratulate him for doing what he did and know that ALL OF YOU can accomplish the same thing. Besides a little bit of thought about how it all goes together, your own results are just a matter of time, love, and labor.

Sonnick

I know it's frustrating to hear "prove this, prove that" and so on. And to answer hundreds of questions may seem overrated as well. However, wouldn't it make you feel good if you helped even a handful of us? I for one, am very interested in your build. I'd love to hear what both you and ethenol have done to your cars to achieve your numbers. I understand the fact that we can all do it as well ($$ and time aside), but you've done it. If you really don't care to share what you have done, and if ethenol doesn't either, that's your choice and you're entitled to it. But it would really help some of us understand what it takes to make these numbers.

You think I haven't been told "yea ok" with some of my street runs? I was basically dead even with an SRT8 Charger from a dig to 100mph. In an Accord LOL. But it happened. I also pulled ~4 cars on a Trailblazer SS after he got the hit from a 65mph roll. That hasn't stopped me.

I know you had initially opened a build thread. It seemed this has become your build thread somewhat, except there is no build. It'd be so great if you could post what you've done besides bolt ons/cams/tune to achieve your numbers and 1/4 mile times. Ethenol too. It seems to be a far cry based on what I've seen thus far, but like I said there will always be "haters" (I despise that word). If members only posted what they thought wouldn't get criticized, there would be no modding community at all.

Do it.

Inaccurate

^ +1

I must admit that I have been thinking a lot about this cam stuff. I am having the urge to dig into the Service Manual to see how much wrenching is needed to changing a cam in the J engine.

My lightweight set-up is really begging for it. I have too much gearing in 1st and too much power below 4k for street tires. I could benefit from the cam without feeling the loss down low.

ethenol

I did also want to throw in that. The tire set up is a 275/40/17 Nitto nt05. And to put it simple. All I did was made the motor more efficient. It is simply a gas fueled air pump. That is all I have to say.

the fenda rolla

What Inaccurate said...I'm also eager to pull the trigger on a cam swap...

Just need some info on which ones, how difficult the swap will be, and pretty much everything else that is involved with such an endeavor...

j-rogsuperstar

I live 5 minutes from Justn and would like to piggyback on what he said.


J-smooth! When we meetin up?!?

swoosh

iTrader: (5)

^^^ ahahaha....since I was looking to get Gerz's setup I thought I would be the quickest NA BASE 5AT for a little bit but then all the info comes out here....seeing my financial situation i know someone will beat me to it

On a more serious note....YOU CANT ACCOMPLISH ANYTHING IF YOU DONT ACKNOWLEDGE IT.....since haters cant do it they feel no one can....look around punk....

Inaccurate/Villie with the lightest TL's out there
Gerz/Ethonol with the fastest NA
Opel I think is the faster SC-ED TL : Please correct me if am wrong
Rodney with the Turbo....
swoosh coming up with the lightweight, fastest, sexiest TL

everyone said it cant be done....but it has been....PROPS to people who made it happen....

Andy, my friend....I would love to learn more from you....if you can take some time and post couple things on here which can benefit a lot more members it will be awesome....I do follow you on FB from time to time and hence have bits and pieces of info and I would like to connect all the info floating around in my head....

Sonnick

You showed a timeslip and that's awesome. I commend you for it. But wouldn't disclosing your mods be a way of relinquishing any remaining doubt? It would also help us to achieve similar results as you and your car.

A similar situation is going on over at J32a. This "hush hush" attitude of the J series really isn't helping anything. Over there it's about the J swap and how to get them running right. People know but don't give away information for free. Over here it's secrecy about what mods produce the end result 320+atw all motor. Do you think the B & K aftermarket grew so rapidly because people kept everything a secret? Another point is that there are literally 3 J series all motor builds going around, ethenol and Gerzand being 2 of them, and 1 on . It'd be nice to actually get a feel for how much $$ was put in, what mods were used, and what came out of it. Then maybe the J series would get recognized as much as the other Honda motors in terms of aftermarket support. You guys could really be opening up doors in so many areas, but instead, it seems like you are choosing to leave them closed for reasons that just don't seem worth it.

gerzand

iTrader: (3)

Please dont take any of this personally, but I have given out all of the clues to the puzzle.. people just have to put them together. And i'm not going to hand out this information on a silver platter for everyone to consume because i am not yet done with my own build, and I refuse to be beaten to the punch. I am not hiding anything, you know all my mods. But if folks were really THAT serious like I am about having an NA race car built for the streets (coming from ZERO knowledge about cars) many would have accomplished this long ago. I have spent the past 4 years of my life outside of my day job dedicated to bringing this all to light...reading and researching...lacking a significant other because of it....and its not easy to let it go at the 90% complete point. Thats how I view it. 2 cents. I hope this serves as some inspiration to you guys.

Sonnick

When you have completed your build, will you then share the steps and what it took to get where you are? If so, I believe it will be worth the wait. I've done tons of research as well, though mostly on exhaust scavenging, I have a pretty good idea of what works well together and which parts supplement each other. However, you are one of the people actually bringing it to fruition. And just as I commended ethenol, I commend you as well. If I had the money to do this trust me, I would have sold my Accord and bought a Type S 6MT. It's one of my favorite reasonably priced cars to date. Nothing like riding around in a FWD luxury sedan beating up on 370s and Camaros.

brian6speed

iTrader: (5)

Blaming his car for not getting girls or boys if thats how you roll.

the fenda rolla

By the time any of this "secret J-series knowledge" comes to light, most of us would have already moved on to bigger and better things (cars)...

I guess I'm just used to the 8th Civic where everything was out in the open, for the most part, and it seems a little (lot) more welcoming to share ideas and what-did-what...

For example, there were timeslips/dynos aplenty...and when I had my Cobb AP unit we were sharing maps all the time...no worries of beating anybody to the punch...it was an excellent open community...and it flourished for the best...

This one isn't too bad, but with the extremely limited availability of aftermarket support as it is, ALL of us could use all the help we could get...

But congrats to the two or three fastest N/Aers...you have the ultimate internetz prize...forum bragging rights

Sonnick

Not only am I gonna thank your post, but I'm gonna give you a as well. Very well put. I thought that was the whole idea of the "forum community."

veggiemonster

iTrader: (1)

^^^exactly. my last forum, i watched everyone open up and share info and in those 2 years, the platform DOUBLED(well almost) it's whp numbers compared the results of 7 years of modding by members.

7 years to get 450whp, 2 years to go from that to over 700whp.

we shared logs, we shared revisions (if possible), hell a guy i met the first time logged my car for me, and let me crash in his hotel room for free, just so i could make it for the show weekend.

people start opening up and being completely honest, and this car will take off.

P1zzaman

iTrader: (1)

I am truly and terribly sorry for this. Notice this is NOT in red. I am sorry. I truly am. No sarcasm there.

I hope you will soon find the significant other in your life. Peace

Hacura

Perhaps a little OT, but for myself, I feel as if I have a tough time trusting a shop in the area that can do the work correctly. I know it's somewhat subjective, but some have PnP'd their engines without sensing increase in power. So it truly does help to know where members are getting their work done from. If need be, I'd rather ship my IM and runners out of state to get it done right knowing another member can vouch for a shop that has real experience and results with our engines.

the fenda rolla

Thanks Sonnick and veggiemonster, y'all are right...this is a good community of fellow enthusiasts, and I would *like* to think of us all as family really...at least that's how it feels whenever I go to an Acura meet and greet...we all talk about what we've done and how we like it...

And I know I am, and many many here are, very appreciative of all the work people have done, by their trial and error and other contributions (small and big), to bring this platform to where it is today. With that said, we still have much more potential to unlock from the TL...and with more communication and information in the open, like veggie said, support for this platform just might take off even more!

callahan

Where the video's of you showing your stage two cams? I can't seem to find it. Thanks for help in advance.

P1zzaman

iTrader: (1)

"I agree, only when the collective share the same knowledge will there be a higher chance of achieving something greater" -quote I just made up

the fenda rolla

Exactly...